How do I help someone appreciate poetry?

[WickedEve]

A few weeks ago I received email from this very nice gentlemen who asked about my site and my poetry. He said that friends pointed him in the direction of my site in hopes that he'd learn more about poetry. This person is intelligent and well traveled and truly interested in discovering the joys of art and poetry. He asked about the various poems on my site (many have been contributed by literotica board members.) He also asked to email a couple of the poets to learn more about certain poems of theirs.

Anyway, he made an offer to share his world travels if I would teach him to enjoy poetry. Well, that's a rather large task. I started by telling him what I thought was so incredible about poetry, and I shared some poems with him. I shared SA Storms' Living with the dead. I think it's an excellent poem that lets you see the dead things (inanimate objects in his home) from his perspective and the connection between these dead things and his own mortality.

So far I've only scratched the surface. What can I tell this man and which poems can I share to help him appreciate something many of us cherish on this board?

 

[JUDO]

WE -

I would tell him that poetry apprecation is an acquired taste. He needs to find that place where he is, and then travel from there.

It's like drinking beer or wine, you start from where your taste will let you, then proceed from there to 'more acquired tastes.'

Afterall, when you first start drinking wine, you can't taste the 'oakiness' from the 'sweetness of the grape.'

So, ask him some questions about poetry that he has read that he could understand, or felt he could understand fully.

Then, from that humble beginning, lead him along the uphill climb to more complex forms, less rhyming metered poetry and finally into free verse. After that, it might take him a while to really appreciate SA or Smithpeter. No offense, there. I just think a new reader needs to begin with basics and build to the more complex.

If he is willing, I believe that doing really elevates the apprecation and accomplishments of others.

Get him to write about something that really turns him on. Not necessarily in a sexual way, either. Ask him what he does in his non-professional time.
Perhaps he could take a simple form and write a little about one of his travels. Possibly, write a simple three-stanza rhyming poem at first, then build from there.

My thoughts.

- Judo

 

[WickedEve]

Thank you very much Judo. I can think of many people who could do a better job with this than me. I still have much to learn myself. But he seems to like the fact that I speak to him casually about the subject, so I'm determined to do what I can. And fortunately I know of a great place to ask for advice.

 

[Angeline]

The Basics

If someone came to me with your friend's request (and in spite of your protests, I would argue that he is lucky to have found you for this), I think there are few basics I'd want to convey.

1. Poetry is painting with words, and just as there is room in the world of visual art for many styles, this is also true of poetry. The trick, I think, is to keep exposing yourself to it to find what appeals to you. Maybe you hate Jackson Pollack--that's ok, keep looking--you'll find another artist whose work touches you.

2. As paint is the medium of the visual artist, words that create imagery are the poet's. The way that poetry is effective is through its sound and its images. These may be clear specific descriptions or more metaphorical. Some writers are much more metaphoric than others, but the best ones convery strong clear images that touch the reader. Look at this example:

[somewhere i have never travelled]
by ee cummings

somewhere i have never travelled,gladly beyond
any experience,your eyes have their silence:
in your most frail gesture are things which enclose me,
or which i cannot touch because they are too near

your slightest look easily will unclose me
though i have closed myself as fingers,
you open always petal by petal myself as Spring opens
(touching skilfully,mysteriously) her first rose

or if your wish be to close me,i and
my life will shut very beautifully, suddenly,
as when the heart of this flower imagines
the snow carefully everywhere descending;

nothing which we are to perceive in this world equals
the power of your intense fragility: whose texture
compels me with the color of its countries,
rendering death and forever with each breathing

(i do not know what it is about you that closes
and opens; only something in me understands
the voice of your eyes is deeper than all roses)
nobody,not even the rain, has such small hands



Isn't that just lovely? It is a difficult metaphoric poem in many ways, but also quite clear. You don't have to analyze it to know that the writer is entranced with his lover and sees what is beautiful in the world in her. You don't even need to be able to articulate it, as I just did; you will feel it as you read the poem. And this is why it is good to read poems that move you over and over because with the rereadings you find nuances you'd not seen before.

I think it's better to read a range of stuff rather than build say from simple easy-to-understand stuff to more complex poems. This, at least, is true for me that poetry is a sensual experience (not in the sexual sense, though it can be). I can feel a poem without intellectualy understanding it. So even a poem that on the surface seems "difficult" may upon reading be more accessible than you thought because you can "feel" it.

3. Last important point. Read poems out loud! Good poems like music pull you into their rhythm and move you along, don't they? And when you do read aloud, don't worry about line breaks, don't think you need to have a formal, stilted "poetry" voice. Read like you talk when you are relaxed and find the natural rhythms, find the sentences. Does that make sense?

I think I would give a new reader poems by Billy Collins and Kenneth Koch, two modern American poets who write clearly and simply, and yet manage to convey profound statements. Poems by Neruda would be wonderful too because his imagery and metaphors are compelling and magical. If you like Eve, I can recommend specific poems.

Finally, it may help your friend to read a bit on how poets perceive poetry. There is a wonderful book--let me find it. Here is the link to the publisher:

On the Level Everyday by Ted Berrigan

Somewhere online is an excerpt from this. I'll try to find it and post the link.

 

[dragonhearted]

Well....

There are hundreds more poems and prose for every hundred poets (at least the famous ones lol). I would intro. him to some of the best known works of Browning (Robt. and Elizabeth), Burns, Emily Dickenson, Whitman...even some of Shakespeares' sonnets. There is something to be appreciated from all. I agree with the theory that poetry is "an acquired taste"...but one has to be introduced to it at an early age too. Mom started reading it to me when I was very young....and I began to put verse together when I was 10 (not that I was any GOOD at it! LoL)

Suzi

 

[WickedEve]

Angeline, I'm going to copy and paste into an email a lot of what you posted. Is that okay? (of course, I will claim it as my own... lol)
Thank you Suzi for the suggestions.

Hopefully, when I'm finished with this man, he won't end up sitting in a corner for the next 5 years reading Mother Goose.

 

[Rybka]

Re: The Basics

2. As paint is the medium of the visual artist, words that create imagery are the poet's. The way that poetry is effective is through its sound and its images. These may be clear specific descriptions or more metaphorical. Some writers are much more metaphoric than others, but the best ones convery strong clear images that touch the reader. Look at this example:

[somewhere i have never travelled]
by ee cummings

If you are going to quote one of my main men, choose something like this ( which should be center justified):

1 x 1

XV1

one's not half two. It's two halves of one:
which halves reintegrating, shall occur
no death and any quantity; but than
all numerable mosts the actual more

minds ignorant of stern miraculous
this every truth-beware of heartless them
(given a scalpel, they dissect a kiss;
or, sold the reason, they undream a dream)

one is the song which fiends and angels sing:
all murdering lies by mortals told make two.
Let liars wilt, repaying life they're loaned;
we (by a gift called dying born) must grow

deep in dark least ourselves remembering
love only rides this year.
All lose, whole find

E.E. Cummings (1944)

(Also, please note that Cummings did not sign his name in lower case. That was done by later editors.)


I would not recommend Cummings to a novice reader, although he is one of my three favorites. I also have learned a lot from Frost and MacLeish, and they are much easier for the beginning reader. However, I would recommend a book like "12 Poets", edited by Glenn Leggett (Holt, Rhinehart, Winston - 1965) if it still available, with which to begin.

Probably the best approach is to ask what interests the inquiring person and start with poems/poets in that area. If you don't know of any such work, ask in a thread here and someone will know of relevant poems with which to start. If you want your friend to learn to love verse as we do, find out what he likes and start off simple with poems of that kind that you like and can answer questions about if he wants to discuss it or asks for clarification.

I would start with poems of set metre and fixed rhyme, and if you can supply an explanation of why it is a poem worth reading, all the better.


Regards,                       Rybka

 

[OT]

I think the most important thing is to tell him to forget any preconceived notion of what poetry ought to be.

A poem is just words; Simply read them. If the words are not to his liking, then guiltlessly move on to the next. Eventually he'll see something in a particular poet or poem that strikes a chord.

As Judo mentioned, there's many a nuance to be discovered. Prematurely trying to appreciate things you are not ready for is sure recipe for yawning, as is feeling like you are "supposed" to like something.

 

[_Land]

Eve Darling

I think one of the easiest ways to introduce him to the joys of poetry(almost like the joys of sex) is to introduce poetry that is about or contains his interest, something that he can relate to......
If he can relate to it his interest will grow.



_N

 

[HomerPindar]

Above and beyond the fine suggestions already made:

Tell him to search out local poetry readings, preferably college sponsered readings of modern poetry by the poet. (this can be risky, so warn him ~ he might be more amused than entertained if it's a night of bad poetry. but hey, hearing crap fertalizes for...um...not-so-much-crap)

Read Joyce. Read biographies on the poets. Watch dance (or figure skating) with the thought that as poetry-in-motion he should try and put what is seen into a form (words are optional if his mind can make sense of motion). Read contrasting writers, go from Jane Austin to Black Elk Speaks to John Grisham, language use isn't confined to poetry. Take a camera out and only photograph objects found pink in color, or only flags, or only round objects - teaching him to look at things differently....

HomerPindar

 

[Angeline]

Premature?

How do you know what a novice is or isn't ready for---if something makes you yawn, put it away and find something else. If all I had was "easy" stuff, it would make me yawn. I like _Land's suggestion, but that isn't always easy to do unless you know a lot of poems.

And Rybka, I'm sorry about the EE and the formatting ; I like that poem and it's just an example. And maybe I'm weird (ok, I know I am, lol), but I could read Shakespeare and "feel" its beauty and power before I ever studied it formally and knew many of the words he used, let alone structure or theme. I can't be the only person to experience poetry that way....

And Eve, my love take what you want, but look at what the other poets said--maybe I went overboard.

 

[OT]

Angeline,

My point with premature was directed at enjoying a poem at face value (either you like it or not) before trying to appreciate the more subtle points. I was not referring to the complexity of the poem or subject.

It's easier to like/appreciate mediocre poetry if you understand some of the restrictions of the form (Sonnets, haiku, some of the more intricate rhyming schemes, etc.)

 

[Sweetwood]

Poetry interpretation

I think that apart from reading poetry, for many people access is a real problem.

Many times people have difficulty understanding where the poet is headed with his work. I find that interpreting a poem for someone then helps, because it intially opens an intellectual window to the poem, and the content. You can discuss form, meter, rhythm etc. and that will open a door that the person can walk through. Then you can talk about the emotional impact it has had on you and what it made you feel.

Initially a poem is just an assembly of words. Because they were written by another, their meaning and content are often hidden. The more crafted and subtle the poem the more difficult it is for a person unfamiliar with this art from to enter the landscape it creates. They need a guide, who is willing to open their eyes and hold their attention intellectually.

My take

Sweetwood

 

[Angeline]

Interpreting

Sweetwood said:

Many times people have difficulty understanding where the poet is headed with his work. I find that interpreting a poem for someone then helps, because it intially opens an intellectual window to the poem, and the content. You can discuss form, meter, rhythm etc. and that will open a door that the person can walk through. Then you can talk about the emotional impact it has had on you and what it made you feel.

This is excellent advice, imho. Eve, if your friend is interested, I'll take a crack writing an interpretation of a poem per Sweetwood's map above.

(Hi Sweetwood and Sweetwife. Nice to see you.)

And OT, I have a sneaking suspician we're saying the same thing.

 

[WickedEve]

Above and beyond the fine suggestions already made:

Tell him to search out local poetry readings, preferably college sponsered readings of modern poetry by the poet. (this can be risky, so warn him ~ he might be more amused than entertained if it's a night of bad poetry. but hey, hearing crap fertalizes for...um...not-so-much-crap)

HomerPindar

I think that's an excellent idea, Homer. I will mention that to him.

 

[WickedEve]

Re: Interpreting

Sweetwood said:

Many times people have difficulty understanding where the poet is headed with his work. I find that interpreting a poem for someone then helps, because it intially opens an intellectual window to the poem, and the content. You can discuss form, meter, rhythm etc. and that will open a door that the person can walk through. Then you can talk about the emotional impact it has had on you and what it made you feel.

This is excellent advice, imho. Eve, if your friend is interested, I'll take a crack writing an interpretation of a poem per Sweetwood's map above.

(Hi Sweetwood and Sweetwife. Nice to see you.)

And OT, I have a sneaking suspician we're saying the same thing.

Angeline, I'm sure he'd appreciate that. One poem I want to share next with him is your After I Loved You.

 

[WickedEve]

Sweetwood, it's an honor to have the kokigami master back on the board.

 

[WriterDom]

Send him an erotic audio poem that you wrote. Nothing nasty, just enough to get his attention.

 

[_Land]

a simple hullo to sweetwood


Perhaps this thread, would be better name how did you learn to appreciate poetry?

I think that at its core value, poetry touches something deeper then just thoughts. Not all poetry of course, It is the song of someones soul, it lets us see inside. I like to think about that as I walk down the busy sidewalk.... If I could understand the poetry in their mind, I would perhaps understand them. I have never met angeline, or for that matter anyone outside of beth here, yet I feel as if I know you.......I have never had a chat conversation either, yet I know something about each of you, I know more about Judo then just her picturesque AV's...... She defies my personal stereo type of a california Surf Babe, not because her picture mind you but because of her poetry. I can see how she thinks through her poetry, I gain perspective other then my own.
I read poetry because it helps me see past my walls,

I look at it this way.........there is a huge box on the wall in which there are thousands and thousands of compartments, there is one person inside each compartment. This compartment is their inner world, their private room, I can speak with this person face to face and never see past his two dimensional presentation.
Poetry takes me past that, it takes me in to their compartment.
lets me see inside. I read poetry to enlighten myself, my own narrow pointed view is challenged, stretched, and suported by others. Eve, your poem in the critique thread, Its angst I related to that. It touched me deeper then physics, while I know I am not alone throught the holidays, It helps know others have the same feelings.

Poetry is a gift, from the author! If we take it and unwrap it we find a gift thatwill touch us. The question is do you want the gift?
Give your friend a Present, It doesnt have to be complicated, just soemthing that will touch him, stir his appreciation, for poetry and for you

 

[Sweetwife]

Learning about poetry

I'm the first to admit I don't know alot about poetry. I find after I read a poem, it is very helpful to me to read other's insight. I have learned much by reading critiques. Martin has taught me so much with his very in-depth interpretations of poems. UP, Eve, Lauren and Z have also helped me to love a poem. I soak up their knowledge and have come to appreciate poetry.

E

 

[WickedEve]

HI E!

Well, right now I'm putting an email together with all these suggestions. Though, it may be easier to tell him to visit the board. lol Actually, I will mention that to him.

Thank you all for the ideas and please keep adding more -- I'm getting ideas for myself too!

Eve

 

[WickedEve]

Eve, your poem in the critique thread, Its angst I related to that. It touched me deeper then physics, while I know I am not alone throught the holidays, It helps know others have the same feelings.

I'm glad I could touch you, land. lol Seriously, thank you.

 

[JUDO]

Re: Poetry interpretation

I think that apart from reading poetry, for many people access is a real problem.

Many times people have difficulty understanding where the poet is headed with his work. I find that interpreting a poem for someone then helps, because it intially opens an intellectual window to the poem, and the content. You can discuss form, meter, rhythm etc. and that will open a door that the person can walk through. Then you can talk about the emotional impact it has had on you and what it made you feel.

Initially a poem is just an assembly of words. Because they were written by another, their meaning and content are often hidden. The more crafted and subtle the poem the more difficult it is for a person unfamiliar with this art from to enter the landscape it creates. They need a guide, who is willing to open their eyes and hold their attention intellectually.

My take

Sweetwood

Sweet! I've missed you guys. I was just asking... someone the other day where you went to.

Yeh!


- Judo

 

[Cordelia]

I look at it this way.........there is a huge box on the wall in which there are thousands and thousands of compartments, there is one person inside each compartment. This compartment is their inner world, their private room, I can speak with this person face to face and never see past his two dimensional presentation.
Poetry takes me past that, it takes me in to their compartment.
lets me see inside. I read poetry to enlighten myself, my own narrow pointed view is challenged, stretched, and suported by others.

Oh my goodness! What a delightful metaphor.....

Thanks, Land...

May I use this?


Awestruck,


Cordelia