Help needed asap

[sweeteuphoria]

Okay, I have a story where two of the characters sing a song to their mate. I named the title and artist, as well as typed some of the lyrics. Question is... Do I need to acknowlege the location where I found the lyrics at the end of the story?

 

[Just-Legal]

No, but it might be an idea to put at the start:

Including <Songname> by <Artist>, no copyright infringement is intended.

 

[sr71plt]

No, but it might be an idea to put at the start:

Including <Songname> by <Artist>, no copyright infringement is intended.

That just brings attention to the issue without having any practical effect.

No one has actually been prosecuted for quoting no more than two lines (or less than 10 percent of the total wordage) of a song. Even then, the title and lyricist should be credited, though.

Beyond that, anything you do is copyright infringement without written permission from whoever owns the song. So, if you are set on infringing, don't bother to do any fancy crediting slugs or anything else that will draw maximum attention to what you've done--with no effect in protecting you from suit.

 

[wyf]

No, but it might be an idea to put at the start:

Including <Songname> by <Artist>, no copyright infringement is intended.

Sorry but that's bull. It IS a copyright infringement, and it was intentional because you did it intentionally. My husband's in publishing, I know these things!!! Just acknowledging doesn't change that.

A friend of his who used lyrics in a book got charged about $500 PER LINE by the music publisher.

 

[wyf]

No one has actually been prosecuted for quoting no more than two lines

Maybe, maybe not, but the music publisher may still lean on you for payment. People don't get prosecuted because they pay.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Okay, I have a story where two of the characters sing a song to their mate. I named the title and artist, as well as typed some of the lyrics. Question is... Do I need to acknowlege the location where I found the lyrics at the end of the story?

Nah, they're scaring you.

If you quote a few (FEW) lines - with no music - in a story (play, newspaper article or whatever) you are not in trouble. The NYT does it all the time.

Just, somehow give a credit to who you quote. In it's simplest, '...' as Simon & Garfunkel said.

Short quotes, preferably acknowledged, are not a legal problem - especially in a not for profit context.

 

[Just-Legal]

Ok I was only posting my experience, no need to act like I just declared myself the Second Coming or something.

 

[sweeteuphoria]

I don't want to start an argument...

Thanks for your help everyone. I'm discovering I have to change the story around a bit. Darn! Those lyrics fit so perfectly to the scene and mood. Now I just have to go back and decide which to leave or remove.
thanks again.
sweet

 

[Weird Harold]

Do I need to acknowlege the location where I found the lyrics

No, you don't need to acknowledge the location where you found the lyrics, you just need to give proper attribution to the copyright owner -- which is NOT always the artists who performed the lyrics.

What you've described falls under "Fair Use" and shouldn't cause any sort of legal problems.

ETA:

From:http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl102.html
The distinction between “fair use” and infringement may be unclear and not easily defined. There is no specific number of words, lines, or notes that may safely be taken without permission. Acknowledging the source of the copyrighted material does not substitute for obtaining permission.

 

[wyf]

Short quotes, preferably acknowledged, are not a legal problem - especially in a not for profit context.

Sorry elfin, but you really don't know what you're talking about. I think you're confused about fair use.

The reality, in all honesty, is that an online story is unlikely to show on the radar, but permission should be sought before including lyrics. And where necessary paid for.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Ok I was only posting my experience, no need to act like I just declared myself the Second Coming or something.

Not me! I get scared at saying anything here cos the clever lot come and tell me I'm silly.

I'm with you, really

Elle

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Sorry elfin, but you really don't know what you're talking about. I think you're confused about fair use.

The reality, in all honesty, is that an online story is unlikely to show on the radar, but permission should be sought before including lyrics. And where necessary paid for.

You're wrong.

Short extracts from books or songs (not including music) are not regarded as breach of copyright as long as no attempt to obtain pecuniary advantage has been taken or the quotation is not more than a citation from a larger work.

And, of course, reference is made to the original author.

There may be a rule of etiquette that says you should ask first, but, as long as the context includes credit for short extracts without derogatory comment, you are totally legal.

 

[sweeteuphoria]

You're wrong.

Short extracts from books or songs (not including music) are not regarded as breach of copyright as long as no attempt to obtain pecuniary advantage has been taken or the quotation is not more than a citation from a larger work.

And, of course, reference is made to the original author.

There may be a rule of etiquette that says you should ask first, but, as long as the context includes credit for short extracts without derogatory comment, you are totally legal.

I agree with you elfin and legal. I found this site
http://fairuse.stanford.edu/Copyright_and_Fair_Use_Overview/chapter9/9-b.html

and used it to reword my story a bit. If you would like to see what it reads just send a PM and I'll show you. Other than that, I think I'll be okay. It's just a story and nothing for profit,

thanks for your help!

 

[sr71plt]

Maybe, maybe not, but the music publisher may still lean on you for payment. People don't get prosecuted because they pay.

I work in publishing too, and I didn't just make up the "No one has actually been prosecuted for quoting no more than two lines (or less than 10 percent of the total wordage) of a song" advice. See the Chicago Manual of Style, 4.77 and 4.78. See also The New & Updated Copyright Primer (New York: Associaition of American Publishers, Inc., 2000) and Paul Goldstein's Copyright Highway (New York: Hill and Wang, 1994).

Or I guess you can go with speculation or what one of your cyber chum's cousin Mavis's clairvoyant channeled from grandfather Harold--who once sang a song and read a book on the same night he stayed at a Holiday Inn said--maybe, you think.

 

[keeblercrumb]

Don't worry about it... I am not in publishing but unless you sell the story for money... I would not sweat it. There are thousands of "lyrics" sites online and I don't think they are paying anybody...

So unless you have a much better deal here then I do, don't sweat it... Offer them half of your profits...

And for God's sake... don't tell Dylan about my "sig"!!!

-KC

 

[Weird Harold]

Or I guess you can go with speculation or what one of your cyber chum's cousin Mavis's clairvoyant channeled from grandfather Harold--who once sang a song and read a book on the same night he stayed at a Holiday Inn said--maybe, you think.

Or she could just follow the link I provided to the US Government Copyright Office's page on Fair Use and decide whether she qualifies. That site is the "official word" unlike Style guides and other rules of thumb. (the "Government" explicitly says that there is no fixed percentage or definition of "Fair Use," so the 10% rule is just an unofficial "rule of thumb.")

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Or she could just follow the link I provided to the US Government Copyright Office's page on Fair Use and decide whether she qualifies. That site is the "official word" unlike Style guides and other rules of thumb. (the "Government" explicitly says that there is no fixed percentage or definition of "Fair Use," so the 10% rule is just an unofficial "rule of thumb.")

Sweeteuphoria

If you google the title of almost any popular song, you will get a thousand or more full sets of lyrics. Without the music and without any intent to profit from the lyrics you are fine. You should give credit if the song isn't universally known.

Honest, no-one is going to get on your case for quoting lyrics - just don't sing it in a Text with Audio.

 

[R. Richard]

Honest, no-one is going to get on your case for quoting lyrics - just don't sing it in a Text with Audio.

I collect 50's 60s music. At least back in those days it was QUITE common for one artist to 'cover' the song of another artist. The 'cover' songs were pretty much identical to the original, including the music, with just very minor changes in the words. The 'cover' version were not only by different artists, they were also released by different record companies.