Grammer checking programs

[SouthernWolf]

Hi

Was curious if any authors / writers have ever tried the grammar checking programs and there thoughts on them. Yes, I know its better to learn to write better but curious if they do there job. Also can they teach you about common errors and ways to fix them? (I.E. making/ helping you be a better writer)

Thks

SouthernWolf

 

[Weird Harold]

Hi

Was curious if any authors / writers have ever tried the grammar checking programs and there thoughts on them. Yes, I know its better to learn to write better but curious if they do there job. Also can they teach you about common errors and ways to fix them? (I.E. making/ helping you be a better writer)

Thks

SouthernWolf

I use the grammar check in MS Word extensively when editing, but it took years to understand what it was trying to tell me in a few areas and which checks needed to be turned off completely.

As an example, naming a character "Frank" will generate dozens of false errors because the word has so many different meanings in addition to being a common nickname for "Francis."

MSWord's grammar check and the few others I've encountered, default to Business PC Formal " and have to be extensively re-configured through the options and preferences tabs to fit each author's fiction style; stupid PC checks like "gender neutral" and "slang" just waste time -- especially when writing Erotica.

Once it has been reconfigured, I find it to be a useful tool in spotting problem areas of my work. It often isn't right, but generates a fault because of some unrelated mistake or cumbersome phrasing. Figuring out why it generated the fault is useful even if I ultimately decide to Ignore it.

I have to stay aware that if I accept suggested changes without evaluating what they are and why they should be made will usually result in total destruction of any individual style and make the story a very boring 2.80 to 3.00 rating (if it is a good story idea in the first place.

 

[sr71plt]

Computer grammar check is pretty much designed for technical reports. Fiction is too flexible for a grammar check program to more than confuse you if you try it on that.

 

[FullyLoadedUK]

If you want to have some fun try this out:

http://www.hemingwayapp.com/

 

[AZMotherLover]

I've never tried one, but it shouldn't be too hard to program something to fix your/you're, there/they're/their, later/latter, less/fewer, desert/dessert, etc.

Anything like that out there?

 

[FullyLoadedUK]

Google docs works for most of these

 

[AZMotherLover]

Google docs works for most of these

Google docs also causes my old, outdated version of firefox to crash.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Like Weird Harold, I use Words grammar checker, but I have had to turn a shit load of stuff off. It's great for writing business letters or technical docs right out of the box. But for fiction, you need some stuff turned off or changed to have it give you a chance in hell.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I've never tried one, but it shouldn't be too hard to program something to fix your/you're, there/they're/their, later/latter, less/fewer, desert/dessert, etc.

Not my field, but I'd think it'd be really hard. Imagine trying to teach a computer when to use "your" vs "you're":

1. The phone rang in Bob's campaign headquarters. "That'll be the Florida results", said Jane, the chief strategist. She took the call, said "uh-huh... yes... thank you," and turned to Bob.

"Looks like you're president," she said.

2. The KGB agent slid a grainy old black-and-white photo across to her CIA counterpart, who studied it with interest. "These men," he said. "That's North Korea's head of covert operations, that guy's a world-famous plastic surgeon, and that one..."

"Looks like your president," she said.

To pick the right word there you have to understand the context of the story.

 

[sexnovella]

human vs machine.

The average human editor beats every program any day of the week. Computers don't understand what you write and may suggest strange changes that aren't correct or even needed but it can spell check words but not always the grammar. If the person editing the text has english as first langue he or she notices anything wierd while the program might miss it or make it worse.

 

[SamScribble]

I think if you subjected a couple of pages of James Joyce or Virginia Woolf to a electronic grammar checker the checker would have a hissy fit.

 

[Handley_Page]

I've never tried one, but it shouldn't be too hard to program something to fix your/you're, there/they're/their, later/latter, less/fewer, desert/dessert, etc.

Anything like that out there?

Not so far, I fear.
My word 2003 will suggest an alternative to certain words or phrases, but I really get quite annoyed that despite setting the Language to UK English, it will insist on some things which strike me as "too American".
For instance, one of my pieces has a "Waitress."
In the UK, this is perfectly normal; a female who waits at table, bringing food & drinks to the customer/s.
Word suggested "Server". Two thoughts from this idiocy; a character cannot pinch the bottom of a Server, and my Server is a bloody great computer-thing for my Internet.

 

[redzinger]

Not so far, I fear.
My word 2003 will suggest an alternative to certain words or phrases, but I really get quite annoyed that despite setting the Language to UK English, it will insist on some things which strike me as "too American".
For instance, one of my pieces has a "Waitress."
In the UK, this is perfectly normal; a female who waits at table, bringing food & drinks to the customer/s.
Word suggested "Server". Two thoughts from this idiocy; a character cannot pinch the bottom of a Server, and my Server is a bloody great computer-thing for my Internet.

Mine keeps defaulting back to US English, which annoys the hell out of me. It's usually the first thing I do with a new version of Word, to change the default. But sooner or later I'll be working on a document and it'll be having kittens at some of the spelling and I'll look down and it'll be bloody US again.

(Nothing wrong with US English, but I work in UK, and I don't want my work to be the bastard child of two versions.)

 

[Weird Harold]

Not so far, I fear.
My word 2003 will suggest an alternative to certain words or phrases, but I really get quite annoyed that despite setting the Language to UK English, it will insist on some things which strike me as "too American".
For instance, one of my pieces has a "Waitress."
In the UK, this is perfectly normal; a female who waits at table, bringing food & drinks to the customer/s.
Word suggested "Server". Two thoughts from this idiocy; a character cannot pinch the bottom of a Server, and my Server is a bloody great computer-thing for my Internet.

That's the "Gender Neutral" check and it can be turned off.

 

[SouthernWolf]

Thanks for the info

 

[sr71plt]

That's the "Gender Neutral" check and it can be turned off.

Yep, it isn't a UK-American English thing. We have waitresses and waiters in the States too.

 

[PayDay]

A Harbrace College Handbook or a Simon and Schuster Handbook For Writers.

 

[redzinger]

That's the "Gender Neutral" check and it can be turned off.

Are you seriously saying there is such a thing? Really?

Good fucking grief.

 

[Weird Harold]

Are you seriously saying there is such a thing? Really?

Good fucking grief.

Yep.

Screen capture from MSWord 2010:

 

[redzinger]

Well, you learn something new every day. Thanks.

(even taught myself where to find it, so if my documents start randomly rejecting things, I know how to sort it out.)

 

[49greg]

Computer grammar check is pretty much designed for technical reports. Fiction is too flexible for a grammar check program to more than confuse you if you try it on that.

I agree. I currently use Libre Office, it has a spell/grammar check button all in one, and isn't too intrusive. When I do a manual spell check, I generally ignore the grammar suggestions. Probably to my peril if I was writing a paper. I used to use MS Word, I think 2007, the disc is still around somewhere, but I don't like it, partly because of the grammar feature.

Yep, it isn't a UK-American English thing. We have waitresses and waiters in the States too.

I agree with the waiter and waitress, but I have noticed in the last few years that in formal places were they introduce themselves, they usually refer to themselves as servers.

I do like waitress and waiter. I don't think of an individual as a person, but as a man or a woman. Well adults, children are just kids, to be rarely seen and never heard, bah humbug.

 

[sr71plt]

I do like waitress and waiter. I don't think of an individual as a person, but as a man or a woman. Well adults, children are just kids, to be rarely seen and never heard, bah humbug.

My wife does a rattatat on the heads of restaurant hostesses and waitresses who refer to the collective dining party as "you guys."

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Yeah, it's pronounced 'uz guyz'.

 

[JKendallDane]

For instance, one of my pieces has a "Waitress."
In the UK, this is perfectly normal; a female who waits at table, bringing food & drinks to the customer/s.
Word suggested "Server". Two thoughts from this idiocy; a character cannot pinch the bottom of a Server, and my Server is a bloody great computer-thing for my Internet.

Thirty or so years ago, there was a new, upscale restaurant in Columbus, Ohio, that had the full medieval theme going, from the names of menu choices to the decorating scheme and employee costumes. The first time I ate there, I about laughed myself silly when the waitress trolloped up to the table and announced her name and: "I'll be your serving wench tonight."

Not too sure that would fly nowadays.

 

[redzinger]

I used to work for Virgin, I used to have to announce in every welcome meeting, several times a week, that I was their 'Customer Care Virgin'.