Friends during and after divorce....possible??

[IrishEyes80]

Ok so this might be long....

A week ago I asked my husband for a divorce, he agreed (he doesnt want it but is giving me what I want) and now we are trying to do this in a way I've NEVER seen before....so I'm wondering if I'm crazy or if this will happen as we've planned. Here's the plan....

We want to come out of this as friends, not just being nice for our kids sake but actual friends that hang out on the weekends. Sound crazy??

Things in our situation prevent us from formally splitting until after the first of the year, so we are still sleeping in the same bed but touching is not going to happen.

Our son is 13, we are not telling him a thing until after the first of the year, (or until things go to shit) when it's time for his dad to leave. I don't want him to get the idea that we will get back together in the coming months.

Our families know what is going on and so do our friends. A little back story...we've been together for 14 years, his parents have passed away as well as one of his older brothers, so he has no family he feels close to anymore except mine. Our friends are basically my friends from high school and my two brothers and their wives. I, of course, want custody of our son but I will never keep them apart! As I said, he'll be leaving the house as well, so basically he feels like a divorce will take away his whole life! I COMPLETELY understand how he could feel that way, that is why we have told our friends and family our plan to remain friends. So he will not lose everything. We don't want anyone to take sides in all of this, if we can help it.

If things get ugly he knows that my two friends I've had since I was 13 and my brothers (that makes up the core of our group of friends) aren't going to side with him in all this, so we are attempting to do the friend thing. I don't want to take everything away from him, I just want out of the marriage. Like I said it's been a week, so far we went through our first hang out with everybody test and it had a few bumps but nothing that I would call a serious issue. We don't usually fight, so I'm not surprised that we haven't had a single fight yet.

He is still very emotional about it all. We had dinner with my family last night and he had to take a time out to compose himself. My parents have let him know that he will always be welcome in their house, and they mean it. My biological dad comes to visit from Ohio and sleeps on my parents (mom and step dad) couch instead of going to a hotel. Obviously my own parents have a different way of handling divorce, they give me hope that our plan can work.

So is it crazy ridiculous to think that he and I can maintain a friendly relationship in all this?

We've discussed the seeing other people issue, he is no where near being able to do that. I checked out of our marriage a long time ago so I'm in a different place as for as this goes. I'm ready for a certain amount of freedom but I have agreed not to date anyone in his face. I'm committed to not rubbing any salt in any wounds he has from all of this, I really don't want to hurt him anymore than I already have!

Anyone have any ideas how to make this work? He keeps saying "I feel like you're waiting for the other shoe to drop" meaning I'm waiting for him to freak out....which of course I am and I've told him that! He keeps assuring me that coming out friends is what he wants as this will be the best thing for our son and the both of us. It's hard for me to believe that we can make this work, I've never seen anyone divorce like this!

Any advice will be great!

Thanks!

 

[IrishEyes80]

I could be friendly but I wouldn't be hanging around you to watch you break my heart.

This is exactly why I'm waiting for that shoe! It's how I would probably feel if the rolls were reversed!

I will say I took off my wedding rings 6 months ago and he knows I did and didn't ask why or ask me to put them back on. I'm almost wondering now if "losing his life" isn't more important than "losing his wife".

 

[SweetErika]

Divorce is a major life change, regardless of how a couple approaches it or it turns out. I'm guessing he'll need plenty of time to process it, even if he had an idea it was coming 6 months or even years ago. The possibility is always different from the reality, and you'll both likely need time to process it once it's final.

Is your husband open to seeing a good counselor/therapist alone and/or together? Putting together some coping strategies and having an impartial party to talk with might really help him. Joint sessions would likely help the two of you work through the inevitable bumps, agree on healthy boundaries and figure out how you might be friends and co-parent most effectively.

If nothing else, I'd strongly suggest checking in with a really good therapist who deals with teens as well as divorces because s/he may bring up some points you haven't considered WRT telling your son, sending him the right messages now and helping him deal with such a huge change. For instance, what if he would do better with a more gradual transition than 'mom and dad were sharing a bed last week, and now dad's moving out'? And do you know for a fact your son would spend the coming months hoping for a reconciliation if you two were honest with him and started the transition for him now?

I'd imagine sharing a bed might be really tough for your husband. If you're doing that for your son's "benefit" then you may be doing more harm than good for both of them. Once your husband has had some more time to process, I'd suggest talking with him about that issue.

And regardless of how long ago you checked out of your marriage, I think it'd be a colossal mistake to date others at this point, even if you're super sneaky about it. Again, though, I believe this is something you should speak about with a therapist.

I'm not trying to be negative. It's just that I worry about how you're planning on going about some things in light of your goals to make the transition easier on your son and remain friends with your husband. Those are tough things to accomplish, and I'm guessing you'll all benefit from the help of a great professional who can get the full picture and give you suggestions based on years of experience.

 

[IrishEyes80]

Divorce is a major life change, regardless of how a couple approaches it or it turns out. I'm guessing he'll need plenty of time to process it, even if he had an idea it was coming 6 months or even years ago. The possibility is always different from the reality, and you'll both likely need time to process it once it's final.

Is your husband open to seeing a good counselor/therapist alone and/or together? Putting together some coping strategies and having an impartial party to talk with might really help him. Joint sessions would likely help the two of you work through the inevitable bumps, agree on healthy boundaries and figure out how you might be friends and co-parent most effectively.

If nothing else, I'd strongly suggest checking in with a really good therapist who deals with teens as well as divorces because s/he may bring up some points you haven't considered WRT telling your son, sending him the right messages now and helping him deal with such a huge change. For instance, what if he would do better with a more gradual transition than 'mom and dad were sharing a bed last week, and now dad's moving out'? And do you know for a fact your son would spend the coming months hoping for a reconciliation if you two were honest with him and started the transition for him now?

I'd imagine sharing a bed might be really tough for your husband. If you're doing that for your son's "benefit" then you may be doing more harm than good for both of them. Once your husband has had some more time to process, I'd suggest talking with him about that issue.

And regardless of how long ago you checked out of your marriage, I think it'd be a colossal mistake to date others at this point, even if you're super sneaky about it. Again, though, I believe this is something you should speak about with a therapist.

I'm not trying to be negative. It's just that I worry about how you're planning on going about some things in light of your goals to make the transition easier on your son and remain friends with your husband. Those are tough things to accomplish, and I'm guessing you'll all benefit from the help of a great professional who can get the full picture and give you suggestions based on years of experience.

I wish he would go to a therapist, either on his own or with the three of us but a couple years ago when I saw things going wrong I asked him to go and he refused. I asked him again a week ago if he would go and again he refused. I've been reading everything I can get my hands on as far as divorce and teens, at this point therapy is something I'm looking into for my son and I but because we've decided to wait to tell him, he won't be able to go to a therapist yet.

 

[BeachMomma]

.....

 

[culloden]

No advice, but I have seen this work in my own family. In fact, that particular couple remain good friends who do most things together. Odd, but possible. Good luck.

 

[heavyhitter01]

This has happened in my family as well. It definitely took some time and patience for the couple to make it work. It took plenty of time and patience for the rest of us (including me) to understand.

Be prepared for those who aren't "in the know" to be very skeptical and question (perhaps rudely!) how it is possible for two divorced people to actually be friends. That's especially true when one of you moves on to a new love yet remain friends with the old love.

 

[Bramblethorn]

We want to come out of this as friends, not just being nice for our kids sake but actual friends that hang out on the weekends. Sound crazy??

From what I've seen, it's possible although not necessarily easy. I would suggest writing down clear agreements about things like property and custody arrangements, because mismatched expectations can be a huge source of strife. Assuming you're both taking some responsibility for your kid, you may also want to come to some agreement on parenting roles (e.g. don't get into a space where one person gets to be the Fun Parent and the other gets all the crappy bits).

 

[IrishEyes80]

Be prepared for those who aren't "in the know" to be very skeptical and question (perhaps rudely!) how it is possible for two divorced people to actually be friends.

Oh how I hope someone in my personal life, that "thinks" they know what's better for my family, questions me! lol honestly I'm putting everything I can into not hurting my son or my ex that I will probably explode all over them! It would give me a great outlet for all this stress! lol

If I ask for their advice that's different.

 

[blulilacgrl]

Oh how I hope someone in my personal life, that "thinks" they know what's better for my family, questions me! lol honestly I'm putting everything I can into not hurting my son or my ex that I will probably explode all over them! It would give me a great outlet for all this stress! lol

If I ask for their advice that's different.

Can I just put two things out here. And these are the two things that I always see trip people up. For some reason people who are divorcing have thise silly notion that because they are no longer together suddenly they don't have to communicate as well or as much as when they were married. When in fact the opposite is true. You need to communicate more and more effectively, because unlike a married couple who can exchange information in passing in the hallway or the bathroom or while cooking dinner, a divorced couple only speaks when one or the other initiates contact or they are together for a family function.

So the idea of clear roles and expectations is paramount. Write them down But even more so is to have a way to discuss changing expectation should the need arise. And most importantly is the need to support each other. The number one thing I have seen divorced parents do that drives each other up the wall is not support each other. For ex. Parent A grounds the child for something or takes away the Ipod for an infraction. Parent B says, but this is my time and lets the child spend the night at a friends house or gives the child his/her Ipod back. Trust me, you may think "Oh he wouldn't do that." But please discuss even those mundane topics of how you will handle punishments from here on out. Will you two discuss grounding or restrictions before instituting them? Is grounding only at the respective parents homes? You will need to discuss Christmas and Birthday presents. What is appropriate what isn't.

Again, it seems silly, but I have seen not the big stuff but the tiny shit fuck up the most amicable of divorces. When it comes to these things. Communication of everything is the main thing to keeping a fair and balanced and friendly relationship after divorce. Making sure that each partner has a say and feels heard when it comes to what is going on the child's life

Now my second part goes to you directly. And please don't take this as a slam. I honestly don't mean it in that way. But I think you need to be prepared for your own reversal. I have seen, and can think of at least 2 instances just off the top of my head, where the person who ended up causing the problem was the person who originally wanted out of the marriage. I am not saying this will be the case. I don't know your story and I am not making a judgment call on whether you should or not. You two have made the decision and it is obviously what you feel is best.

But be aware. You are worried about his reactions and how he might behave. You also need to think about yourself. You need to be self analytical and objective about your actions. On both occasions that I am thinking about it was the person who left who then got jealous when the their former spouse moves on. There is a certain amount of power in leaving. But here is the thing. Often people change not for us, but because of us. And there may come a time when he will meet someone new. And when he does there is every chance that he will do for that new person things he would not do for you. Or there is a chance that you may see him doing well and get angry at that. Human emotions are tricky things, and things that you think logically won't bother us, sometimes bite us in the ass. So my advice for you and you alone. Watch and care for your own emotions. Even if you feel that you are ready and have been ready to leave this marriage. That doesn't mean you can't be blindsided. Stay with your counselor a little longer than maybe you think necessary and be aware of your own emotions.

Does any of that make any sense to anyone?

Good luck to you Irish. I hope it works out for you.

 

[IrishEyes80]

Can I just put two things out here. And these are the two things that I always see trip people up. For some reason people who are divorcing have thise silly notion that because they are no longer together suddenly they don't have to communicate as well or as much as when they were married. When in fact the opposite is true. You need to communicate more and more effectively, because unlike a married couple who can exchange information in passing in the hallway or the bathroom or while cooking dinner, a divorced couple only speaks when one or the other initiates contact or they are together for a family function.

So the idea of clear roles and expectations is paramount. Write them down But even more so is to have a way to discuss changing expectation should the need arise. And most importantly is the need to support each other. The number one thing I have seen divorced parents do that drives each other up the wall is not support each other. For ex. Parent A grounds the child for something or takes away the Ipod for an infraction. Parent B says, but this is my time and lets the child spend the night at a friends house or gives the child his/her Ipod back. Trust me, you may think "Oh he wouldn't do that." But please discuss even those mundane topics of how you will handle punishments from here on out. Will you two discuss grounding or restrictions before instituting them? Is grounding only at the respective parents homes? You will need to discuss Christmas and Birthday presents. What is appropriate what isn't.

Again, it seems silly, but I have seen not the big stuff but the tiny shit fuck up the most amicable of divorces. When it comes to these things. Communication of everything is the main thing to keeping a fair and balanced and friendly relationship after divorce. Making sure that each partner has a say and feels heard when it comes to what is going on the child's life

Now my second part goes to you directly. And please don't take this as a slam. I honestly don't mean it in that way. But I think you need to be prepared for your own reversal. I have seen, and can think of at least 2 instances just off the top of my head, where the person who ended up causing the problem was the person who originally wanted out of the marriage. I am not saying this will be the case. I don't know your story and I am not making a judgment call on whether you should or not. You two have made the decision and it is obviously what you feel is best.

But be aware. You are worried about his reactions and how he might behave. You also need to think about yourself. You need to be self analytical and objective about your actions. On both occasions that I am thinking about it was the person who left who then got jealous when the their former spouse moves on. There is a certain amount of power in leaving. But here is the thing. Often people change not for us, but because of us. And there may come a time when he will meet someone new. And when he does there is every chance that he will do for that new person things he would not do for you. Or there is a chance that you may see him doing well and get angry at that. Human emotions are tricky things, and things that you think logically won't bother us, sometimes bite us in the ass. So my advice for you and you alone. Watch and care for your own emotions. Even if you feel that you are ready and have been ready to leave this marriage. That doesn't mean you can't be blindsided. Stay with your counselor a little longer than maybe you think necessary and be aware of your own emotions.

Does any of that make any sense to anyone?

Good luck to you Irish. I hope it works out for you.

Thanks for the advice.

Communication was one of our issues, but since I've asked for the divorce we are having more...what I call "come to Jesus" meetings.

We have talked about A LOT of things this week including us moving on to other people. It's a one day at a time kind of thing at this point. I feel like because I've asked for this it's up to me to make it easier on him, so everyday I'm asking what did I do today to piss you off, in hopes that he will be completely honest with me and we can catch an issue before it becomes a problem. I have never been divorced before so I'm flying by the seat of my pants and hoping at each turn I'm making the best decisions for my son.

 

[blulilacgrl]

Thanks for the advice.

Communication was one of our issues, but since I've asked for the divorce we are having more...what I call "come to Jesus" meetings.

We have talked about A LOT of things this week including us moving on to other people. It's a one day at a time kind of thing at this point. I feel like because I've asked for this it's up to me to make it easier on him, so everyday I'm asking what did I do today to piss you off, in hopes that he will be completely honest with me and we can catch an issue before it becomes a problem. I have never been divorced before so I'm flying by the seat of my pants and hoping at each turn I'm making the best decisions for my son.

Like I said I wish you the best of luck. All I can say is to go into each talk as if you are talking to a stranger. Never assume you know what he is going to feel, think, or do. Therefore both of you need to talk it down to the bone. I know it sounds silly after knowing each other after all this time, but miscommunication and not meeting perceived expectations ruins any relationship.

 

[Beck31]

Deleted

......

 

[NippleMuncher]

What's his email address, pmann has a picture he wants to send him!

Divorce and separation are never easy, even when both sides are amicable. The only way for there to remain a friendship between you is for both of you to have closure, and be done with the relationship. We know where you stand, so that won't be a problem. Unfortunately, I think I also know where he stands, and as you said, losing the life is worse than losing the wife. I'm not getting the sense that he's going to get crazy, but I don't think that HE will be able to be friends with you, at least for a while once the separation and termination take place. He doesn't have to like losing you, but he does have to respect you and himself enough to recognize that it's over and let it go before he will ever be in a place to be friends with you.

Also, the fact that he relies on your family and friends network after the loss of his own, may play into your favor. He may be willing to lose you, but NOT lose the rest of the family, the thought of which will likely be more than enough for him to stay civil throughout this life changing event.

But we can keep the email idea in reserves just in case we need it.

 

[IrishEyes80]

What's his email address, pmann has a picture he wants to send him!

Also, the fact that he relies on your family and friends network after the loss of his own, may play into your favor. He may be willing to lose you, but NOT lose the rest of the family, the thought of which will likely be more than enough for him to stay civil throughout this life changing event.

But we can keep the email idea in reserves just in case we need it.

I'm hoping that if he sees that my family and friends aren't going to abandon him, he'll be able to start moving on. No one wants him thrown out and forgotten.

Hehehe I can only imagine the pic pmann would have to share!

 

[bob53]

There are a couple of things that I see have been missed in this discussion:
1) Both of you need to look at how totally honest you are being with each other. This goes deeply as you both must be clear and own your own feelings and represent them as your own feelings. Placing blame does no one any good and does NOT forward your goals for your son.

2) I notice that you are expecting custody. Considering his age he is VERY close to being able to choose in the eyes of the laws in most states.
If you are truly looking out for the best interests of the child ( Legal definition /terminology ) consider that he (son) may want to live with his Dad. If that happens then will you stay in the house and both Dad and Son move? Or will it be you moving?

I am asking this as it appears that you may have a picture painted in your mind of how the final break up will look. It may not go that way for many reasons. Will you be able to remain friends if your son chooses differently than you want / are expecting? You will need to be open to all possibilities of how this will work out long term.

Both of you need to be open to all possibilities and always be putting your son first.

I am sure there will be many other twists that will come up as this evolves for the 3 of you.

 

[SithLord13]

Be careful after you intiate proceedings as after the shock and sadness, he may at the urging of his own attorney go for custody himself. My SO was in a similar situation with her ex husband until he got served the papers. They were friendly during separation, but after he got his attorneys he did everything in his power to spite her and succeeded in taking sole custody of their child. Tread carefully.

 

[IrishEyes80]

2) I notice that you are expecting custody. Considering his age he is VERY close to being able to choose in the eyes of the laws in most states.
If you are truly looking out for the best interests of the child ( Legal definition /terminology ) consider that he (son) may want to live with his Dad. If that happens then will you stay in the house and both Dad and Son move? Or will it be you moving?

I am asking this as it appears that you may have a picture painted in your mind of how the final break up will look. It may not go that way for many reasons. Will you be able to remain friends if your son chooses differently than you want / are expecting? You will need to be open to all possibilities of how this will work out long term.

This is the point that stands out most for me. In our state the age to chose is 14 he's almost there. I will be very upset if he chose to stay with his dad. This is something my husband and I have talked about and he's not going to fight me for custody at this point. If that changes then I will fight it. Honestly he hasn't handled something's that pertain to my son very well so I think it would be in our sons best interest to be with me. I hope it doesn't come to that!

 

[cfuhrer]

we've decided to wait to tell him, he won't be able to go to a therapist yet.

News flash: your son already knows. Kids are amazingly observant and intuitive. He knows something is off, he knows mom and dad aren't acting like themselves no matter how well they think their hiding it, he knows something big is coming, and he probably even noticed you aren't wearing your rings.

Tell him sooner rather than later. If not you risk the "other shoe" you're waiting on being your kid telling you off for holding out such a huge piece of information.

Right now he's possibly thinking several things including: "if mom and dad are keeping this from me, what else are they hiding?" And "why don't they trust me enough to tell me what I already know but need to hear from them?"

You need to start laying the framework of acceptance and coping for him now.

As for your actual question regarding remaining friends with your ex- you can do anything you put your mind to; you just have to remain calm, reasonable, communicate like mad and remain dedicated to the outcome.

Making a civil divorce work is remarkably like making a marriage work.

 

[IrishEyes80]

News flash: your son already knows. Kids are amazingly observant and intuitive. He knows something is off, he knows mom and dad aren't acting like themselves no matter how well they think their hiding it, he knows something big is coming, and he probably even noticed you aren't wearing your rings.

Tell him sooner rather than later. If not you risk the "other shoe" you're waiting on being your kid telling you off for holding out such a huge piece of information.

Right now he's possibly thinking several things including: "if mom and dad are keeping this from me, what else are they hiding?" And "why don't they trust me enough to tell me what I already know but need to hear from them?"

You need to start laying the framework of acceptance and coping for him now.

As for your actual question regarding remaining friends with your ex- you can do anything you put your mind to; you just have to remain calm, reasonable, communicate like mad and remain dedicated to the outcome.

Making a civil divorce work is remarkably like making a marriage work.

Is this what happened to your kids? Did you wait to tell them only to find out they already knew?

If so how did you handle the after effect?

 

[cfuhrer]

Is this what happened to your kids? Did you wait to tell them only to find out they already knew?

If so how did you handle the after effect?

I was the kid.

And while I was just glad they were going their separate ways my sister still harbors some resentment over the assumption she didn't know what was going on.

 

[IrishEyes80]

I was the kid.

And while I was just glad they were going their separate ways my sister still harbors some resentment over the assumption she didn't know what was going on.

Sorry you and your sister went through that. I'll take what you said to heart...seriously!

Thank you for another perspective!

 

[Eilan]

I was the kid.

And while I was just glad they were going their separate ways my sister still harbors some resentment over the assumption she didn't know what was going on.

Yup. Me, too. I knew when I was three years old that my parents didn't like each other. They didn't separate until I was a senior in high school because my mom wanted to stay together "for the sake of the children."

 

[nfrrdscnnr1]

double

Cfuhrer is wise and has written wisdom.
Money and custody are the two usual things over which divorcing people fight and VERY often, they fight over those things instead of fighting about the real issues between them.
Good for you and best of luck.

 

[IrishEyes80]

I think our situation is a little different, we don't fight ever really, we just dont have a lot in common and we've grown apart, if we hated each other coming out of this as friends wouldn't be an option.

Our relationship before I asked for the divorce is much the same as it is now. We really were just friends before I told him what I wanted. That's why I'm hoping that we can keep the same kind of relationship through all of this.