Freedom of Speech?

[cheerful_deviant]

This just came up in my local news and it concerns me. A group of students has been suspended for making a music CD that mentions underage drinking, sex and violence. Personally I don't approve of any of those things of course, but why can't they sing about them? The CD was not made in the school, it appears that only first names are used, so how can suspension be justified?

I doubt that anything they have in their music can ever worse than what they hear on the radio or TV. The police seem to see nothing wrong with it, so what does the school department think they can do?

(Of course, it is always possible that the local news does not have their facts correct.)

Any thoughts?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Songs Written, Performed By Students Being Called Controversial

Lyrics Include Talk About Underage Drinking, Violence, Weapons, Sex

POSTED: 5:37 pm EST February 4, 2005
UPDATED: 12:51 am EST February 5, 2005

JOHNSTON, R.I. -- Some are calling the lyrics of songs written and performed by some Johnston Senior High School students, controversial.

Margaret Iacovelli, Johnston School Superintendent, could not give News Channel 10 the names of the students or exactly how many are being investigated because of confidentiality issues.

"We're always concerned, but I can assure everyone including the public that we will make sure that Johnston High School is always a safe environment for school and staff," said Iacovelli.

A lot of students have heard the CD and just about every student at the school has heard about it – including many parents.\

Iacovelli said she just learned about it this week.

High school students may have made the CD, but it was not made at the school, nor was any school equipment used.

The lyrics include talk about minors buying alcohol and underage drinking. Some of the lines are sexually explicit and use girls' first names. One song mentions violence, weapons and killing.

"All the concerns and comments of the parents and those affected will be addressed as well as any violations to school policy," said Lorraine Natale, of the Johnston School Committee.

All the students involved have been given suspensions, which means a five-day suspension as well as community service. They also have to go through sensitivity training.

As a protocol, the school department has called in Johnston Police to look into the matter. At this point, police said there is nothing criminal about the CD.

 

[Guest]

Any thoughts?

No.

 

[Rhys]

Welcome to the New World Order.

 

[Guest]

Looks like another classic case of christianity gone too far.

 

[Rhys]

Looks like another classic case of christianity gone too far.

Out of curiosity, where do you get christian fundamentalism out of this?

 

[Quiet_Cool]

Sounds like the bigger issue here, even concerning those involved, is the mentioning of names and behavior, not so much that they're to be censored.

Just my .02, but it seemed obvious with what's written there. No Christian fundamentalism to be seen.

Q_C

 

[Guest]

Out of curiosity, where do you get christian fundamentalism out of this?

It's the christians and the moral majority that are almost always the driving force behind these sorts of actions. Some church goers heard the song being played by their children and instead of just telling their children not to listen to that, they decide it is their duty as a christian to rid the world of the this "disgusting filth".

The same kind of people who tried to ban Lennon's "Imagine" from the airwaves claiming the song said there is no god. The song didn't say that, naturally but they never bothered to listen to it. And who were they to decide what everyone should listen to in the first place. I find it humorous that you don't find many athiests or agnostics pushing to have christian rock banned from music stores and radios. There isn't a movement that I know of to have the bible banned from school libraries.

There is a constant movement in this country to pass laws for the benifit of christian beliefs, despite the contitutional seperation of church and state.

People today see the US as the worlds biggest bully. I say that's bullshit. The christian church is the worlds biggest bully.

 

[Quiet_Cool]

It's the christians and the moral majority that are almost always the driving force behind these sorts of actions. Some church goers heard the song being played by their children and instead of just telling their children not to listen to that, they decide it is their duty as a christian to rid the world of the this "disgusting filth".

The same kind of people who tried to ban Lennon's "Imagine" from the airwaves claiming the song said there is no god. The song didn't say that, naturally but they never bothered to listen to it. And who were they to decide what everyone should listen to in the first place. I find it humorous that you don't find many athiests or agnostics pushing to have christian rock banned from music stores and radios. There isn't a movement that I know of to have the bible banned from school libraries.

There is a constant movement in this country to pass laws for the benifit of christian beliefs, despite the contitutional seperation of church and state.

People today see the US as the worlds biggest bully. I say that's bullshit. The christian church is the worlds biggest bully.

Actually, this sounds more like the recent story that was on the news here a few weeks back, about the woman who was asked not to read the Christian story to the elemetary school kids. At least it sounds similar. And in that occasion, the story wasn't preaching to passing on Christian ideals, it was merely a story that had Christian bases.

Basically, the school (or teacher in the story from a few weeks back) are just covering their tails, on the off-chance things get ugly. Hell, it said in the article said: "At this point, police said there is nothing criminal about the CD."

What else do you need?

If that story would have been read in a classroom and not interrupted, there could easily have been backlash over it, just as there may be over this CD.

Q_C

 

[Rhys]

It's the christians and the moral majority that are almost always the driving force behind these sorts of actions. Some church goers heard the song being played by their children and instead of just telling their children not to listen to that, they decide it is their duty as a christian to rid the world of the this "disgusting filth".

.

You must not remember the movement spearheaded by Tipper Gore (remember Al Gore? The Democrat? That's his wife) called the PMRC (the Parents Music Resource Centre) that advocated the banning of certain recording artists like Madonna and Prince for their "explicit" lyrics. Their continued lobbying forced the industry to begin labeling CD's with the warning stickers else they faced legislation that would require them to drop certain artists. This was in effect, a form of censorship. Interestingly enough, it was the liberals this time not the christian right squeeling that records had become too risque.

The Village Voice once advocated the banning of Nine Inch Nails and Marilyn Manson after the debacle in Colorado.

Its not the all the christian fundies. There is a strong liberal contingent that advocates censorship as well. Blaming this one on christians, with no indication that the religious right was even involved might be jumping to conclusions.

 

[Guest]

athiests

Camel toe?

 

[carsonshepherd]

Camel toe?

okay.... now that was funny....

 

[Guest]

okay.... now that was funny....

Really?

 

[Lisa Denton]

I didn't see the whole thing, was there some link I missed? WTF are you all talking about? I can see the freedom of speech connection but everything else is just the same old crap.

The parents of these kids didn't want nothing to do with them since they tuned 5 and wasn't fun to play with anymore.

Of course they send them to school for the school to teach them to be human beings, to teach them right from wrong, to teach them whatever the school decides they should know. If the local school decides they shouldn't be making songs with bad words about all the sex, drugs, and violence they do then well of course the parents think the school should tell them to do that stuff and then not sing about it.

Its not the schools job to teach them about history, math, reading, writing, or science. They should teach them to wear a condom and not talk about getting high and fucking and fighting each other.

The school is just doing thier job, trying to raise these kids however they see fit. If you don't like it you never should have told the teachers to quit teaching basic skills, and teach the kids thier moral values. Since you either have no moral values or don't want to waste your time dealing with some snot-nosed brats, some of which happen to be yours, then shut the fuck up and let the schools raise your kids however they want.

 

[Quiet_Cool]

I didn't see the whole thing, was there some link I missed? WTF are you all talking about? I can see the freedom of speech connection but everything else is just the same old crap.

The parents of these kids didn't want nothing to do with them since they tuned 5 and wasn't fun to play with anymore.

Of course they send them to school for the school to teach them to be human beings, to teach them right from wrong, to teach them whatever the school decides they should know. If the local school decides they shouldn't be making songs with bad words about all the sex, drugs, and violence they do then well of course the parents think the school should tell them to do that stuff and then not sing about it.

Its not the schools job to teach them about history, math, reading, writing, or science. They should teach them to wear a condom and not talk about getting high and fucking and fighting each other.

The school is just doing thier job, trying to raise these kids however they see fit. If you don't like it you never should have told the teachers to quit teaching basic skills, and teach the kids thier moral values. Since you either have no moral values or don't want to waste your time dealing with some snot-nosed brats, some of which happen to be yours, then shut the fuck up and let the schools raise your kids however they want.

Wow.

That rant deserves it's own license plate.

Q_C

 

[Weird Harold]

High school students may have made the CD, but it was not made at the school, nor was any school equipment used.

Just from the facts given in the article, I hope that school district has a large budget for legal judgements. I can't see any reason the school should have any jurisdiction in this matter and is definitely violating the students civil rights.

The school district's only hope is that the students violated some school policy by selling or distributing the CD on school property, but there is no hint of that in the article.

 

[lucky-E-leven]

Looks to me like the school's doing everything for the sake of removing them from any liability of violence &/or slander issues. School's not the same place it was before kids started shooting it up.

As far as I can tell, the only mistake the kids made was overdistribution. Not that you can blame them, when I was that age things didn't seem real unless done to the extreme anyway.

~lucky

 

[Rhys]

Re: Re: Freedom of Speech?

Just from the facts given in the article, I hope that school district has a large budget for legal judgements. I can't see any reason the school should have any jurisdiction in this matter and is definitely violating the students civil rights.

The school district's only hope is that the students violated some school policy by selling or distributing the CD on school property, but there is no hint of that in the article.

Exactly. The ACLU could have a field day with this one.

 

[lucky-E-leven]

Re: Re: Freedom of Speech?

The school district's only hope is that the students violated some school policy by selling or distributing the CD on school property, but there is no hint of that in the article.

I agree with you, but I also know how over the top public schools became after incidents like Columbine, etc. I think the moment any kind of violence is mentioned they are justified in at least investigating it. The burden of proof falls on them, of course, to show that the students making the c.d. or being mentioned in accordance with the violence are actual students of that school, but if it were to go uninvestigated and result in incident, they'd own a decent share of the responsibility.

~lucky

 

[Lisa Denton]

Wow.

That rant deserves it's own license plate.

Q_C

He, he. I was lookin for a heated discussion, no takers huh?

 

[Guest]

It happened in Rhode Island so I don't give a fuck.

Perdita

 

[carsonshepherd]

It happened in Rhode Island so I don't give a fuck.

Perdita

I Perdita....

 

[Quiet_Cool]

He, he. I was lookin for a heated discussion, no takers huh?

I'm game for one too, but I can't argue with you on this. Who could? Not all parents are that bad, but enough are...

Q_C

 

[Lisa Denton]

I'm game for one too, but I can't argue with you on this. Who could? Not all parents are that bad, but enough are...

Q_C

Yea, I know. I wasn't really lookin for a fight, just a friendly playful wrestlin match. I think Mum perdita said it right though, I mean, who knows what really goes on there? And do they really think we are going to fall for the idea that there is a state named Rhode Island?

 

[Guest]

Its not the schools job to teach them about history, math, reading, writing, or science.

 

[cheerful_deviant]

Re: Re: Freedom of Speech?

Just from the facts given in the article, I hope that school district has a large budget for legal judgements. I can't see any reason the school should have any jurisdiction in this matter and is definitely violating the students civil rights.

The school district's only hope is that the students violated some school policy by selling or distributing the CD on school property, but there is no hint of that in the article.

These were my thoughts exactly upon reading this article. The only justification that I can see the school has for their actions is that the CD was sold on school grounds. Otherwise I think they may have overstepped their bounds.