France crippled by protesters over pension reform

[BabyBoomer50s]

France is preparing to raise the retirement age from 62 to 64 and its obscenely dependent citizenry is not happy. Get ready America. Demographics, actuarial tables, and the structure of our national income redistribution program are converging. Prepare for screamers in the streets when politicians in both parties are forced to deal with it.

https://www.npr.org/2023/03/07/1161...try-to-a-standstill-to-protest-pension-reform

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64870836

 

[Lazaran]

BabyBoobs is VERY “concerned” about everything except THE FOX “NEWS” SCANDAL.

BabyBoobs also was VERY “concerned” about the TWITTER FAILS..

BabyBoobs

 

[JohnEngelman]

The French have guaranteed five week vacations and 35 hour work weeks. That sounds good to me.

 

[Chobham]

France is preparing to raise the retirement age from 62 to 64 and its obscenely dependent citizenry is not happy. Get ready America. Demographics, actuarial tables, and the structure of our national income redistribution program are converging. Prepare for screamers in the streets when politicians in both parties are forced to deal with it.

https://www.npr.org/2023/03/07/1161...try-to-a-standstill-to-protest-pension-reform

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64870836

This is the only reason I can think of that the democrats (and some republicans) are perfectly content with allowing the illegals to flood our nation. I think that they believe that eventually, by shear weight of numbers, that we will be forced to give them a path to citizenship. They will then be part of the system and be legally paying into SS, Medicare, and Medicaid. And there is a certain logic to the notion. While their contributions won't be quality (dollar contributed by individual) they might make up the shortfall in volume.

But there is a fallacy in this approach, an approach that France and Germany tried starting in the late 1970's when their looming demographic disaster was going to jeopardize their safety net programs. All the wholesale immigration did was kick the can down the road and seriously imperiled their culture. The other aspect of it was that the immigrants they took in were much like those crossing our border, they were uneducated, unskilled, and unhealthy. All of which merely shifted the costs to the other safety net programs they had put in place. In other words they merely moved the deficit spending to a new cost center on the national balance sheet.

In a nation that has evolved to a relatively high technological society the uneducated and unskilled have very little to contribute meaningfully. The Australian program of immigration based on merit points makes a hell of a lot more sense. Today there is 1.9 job openings for every available job applicant. Those jobs aren't being filled because they require skills that the illegals don't have and it is unlikely that they ever will. Those openings exist because the 'boomers' are retiring en mass and taking their experience, skills, and knowledge with them and their aren't enough X'ers and millennials to fill the void.

I don't think that there will be rioting in the streets if congress decides to raise contributions or the eligibility age, but there's going to be a bunch of pissed off X'ers and millennials.

 

[DeluxAuto]

This is the only reason I can think of that the democrats (and some republicans) are perfectly content with allowing the illegals to flood our nation. I think that they believe that eventually, by shear weight of numbers, that we will be forced to give them a path to citizenship. They will then be part of the system and be legally paying into SS, Medicare, and Medicaid. And there is a certain logic to the notion. While their contributions won't be quality (dollar contributed by individual) they might make up the shortfall in volume.

But there is a fallacy in this approach, an approach that France and Germany tried starting in the late 1970's when their looming demographic disaster was going to jeopardize their safety net programs. All the wholesale immigration did was kick the can down the road and seriously imperiled their culture. The other aspect of it was that the immigrants they took in were much like those crossing our border, they were uneducated, unskilled, and unhealthy. All of which merely shifted the costs to the other safety net programs they had put in place. In other words they merely moved the deficit spending to a new cost center on the national balance sheet.

In a nation that has evolved to a relatively high technological society the uneducated and unskilled have very little to contribute meaningfully. The Australian program of immigration based on merit points makes a hell of a lot more sense. Today there is 1.9 job openings for every available job applicant. Those jobs aren't being filled because they require skills that the illegals don't have and it is unlikely that they ever will. Those openings exist because the 'boomers' are retiring en mass and taking their experience, skills, and knowledge with them and their aren't enough X'ers and millennials to fill the void.

I don't think that there will be rioting in the streets if congress decides to raise contributions or the eligibility age, but there's going to be a bunch of pissed off X'ers and millennials.

Your predictions are garbage so we are not worried.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

This is the only reason I can think of that the democrats (and some republicans) are perfectly content with allowing the illegals to flood our nation. I think that they believe that eventually, by shear weight of numbers, that we will be forced to give them a path to citizenship. They will then be part of the system and be legally paying into SS, Medicare, and Medicaid. And there is a certain logic to the notion. While their contributions won't be quality (dollar contributed by individual) they might make up the shortfall in volume.

But there is a fallacy in this approach, an approach that France and Germany tried starting in the late 1970's when their looming demographic disaster was going to jeopardize their safety net programs. All the wholesale immigration did was kick the can down the road and seriously imperiled their culture. The other aspect of it was that the immigrants they took in were much like those crossing our border, they were uneducated, unskilled, and unhealthy. All of which merely shifted the costs to the other safety net programs they had put in place. In other words they merely moved the deficit spending to a new cost center on the national balance sheet.

In a nation that has evolved to a relatively high technological society the uneducated and unskilled have very little to contribute meaningfully. The Australian program of immigration based on merit points makes a hell of a lot more sense. Today there is 1.9 job openings for every available job applicant. Those jobs aren't being filled because they require skills that the illegals don't have and it is unlikely that they ever will. Those openings exist because the 'boomers' are retiring en mass and taking their experience, skills, and knowledge with them and their aren't enough X'ers and millennials to fill the void.

I don't think that there will be rioting in the streets if congress decides to raise contributions or the eligibility age, but there's going to be a bunch of pissed off X'ers and millennials.

Interesting perspective. Smart, legal, merit-based immigration policies would help with the SS/Medicare problem, but there doesn’t seem to be much traction from either party on that. Reagan and Tip O’Neil rolled their sleeves up and got past partisan divides back in the 80s to keep the system afloat. At some point very soon, leaders will have no choice but to do the same. Retirement age, tax hikes and benefits are all on the table.

 

[Chobham]

Interesting perspective. Smart, legal, merit-based immigration policies would help with the SS/Medicare problem, but there doesn’t seem to be much traction from either party on that. Reagan and Tip O’Neil rolled their sleeves up and got past partisan divides back in the 80s to keep the system afloat. At some point very soon, leaders will have no choice but to do the same. Retirement age, tax hikes and benefits are all on the table.

I give that zero chance under this administration.

 

[Lazaran]

And that ^ exchange between Chobby and BabyBoobs is why they call it the RWCJ.

Chobby and BabyBoobs

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

And that ^ exchange between Chobby and BabyBoobs is why they call it the RWCJ.

Chobby and BabyBoobs

Republican Women for Cannabis Justice

 

[Chernosoth]

Between 64 and France's life expectancy in the 80s is still a long retirement. But now there are several factors adding up to shorter lives. France's greater use of nuclear energy irradiates the land and water. Among the jabs' various effects, the suppressed immune system is less able to stop cancer. Now there is "turbo cancer." In a nuked nation, that could keep the gravediggers busy for a while.

 

[Chobham]

Between 64 and France's life expectancy in the 80s is still a long retirement. But now there are several factors adding up to shorter lives. France's greater use of nuclear energy irradiates the land and water. Among the jabs' various effects, the suppressed immune system is less able to stop cancer. Now there is "turbo cancer." In a nuked nation, that could keep the gravediggers busy for a while.

Right?

This is the demographic profile for France.

Profile

Two things to note from the profile. The first being that males out number females. That is abnormal.

The second is the 'stove pipe' profile. Virtually all of the Western nations 'safety net/retirement' programs are based on the notion that there will always be more, and ever increasing, numbers paying into the system than are withdrawing. Not unlike out own SS system they are all Ponzi schemes, just more generous. Their unemployment rate is about 7.3% and likely to increase.

But somehow the point of the OP flew over your head. It's not the retiree's that are rioting.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

BabyBoobs is VERY “concerned” about everything except THE FOX “NEWS” SCANDAL.

BabyBoobs also was VERY “concerned” about the TWITTER FAILS..

BabyBoobs

Perhaps someday there will be an active thread about whatever it is that has you so worked up.

 

[Chernosoth]

But somehow the point of the OP flew over your head. It's not the retiree's that are rioting.

Rioters are generally young everywhere. Some of the youth have probably realized there won't be any retirement for them, anywhere in Europe or the US. That will be a forgotten luxury of formerly wealthy nations.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Rioters are generally young everywhere. Some of the youth have probably realized there won't be any retirement for them, anywhere in Europe or the US. That will be a forgotten luxury of formerly wealthy nations.

Except for those who plan, save, and invest for their retirement.

 

[PastMaster]

Except for those who plan, save, and invest for their retirement.

That's an incredibly middle class and outdated attitude.

I would hate to be young now. With the way the economies everywhere are going its difficult enough to make enough money to make a living and live day to day. Property prices are so high that many, certainly here in the UK, will never be able to afford to buy a home. There are huge swathes of the population living hand to mouth and telling them that they need to plan save and invest for their retirement is just insulting.

You need a degree to be a toilet cleaner these days - so doing what your parents told you doing well at school is no guarantee that you will get anything other than a massive debt around your neck when you leave.

In the same instant I both hate and admire the french - I hate them because all their politics seem to be driven by a revolution mentality - if the people dont get what they want - they take to the streets and blockade and do violence until they do - I admire them for exactly the same reason.

So- Mr Baby boomer - who lived through an age where you could plan, and save and invest for your retirement - good for you. You managed it.
I too - being of the same generation also managed to do so.

In todays economy, it's not so easy.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

That's an incredibly middle class and outdated attitude.

I would hate to be young now. With the way the economies everywhere are going its difficult enough to make enough money to make a living and live day to day. Property prices are so high that many, certainly here in the UK, will never be able to afford to buy a home. There are huge swathes of the population living hand to mouth and telling them that they need to plan save and invest for their retirement is just insulting.

You need a degree to be a toilet cleaner these days - so doing what your parents told you doing well at school is no guarantee that you will get anything other than a massive debt around your neck when you leave.

In the same instant I both hate and admire the french - I hate them because all their politics seem to be driven by a revolution mentality - if the people dont get what they want - they take to the streets and blockade and do violence until they do - I admire them for exactly the same reason.

So- Mr Baby boomer - who lived through an age where you could plan, and save and invest for your retirement - good for you. You managed it.
I too - being of the same generation also managed to do so.

In todays economy, it's not so easy.

It can be done. My grown millennial kids are on solid paths toward comfortable retirement in their golden years. Same with my nephews and nieces. Saving and investing is part of the equation. Marriage, career choices, lifestyle decisions, tax deferred retirement accounts, tax planning, and finding work in lower cost parts of the country make a big difference as well.

 

[PastMaster]

It can be done. My grown millennial kids are on solid paths toward comfortable retirement in their golden years. Same with my nephews and nieces. Saving and investing is part of the equation. Marriage, career choices, lifestyle decisions, tax deferred retirement accounts, tax planning, and finding work in lower cost parts of the country make a big difference as well.

I never said it couldnt be done, I said its much more difficult for those today than it was for us

I also have no doubt that your millenial kids had assistance from their boomer parents. Like i said Middle class. There are families out there who dream of having enough money to eat and keep a roof over their heads. Saving is a pipe dream. and it's only getting worse.

My Energy bill has near tripled in the last 12 months - I've gone from paying just over £140 per month to nearly £500 per month. Fortunately I can stand it - others are having to make a choice between eating and heating.

 

[Chernosoth]

It can be done. My grown millennial kids are on solid paths toward comfortable retirement in their golden years. Same with my nephews and nieces. Saving and investing is part of the equation. Marriage, career choices, lifestyle decisions, tax deferred retirement accounts, tax planning, and finding work in lower cost parts of the country make a big difference as well.

You need to believe that because you're not ready to admit your kids' future is a shit sandwich. Staying out of debt is always a good idea, but most of that planning and saving may add up to nothing in a currency collapse, runaway inflation, or a messy mix of both. We probably will have one of those. And there are worse possibilities. Maybe they see that coming and buy gold, and have their gold stolen. When most people don't have money, who does have some is soon obvious. The people with a better chance of being relatively OK stock up on tradeable practical skills: growing food, repairing commonly used items, healthcare, brewing beer, etc.