Flaws you can't unsee in great stories and how to fix them.

[SimonDoom]

Everything wrong: It was made in the first place.

How to fix it: Tequila

Television should have an interactive "expunge" feature, so when you really hate a character you can push a button and watch the person blow up on screen. That and tequila might have made ROP, well, not watchable exactly, but maybe worth it for the pyrotechnics.

 

[onehitwanda]

Television should have an interactive "expunge" feature, so when you really hate a character you can push a button and watch the person blow up on screen. That and tequila might have made ROP, well, not watchable exactly, but maybe worth it for the pyrotechnics.

Jar Jar Binks would have died a billion deaths by now.

 

[Lathanar1]

I'll see your Rings of Power Series and raise you Wheel of Time Series.

 

[SimonDoom]

Jar Jar Binks would have died a billion deaths by now.

Yes, and blowing up would be too quick and kind. For some characters you need the "Eaten by bullet ants" button.

 

[onehitwanda]

Yes, and blowing up would be too quick and kind. For some characters you need the "Eaten by bullet ants" button.

Drowned in monkey semen seems more fitting.

 

[Bamagan]

Drowned in monkey semen seems more fitting.

Well, they're not monkeys, but we might be able to arrange a pornographic parody/mash-up with the Planet of the Apes series...

 

[onehitwanda]

Well, they're not monkeys, but we might be able to arrange a pornographic parody/mash-up with the Planet of the Apes series...

Why do I suddenly hear Also sprach Zarathustra?

 

[jehoram]

Another fundamental flaw of this interpretation is that it undermines Michael's story arc. If Fredo actually knowingly tried to assassinate Michael, then Michael would be justified in killing him. But we are supposed to feel at the end of Godfather 2 that Michael has gone beyond justification. He eliminates anybody who presents even a small threat to the "family," which at that point is just himself. It's important to feel the wrongness of his assassination of his brother.

I think that in their last conversation, Fredo told Michael that the gunmen were only supposed to scare Michael into making that arrangement with Hyman Roth and his lackey Johnny Ola. He claimed that he didn't know that it was a serious assassination attempt. That was why he expected forgiveness.

Michael's decision to have Fredo whacked was that he could no longer trust him. Fredo had demonstrated a willingness to work with Michael's enemies, and that made him an enemy, too. Remember Michael's speech in the first Godfather movie? "Fredo, you're my brother and I love you. But never take sides against the family again." But Fredo did just that. Just as Carlo had been whacked even though he may not have realized that his action would cause Sonny to be led into a fatal ambush. Once you move against the family, you're a dead man. Only the fact that his mother was alive allowed him to stay alive for so long.

One more thing. To a Corleone, family was everything. So whacking Fredo was like cutting his own arm off. When I got to see the re-cut of Godfather III (which was an improvement, BTW), I noted that Michael's press agent was Dominic Abbandando. Dominic was obviously a descendant of Genco Abbandando, Vito's first consiglieri and, like Enzo the Baker, a long-time associate of the Corleones who was treated as part of the extended family that Michael had accumulated over the years and were nearly as important to him as his relations.

 

[SimonDoom]

I think that in their last conversation, Fredo told Michael that the gunmen were only supposed to scare Michael into making that arrangement with Hyman Roth and his lackey Johnny Ola. He claimed that he didn't know that it was a serious assassination attempt. That was why he expected forgiveness.

That's not what he said. As I recall, all he said was something like "I didn't know it was going to be a hit." There was no mention of trying to "scare" Michael. There was no mention of assisting the gunmen. That's extrapolating something from the screenplay text that isn't really there.

This theory makes no sense, either. Fredo is going to allow gunmen with machine guns onto the property to fire into Michael's bedroom to "scare" him. That's preposterous. Scare him for what reason? And then they do scare him, and he kills them? He couldn't kill anybody. None of it makes any sense whatsoever. It doesn't fit with what we know of the characters and it doesn't make sense as a plot point when you really think about it.



My objection stands: what we are given in the screenplay simply isn't enough to support what we're supposed to understand. And I don't believe Coppola ever fully thought it through. It's a hole in the plot.

 

[SerenaSteeleMonroe]

I think that in their last conversation, Fredo told Michael that the gunmen were only supposed to scare Michael into making that arrangement with Hyman Roth and his lackey Johnny Ola. He claimed that he didn't know that it was a serious assassination attempt. That was why he expected forgiveness.

Michael's decision to have Fredo whacked was that he could no longer trust him. Fredo had demonstrated a willingness to work with Michael's enemies, and that made him an enemy, too. Remember Michael's speech in the first Godfather movie? "Fredo, you're my brother and I love you. But never take sides against the family again." But Fredo did just that. Just as Carlo had been whacked even though he may not have realized that his action would cause Sonny to be led into a fatal ambush. Once you move against the family, you're a dead man. Only the fact that his mother was alive allowed him to stay alive for so long.

One more thing. To a Corleone, family was everything. So whacking Fredo was like cutting his own arm off. When I got to see the re-cut of Godfather III (which was an improvement, BTW), I noted that Michael's press agent was Dominic Abbandando. Dominic was obviously a descendant of Genco Abbandando, Vito's first consiglieri and, like Enzo the Baker, a long-time associate of the Corleones who was treated as part of the extended family that Michael had accumulated over the years and were nearly as important to him as his relations.

The Godfather was a wonderfully written book. Mario Puzo claimed he had no knowledge of the Mafia and learned about it from research. But the fact that Puzo was raised in Hell's Kitchen, when it was hell, suggests that maybe that isn't true. I can't remember if any of the books better explain the betrayal.

 

[jehoram]

That's not what he said. As I recall, all he said was something like "I didn't know it was going to be a hit." There was no mention of trying to "scare" Michael. There was no mention of assisting the gunmen. That's extrapolating something from the screenplay text that isn't really there.

This theory makes no sense, either. Fredo is going to allow gunmen with machine guns onto the property to fire into Michael's bedroom to "scare" him. That's preposterous. Scare him for what reason? And then they do scare him, and he kills them? He couldn't kill anybody. None of it makes any sense whatsoever. It doesn't fit with what we know of the characters and it doesn't make sense as a plot point when you really think about it.



My objection stands: what we are given in the screenplay simply isn't enough to support what we're supposed to understand. And I don't believe Coppola ever fully thought it through. It's a hole in the plot.

I see your point. That's something that Coppola and Puzo should have made clearer. It is hard to understand why Fredo would have let them into the compound just to have them rough Michael up a little or maybe just demonstrate how his security would not protect him if Roth ordered the hit.

 

[jehoram]

The Godfather was a wonderfully written book. Mario Puzo claimed he had no knowledge of the Mafia and learned about it from research. But the fact that Puzo was raised in Hell's Kitchen, when it was hell, suggests that maybe that isn't true. I can't remember if any of the books better explain the betrayal.

I agree that if you grew up in Hell's Kitchen, you would have at least known that the Mafia existed, even if you didn't know its structure, which could be found when he researched it.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Maybe I'm forgetting something about Terminator 2.

How did T1000 do it? (the time travel)

I don't recall that ever being explained; I suspect the guiding principle was "liquid metal is neat so fuck what we said last time".

 

[Britva415]

I don't recall that ever being explained; I suspect the guiding principle was "liquid metal is neat so fuck what we said last time".

Well NOW I can't unsee it

 

[Bramblethorn]

Television should have an interactive "expunge" feature, so when you really hate a character you can push a button and watch the person blow up on screen. That and tequila might have made ROP, well, not watchable exactly, but maybe worth it for the pyrotechnics.

It would make the TV news interesting.

 

[ShamBaLa]

Saving Private Ryan. There's a dozen errors but the long shot of Miller and his team crossing a field shows 8 men when one had already been killed in the assault on the machine gun on a hill. Should be 7 men.

 

[~Elizabeth~]

No

 

[SerenaSteeleMonroe]

Saving Private Ryan. There's a dozen errors but the long shot of Miller and his team crossing a field shows 8 men when one had already been killed in the assault on the machine gun on a hill. Should be 7 men.

Have you never heard of the rapid cloning technology used to replace fallen comrades? Oops, wrong genre for that. My mistake.

 

[Zootonius]

The Imitation Game

Virtually everything in the movie is wrong. Turing wasn't ostracized by his colleagues, he was highly respected by his peers (He was Britain's leading mathematician!) He didn't build the bombes, he just designed them. Commander Denniston doesn't reluctantly accept Turing, he personally went to Cambridge to recruit him. The errors are endless.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

The Imitation Game

Virtually everything in the movie is wrong. Turing wasn't ostracized by his colleagues, he was highly respected by his peers (He was Britain's leading mathematician!) He didn't build the bombes, he just designed them. Commander Denniston doesn't reluctantly accept Turing, he personally went to Cambridge to recruit him. The errors are endless.

Well, those would be different types of errors. They are not plot holes, merely historical inaccuracies (I assume, I don't know the history as you might) which is fine in a dramatized fiction.