First time writer. Would like some feedback.

[cutegirl15]

Hi everyone,

This is my first time writing an erotic story and iwas wondering if i could get some feedback from people about how i have done....I'm not really sure what makes an erotic story successful so any advice would be appreciated. There is a link to the story below. It's called an eventful first meeting.

Many Thanks

http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=482003

 

[seth6138]

I'll read it right now..

 

[cutegirl15]

Why thank you.

 

[justcruisin]

will read it too.....!

 

[cutegirl15]

Thanks...hopefully will get some feedback...worrying a bit that it is so bad no one can even bear to critique :s lol.

 

[polynices]

Here are a few impressions after one reading - though I'll have to go through it again to quote, of course:

1. The writing is certainly competent. There was nothing in the style, phrasing, grammar etc. that tripped me or put me off.

2. I thought the opening was strong. I liked the shortish sentences of the first two paragraphs and, although I was thinking 'Oh-oh! Romance!' from the beginning, (you'll gather Romance isn't really my thing) I thought you'd avoided cliche in those paragraphs.

For me, The clock seemed to loom over her. is a strong opening (though, perhaps,The clock loomed over her. would be more concrete? More immediate?)

I liked: Her heart danced faster. There's a cliche threatening there, of course ('Her heart beat faster.') but it doesn't happen. Danced makes the sentence work. It keeps it fresh. It's physical.

3. I liked the description through selected detail in paragraph 2. E.g.

Businessmen shook hands. Mothers carried bundled children and mountainous bags while running for trains. Another minute had passed.

4. My first wobble was here:

She was tired of men who acted like boys and didn't know how to give her what she wanted. She had been hurt and damaged too many times. Her value was at an all time low.

For me, this is cliche and I reacted against it. However, I realise it isn't out of place within the Romance genre (and I don't doubt that some women actually feel like that) .

5. I was a touch confused when I got to:

Tentatively she logged on.

For a little while I thought she was using a laptop in the railway station. It took me a while to realise it was flashback. So perhaps that transition could be made just a little plainer.

6. I liked the stuff about her initial uncertainty in the chatroom. It struck me as authentic.

7. I had two separate responses to this sentence:

None of these men, clearly there just to have a wank while their wives were asleep, would go anywhere towards satisfying the deep curiosity and desire that was burning within her.

a) Up to this point the piece could have been a mainstream romance story, so I was almost disappointed by clearly there just to have a wank - not, I hasten to add, that I have any objection to wanking or to references to it. I suppose what I mean is just that this is the moment when the story finally turns from being mainstream Romance to 'Literotica Erotica' and I wondered, in this case, if you actually needed to go down the erotica route at all. It seems to me that this could be a 'straight' and possibly sellable women's magazine story if the emphasis is changed a bit. BUT that really is just an observation. It isn't meant as a criticism of the story as it stands, and maybe I'm out of touch with modern women's magazines anyway. (Perhaps wanking is acceptable to them nowadays.)

b) None of these men ... would go anywhere towards satisfying the deep curiosity and desire that was burning within her.

Again, I felt this was cliche. (That doesn't mean it's inauthentic, by the way. I'm sure people do feel like that. It's the language that expresses the feeling that's stale, not the feeling itself.)

8. She lingered for a few moments longer watching the replies flick past on the screen. The name 'Teacher' popped up suddenly.

I found this a shade alarming for a moment, with its possible overtone of cyberstalking and 'grooming'. I was reassured when I got to:

She thought that she liked the irony as she had just qualified as a teacher herself.

9. I wonder about the overall value of the online conversation, though. It seems a shade perfunctory. I started out expecting a lot from it but you left the chatroom flashback earlier than I'd thought you would. I think you could either make much more of their developing relationship online - with all the doubts and shifts of sympathy that entails - or just reduce it to a few sentences. ('They'd met online. She'd been uncertain at first, but eventually he won her over.')

10. I liked the final detail in this sentence:

She sighed into his chest with relief. Finally, he was here with her. He extracted her from his arms and took her hand in his, rubbing the joint between her thumb and forefinger gently.

I think, again, that gives a sense of authenticity.

11. From this moment: "Let's go to the hotel sweetheart." I didn't like the man. I disliked his self-confidence; his control. (Again that isn't criticism. It's simply my response.)

12. The Sex: I'm afraid I have a problem with most of the sex scenes on Literotica. I usually find them predictable and I often skip over them. I think it's extremely difficult to write fresh and arresting sex scenes. The language used in them so often seems derivative. (I don't exclude my own stories from that criticism by the way.) I wonder if it's more exciting to write a sex scene than to read one?

What I'm getting round to is it that I found myself skipping through the sex scene in this story. However, I doubt that I'm a representative reader in this. Without the sex it wouldn't have been an erotic story and you'd have had howls of complaint from readers.

OK, those were first thoughts. Here's a sort of summation:

As I said, I liked the opening paragraphs and they were fresh enough to keep me with you despite my recognition that we were in my unfavourite Romance territory. As the story went on there seemed to be more cliche, but that's probably acceptable in Romance.

I have a suspicion that there are interesting themes going on 'beneath' the surface story. As I said earlier, the whole business of cyber seduction could be explored - and the early stages of the chatroom scene indicate that you may have considerable insight into that - into, for example, the issues of fantasy (the chatroom persona) vs. reality (the in person meeting in cold daylight).

(I came across a new - for me - phrase the other day, by the way: 'dramaturgical consciousness': the way people nowadays are said to be developing dramatized personae via the internet, Facebook etc. I think there's a promising topic to be developed there, for anyone who wants to take it on.)

The second possible theme is male dominance/female submission. I said earlier that I disliked the male character from the outset, but I don't think I'm meant to. Your early statement - She was tired of men who acted like boys and didn't know how to give her what she wanted. - is presumably the clue. Does this woman character want to be 'mastered'?

- "Come here beautiful." She obeyed him almost without thought ...

- "Feels as good as I imagined," he threw a quite smile, "now are you going to give me what I want baby?" Without waiting for an answer his hands moved to the front of her thighs, lifting her short denim skirt ...

- "Well?" He paused, "Do you want me to fuck you? Is that why?" She could barely let out a gasp of a yes. "Tell me what you want." "I want you to fuck me." The words escaped her lips as a high pitched moan.

- "Come on baby, cum for me." Whether it was being given permission or the hard friction of him within her she could feel herself cum almost immediately onto his cock.

I have to admit that I'm probably very unrepresentative in finding this perplexing. If you get any more responses (I hope you do) people may well howl at my lack of insight here. But I don't really understand how the woman can be so passive in this new-to-them-both situation and the man so active/dominant.

That certainly isn't a criticism of the story as it stands - it's merely my own, probably oddball, response. But I do wonder if their initial encounter might have been more nuanced - more subtly modulated in the exchanges between them - power and otherwise - than is presented here.

I hope that was helpful. I think the one thing it probably demonstrates is the cliche that readers come in different shapes and sizes - and, as I said, I'm probably an odd shaped reader. Oh, and I definitely hope you keep on writing. This piece is certainly evidence that there's something worthwhile going on, as far as I can see.

- polynices

 

[cutegirl15]

wow thanks so much for the detailed response. You have certainly picked up on some things that i myself thought about when i was writing the story.

"For me, The clock seemed to loom over her. is a strong opening (though, perhaps,The clock loomed over her. would be more concrete? More immediate?)"

I agree with this totally. Sometimes you can't hear the words in your own head.

5. I was a touch confused when I got to:

Tentatively she logged on.

For a little while I thought she was using a laptop in the railway station. It took me a while to realise it was flashback. So perhaps that transition could be made just a little plainer.

Also with this...same thing...i can easily change this and totally agree with you that perhaps it isn't fully clear.

What was most interesting was your comments on the whole online thing. When i first wrote the story i had included a lot more about the online communication but i removed it because i felt that it didn't read well and that it seemed kind of cheesy...but that's food for thought. Perhaps i should explore further or maybe explore again in another story. I like the idea of 'dramaturgical consciousness'...it's actually something that really bothers me (in my general dya to day life - the horror of facebook!)and could be fruitful in terms of writing.

I'm divided on the whole male character thing...on one hand reading it over with parts you have highlighted...i think that in the story here their interaction doesn't actually make sense to a certain degree. I think because the character is based on a real life person. I have more knowledge of his personality and this has perhaps come through in a way that is not appropriate...as you would (possibly not) feel that way about someone on first meeting. It's difficult...but something i shall certainly keep in mind as i would like to write more. In retrospect a toned down version might be more appropriate to leave room for development in the relationship...i just get carried away and can't help myself

The sex scenes...i'm afraid i agree with you in that there isn't really any way to make them unique. I suppose in terms of audience maybe think whether is it romance or erotic fiction? But you know the distinction never occured to me because to me sex =romance. Even if it is of the dirtiest kind. Maybe i have to do some psychoanalysing of my own!

The word "wank" i did actually wonder whether to put that in at all because i felt that it jarred with the rest of the text...but i felt that it began to maybe convey a bit about the girl's personality and they way she saw things so i left it...bad decision..i don't know...

Thanks so much for taking the time. It really means a lot.
I've gained a lot of good pointers from your feedback already.

xxx

 

[Lien_Geller]

Some more feedback.

Hey there, I’m kind of apprehensive about following up polynices epic post up there. This isn't going to be as long or as helpful but here's a few things that struck me when reading your story.

Firstly I like the style of writing. It kind of reminds me of dialogue in old film noir movies. Short impactful sentences really draw the reader in and give it an almost poetic tone. Colour me impressed!

There were two things that bugged me however.

The first is a slight snag that has already been flagged up. The use of the words 'have a wank' by the narrator seem a little out of place. It stands out as odd alongside sentences such as 'Her heart danced faster' and 'She watched as lovers clung to each other; kissing through veils of tears...'

It’s like this:

‘The scintillating feathery touch of her fingertips was pure heaven as they played their way along his thoroughly aroused member. His eyes closed tightly with each warm wave of her breath that he felt caressing his skin. So then he flipped her over like a cheeseburger and put his schlong up her bum hole.’

Ok so yours isn’t nearly as bad as that but it helps to try and pick a tone and stick with it otherwise things can get slightly disillusioning. Your style is very powerful, almost epic even, so just be careful with what words you use because the higher you go the further you can fall down. This is of course a very minor snag in the story because I can only see it happening once but I just thought I’d mention it anyways.

Second is a bigger flaw but bear in mind this might just be my personal preferences coming into play here. If you just write to write sex then it’s fine. If you want your stories to have a little more depth however, then I’d really concentrate on characterisation. When readers aren’t told things about characters they usually assume the worst. She’s on the internet scouting for guys right? Bit of a slag then isn’t she? No? Why not? It would help to explain why this woman is feeling so vulnerable and why she’s gone to the internet to find a man.

Likewise the man has very little in the way of any kind of personality other than wanting to screw the woman. Again if you just like writing sex stories for the sex then that’s totally fine. If you’re looking to branch out then I would at least include some kind of conversation between them other than talk related to sex.

I’m not saying they should spend four pages talking about death and taxes of course but instead of telling me this guy can make funny jokes to put her at ease then show me. In fact one of the things that would make this story go from good to great would be to include the actual conversation they have over the internet. Again it doesn’t have to be pages and pages because the sex is what people show up here for after all. Just show me these guys have some personality, maybe a little back story.

Finally I’d just like to say that I enjoyed this and I don’t usually like this style of story. So if this is your first time writing then it’s very good and the sex was very hot. Also I’m a new writer myself and my writing has tonnes of problems with it so don’t feel you’re being critiqued by an expert here. Still, I hope you found this helpful and I hope you keep writing.

Lien Geller

 

[cutegirl15]

Thanks,

Every criticism is helpful i think because it helps you to see things through others eyes. I think what you have said is really important. I'm used to writing non-erotic fiction and so would usually add in more detail about personality etc but due to the nature of erotic writing i wasn't sure that it would be welcome. I guess it is about finding the correct line to take in the writing. I think that what i write will always be more story based than 'just sex' so maybe i can allow myself that bit more freedom to put in more detail.

I will have to read some of yours also.
Thanks very much for taking the time.

 

[polynices]

I'm used to writing non-erotic fiction and so would usually add in more detail about personality etc but due to the nature of erotic writing i wasn't sure that it would be welcome. I guess it is about finding the correct line to take in the writing. QUOTE]

I think this is the central problem with writing for Literotica. Nobody really knows the 'right' way to write erotica here. Erotic writing can certainly have lots of plot, background, atmosphere, character development and so on - but that won't necessarly go down well with all the punters. (Though it will with some.) Similarly, a straightforward 'stroke' story can be popular, but not with everybody. The standard advice is "write for yourself and don't worry about trying to second-guess readers' expectations" - and it's good advice, except that there's always a tendency to want to please readers. (There is for me, anyway, however much I try to resist it.)

So I think due to the nature of erotic writing nobody's sure what's welcome.

Welcome to a perpetual conundrum.

- polynices

 

[D_K_Moon]

Hi everyone,

This is my first time writing an erotic story and iwas wondering if i could get some feedback from people about how i have done....I'm not really sure what makes an erotic story successful so any advice would be appreciated. There is a link to the story below. It's called an eventful first meeting.

Many Thanks

http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=482003

It's more of a vignette than a story.

I think this story has been told many times before, and that's fine. It's a tried and true plot. Where your piece falters is due to its brevity. You don't really have time to tell much of the backstory, there's no space for your characters to develop.

It's a sweet little bit, but something I think you could have done so much more with.

 

[D_K_Moon]

I think this is the central problem with writing for Literotica. Nobody really knows the 'right' way to write erotica here.

While you may feel this comment describes you as a writer, I would have to disagree with completely. There is no right way to write anything, otherwise we would have one book, one story, and that's it.

There are plenty of writers here at Lit that are sucessful in their writing. I would include myself in this list. I know the right way for me to write an erotic story, and in this, I have no doubts.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Congrats on your first posting. No, it certainly doesn’t suck and I thought it was an impressive debut. I’d go along with much of polynices’s comments but will offer my two cents as well.

I thought the introduction great. The metaphor and description coupled with the staccato and questioning style conveyed her fretfulness at a busy station very well.

The middle passage when you talk about the chat sessions seemed to be lacking a bit of tension. IMO, this is the real key part and would have been better if written more in chat dialogue to show the relationship developing. The old story mantra, ‘show don’t tell’.

At the moment it is a bit rushed. There is no evolution where he gradually calms her fears and revives her hope in a face-to-face meeting. This could be done with conversation and we readers need it because we should be hoping as much as her that the hero will step off the train at the start of part three.

Dialogue here – and in part three – would add length but that’s no problem. At the moment the story is pretty short, almost a vignette, and you could add half again without exceeding a lit page.

As has been said, the flashback, always tricky, is a bit confusing. You need to telegraph this more so readers follow it immediately: either with a few asterisks (ungainly to my mind) or flagging the time shift for us. Perhaps;

She thought BACK to their first accidental encounter, the night six months ago when she HAD tentatively logged on. . .

I was a bit confused by the relevance of ‘Teacher’ and ‘someone who knows how to take of me’. By the end of part three I think I understand it’s to do with ceding control, but I’m not sure. Most of us make the mistake when we start writing of forgetting that the reader only understands what’s on the page, not the stuff that’s in our heads.

Again, to my mind, part three is a bit rushed. Doesn’t she suddenly have doubts when he’s finally there in the flesh? Doesn’t he have to be calm, masterful and caring to comfort her? A drink in the hotel bar where he tells her she doesn't have to go on, he wants more than a one-night stand. She overcomes her fears and makes her decision.

A sex scene is difficult to write. You have to deal with the physical mechanics of getting clothes off and manipulating and engaging the appropriate body parts, but this is hardly novel and not erotic. As driphoney said on another thread, to make a scene erotic you need to answer ‘why’ and deal with the emotional. Dialogue matters here, but the five senses (plus the sixth – brain) are the key.

Here, isn’t she conscious of his eyes on her nakedness, aroused by the slightly salty, masculine smell of his skin etc. Surely the scene needs a bit more build-up to show how the sex is the physical climax of an emotional ride – how he gives her something she’s been missing?

Sorry to go on so much. Feel free to ignore my comments but I do really like your writing and approach and look forward to reading more from you.

Well done.

Elle

 

[elfin_odalisque]

It's more of a vignette than a story.

I think this story has been many times before, and that's fine. It's a tried and true plot. Where your piece falters is due to its brevity. You don't really have time to tell much of the backstory, there's no space for your characters to develop.

It's a sweet little bit, but something I think you could have done so much more with.

Why can you say in six lines what I take a page to say less succinctly?

 

[cutegirl15]

I like the way this has started a little debate about the rhyme and reason behind writing.

Everyone's comments so far have been greatly helpful and the development of character is definitely what i'm picking up on as being the most important aspect to think about for the next thing i write. It's interesting because in general comments have been for more charcter development which i have shied away from a bit. However, i do think partly it is due to my impatience at having the story put down on paper. I shall endeavour to use more restraint next time!

This story was always meant to just be a short exploration into erotic fiction so the length is not so much an issue for me. I'd like to have a go at something a bit longer next time. Already the little wheels in my brain are turning.

It's really encouraging to get some really constructive criticism on my writing so thanks so much

btw Elle - some good advice on writing the sex part of the scene - i'm going to try and take tha forward into my next piece also
xx

 

[D_K_Moon]

Why can you say in six lines what I take a page to say less succinctly?

Oh that's easy, I just get up and blurt something out, sit down really fast and wait to listen to someone who really knows what they're talking about to take over. (Namely you, my friend.)

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Oh that's easy, I just get up and blurt something out, sit down really fast and wait to listen to someone who really knows what they're talking about to take over. (Namely you, my friend.)

Flattery is so seductive. Bet your wife keeps you under lock and key (she should).

So glad you're back.

 

[D_K_Moon]

Flattery is so seductive. Bet your wife keeps you under lock and key (she should).

So glad you're back.

And it's good to be back!