Feedback please on my BRIDE OF KONG mini-series

[Hypoxia]

Gentle Readers: One of my early accepted submissions here was my BRIDE OF KONG three-part series. The first two chapters seem fairly acceptable to me. The third chapter... well, it sucks. It needs a major re-think. I am open to any and all feedback, criticism, suggestions, anything except death threats. Thanks!

BRIDE OF KONG 01
BRIDE OF KONG 02
BRIDE OF KONG 03

Question: If a female human protagonist has sex with a mini-clone of Kong, is that bestiality?

 

[monoblanco]

Hi Pox!

It's hard to breath in here but I'll do my best

Are you only looking for critique / suggestions for the 3rd chapter or the whole thing?

I started with chapter one and a few things jumped out at me pretty quickly so I thought I'd stop and ask.

Oh, and in answer to your question about Kong, I would think, yes, that counts as bestiality but if chapters 1 and 2 got posted, someone (with actual authority, unlike me) doesn't agree.

And FYI, in case it adds anything to my editorial credibility, my nickname (and username) means monkey. Kong is sort of a distant cousin.

 

[Hypoxia]

Hi Pox!

It's hard to breath in here but I'll do my best

Slowly breathe in, breathe out, pass out, oh yeah. Hyperventilation takes so much more work.

Are you only looking for critique / suggestions for the 3rd chapter or the whole thing?

I started with chapter one and a few things jumped out at me pretty quickly so I thought I'd stop and ask.

Any and all feedback is welcome. BOK is my first totally fictional piece here and my storytelling shortcomings are probably evident.

Oh, and in answer to your question about Kong, I would think, yes, that counts as bestiality but if chapters 1 and 2 got posted, someone (with actual authority, unlike me) doesn't agree.

Only adult humans have sex in chapters 1 and 2. I wrote my (weak) chapter 3 specifically to avoid animal and underage sex. I'm exploring the possibility of a chapter 3 rewrite that includes sex with the mini-clone Kong, but I'm just not sure how to distinguish genetically modified 'animals' from nonhumans. The cinema Kong certainly wasn't just an ordinary animal, and neither is a gene-tweaked Kong clone-oid, especially if the Kong-oid has enhanced intelligence.

Another way to look at it: Suppose I write a cinema mashup where Kong (or Godzilla) and the 50-Foot Woman have sex. Is that bestiality? Yes, if the beasts are 'animals'. No, if the monsters are 'nonhuman'. I wonder if these distinctions are define anywhere here?

And FYI, in case it adds anything to my editorial credibility, my nickname (and username) means monkey. Kong is sort of a distant cousin.

Ah, you big old White Ape you!

 

[monoblanco]

How did you know?

White Ape is my other nickname!

Ok, so on to stories...

First off, I'm an editor by profession but am new to the boards here on Lit so am still learning the ropes. Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

Also, you are the author. They're your stories, so my suggestions are just that, suggestions. The decision of whether to accept them or not is yours.

That said, a few thoughts:

The use of perspective at the beginning of chapters one and two is odd. I understand what you're trying to do, but using a plot device to explain the surroundings to the reader is really tricky. It feels really off putting when you switch from 2nd to 3rd person just like that.

Instead, and I realize this would mean editing more than just chapter 3, I recommend using only one perspective to avoid confusing (and possibly annoying) your reader.

It seems like you're going for some level of either historical accuracy or a feeling that this story is in fact real, at least based on your intros.

If that is the case, you really want the reader to feel like he/she is there, or to believe that this story could really have happened, there are a lot of different plot devices you could use but any of them would mean essentially rewriting the entire thing.

Since all 3 chapters are posted to the site, quite frankly, my suggestion is to let them be. They're published, let them be done. I sometimes can't resist the urge to continuously tinker with stories. That's why I still haven't published anything on this damn site yet. But since it's already out there, I say, leave it alone.

I like your idea of similar stories you could follow up with. I would totally read the King King / 50 ft woman story. That sounds full of all kinds of potential. Not enough movie monster stories out there.

So, those are some initial thoughts without going through and actually editing your copy.

Your call.

 

[PennLady]

Only adult humans have sex in chapters 1 and 2. I wrote my (weak) chapter 3 specifically to avoid animal and underage sex. I'm exploring the possibility of a chapter 3 rewrite that includes sex with the mini-clone Kong, but I'm just not sure how to distinguish genetically modified 'animals' from nonhumans. The cinema Kong certainly wasn't just an ordinary animal, and neither is a gene-tweaked Kong clone-oid, especially if the Kong-oid has enhanced intelligence.

How are they genetically modified? That might make a difference. If they're just a gorilla that can talk, then it's still a gorilla and I would think that would count as bestiality. If they can become human, like a werewolf, that's different. But I'm not sure how you'd do that.

 

[Darkniciad]

I'd give it a high chance of being rejected as bestiality. A creature that occurs in nature requires some pretty serious modification before it will pass muster. It would have to be humanized well beyond the Kong character. I'm talking about Planet of the Apes level anthromorphic qualities including speech.

That's always appeared to be a major criteria line for bestiality on Lit. If it's a naturally occurring creature, there's a really high bar. If it's a well-established fantasy creature, ( dragon, naga, satyr, or even unicorn ) the bar is fairly low.

 

[Hypoxia]

How did you know?

White Ape is my other nickname!

Well, I know a wee bit of Spanish. I can translate mono (monkey) blanco (white) pretty easily.

... I recommend using only one perspective to avoid confusing (and possibly annoying) your reader.

It seems like you're going for some level of either historical accuracy or a feeling that this story is in fact real, at least based on your intros.

If that is the case, you really want the reader to feel like he/she is there, or to believe that this story could really have happened, there are a lot of different plot devices you could use but any of them would mean essentially rewriting the entire thing.

I originally conceived of BOK as a cinematic treatment. That "plot device" consists of establishing camera movements. I tried to isolate the "magic eye" segments; I only let the magic eye intrude directly into the narrative once, to gloss-over a funeral and mourning. Yeah, other tricks would require a total rewrite. I can't justify the effort of restructuring the story.

As for 'reality', this story is set in a universe where the KING KONG and JURASSIC PARK films are documentaries. I try to stay accurate to those pseudo-histories.

Since all 3 chapters are posted to the site, quite frankly, my suggestion is to let them be. They're published, let them be done. I sometimes can't resist the urge to continuously tinker with stories. That's why I still haven't published anything on this damn site yet. But since it's already out there, I say, leave it alone.

I may still do some minor cleanup-tinkering with chapters 1 and 2, but as I said, I'm fairly satisfied with those, enough so that I wouldn't restructure or extend them. Alas, I am *quite* unhappy with how I wrote chapter 3. I'd like to try some alternative endings. I just can't think of any right now, except to implicate a Kong mini-clone.

I like your idea of similar stories you could follow up with. I would totally read the King King / 50 ft woman story. That sounds full of all kinds of potential. Not enough movie monster stories out there.

I guess monster+human sex would be OK here at LIT, as long as body sizes are normalized: shrink the monster or enlarge the human. THE INCREDIBLE SHRINKING KONG! GODZILLA AND THE GIANT GO-GO GIRLS! Hmmm, I wonder how to sexualize THE CRAWLING EYE or THE THING?

So, those are some initial thoughts without going through and actually editing your copy.

Your call.

I would indeed like to see your detailed comments on the story. Thanks!

How are they genetically modified? That might make a difference. If they're just a gorilla that can talk, then it's still a gorilla and I would think that would count as bestiality. If they can become human, like a werewolf, that's different. But I'm not sure how you'd do that.

I should probably look for guidelines here. Or I could just submit the scene and see if it's rejected.

I'd give it a high chance of being rejected as bestiality. A creature that occurs in nature requires some pretty serious modification before it will pass muster. It would have to be humanized well beyond the Kong character. I'm talking about Planet of the Apes level anthromorphic qualities including speech.

That's always appeared to be a major criteria line for bestiality on Lit. If it's a naturally occurring creature, there's a really high bar. If it's a well-established fantasy creature, ( dragon, naga, satyr, or even unicorn ) the bar is fairly low.

I grok T.Rex or a velociraptor as a "naturally occurring creature". I'm not sure if Kong or Godzilla qualify. I'm not sure if their gene-tweaked descendants qualify. Hmmm, maybe I could just do an end-run around the bestiality issue and still satisfy the story requirement that a human woman becomes The Bride Of Kong. End-run: She marries the Kong clone, but doesn't have sex during the story -- that's just promised.

"The preacher stammered out, 'I now pronounce you Kong and Wife.' Kong dragged his blushing new bride to their marriage bough of twigs and vines. Her screams pierced the night. THE END."

Something like that.

 

[monoblanco]

Here are some additional thoughts:

The overall plot of the story jumps very suddenly from one thing to the next, not just from one subchapter to the next, but also within the scenes. I recommend you consider expanding this into several more pages to give you time to develop your story more fully. I would think it needs to be about twice as long as it is.

Spend some more time in the scene with Lorraine. Develop that part of the exposition more. Linda seems not at all bothered by the fact that she's been kidnapped. Develop the emotional aspect of that more. Maybe have her, or Lorraine (or the narrator) give more details as to how all this came about. Spend some time in the room explaining what's happening when we first meet Nona. What are each of them feeling? Why? Take your time here. This scene has a lot of potential to help you develop these characters, explain what's happening and why, and also to delve into this idea of hybrid sexuality. What are pheromones? Do they affect the hybrids any differently than they do normal humans? How so? You get the idea.

You mentioned Jurassic Park as a 'documentary'. That's a great idea. Use that to your advantage. In that movie, many things are stated explicitly, other things are shown to you in the background of a scene, but they're still shown to you. You could try to do the same thing here. Show more of this island, describe more about what these hybrids look like, show and explain more about what they feel, how it affects them, and why they feel that way. Show, don't tell.

In terms of the overall structure of the story, here's a thought, if she's been kidnapped, since you made such a big deal of the hybrids' reaction to rape, you could develop that more fully. Have your main character explain to them that kidnapping is similar to rape in a way, the hybrids react just as negatively, then they could help her escape this island. That shared experience is also where you can develop the growing connection between your characters. That is an easy way to build a relationship between them and an easy way to develop intimacy that leads to other things.

Oh, BTW, why do they react that way to rape? How/why do they know it's bad? Who told them that? Another example of an area you could develop more fully.

It's a small thing but at one point she has a Nokia phone, then later, it's an iPhone. Maybe just give her 'a phone'.

Her friend Dolores isn't well developed. What's the connection between them? She very quickly goes from having lunch to getting married. You could spend more time developing her character in this story. Maybe after escaping from the island, Dolores helps out somehow, again build on that shared experience to help get you to the ultimate goal.

There's nothing wrong with jumping from the island to the city, but just make sure that you do everything you want and need to do before you jump. As a reader I was left wondering, wanting to know more about the island, more about the project that created these hybrids, more about their reaction to and connection with the main character, more about her friend, more about the final sex scene, etc.

I'm not saying write a technical manual, but for each detail you do give, you could add one or two more things to tell your reader more about what's going on, and expand your story without it becoming a marathon.

Finally, not sure if this is your intention, but the sex at the end is very brief. A six way orgy could go on MUCH longer. Since you're ending up with some of these characters getting married, I recommend spending more time developing that scene. Explain just how profound the emotional impact of it all is for each of them, how they're being effected, why they want to be with the other person and not just to fuck, and so on. In the end, why would they wind up getting married after just one fuck, regardless of how good it was?

So, bottom line, I'd say, you've got a great concept here and you're off to a good start. Think about how she gets off this island as a way to develop your characters and the connections between them. Next, consider adding more detail throughout to explain more to your readers, YOU know what's going on a why, but as a reader, it wasn't always clear to me. More exposition (which can come as dialog or narration or...) would definitely help.

My two kopecks.

Cheers.

 

[Hypoxia]

@monoblanco: Thanks so much for your comments! I'll work your suggestions into the story. (I might not finish for a few weeks. Damn the real world!) As for the phone thang: I used the brands as decade markers. Nokia was big around 2000 and iPhones didn't exist. By 2014, iPhones rule and Nokia is fading. Maybe my era transitions are a bit too subtle. And more exposition, yes. I have a nasty tendency towards being too concise and elliptical in my tales. I'm working on that.

Thanks!

--Hypoxia [gasp!]

 

[monoblanco]

My pleasure Pox,

If you think it needs it, ping me when it's done and I'll be happy to look it over again.

At any rate, I look forward to reading v 2.0

Cheers!