Feedback Needed by New Author --> How to Get to "H(ot)"?

[NikkiSwank]

Over the last six months or so, I have published four stories on Literotica. Each story has received many thousands of views as well as an average "rating" in the range 4.05-4.45. I am pleased that all earned at least 4 stars.

However, I'd really like to find my way to writing stories that please such a high percentage of readers that some or all rate above 4.5. But I can't figure out what I'm doing "wrong" and/or not doing.

Can anyone here either offer me constructive feedback or suggest an editor?

I've tried a few times now browsing the long list of Volunteer Editors and also searching within it, but there seems to be no way to focus down to just those Volunteer Editors who are also Literotica authors (ideally, with a pattern of success at scoring 4.5 or higher; I have tried self-studying those authors' stories for ideas).

SPECIFIC QUESTIONS:
- Is there something I could improve about the pacing of my stories? (e.g., Do I need to either increase the tension and build-up and/or increase the length of the climatic bits?)
- Are my stories too long? (Note they are of varying lengths; with the highest rated one of middle length.)
- Are my scenes either not taboo enough or too taboo?

 

[RejectReality]

We can be a lazy bunch, so this link to your submissions page may help draw some responses.

http://www.literotica.com/stories/memberpage.php?uid=2029926&page=submissions

First things first: The categories you've written in so far aren't known for high scores.

BDSM has a core community of "purists" who tend to downvote anything that doesn't meet their definition of BDSM.

Non-Con suffers from low votes attempting to discourage participation in the category at all, as well as from people who don't think you go far enough on the sadistic side.

Mind Control fans are very picky, in my experience.

And Loving Wives is known as a Shark Pit with good reason. There are warring camps of readers there. If you please one group, the other votes 1 and leaves nasty comments. Loving Wives is a no-win situation, for the most part.

Being relatively new, with only four stories out so far, scores above 4 in those tough categories is actually doing pretty well. As you build readership, your core group of fans will lift your scores.

In the middle of something right now, so I haven't actually read any of the stories, but the categories alone are enough to explain why you haven't broken the 4.5 barrier yet.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

High score categories...Incest/Taboo...that's about it...but...and there always is a but, they should be blood relationships. Mom/Son, Daddy/Daughter, etc. 3rd cousins doesn't count much.

 

[RejectReality]

Romance, Sci-Fi&Fantasy, Non-Human are the top average score categories.

After that, you're probably looking at Mature and Group Sex.

Incest gets too many drive-by low votes. Granted, you'll get more reads and votes there than anywhere else, but it's far from a high-scoring category.

 

[NikkiSwank]

Thanks, RejectReality. Since I would be likely to write in these same categories again, I think you are probably saying that for higher scores I should pay closer attention to "writing to the category audience". I certainly have not been thinking that way so far.

 

[8letters]

I started reading "Deacons and Damsels". There isn't much to the main character. We don't know her name. She's a mom, but we don't know about her kids. The only thing she thinks about in the story is sex. Is she happy? Bored? Overworked? Feeling unappreciated? What are the difficulties she's having with her husband, David?

When David asks Joan about swinging and then begs the main character to go to the swinging party, what does the main character think? Isn't she worried that David is bored with her and is looking for something outside their marriage to spice up their life? Is she also bored with their marriage?

The more connected I feel to the main characters, the more I enjoy them having sex. I wasn't that connected with yours.

Edit: Also, "Deacons and Damsels" IMHO belongs in "Group Sex", not "Loving Wives".

 

[TxRad]

Write your stories your way and let the votes fall where they may. You can't please everyone but yourself. In any case, votes are not the best way to interrupt the merit of stories as they are manipulated constantly by one faction or someone who just trolls for the fun of it.

Check your scores the first of each month and after a contest finishes. That is as close to an accurate set of scores you'll get. The site runs sweeps at those times to remove what it considers fraudulent votes. And no, no one except the site knows the criteria for obvious reasons.

 

[NikkiSwank]

Thank you, 8letters, for giving the story a try and for this specific constructive feedback. "D&D" is the longest story I've ever written--and I'm definitely not as pleased with it as with some of the shorter ones.

 

[NikkiSwank]

TxRad,

That's very interesting information. I had noted a sizable (upward) swing in the ratings of at least one story. But I had no idea about this regular rating sweeping, nor about intentional fraud!

Cheers!

 

[soflabbwlvr]

I read "Remote Love." It's well written, clever, and fun. I enjoyed the story. But as another commenter mentioned regarding your Loving Wives story, I think it is in the wrong category.

High marks in Noncon/Reluctance are usually earned one of two ways. There is an audience of primarily men who enjoy reading stories in which women are humiliated and raped, the more violently the better. The stories that audience seeks straddle and often cross the border dividing what is acceptable and what should not be approved on this site.

There is a second audience, however, consisting primarily of young women who follow the teachings of E L James. These readers like stories where powerful men with domineering personalities come into possession of beautiful young women who need to be taught how to satisfy a real man. The young women know that someday the powerful men will see that these young women are special and after the women suffer enough and become skilled enough at pleasing the men, they eventually fall in love. This group of readers is responsible for awarding the highest scores in this category.

Your story does not appeal to the expectations of either of these groups. It was very well written, but the story is not one that would sway the majority of the readers of that category. Had you posted it in Erotic Couplings or Toys and Masturbation, it might have scored higher (although 4.45 in Noncon is not a bad score).

I write in Noncon, but I don't do the rapey stuff. I consider my stories "Noncon Light." Your story is much lighter than mine. Your issue isn't really in the writing, it's in finding the right audience.

 

[DreamCloud]

Your stories are almost all action. The action is good, but I prefer some flavor mixed in the action.

I don't want a cop to pull me over.
I want a state trooper in an over ironed shirt, creases starched hard, wearing a forward titled cowboy hat to pull me over.

I like the personality to come through the descriptions as well as the actions. I won't pretend I know what everyone else wants.

Above all - write what you want. You will find readers who will appreciate it.

 

[sr71plt]

I want a state trooper in an over ironed shirt, creases starched hard, wearing a forward titled cowboy hat to pull me over.

Oh, me too!

 

[NikkiSwank]

Thanks, DreamCloud. I definitely need to work on that!

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

It takes a lot to impress me, plenty of best selling writers do not.

 

[NikkiSwank]

Does anyone here know whether changing the category of a previously published story is a good idea?

For one story, I suggested Erotic Couplings but it was posted in BDSM. For another I suggested a change from Loving Wives to Group Sex when I made a minor typo update but the category wasn't changed.

The idea that Remote Love possibly belongs more in Toys & Masturbation is intriguing and wasn't on my radar at all.

 

[jomar]

What Tx said. Seriously, we all love the red H, but that is not necessarily the measure of a good story. Also, it's harder to get the H since they changed the scoring criteria, so anything over 4 really good. So, on a free site, write what pleases YOU.

 

[RejectReality]

Does anyone here know whether changing the category of a previously published story is a good idea?

For one story, I suggested Erotic Couplings but it was posted in BDSM. For another I suggested a change from Loving Wives to Group Sex when I made a minor typo update but the category wasn't changed.

The idea that Remote Love possibly belongs more in Toys & Masturbation is intriguing and wasn't on my radar at all.

Depends upon what your goals are. If you're hoping it will increase your score or the readership on the story, there's not much sense in changing it. Once you're past the first week or two, the activity on a story trickles off to a drip. You won't see much change.

The exception to this is Loving Wives. If a LW story is in the wrong category, it's an unnecessary drag on the rest of your list. Those nutballs will dig up stories out of the archives to hate on, and then proceed to attack everything else in your list with low scores and nasty comments as well.

If you're thinking of writing a follow-up to any of them ( a chapter two or a stand-alone story following the same characters ) then it might be worth your while to change the category to something more appropriate. Readers who have just discovered you will go back to the earlier, connected story, and a better category choice there will attract more readers and higher scores.

The unchanged category during an edit could be one of three things

• Laurel missed it while scanning the "notes" section of the submission
• She thought LW was the appropriate category
• It got lost in the shuffle because something else wasn't done properly in the editing process

Just to clarify the last: Did you submit a full manuscript with the changes made to the typos? The editing process isn't exactly crystal clear in the FAQs, so that's a common mistake when editing story text.

( You only need to submit the manuscript when editing the text. Edits of category, title, etc. don't need the manuscript. You can copy the "notes" section into the "story text" section in order to complete the form any time you don't need to make changes to the actual text of the story. )

As to the changed category, Erotic Couplings is sort of a catch-all category, and Laurel probably changed it to better focus on what she felt was the main thrust of the story.

Laurel has the final say on what category your story goes in, so you need to be persuasive when changing category -- especially if she changed it to something you don't feel is appropriate during the original submission. Say why you believe the current category doesn't fit, and why the new category fits better in the "notes" section. A simple "I want to change the category to" may not be enough.

 

[NikkiSwank]

Thanks for the encouragement jomar.

I'm entirely new to creative writing. So as I try to branch out from erotica to other genres now, I'm eager to learn from the free and sizable audience in this community how to improve my writing overall.

I hypothesize that erotica is a forgiving genre, because there is an obvious subject for tension and release. And, as long as the reader is aroused by what you write, you only have to get the tension and release right and not everything else.

I'm seeking higher ratings (as well as your helpful feedback here), because I think learning how to achieve that would help me as I approach other audiences.

 

[8letters]

Does anyone here know whether changing the category of a previously published story is a good idea?

For one story, I suggested Erotic Couplings but it was posted in BDSM. For another I suggested a change from Loving Wives to Group Sex when I made a minor typo update but the category wasn't changed.

The idea that Remote Love possibly belongs more in Toys & Masturbation is intriguing and wasn't on my radar at all.

I would think it would be a better idea to delete the story, rewrite it based on the feedback you have here and then resubmit it to the correct category with an initial author's note saying that you had submitted this story earlier and had decided to rewrite it.

 

[sr71plt]

Or, you could not worry so much about the story getting a red H, which is dependent on so many variables, and just make sure that the story is how you want it (especially that it hasn't been watered down in pursuit of a red H).

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Your attitude is all wrong, for erotica or any other writing. You remind me of those kids who go on American Idol who can't necessarily sing, but want to be the American Idol. They think if they believe in themselves enough it will magically happen.

Why would you want to write erotica unless you read erotica and get turned on by it? My first suggestion is stop trying to be a writer and read. Find some hot hot story in a filthy genre that turns you on. Have an orgasm. Then come back to it.

Whoever said writing erotica is easy? And no, it's not exactly a forgiving audience. They know what they like.

If you don't MEAN it, it's never going to be hot.

You make erotica sound like a technical exercise. If your stories are anything like your description of erotica ("It's just tension and release, right?") then they'll be as hot and enticing as going to get your car fixed. I hope you don't have sex like that.

This attitude annoys me. Clearly you have a desire to write. Maybe erotica is not your genre. Find what you really really WANT to write about and then try it again.

Thanks for the encouragement jomar.

I'm entirely new to creative writing. So as I try to branch out from erotica to other genres now, I'm eager to learn from the free and sizable audience in this community how to improve my writing overall.

I hypothesize that erotica is a forgiving genre, because there is an obvious subject for tension and release. And, as long as the reader is aroused by what you write, you only have to get the tension and release right and not everything else.

I'm seeking higher ratings (as well as your helpful feedback here), because I think learning how to achieve that would help me as I approach other audiences.

 

[NikkiSwank]

Carnal_Flower,

I was probably unclear. I'm over 40 and professionally successful in various less creative endeavors, but completely new to creative writing in the past six months. Erotica is actually what I like writing best and thus what I gravitated to first.

However, I know I can do better as a writer. Much. I guess what I really mean by erotica seeming an easier genre is that I'm absolutely certain I do not write well enough to score 4+ stars on a book on Amazon and am thus surprised I've received such high ratings here. The post you responded to was a very short attempt to rationalize that.

I'm very impressed by your "singing" (all your stories have 4.5+ ratings, I see) and am working hard to find my own "voice". Got any tips for me? That's ultimately what I am really looking for with this thread.

Cheers.

P.S. I've been reading erotica, including here at Literotica, on the order of several times a week for two decades or more. And it sure as shit does get me off.

 

[sr71plt]

I just can't get past the obsession with a 4.5 rating. Sorry to break it to you, but I think the best writers on Lit. don't get many 4.5 stories precisely because they are some of the best writers on Lit. and, for various reasons, aren't what most Lit. readers are looking for or supporting. I can't have any sympathy for obsession with the numbers.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

It's not about being a good writer. It's about erotica. There are plenty of hot hot hot stories, to me, that are in fact pretty badly written. But the sentiment is there. The sizzling hot sexual passion is there whether they're good writers or not. Look at old erotica. Victorian erotica. Its generally crap writing, but so hot. The first rule in good erotica is to mean it. It's not about the sex, it's about the feeling.

On the other end, I see plenty of really well-written, amazingly well-written stories on lit, some are even contest winners, that are not erotic to me in the least. They may be brilliantly written, but they have the aspect of just attaching their brilliant writing to the erotica genre just because lit is here. These get lit's Hot ratings, though less frequently. It's more rare for that red H to reward truly good writing. Quite often they don't, because, well, it may be good writing, but it's not grabbing people at the erotic level. If that's what you want, then don't stress about the "Hot" at all.

I'm unforgiving. My feeling is, if you're going to present your work as erotica, then it better be. No matter how good of a writer you are. But if you're just trying to exploit the genre because you think it will be easy or you're just slumming, go write a mystery or a romance or whatever.

 

[NikkiSwank]

You make a good point, sr71plt. I don't care about the rating as much as I do about becoming a better writer. Thanks!