Fantasy and self-abuse.

[gauchecritic]

self-abuse, how puritanical is that?

Anyway. I've just realised earlier this evening, that fantasy-whilst-indulging (for some reason the girly magazines insist that fantasy for females only exists whilst "making love", which isn't really a good sign of sexual happiness is it?) Fantasy whilst wanking (let's be brutal) consists almost entirely of dialogue. There is no need to set the scene, fill in the back story, touch the plot points. These 'writerly' things are set-up in the imagination with very little actual verbiage. The words chosen to enhance the scene are what your 'lover' utters and what you say in response (or not).

Is this a common thing? Or am I alone? (Not am I alone when abusing myself? which is a different subject entirely)

Is this a hindrance to writers or an aid? Is the 'set-up' as important as the dialogue when writing? Is the background unnecessary when we are alone?

 

[Stella_Omega]

can you clarify your question? I mean, it looks like a good subject, only I'm not sure what you're saying here...

 

[Tom Collins]

I sort of consider myself a freak in that I've pretty much always had very involved fantasies. The only thing that's really changed since I began writing is that I tend to have a running, narrative monolog (in words, I mean) going along describing everything as if I were writing a story in Word. Even stopping and going back and trying different phrasing...naturally, this winds up haulting and reversing the action, if any.

I'm pretty sure I'm a fruitcake. The thing is, I've come up with some of my best descriptions at such times.

 

[jomar]

The only thing that's really changed since I began writing is that I tend to have a running, narrative monolog (in words, I mean) going along describing everything as if I were writing a story in Word. Even stopping and going back and trying different phrasing...naturally, this winds up haulting and reversing the action, if any.

I'm pretty sure I'm a fruitcake. The thing is, I've come up with some of my best descriptions at such times.

You're not a freak because since I've started writing I do it to. Especially annoying when, ahem, relieving stress.

But I also edit my dreams if they're not going they way I like (lucid dreaming).

 

[Tom Collins]

You're not a freak because since I've started writing I do it to. Especially annoying when, ahem, relieving stress.

But I also edit my dreams if they're not going they way I like (lucid dreaming).

I can't say I do the second, but at least when I get down to the nitty-gritty, as it were, the narrative monolog shuts up and it reverts to pure imagery.

 

[starrkers]

Tom, I do the same thing. Right down to shutting up and reverting to imagery

 

[jomar]

I can't say I do the second, but at least when I get down to the nitty-gritty, as it were, the narrative monolog shuts up and it reverts to pure imagery.

Me too. I left out the last part.

 

[Tom Collins]

Tom, I do the same thing. Right down to shutting up and reverting to imagery

Me too. I left out the last part.

I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who's sometimes too distracted trying to remember a great phrasing to be effectively doing what they started out to do to begin with.

I'm a fruitcake among friends.

 

[SimpleGifts]

Well, I've been 'wanking' to online porn recently, so the dialogue is pretty bad most of the time.

When jacking off purely to a fantasy...well. I tend to fantasize about real people in my life, so maybe that makes your point moot. They are people, I already have a background with them, a context, and "set-up" of some kind...so no need to construct those from uncut cloth.

My ex-lover and I used to write down and share fantasies as a way to "relieve tension" while apart and just to express ourselves...and those often had somewhat elaborate scenarios and background detail. But not always. So I don't see how one's preferred fantasies make it more difficult to write erotica...unless I'm misunderstanding your point?

SG

 

[Tom Collins]

Well, I've been 'wanking' to online porn recently, so the dialogue is pretty bad most of the time.

SG

That's sad. Even the bit of wank I write has decent dialog, and some character building, I think. Only one I wrote that doesn't, and it's only about 1200 words and really is pure wank, but there's no dialog at all, and no reason it should have dialog since it's written in a combo of first and second person.

 

[SimpleGifts]

That's sad. Even the bit of wank I write has decent dialog, and some character building, I think. Only one I wrote that doesn't, and it's only about 1200 words and really is pure wank, but there's no dialog at all, and no reason it should have dialog since it's written in a combo of first and second person.

Clarification: the online porn is commercial adult video crap from San Fernando Valley. Just a phase I'm going through. Usually my standards and taste are much more refined and sophisticated...

SG

 

[Tom Collins]

Clarification: the online porn is commercial adult video crap from San Fernando Valley. Just a phase I'm going through. Usually my standards and taste are much more refined and sophisticated...

SG

Oh, I thought you were talking about stories. It's S.O.P. for porn flick dialog to be complete drivel. They ought to hire me. I could make them some bucks, man.

 

[shereads]

(for some reason the girly magazines insist that fantasy for females only exists whilst "making love",

WTF?

Do these magazines maintain that we females abstain from self-abuse? Or am I misreading you? It seems as if you (the girly magazines) are saying that women don't take our fantasies off our mental shelves unless we are with a partner. Hmph.

As to the question of wanking - or wankessing - with and without the assistance of complex sexual fantasies:

Speaking for mys speaking for my friends who masturbate, fantasies are an essential part of the female self-abuse experience, as a substitute for the mental stimulation provided by the presence of one's partner. My friends would hasten to add that the longer one has been without an orgasm, the simpler the fantasy can be. Returning home after a week at Mom's apartment in the shared bedroom, a fantasy like this one might suffice:

Imaginary Sex Parther: "Oh baby."

Self-Abusing Female: "YES!!!"

With frequent self-abuse, more complex fanasies might be required. Plotlines, backstory, sets, costumes. There might even be storyboards.

~ ~ ~

Maybe it's easier for men to reach climax with less mental stimulation. But that doesn't explain those inflatable dolls with open mouths and surprised expressions. There's got to be a story there.

 

[Pure]

[,,,,]

 

[Vermilion]

Tom - if you think that's weird, then wait'll you hear about mine...
My fantasies are so involved that many and many a time I have ended up orgasming to the thought of the perfect pudding (etc).

Seriously. I get so involved in the fantasy while I'm getting myself off that by the time I reach the crucial point physically I'm only just setting out some of the finer details mentally. This is why I generally run the same fantasy for a few weeks. By the end I'm mentally and physically matched up

Generally once I've reached this stage I writre it down and then it's so finalised I lose interest and have to start again wiht a new one
x
V

 

[Grushenka]

can you clarify your question? I mean, it looks like a good subject, only I'm not sure what you're saying here...

Ditto. But I also wonder at what kind of girly mags you (GC) read (or are published in England). I've been wanking longer than most people here and I've rarely done it to dialogues in my head. I set scenes, intuit, and go for it.

Have you read any of the Nancy Friday books, beginning with 1973's "My Secret Garden". I think there were two or three after that one, collections of 'real' women's sexual fantasies. I've been using (abusing) them since their publication, some of the best smut around. There's some dialogue, but I think you'd see that it's the scene and descriptives that are most important (enticing) to the lady wankers.

Now that I think of it, writing the dialogue is what I don't like about writing smut. Nearly finished with my earthday entry and it's the dialogue that bugs me. The rest is fun, though.

 

[CharleyH]

self-abuse, how puritanical is that?

Anyway. I've just realised earlier this evening, that fantasy-whilst-indulging (for some reason the girly magazines insist that fantasy for females only exists whilst "making love", which isn't really a good sign of sexual happiness is it?) Fantasy whilst wanking (let's be brutal) consists almost entirely of dialogue. There is no need to set the scene, fill in the back story, touch the plot points. These 'writerly' things are set-up in the imagination with very little actual verbiage. The words chosen to enhance the scene are what your 'lover' utters and what you say in response (or not).

Is this a common thing? Or am I alone? (Not am I alone when abusing myself? which is a different subject entirely)

Is this a hindrance to writers or an aid? Is the 'set-up' as important as the dialogue when writing? Is the background unnecessary when we are alone?

Men are simple.

 

[maggot420]

Men are simple.

Maybe most men are simple would be more accurate.

 

[gauchecritic]

Men are simple.

Simple like Carrot.

Sher, I was thinking more in terms of those 'surveys' they use for fillers. Most explicitly sexual questions are cloaked in terms of partnership rather than solo activity. (You can tell I haven't read a girly magazine for some years.)


To the question (such as it was) I can accept a build up of scenario, when the lights flicker to leave you in darkness in the house that you're looking round as a prospective purchaser and suddenly finding yourself in the arms of the estate agent (realtor).

Are those of you that answered no, you use your creative imagination to set the scene, actually saying that whilst frotting you are actually thinking "As I feel the scratch of incisors countering the tug of taut skin I sense a wind billowing the curtains promising the howl and the whole of the moon.

I don't deny that you picture the scene and are aware of the surroundings, but actually putting words to them?

A proper question for Stella: Can you match the near reality of imagination with the written word? Is it frustrating or inspirational?

 

[CharleyH]

Maybe most men are simple would be more accurate.

No need to qualify. Simply ... men are simple.

 

[CharleyH]

Simple like Carrot.

If we are talking hard and no brain? Yep. I know there is more to this though, and in that light I am enjoying the read.

 

[Grushenka]

I don't deny that you picture the scene and are aware of the surroundings, but actually putting words to them?

No, no, no. I think the best way I can describe my self-abuse fantasies is to say they are like dreams. I use images and very fleeting thoughts, can go from one scene to another at light-speed. I absolutely don't speak/think (in my head): And then he puts his hand up my thigh... then my nipples go all hard... then I go kablooey all over his face, etc.

 

[gauchecritic]

If we are talking hard and no brain? Yep. I know there is more to this though, and in that light I am enjoying the read.

Guileless, is the word. Not complex.

 

[CharleyH]

Guileless.

I hadn't seen the word before this point in time.

Edit to add the truth is men are simple.

 

[CharleyH]

[QUOTE/]

Anyway. I've just realised earlier this evening, that fantasy-whilst-indulging (for some reason the girly magazines insist that fantasy for females only exists whilst "making love", which isn't really a good sign of sexual happiness is it?[/quote] Nope it is a myth, and one created.

Fantasy whilst wanking (let's be brutal) consists almost entirely of dialogue.

Does it? I hope not!

I use Stanislovsky for a reason ... characters are made by action and although a writer dialoguges ... a character is still made by action and that rests on an authors ability to describe it.