Fahrenheit 9/11

[shereads]

Wait a minute. I'm a raging liberal and I don't care much about guns either way. I'm a guy. I think guns are kind of cool. I just wouldn't have one in my house.

---dr.M.

I had that talk with my future ex-husband when I found out there were four or five guns in various drawers around the house, "for our protection." I didn't think it made much sense to protect ourselves by leaving weapons where burglars might find them while we slept.

"They're not loaded," he said with a patient sigh, rolling his eyes heavenward in that special way spouses have when their partners are showing their ignorance. "And as long as they're not loaded, they're harmless." He took an unloaded handgun out of the bedside table, sat down on the bed, and began to demonstrate how to safely handle a gun. As I sat down beside him, it went off in his hand. The bullet went through the wall directly behind where I had been standing.

I hope it's not terribly indelicate to tell you that he...How shall I say this...He required a change of underwear.

 

[Guest]

Everyone in my family has guns -

Mostly hunting rifles, but guns.

My extended family lives in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan.

Everyone hunts, everyone owns guns.

They do not have many accidents, nor do the children play with those weapons. They are taught at an early age about the dangers.

The easy access to handguns around the country, however, troubles me. You know it is usually some idiotic asshole who lives down the street who is a handgun owner (you know, the house everyone avoids, loud music at night, six cars in the driveway . . .)

There has to be a way to prevent that moron from owning a weapon!

 

[cantdog]

I wish I could remember that easy feel-good. Politics doesn't provide that.

When I read feel-goods they sound like lies. I should secede. Start with my house and work out from there. I always find I can regulate my own life better than any government, contrary to governmental belief. And I can do better things with the money it takes in taxes than it seems to be doing.

The lure of anarchism.

http://no-troy.planetaclix.pt/images/mexico.gif

cantdog

 

[Guest]

I really like your new AV, cant.

 

[shereads]

Re: Everyone in my family has guns -

There has to be a way to prevent that moron from owning a weapon!

My ex husband was not a moron! He was a perfectly nice man with some maturity issues.

 

[Guest]

Re: Re: Everyone in my family has guns -

My ex husband was not a moron! He was a perfectly nice man with some maturity issues.

Just tell him to change his shorts!

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

... I hope it's not terribly indelicate to tell you that he...How shall I say this...He required a change of underwear.

http://www.addis-welt.de/smilie/smilie/star/191.jpgWhyever would you wish to be delicate?

You should have rubbed his nose in it -- literally. Pointed out that since both he and the gun had discarged at the same time, he would have to decide which of them would forever exit the premises. One mess at a time (not to mention near personal puctuation) was all that you can handle.

A gun in the house is dangerous.

An incompetent with a gun in the house is tempting the fates.

By the way, has he any redeeming qualities? So that if he gets rid of the guns he might scruttle back to former future ex-husband?

 

[Wildcard Ky]

Through my tears during the "missing man" formation at the Reagan funeral this evening - it occurred to me that millions of people watching probably now think Reagan was a combat pilot. That's when I stopped crying and just felt lousy.

I used to wonder how John Wayne and Ronald Reagan managed to acquire the aura of military heros.

I can't speak for John Wayne, but Reagan was Commander in Chief of the Military. I think that qualifies him for the honors he received during his funeral. One day when Clinton passes away, he will receive the same honors, even though he was never in the military. Clinton will rightfully receive the honors because he was Commander in Chief.

Here's a link that details Reagans military service, he was in the Army Air Corps.

Reagan

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I had that talk with my future ex-husband when I found out there were four or five guns in various drawers around the house, "for our protection." I didn't think it made much sense to protect ourselves by leaving weapons where burglars might find them while we slept.

"They're not loaded," he said with a patient sigh, rolling his eyes heavenward in that special way spouses have when their partners are showing their ignorance. "And as long as they're not loaded, they're harmless." He took an unloaded handgun out of the bedside table, sat down on the bed, and began to demonstrate how to safely handle a gun. As I sat down beside him, it went off in his hand. The bullet went through the wall directly behind where I had been standing.

I hope it's not terribly indelicate to tell you that he...How shall I say this...He required a change of underwear.

A gun in the house is dangerous.

An incompetent with a gun in the house is tempting the fates.

VB: Completely disagree with the first statement, completely agree with the second statement. A gun is only as dangerous as the person holding it. I have many guns in my house. All are locked up in my gun safe and the ammunition is locked up in a separate cabinet. I've owned guns for over 20 years and I can honestly say that I've never had one go off on accident. The only time my guns fire a bullet is when I purposely aim them and pull the trigger.

My kids know what the gun safe is, and what's in there. They also know the price they will pay if they try to get in there when I'm not around. As each of my kids becomes mature enough, I teach them gun safety, and how to shoot. My kids aren't afraid of guns, and they aren't in awe of them either. A gun isn't some cool mystery with an aura of greatness to it. It's just a gun. They know how they work, how to operate them, how dangerous they can be, and how to be safe with them. I don't leave guns stashed around the house "for protection". I have two young kids, and they bring other young friends over. To leave a gun stashed around the house in my situation is unthinkable.

Shereads, it saddens me to hear stories like the one you told. Unfortunately there are some people (idiots) that act so reckless with guns. Owning a gun comes with great responsibility, some people don't live up to that responsibility. Fortunately you weren't hurt or killed over his act of ignorance. I'm sorry that you had to go through that.

P.S. Glad to see your old AV again.

 

[shereads]

I'm sorry that you had to go through that.

Not nearly as sorry as he was.



I didn't mean to suggest that Reagan didn't deserve a military funeral as Commander in Chief. I was just noting that he and John Wayne - and now GWB - seem to acquire the aura of combat veterans just by playing the role.

When I was a kid, I always assumed that John Wayne was a combat veteran. I never imagined that someone would be as critical of Vietnam war protesters as John Wayne was, if he had avoided service in his own generation's war.

 

[Clare Quilty]

As I sat down beside him, it went off in his hand. The bullet went through the wall directly behind where I had been standing...

When people say that a gun went off they almost always mean that they inexplicably pulled the trigger with the assumption that there wasn't a round in the chamber -- or they were trying to manually de-cock a gun with an external hammer and their thumb slipped.

 

[shereads]

Whoever sits on the movie ratings board has slapped Farenheit 911 with an "R" rating, which is the surest way to doom a theatrical release to limited showings.

Couldn't be pressure from Disney, could it?

 

[shereads]

I'm going to see Farenheit 911 tomorrow and to my man Bill's book signing in Coral Gables on Tuesday.

A friend tells me that she feels "a historic obligation" to perform oral sex on the president, or at least offer, despite the expected crowd. I just want him to autograph my book. With a pen.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I wish you could get to meet Clinton one on one and talk for a few minutes (no funny business meant or implied). He's a very charming and personable guy to talk to. I had the pleasure of meeting him when he was the governor of Arkansas and we spoke for about 15-20 minutes. It's a gift of his to make you feel like a friend, even though you just met and will probably never meet again.

If your friend feels an overwhelming urge to fulfil her obligation, tell her you can set her with the next best thing.....A guy that has met Clinton (and almost killed him). LOL. Just kidding.

I didn't really say that did I? Bad boy...........

 

[shereads]

I wish you could get to meet Clinton one on one and talk for a few minutes (no funny business meant or implied). He's a very charming and personable guy to talk to. I had the pleasure of meeting him when he was the governor of Arkansas and we spoke for about 15-20 minutes. It's a gift of his to make you feel like a friend, even though you just met and will probably never meet again.

You met him? You talked to him? And did he form complete sentences without the use of a teleprompter?

Wow.

I have no idea how they're going to fit him into this little local book store. I think it's great that he's doing the signing at one of the last independent book stores, though, instead of the mega-Barnes&Noble up the street.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I had posted this in the thread Little known fact about president's. Here's a pasted copy of the story:

Here's one you don't know about Clinton, yours truly damn near killed him in 1991. LOL.

True story: I was in the Air Force, stationed in Arkansas. Clinton was governor at the time. The base I was at was scheduled to close. When a base closes, it is turned over to the state. Clinton was there as Governor to basically see what his state was getting.

I was working up inside the landing gear of a B-52. People that work on the planes know that you always look up to see if someone is there before you walk under the gear. Clinton wanted to see a plane, but didn't know the rules. Just as I'm jumping down from the landing gear, he walks right under without looking. I had to pull myself back in mid air to avoid crashing down on top of him. I landed on my feet with our noses about 6-8 inches apart. It scared the shit out of both of us. Him because some guy just dropped out of nowhere and is suddenly 6 inches from his face, and me because some dumb jerk just walked under the plane........oh shit, that's the Governor. What the hell is he doing here?

After a few seconds, we collected our wits and wound up having a very nice conversation for 15-20 minutes. He's a pretty cool guy in person. This was during the time that there was speculation that he would run for President. I asked him if he was going to run, and his answer was "I think so".

Imagine the profound impact I could have had on world history if I had landed on him and broken his neck in 1991.

 

[shereads]

Imagine the profound impact I could have had on world history if I had landed on him and broken his neck in 1991.

"What did you do at work today?"

"Landed on the governor. Broke his neck."

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

... Imagine the profound impact I could have had on world history if I had landed on him and broken his neck in 1991.

Mr. Ky,

That is why I enjoy reading alt history.

If you had broken Clinton’s neck, think of all that would have changed.

Ken Starr, for example, would have lived a lonely, frustrated, useless existence, instead of the notorious, frustrated, useless existence that he did live.

 

[Wildcard Ky]

Mr. Ky,

That is why I enjoy reading alt history.

If you had broken Clinton’s neck, think of all that would have changed.

Ken Starr, for example, would have lived a lonely, frustrated, useless existence, instead of the notorious, frustrated, useless existence that he did live.

LOL. Methinks you're right.

 

[Pure]

A definitely stellar military career, as described in Wildkard's link.
The kinds of things movies are made of!

{I'd love to see this flak writer's rendition of the Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld military careers.}


Ronald R in the military

His first assignment was at the San Francisco Port of Embarkation, Fort Mason, Cal., as Liaison Officer of the Port and Transportation Office.

At this time, the AAF and Warner Brothers Studios were planning a feature motion picture to be entitled "Air Force" and wanted Lt. Reagan for the leading role, so on May 15, 1942, he applied for transfer from the Cavalry to the AAF.

The transfer was approved and on June 9th, 1942, Lt. Reagan was assigned to AAF Public Relations as P.R. Officer in Burbank, Cal. and subsequently to the 1st Motion Picture Unit in Culver City.

Lt. Reagan was promoted to first lieutenant, Jan. 14, 1943, and on Feb. 26, he was sent to the Provisional Task Force Show Unit of "This is the Army" at Burbank. Following this duty, he returned to the 1st Motion Picture Unit and on Jul. 22, 1943, was promoted to captain.

As the result of a personal request from the Secretary of the Treasury to the Secretary of War, Capt. Reagan was ordered on temporary duty to New York City in Jan. 1944 to participate in the opening of the 4th War Loan Drive, after which he returned to California to the 1st Motion Picture Unit. On Nov. 14, 1944, he was assigned to the 18th AAF Base Unit at Culver City where he remained until the end of the war. On Sep. 8, 1945, he was ordered to Fort MacArthur, Cal. for separation, effective Dec. 9, 1945.

[...] Captain Reagan has received a 'superior' efficiency rating continually since 1 Jul., 1943." The reference to "unusual initiative" undoubtedly resulted, at least in part, from Capt. Reagan repeatedly volunteering to assist in producing and narrating AAF motion pictures, in addition to his regular duties. By the end of the war, his military units had produced 400 training films for the AAF.

[end excerpts]
http://www.wpafb.af.mil/museum/history/wwii/rr.htm

 

[Wildcard Ky]

In fairness to Reagan, you forgot to add that he was initially rejected from voluntary service for Medical reasons, then tried again and was able to make it in the second time.

Apparently he wanted to serve, but had physical issues that limited him. He did what he could.

Also in the interest of fairness, you should add Clinton to the list of people whom you would want have their service described by that writer.

 

[haldir]

As someone from Scotland who has read all Moore's books and who found "Bowling for Columbine" the most eviscerating critique of US gun laws ever produced, I'd like to totally support the views of Perdita.

You guys are living on borrowed time. You are the new Roman Empire - there is no one who can stand against you. You have, essentially, absolute power.

Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Iraq 2 was an illegal invasion of a sovereign nation. I am deeply ashamed that the UK governement was such an integral part of this operation. It would have been far more effective and far less costly in lives to have lifted the UN & US sanctions and encouraged MacD's and Coke etc to expand into Iraq. A few years down the line - no Saddam and no threat to anyone (not that they were anyway).

Look at the business background and the business interests of those making the decisions.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

As someone from Scotland who has read all Moore's books and who found "Bowling for Columbine" the most eviscerating critique of US gun laws ever produced, I'd like to totally support the views of Perdita.

You guys are living on borrowed time. You are the new Roman Empire - there is no one who can stand against you. You have, essentially, absolute power.

Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Iraq 2 was an illegal invasion of a sovereign nation. I am deeply ashamed that the UK governement was such an integral part of this operation. It would have been far more effective and far less costly in lives to have lifted the UN & US sanctions and encouraged MacD's and Coke etc to expand into Iraq. A few years down the line - no Saddam and no threat to anyone (not that they were anyway).

Look at the business background and the business interests of those making the decisions.

Moore is scathing. Not factually correct, but scathing. Intersting, that in our discussions on far left hate mongers he didn't come up. He is easily as nasty and facetious as Rush or Ann Coulter. I hope there aren't a lot of people who take this american hateing clown seriously enough to form opinions on us.

From a Dateline NBC Interview:

Lauer: “But you didn’t set out to poke a sharp stick in the eye of the Bush administration and the Bush family?”

Moore: “That’s part of what I’m doing. But most importantly, listen, if I just wanted to—if it was just about the politics, if that was my primary motivation, politics, I would, you know, suspend what I’m doing right now and get out on a campaign trail.”

At least he is honest about his motives.

-Colly

 

[Guest]

As Colly and others well know, I'm not into talking politics, not in detail anyway. However, I wish people could keep in mind that first and foremost Moore is a "filmaker". He has some common theme obviously, but as he says himself, it's not the politics that drives him.

There have been many politically-based or oriented directors (look at fucking Jean-Luc Godard), but above all they are creative people. When you get a filmaker who is politically driven (or ordered) you get Soviet-like propaganda kitsch drivel.

It seems to me silly and useless to criticise Moore vis-a-vis politics and "the fucking" truth. Of course if he makes people think for themselves, that's grand. if he causes people to vote anti-Bush, that's fine too. I already know what his new film is about, I plan to enjoy its art and craft as soon as I can.

Perdita

edited for grammar

 

[haldir]

Yes, he is honest about his motivation.

However, I really have to take issue with the idea that he, or people who appreciate and understand his arguements, are hating the USA.

Agreed that some of his facts may be "inaccurate" but when was the last time ANY government ANYWHERE told us, the people their motives or the basis for their version of events.

FACT - no weapons of mass destruction found in Iraq
FACT - those at the top of the US administration are deeply involved with/tied to US oil interests or contruction interests.

My understanding of Michael Moore's position is that he actively promotes the idea that people should get of their arses and get involved in the political process (and suggesting how they can do it). What he wants is an USA that is TRULY a beacon of democracy for the world, with real opportunity for all - not the sham that it's citizens live with at the moment.