Extra promotion

[NotWise]

Welcome to the mini-event, "Burning Down the House." Several writers who read and post in the Loving Wives category put our heads together and decided to write some classic Loving Wives stories.

So how did these writers qualify for extra promotion from Literotica?

This has been going on for a while, with blackrandi1958 being pretty much at the center of it. I want Laurel to explain. Why are some writers getting special benefits that aren't available to all of us?

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

Like Kermit, I was over here sipping my tea this morning. And then, I re-read some of the LW recent stories by Inkhorn and Zeb_Carter and others.... Inkhorn’s Rebirth is the 30 day #1 Story in LW. Just sayin.

On a cursory glance, it seemed like there’s two potential solutions: either 1) the author’s here make their own factions, too, and produce invite only “events” to self-promote, or 2) the writers send a joint letter requesting Laurel to reconsider/revise the concept of the “invitation events” so that they’re not just free marketing for small cliques (or, at least, include some pre-invitational call to all writers).

To be fair, it’s possible Inkhorn and Zeb and others were invited and declined.... Maybe they could weigh in?

Regardless, it made me doubly glad that the Pastiches de Ogg is open to EVERYONE.

 

[Bramblethorn]

So how did these writers qualify for extra promotion from Literotica?

This has been going on for a while, with blackrandi1958 being pretty much at the center of it. I want Laurel to explain. Why are some writers getting special benefits that aren't available to all of us?

Context for other readers: https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=1496456

 

[Hypoxia]

So how did these writers qualify for extra promotion from Literotica?

Bramblethorn's link explains quite a bit. You may mount your own event(s). These aren't contests, only theme-for-a-day author exercises. I should start one; the theme, 'ukuleles. Or bagels.

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

Bramblethorn's link explains quite a bit. You may mount your own event(s). These aren't contests, only theme-for-a-day author exercises. I should start one; the theme, 'ukuleles. Or bagels.

Well, no. It doesn’t fully “explain” it. There’s one mention with no details a couple of days before publication for the current event. Compare with HeyAll’s *invitation only* event above, which has a submission date as well as publication date....

I’m not arguing one way or the other for invitationals; I’m sure they serve many purposes. But I do think that if there’s an event, open or invitational, for bagels or ukeleles, there should be some notice.

 

[NotWise]

Context for other readers: https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=1496456

Thanks for adding that.

In addition to that, the last few months have given us Beyond the Wall of Sleep and On The Job, and Welcome to the New World ( which doesn't seem to have a working link). They're all exclusive "events."

Laurel gave these events extra promotion and I don't know how the events or authors in exclusive events qualified for the attention. I want an explanation.

EDIT: Rationalize all you want. I need Laurel's explanation.

 

[HeyAll]

Well, no. It doesn’t fully “explain” it. There’s one mention with no details a couple of days before publication for the current event. Compare with HeyAll’s *invitation only* event above, which has a submission date as well as publication date....

I’m not arguing one way or the other for invitationals; I’m sure they serve many purposes. But I do think that if there’s an event, open or invitational, for bagels or ukeleles, there should be some notice.

The one I did was basically 'invitation only' but really anyone could join, as the guidelines were open for anyone to see on the main thread.

The reason I did that was because a prior event was publicly advertised as open to everyone -- I dont recall the name of that event -- and the first page was literally almost filled with new stories for that event. I remember people complaining about it because their stories were bumped off the Hub because of the massive influx.

Anyway, I'm interested in doing another 'on the job' story event for 2020 with the same setup.

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

The one I did was basically 'invitation only' but really anyone could join, as the guidelines were open for anyone to see on the main thread.

The reason I did that was because a prior event was publicly advertised as open to everyone -- I dont recall the name of that event -- and the first page was literally almost filled with new stories for that event. I remember people complaining about it because their stories were bumped off the Hub because of the massive influx.

Anyway, I'm interested in doing another 'on the job' story event for 2020 with the same setup.

Thanks HeyAll! That helps to clarify a big part of my question. If you do the On the Job event again, I’m looking forward to it as one of the readers.

 

[Blind_Justice]

@Notwise: The Geek Pride Day event started like that as well. Last year, PuckIt and I talked loosely about a "May the Fourth" style inofficial event and a day later, after either he or Etaski talked to Laurel, the thing was an official inofficial event, with mention on the home page and the whole jazz.

Ask Laurel. PM her. She talks to mortals.

 

[NotWise]

@Notwise: The Geek Pride Day event started like that as well. Last year, PuckIt and I talked loosely about a "May the Fourth" style inofficial event and a day later, after either he or Etaski talked to Laurel, the thing was an official inofficial event, with mention on the home page and the whole jazz.

Ask Laurel. PM her. She talks to mortals.

Geek Pride never came out as an "Invitation only" event. It was open to all. Everyone who wanted to participate in the event could participate in the event, and they all got the same promotion from it. No-one other than Laurel was making decisions.

For the "Invitation only" events, someone other that Laurel decided who participated and then the site gave them the promotional benefit.

I want Laurel to explain -- not to me, but to all of us.

 

[HeyAll]

Back the main question, to my understanding, it's because Blackrandle asked. She basically created the special event of this format, to my understanding.

Before that there were some other author events, like that chain story thing, whatever it was.

And since the first few Blackrandle events, other people have hosted their own by contacting Laurel. In the end, readers win.

I know for the event that I arranged, it was open to authors on the forum, but I also personally contacted several active authors on the Top 250 list to bring out some great stories.

Thanks HeyAll! That helps to clarify a big part of my question. If you do the On the Job event again, I’m looking forward to it as one of the readers.

You'll be invited. lol

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

.

You'll be invited. lol

If I was drinking milk, it would be coming out of my nose literally laughing out loud. great word play!

 

[NotWise]

And since the first few Blackrandle events, other people have hosted their own by contacting Laurel. In the end, readers win.

The readers don't win. The events are all "author's events." They aren't "reader's events." How many readers really wanted 750 word stories? There were probably zero readers who cared if a story took place in one night. That's all a different issue.

 

[RejectReality]

What's the big deal? So, a few of the events have an organizer who selects which stories/authors are included.

All anyone needs to do in order to receive the same level of additional promotion is to join one of the open events, or start their own.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

No, I wasn't invited.

 

[SimonDoom]

I don't see a problem with this. I think the promotional impact of events generally, and invitation-only events in particular, is limited. They don't get the same degree of promotion as events on the main pages.

I can understand an event organizer wanting to have some control over the quality, number, and nature of the stories by determining who participates. It makes perfect sense for the latest Burning Down The House event, for example. I generally don't like those stories (even if they're well written), and if I participated I'd probably take the story in a direction that the organizer and other participants disliked, or thought was bad quality. I'd probably piss off most of the readers, and that would make the event overall less appealing for everyone involved.

If the Site owner did NOT allow such events to be invitation only, then they might not happen at all. That would be a loss to the site. I see giving some degree of content/participant control to the organizer ultimately as being a plus for the Site.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Geek Pride never came out as an "Invitation only" event. It was open to all. Everyone who wanted to participate in the event could participate in the event, and they all got the same promotion from it. No-one other than Laurel was making decisions.

For the "Invitation only" events, someone other that Laurel decided who participated and then the site gave them the promotional benefit.

I want Laurel to explain -- not to me, but to all of us.

I can explain that one. Laurel is more than happy to facilitate an event whether it’s open or by invitation. I sort of jumped in and organized a couple and my personal preference is to have an open event and invite all comers. That’s just me. BlackRandi likes the by invitation only approach and really, Laurel leaves it completely up to the organizer as to the approach. Since these events started, to see a few different approaches. A little group, by invitation, open to all. It’s really up to the person who takes the initiative to set it up - Laurel doesn’t have any hard and fast rule. I think I started a thread on events to ask everyone a while ago and that’s where that OneNight idea came from.

 

[SimonDoom]

T

Anyway, I'm interested in doing another 'on the job' story event for 2020 with the same setup.

I hope you do. I partially wrote a story for that event that I was quite excited about but did not finish. I'll wait until that event to finish and publish it if you do it again.

 

[NotWise]

What's the big deal? So, a few of the events have an organizer who selects which stories/authors are included.

The "big deal" is that the extra promotion given to authors in the event is at the expense of the authors who are not participating. If I had a story on the LW hub before the "Burning Down the House" stories posted, I might have expected another day or three of exposure on the hub before my story dropped of the end of the hub. The event would have taken away my exposure.

Earlier "events" like the the Fawc contests were organized so they didn't interfere with other authors, but a lot of the events are organized so they do. It clearly favors the participants over the non-participants, who in this case appear to be clique.

All anyone needs to do in order to receive the same level of additional promotion is to join one of the open events, or start their own.

Won't happen for me. I followed several of the recent author's events and participated in one before I came to see them as generally bad things.

On a site that is mostly administered for the readers, the author's events are run for the authors -- sometimes for selected groups of authors -- and the readers have expressed (through votes) a low appreciation for at least some of the events. And then there's the issue in my first paragraph. The author's events usually operate at the expense of other authors.

 

[SimonDoom]

On a site that is mostly administered for the readers, the author's events are run for the authors -- sometimes for selected groups of authors -- and the readers have expressed (through votes) a low appreciation for at least some of the events. And then there's the issue in my first paragraph. The author's events usually operate at the expense of other authors.

You are right that these events are primarily for the benefit of the authors. Do they benefit readers? Yes, if the existence of these "closed" invitation-only events incentivizes authors to write stories they might not otherwise write.

Does that happen? I suspect yes. I was invited to an event by Randi last year, but I failed to get the assignment in on time. But the invitation spurred me to come up with, and start writing, a story I never otherwise would have written or even thought of writing. I still hope to finish it and submit it someday.

Considerations of fairness to non-participating authors are legitimate, but they're probably outweighed by the benefit to both readers and authors of giving authors like Blackrandi the freedom to create events on the terms of their choosing.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Thanks HeyAll! That helps to clarify a big part of my question. If you do the On the Job event again, I’m looking forward to it as one of the readers.

Well I have an On the Job story half done that missed that event so I’m in too

 

[NotWise]

You are right that these events are primarily for the benefit of the authors. Do they benefit readers? Yes, if the existence of these "closed" invitation-only events incentivizes authors to write stories they might not otherwise write.

I don't see how that's a benefit to the readers. Do you have a reason to believe that the readers like it (or even know) when authors write things they otherwise wouldn't?

I see the contests as being reader's events. Competition encourages authors to write to the reader's preferences, and the outcome is based on the reader's reactions.

 

[TxRad]

I was Invited by Blackrandi to enter her first event. It was for westerns only. I looked and was surprised by how few westerns there were. I had a western under construction so I finished it.

I don't think it hindered anyone in any way.

I was invited to another but I was too busy at the time and had nothing to offer in any case.

I don't see the problem as the number of stories are relatively small.

 

[SimonDoom]

I don't see how that's a benefit to the readers. Do you have a reason to believe that the readers like it (or even know) when authors write things they otherwise wouldn't?

.

From the reader's point of view, the whole point of this site is to offer good stories. The more, the better. If the existence of these events spurs the publication of more quality stories, that is for the reader's benefit.

 

[Vix_Giovanni]

What's the big deal? So, a few of the events have an organizer who selects which stories/authors are included.

All anyone needs to do in order to receive the same level of additional promotion is to join one of the open events, or start their own.

Totally a valid point of view.

But this is why I was sipping my tea yesterday morning: there's a difference between an invitational and an exclusion. An amateur invitational has some kind of qualifier. Although the hosts may reach out to a select few participants, the standard of the invitational is publicly marketed to give "notice". That way, even if someone isn't invited, if s/he meets the requirements of the invitational, s/he can request a consideration. And that way, the event doesn't become an exclusion.

For example, the 2020 Rogue Fitness invitational is now live for the CrossFit games. Certain athletes will be anticipated to compete at the actual event. But there's a qualifier that anyone can perform and if their levels are high enough, they too will be invited, regardless of whether they're known in the CrossFit community.

That's also how HeyAll hosted the On the Job event.

So, what does any of that matter here for a little writing event on Literotica?

If Literotica were just a 100% amateur submission free for all, it would probably matter very little except to occasionally ruffle a few feathers here and there. But Literotica hosts competitions for monetary prizes and non-monetary publishing benefits like "W"s and homepage marketing. And those contests are also called "events". And even when they're not, they are marketed on the site with the same advertising copy and illustrations, same style and often similar rules. Finally, the prizes for the writing contest events are awarded based on reader votes. And we all know that reader votes come, in part, from exposure and popularity.

We that hang out in the Author's Hangout and/or have done a few writing events and competition events, and seen open writing events in bolded green and invitational events in bolded purple, may feel like we have a handle on the differences. But it's inappropriate to assume that the average Literotica reader understands the differences (I'll be very honest; I was initially one of those confused, and when I began writing, I thought every event had a monetary prize).

So the problem with an exclusive event, and especially with an exclusive event that 1) is hosted/participated by the same recurring clique, 2) given the same type of site marketing and support as the Literotica contests, 3) goes live very close to the actual writing contest's voting beginning, and 4) provides no qualifiers for selection and no notice to other authors to participate too is that the invitational event then infringes on the contest by influencing competition.

Because money's involved, that's a big legal no-no.

Back to my tea.