Exterminate this Vermin

[Boxlicker101]

That's what I say. Execute this scum and make the world a better place.

http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/news/local/crime/article/MUHGAT16_20090916-092001/293247/

I'm a little surprised that they're acting so quickly. It's only been about seven years. Usually, these things drag on for much longer.

 

[sr71plt]

Certainly had my world tied up in knots for a big chunk of time. This, indeed, is an example of why I can't say flatly that I'm against the death penalty.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Today's the day this scum gets his. Even his shyster admits the man is guilty, but still insists we should have a lot more mercy than his client ever had.

http://wjz.com/local/john.allen.muhammad.2.1293458.html

 

[Dragonlipz]

He's one, but not the only one....
I'm a progressive, but I'm also someone who's witness to best and worst of humanity....at our best we are amazing, near saints....at our worst, there are none that compare....this guy is one of the worst....but only one...there are many more and none of them deserve to live anymore than this scumbucket....the serial killer in Cleveland, the mass-murderer/terrorist-wannabe in Fort Hood come to mind but list is far longer than that......just heard no clemency for JAM aka DC sniper#1......
I feel better...........................

 

[R. Richard]

It's way past time to eradicate this cancer on humanity.

However, perhaps someone can tell me, "Why did I have to pay for seven years of an admitted killer's room and board?"

 

[Stella_Omega]

I am not against the death penalty. It's used far too much-- but the public deaths of criminals like this one, are healing moments for society.

That was fast, you're right, Box.

 

[elfin_odalisque]

There is no justification in the 21st century for putting anyone to death as some form of tribal punishment.

Murderers, serious child abusers, serial rapists and others should be taken out of circulation and kept away from society until they die.

 

[kromen]

There is no justification in the 21st century for putting anyone to death as some form of tribal punishment.

Murderers, serious child abusers, serial rapists and others should be taken out of circulation and kept away from society until they die.

At whose expense? In NYC, there are homeless who commit misdemeanors just for room and board during the winter.

People that commit murder know don't even consider the consequences now, so imagine if they knew that there was no death penalty. As for "serious" child abusers and "serial" rapists; as opposed to casual pedophiles and one time rapists?

 

[Epmd607]

At whose expense? In NYC, there are homeless who commit misdemeanors just for room and board during the winter.

People that commit murder know don't even consider the consequences now, so imagine if they knew that there was no death penalty. As for "serious" child abusers and "serial" rapists; as opposed to casual pedophiles and one time rapists?

There are statistics on the impact of the death penalty on criminal behavior. Whether it exists or not doesn't really affect how people act because it's such a distant thought from the crime itself. If you're a serial rapist the death penalty isn't going to deter you because that moment in your life the most important thing to you is finding a woman to rape and kill, or a child to abuse if you're a serial ped. I'm against the civilian death penalty because they find innocent people on death row, such as that fiasco in Illinois, there were 18 found innocent in a short period of time. Maybe it was thirteen in 2001? I don't know, it's something significant.

 

[Huckleman2000]

yada yada yada
I don't need the death penalty to know that sniping people in their cars is a heinous crime. This state-sanctioned murder will not bring the victims back, nor will it serve as any deterrent to the next mass killer. All it does is inflame the blood lust of the most Authoritarian members of society, so I suppose it serves the State. It does nothing to make anyone safer to execute this killer.

 

[cloudy]

It does nothing to make anyone safer to execute this killer.

Thank you. This is exactly what I've been saying in every death penalty debate on this board for years.

It isn't justice, its vengeance. There's a difference.

 

[Epmd607]

There's not much of a distinction between 'justice' and 'vengeance'. We should get Thrasymachus up in here and talk about Justice and Vengeance for a couple thread pages.

 

[kromen]

There are statistics on the impact of the death penalty on criminal behavior. Whether it exists or not doesn't really affect how people act because it's such a distant thought from the crime itself. If you're a serial rapist the death penalty isn't going to deter you because that moment in your life the most important thing to you is finding a woman to rape and kill, or a child to abuse if you're a serial ped. I'm against the civilian death penalty because they find innocent people on death row, such as that fiasco in Illinois, there were 18 found innocent in a short period of time. Maybe it was thirteen in 2001? I don't know, it's something significant.

I will agree that the justice system is severely screwed up and they are many who have been found wrongly accused after many years if incarceration and posthumously too. In this specific case, there was no mistaken identity, DNA tainting, or mental lapse in judgement.

 

[TxRad]

It does nothing to make anyone safer to execute this killer.

You're right to a point. Lethal injections and the gas chamber behind prison walls with only a few people present does nothing. Out of sight, out of mind.

Take guys like this that are guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt and hang them on the courthouse lawn. Invite everyone and the media. Put it on the ten o'clock news. That would get peoples attention and make them think twice.

The death penalty only works if people are afraid of it. Giving someone a shot and them going to sleep doesn't work. People who do violent crimes laugh at it.

 

[Stella_Omega]

yada yada yada
I don't need the death penalty to know that sniping people in their cars is a heinous crime. This state-sanctioned murder will not bring the victims back, nor will it serve as any deterrent to the next mass killer. All it does is inflame the blood lust of the most Authoritarian members of society, so I suppose it serves the State. It does nothing to make anyone safer to execute this killer.

It serves the rest of us. We feel as if there is some chance that we, too might be mourned, and avenged. Don't discount that need that humans have, to feel protected by our own...

The idea that killing criminals is a deterrent is of course completely wrong.

But life imprisonment works pretty well too. Every time I heard that Manson or Fromme had been denied parole once more, I felt better; these people had been rendered harmless decades ago, really. Keeping them in jail served one purpose alone; that "tribal revenge" that EO decries. Tribal justice is really important-- it lets us have a tribe, in a society where a sense of close belonging is very rare.

 

[sereneone4u]

I am against the death penalty with the exception of extreme cases when you KNOW the person did it. I have mentioned it before, but I am again, Ted Bundy kept escaping and killing, incarceration just slowed him down. Other killers, especially those who prey on children, do not stop. Child killers should die horrific painful deaths and it should be televised. Our children are free game nowadays, their schools are jails and it is ridiculous that the innocent are the ones punished so that disgusting animals can roam free and have rights...you kill a child, you can never repay that except with a painful death.

JMO

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Jail time, tv, three squares a day, medical care, a bed to sleep in, what more could anyone ask for, except liberty.

Put them behind bars, yes. Have guards to keep them there. But that's where the states responsibility ends.

Feed them? No. Provide them with clothes to wear? No. Provide them with all the comforts of home? No.

If they want to live then they better have someone that will provide them with those things the state won't, food and clothing.

Or maybe meals on wheels can make a stop at you cell three times a day.

Cruel and unusual, of course. But without punishment that is, there is no deterrent to crime. When America went soft on criminals, criminals became hard on America and more plentiful.

 

[rgraham666]

I'll state my reasons for opposing the death penalty yet again.

1. You can't fix mistakes.

2. It's not carried out fairly.

3. It's more often a political tool than a judicial one.

I often wonder though, why do we put so much energy into protecting against physical threats; vaccination programs, sewers, food inspection, etc. Why do we spend so little protecting against mental threats?

 

[cloudy]

Cruel and unusual, of course. But without punishment that is, there is no deterrent to crime. When America went soft on criminals, criminals became hard on America and more plentiful.

Yep, we're so soft on criminals that we have the highest percentage of our population in prison in the world.

 

[Epmd607]

Shout out to Biblical Vengeance under the guise of Justice. Justice in the Bible is only described in terms of Vengeance. Vengeance is part of what makes a community a community, as someone else hinted at. The community must exclude ideas, people, crimes, objects as to define and therefore protect the community. Vengeance is part of our mythology as Americans, it's an important part of all cultures, gives people a sense of belonging, which in turn protects the existence of a community. Almost evolutionary...

 

[sr71plt]

Jail time, tv, three squares a day, medical care, a bed to sleep in, what more could anyone ask for, except liberty.

Put them behind bars, yes. Have guards to keep them there. But that's where the states responsibility ends.

Feed them? No. Provide them with clothes to wear? No. Provide them with all the comforts of home? No.

If they want to live then they better have someone that will provide them with those things the state won't, food and clothing.

Or maybe meals on wheels can make a stop at you cell three times a day.

Cruel and unusual, of course. But without punishment that is, there is no deterrent to crime. When America went soft on criminals, criminals became hard on America and more plentiful.

Oh, I think it would be enough just to deny them access to TV, computers, writing paper, books, etc. Just bore them to death.

Not feeding them just puts you on their level, I think.

 

[Bianca_Sommerland]

Oh this argument again. Fun fun.

Maybe I'll change my stance. I mean really, the victim won't be brought back by 'vengeance' on their killer. The victim is gone. The murderer is still alive. It is our responsibility to give this human being the very basics needed to survive. We wouldn't want to stoop to their level.

 

[JackLuis]

Ending the cost of maintenance with a .40 caliber S&W behind the ear.
That;s a painless as it can get, because the bullet travels faster than the sensation. 40 milliseconds more or less.

Why the high cost ceremony?

Cap 'em and plant 'em I say.

 

[Huckleman2000]

Shout out to Biblical Vengeance under the guise of Justice. Justice in the Bible is only described in terms of Vengeance. Vengeance is part of what makes a community a community, as someone else hinted at. The community must exclude ideas, people, crimes, objects as to define and therefore protect the community. Vengeance is part of our mythology as Americans, it's an important part of all cultures, gives people a sense of belonging, which in turn protects the existence of a community. Almost evolutionary...

This is exactly why I don't believe in the death penalty. Not just for the very good reasons others have enumerated above, but also because of what it does to society. Yes, ritual killing bonds people, whether the Manson Family or the Inquisition or the NRA; that doesn't make it a good idea. Civilization has moved past it, except for a few countries that the US should be embarrassed to be associated with.

 

[mountaindreamer]

My two cents:
If there is IRREFUTABLE evidence that someone is guilty of a heinous crime, they should be put to death immediately. Why should I have to pay for some scum-bag to live out the rest of their life?
Years ago (back in the 80's) when I was in school, we were taken to a jail that is a mere two miles from our city. Hundreds of inmates were hanging out in their air-conditioned public area, playing games, reading, and watching cable television. This made a profound impact on me when I realized all of my family members at that moment were at work and would be coming home later that evening to a house that had neither central a/c or cable television as they were both too expensive at that time. We were considered upper middle class, by no means poor. The final straw, those luxuries the loafing inmates were enjoying were paid for by my hard working family. And let's not even go into the medical care issue. My medical costs me $400 a month and theirs is...oh that's right, they get that free as well.
IF someone is going to be executed, then I agree as well that it should be made more public. People in America just aren't really afraid to go to jail...unless you live in Arizona of course. That is one state I believe got it right. Let them live outside with NO creature comforts and gosh, actually make them work!