Etiquette for responding to PM's

[SmileyGirl]

I'm not easily offended, but I find your ageism offensive. There are plenty of idiots and jerks of all ages. There are also plenty of respectful, and polite 20 somethings.

I concur, it's unfair to be prejudiced against age. There are rude people in all walks of life, all ages, male and female. I've had disrespectful pm's from older men who (if you were being judgemental on age) "should know better". I've had the same from younger guys my age. On the flip side I've met some great people young and old. Rudeness doesn't discriminate by age.

 

[SlutAddicted]

Personally I find it very frustrating when people don't respond in a timely manner. I used to work in the consulting business and still remember my boss saying there is absolutely no reason you can't respond to anyone within 24 hours. Maybe you can't give them all the attention they want but you can at least touchbase and let them know they aren't being ignored. That was real life business vs online chat so obviously the parameters are quite a bit looser but the principal applies. I think most people do see some kind of follow-up as a courtesy and if they don't do so its because they don't care to be courteous which is pretty insulting.

Having said that an accusation and an ultimatum will get my back up every time. I would have had to commit a far more egregious offence against someone to whom I felt a real commitment before I would have anything but a negative response to that approach. Leaping to judgment or presuming to be in a position to chastise others is just as offensive, if not more so, than failing to respond in a timely manner. Even if I was in the wrong this feels like a punch in the face when polite clarification based upon benefit of the doubt would have done the job.

We all need to strive to treat each other well but harmony is also dependent upon how we respond when someone makes a mistake. From what I have read she offended you so you offended her right back. And now your even.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[amofiga]

<<<<Personally I find it very frustrating when people don't respond in a timely manner. I used to work in the consulting business and still remember my boss saying there is absolutely no reason you can't respond to anyone within 24 hours. Maybe you can't give them all the attention they want but you can at least touchbase and let them know they aren't being ignored. That was real life business vs online chat so obviously the parameters are quite a bit looser but the principal applies. I think most people do see some kind of follow-up as a courtesy and if they don't do so its because they don't care to be courteous which is pretty insulting.>>>>

<<<No reason at all? Appendicitis? Assualt? Mugging including contact devices? I can think of many, some I have done to people, some I have been on the receiving end of. Life goes on. Even if it also is just ....oversight or rudeness or cold feet. >>>

Both are good points. One can never rule out catastrophic things that happen. However, the probability of such catastrophic events are relatively low and I feel like many times when people don't respond, they are just busy for one reason or another or just toying with someone or just don't care about the feelings of others. Given that someone hasn't been in a plane crash or car accident or suffered a heart attack and that they are just "busy", a quick, "hello, sorry I've been busy but haven't forgotten about you" type message would be in order. Otherwise, it's easy to assume that the other person just doesn't want to deal with you. In which case a "Hello, I'm sorry but I'm just not interested," would be the more adult approach. It goes hand in hand with the person that just says, "I'll call you," and never does versus the considerate adult that says, "I appreciate the date but I don't think we're compatible so please understand that I'm not interested in seeing you again." We all have to be grown up and face rejection, but it's easier if we just aren't left guessing.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[BiBunny]

I mean...I've been freelancing for years, but I don't really agree with the 24 hours thing.

(So, er, I may have gone off on a tangent here. Sorry? )

I am not, absolutely not, on call for everybody 24/7, just because I have an email account and work at home rather than in an office. People already have zero respect for contractors--especially work-at-home contractors--and their time as it is, and I have no desire to train them that sending me 15 emails at 3 am that say the exact same thing and/or demanding why I didn't answer their first email an hour ago is ok.

Yes, I have had people do that before. No, I am not at all exaggerating.

My sleep time and my times when I am away from home are my own, and just because I own a smartphone doesn't mean I have any desire to answer your email about your stupid website (or whatever) when I'm away for the weekend or on vacation. You can hold your ass on just like everybody else has to.

That being said, I do try to get back to people within 48 to 72 hours (i.e., the length of a weekend) if I'm away.

I realize that's not exactly what SlutAddicted was saying, but I had a rant that needed to come out, and that reminded me of it. Sorry again.

 

[SlightlyGone]

I've just had a very negative experience and would like to know your opinion. Someone responded to a PM saying they were into BDSM and possibly wanted to play, but that they were at work and would get back to me "later tonight." I waited close to one week for a response. I then gave her a time when I would no longer be interested to hear from her, since this felt like a game she was playing (which I've experienced several times before). She responded by blaming me for being pushy and "too needy" and ended the conversation.

My question is of etiquette; Did I not handle this correctly? How would YOU have handled it?

If she doesn't get back to you, she doesn't get back to you, no need to pursue someone whose lost interest that fast.

I'd have to read your response word for word to know why she considers you 'too needy.' But if you're giving someone you don't know a deadline and they already didn't get back to you when they said they would, no wonder they cut off the conversation.

 

[SlutAddicted]

I guess I was being slightly facetious. People who deal with me in real life know there are valid reasons that I will not, for example, respond to a phone call or email sometimes. Here are reasons, besides crises, that people deal with that will make twenty four hour slots difficult if not impossible at times.

There is also the point that not responding within twenty four hours is a horror of the modern age IMO, that traps us into being on call all the time. Suppose you are just on holiday with your partner for a week, with no commitment to work. Remember the days when we had no phones? Increasingly this demand to be on call ALL. The time for work and friends /relatives is seeing people we know going to places they have NO interest in....wonderful sounding places! and when I excited ly ask about their time away they look bored and sad and say! ' got phone signal in the hotel ' and frown.

The other thing to consider is the joyful torture of waiting. Anticipation, or doubt.

Its actually ok if we want to, and our responsibilities ( work, family) allow us to, to not always hop. This year, for the first time in years G has not had to hope so quickly to the work phone: the difference this has made is incredible. The year has to end at sometime. but its been a reminder for us of priorities and also, that time is only part of the equation of modern life.

The single greatest thing about e communication though, is it is not time sensitive,: it doesn't have to be at 'sociable' hours, or at the time the other party is available too necessarily.

Of course people can't respond in the case of serious accidents or illness or whatever. I assumed that was too obvious to need clarification. But since the clarity is required.......if they were dead I also would not go to their funeral to berate them .

I described a demanding work environment and made it quite clear that the 24 hours was the time in that context and that it might well be longer in other contexts. I was also clear that I didn't mean we had to provide everything somebody wants - it can be a one line "will get back to you" or even the standard auto reply "I am out of the office and will get back to you."

My point wasn't to define the parameters but to highlight the need based upon your own life to take some responsibility to provide basic courtesy. Too often we consider only the validity of our excuse rather than taking basic responsibility to be polite. If you know someone wants to interact with you and you can't do so for three days it is profoundly selfish to leave them hanging minute by minute when a simple "will get back to you in a few days" would take 6 seconds to text.

 

[SlutAddicted]

I mean...I've been freelancing for years, but I don't really agree with the 24 hours thing.

(So, er, I may have gone off on a tangent here. Sorry? )

I am not, absolutely not, on call for everybody 24/7, just because I have an email account and work at home rather than in an office. People already have zero respect for contractors--especially work-at-home contractors--and their time as it is, and I have no desire to train them that sending me 15 emails at 3 am that say the exact same thing and/or demanding why I didn't answer their first email an hour ago is ok.

Yes, I have had people do that before. No, I am not at all exaggerating.

My sleep time and my times when I am away from home are my own, and just because I own a smartphone doesn't mean I have any desire to answer your email about your stupid website (or whatever) when I'm away for the weekend or on vacation. You can hold your ass on just like everybody else has to.

That being said, I do try to get back to people within 48 to 72 hours (i.e., the length of a weekend) if I'm away.

I realize that's not exactly what SlutAddicted was saying, but I had a rant that needed to come out, and that reminded me of it. Sorry again.

You are right. I wasn't setting 24 hours as some kind of universal parameter. That was a very demanding constraint in a very demanding consulting business which I left for partly that reason - it was an example with context provided.

We all have different lives and different constraints and needs. These days my customers and colleagues know I don't want to be bothered on weekends and won't respond......most I tell I don't even want to hear from you on the weekend, save it until Monday. And during the week I give myself 48-72 hours.

The point is that I try to be somewhat consistent and give a few seconds thought to the other person's need and expectation. That doesn't mean I feel obliged to jump when they ask. If they are the type of person who expects that I might even make a point of taking my time. But either way I try to think about more than solely what suits my convenience.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[SlutAddicted]

I agree with you on courtesy, absolutely but in defining these parametres to quite tight time periods outside work life AND even more so to Internet communication and early days, I think this is similarly displaying responsibility to consider that others are not on our schedule. And I say that as some one who depends more time online than most people


Fwiw, its not unheard of for work places to 'disallow' out of office responses so as to make sure clients get great personal service. ( only allowing them on flights or hospital tables). G worked in such a place for some time, which is why he is decompressing this year. .

We all have our own parameters and they can be very circumstantial. For instance, I have a couple friends in far flung locations that I talk to a few times a year. Sometimes we play phone tag and it can take weeks or months to connect - but I know from the tone of the voicemail when it is more urgent.

I take your point re out of office emails. But I think you know I was citing an example as opposed to prescribing a universal solution. You just got through criticizing the example I used of a required 24 hour response required in just such a job where out of office emails were not an acceptable.

The point was that in any given context there is a basic courtesy and standard that takes into account the other person's perspective. And when you say I'll contact you at time X then you are the one establishing the expectation and should feel some basic courtesy to follow through or send a one line email saying you can't.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[staciliv]

I've just had a very negative experience and would like to know your opinion. Someone responded to a PM saying they were into BDSM and possibly wanted to play, but that they were at work and would get back to me "later tonight." I waited close to one week for a response. I then gave her a time when I would no longer be interested to hear from her, since this felt like a game she was playing (which I've experienced several times before). She responded by blaming me for being pushy and "too needy" and ended the conversation.

My question is of etiquette; Did I not handle this correctly? How would YOU have handled it?

Let me get this straight: she said "later tonight" and you waited A WEEK?

I sympathize but if I look up "needy" in the dictionary I bet your picture is next to it.

Send me a pm, Ill do my best to respond, but wait ten minutes, not a week!

 

[jonnysimple]

Hang on....I am not CRITICISING your example. . Or you, or your points. I'm sorry if that was not clear. I am just disagreeing with them slightly, and suggesting that your ex boss's old line is flawed in many cases and non applicable outside a the situation you describe and I was relating as familiar to us. Does that clarify my position and make it clear I was not being critical?

Herein lies the problem; when something is misinterpreted, it can become bigger than it is, or can come off as an insult, or mistreatment, or in my case, an aggression. In a face-to-face, you would have corrected the misinterpretation and it would have been forgotten, however, in this case, being a thread, the misinterpreted response is written in stone, and in some cases, more than one misinterpreted response can arrive, and a snowball effect begins. Someone posted that I sent a asshat (whatever that means) PM to them, but it was a tongue-and-cheek PM with absolutely no harm meant.. alas, her response is now in stone and part of this thread, even though it has no place here.

 

[SlutAddicted]

Hang on....I am not CRITICISING your example. . Or you, or your points. I'm sorry if that was not clear. I am just disagreeing with them slightly, and suggesting that your ex boss's old line is flawed in many cases and non applicable outside a the situation you describe and I was relating as familiar to us. Does that clarify my position and make it clear I was not being critical?

I don't think you are being critical so much as not-picking.

One minute you are saying "that's too onerous of a standard" (24 hour response) then when I cite a lower standard (out of office email) you are saying "fwiw some environments require a higher standard". I know - that was the standard I referred to in the first place.

Either way you know they are just examples and the point is not to define the standard but to make the point that in any given situation there is some basic standard of courtesy that takes into account the perspective of the other person.

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[jonnysimple]

Ok, I see what you mean. I disagree that that's exactly as it played out, but I'll not drag it out for sake of nit picking and I certainly see how it can read in broad strokes like that, so I may I clarify? I am saying I see it happens, and in can see why business do it but that i think its poor for human interaction and expectation.

I agree with your second paragraph, and think that the point is that perspective of the second person falls to BOTH parties to consider.

I certainly agree the person was rude not to message and apologise but decline. If I were available and had interest and had started communication with jonny simple, I know that I would have pulled out, having read more, . ( sorry jonny) . There is the honesty thing , then his age fudge, then the not playing with two people at one time, but while this has been a something and nothing he has had a play partner in real life. While neither the age nor the partner might have been an issue, the fudging would have been. If someone else were able to find similar details based on tumbler or blog or shared postings on another forum or where ever they met....she might have just felt ( inappropriately) that it was not worth her manners.

Please understand, this is not a comment Jonnysimple, on my interaction on you as a fellow poster, but in how I would feel were to potentially be looking at you differently. It is not meant to be offensive, and of you find it so I am happy to remove the content.

Way too many misinterpretations here.

1. I said that I don't play with two people at the same time, which is indeed true, but another person misinterpreted that based on something I posted later, which was yet again another misinterpretation. I am a play-partner monogamist!!!

2. The person who PM'ed me to say "hey, we might play" knew my true age already, no mistaking that.

3. I have had several play partners, all of which would tell you quite unequivocally, I'm one hell of a nice guy, honest, and respectful to a fault. This is why the "altercation" I had with the girl prompting this thread was so hurtful.

This, by the way, is one of the reasons I wanted to shut this thread down, as it's spiraling out of control, and I'm starting to look like a monster. So let me refresh the thread perhaps with more detail...

1. Girl PM's me to say "hey, I'd possibly like to play with you."
2. I replied asking her location
3. She replied with her location, and says "I'm still at work but will get back to you later tonight"
4. Two days pass
5. I PM her saying "Hey, haven't heard from you."
6. Another day passes
7. On fourth day I PM her saying "With all due respect; I hope you are not playing a game here, but I'd like a response by noon Saturday or I will block you." This is another full day away.
8. Saturday, before noon, she responds with anger towards me having set a timeline, etc., etc., and calling me needy. Very aggressive tone.
9. I respond saying "hey, I'm sorry if that's the way you feel" and after one more exchanges I closed it off saying "that's fine, again sorry for any bad feelings, take care."

I already stated earlier in this thread that the "blocking" thing in #7 was not wise, however, despite this, a minimum of an apology would be expected, AND THEN anger and rage would have been less hurtful. I have received many PM's on this and other forums from "fake accounts" and girls (or guys pretending) just for fun and mind games. So because of those fuckers, this girl now ends up being the victim, as do I.

At this point, I will no longer monitor this thread, as I have what I need, I am now a better person, and I thank everyone for their input and feedback.