Erotic Horror v. Horror With Erotic Content

[Libratine]

The stories I'm working on for the Halloween contest are making me wonder about the difference between erotic horror and horror with erotic content. For a purist, I guess, the term erotic horror implies that the erotic part of the story is integral; take away the juicy bits and you're left with half a story. On the other hand, horror with erotic content is just made spicier by adding the erotic parts. They aren't really necessary for the story to move along and are basically just eye candy. Tasty candy, but like the real thing it's not necessary for a good diet.

What I'm writing has gotten me thinking that I'm writing the second type of story, and that bothers me a little. These are the first stories I'll be submitting to Literotica since 2006. I guess I want to make the splash as big as possible, so to speak. I'm sure most of you will tell me I'm overthinking it and that the readership won't really care. But what about we writers?

Do you really care if you're writing pure erotic horror (or erotic anything for that matter), or is it enough that you splice in the expected bumping and grinding in order for it to be called erotica? Or is there really a difference at all, and all I'm doing is beating myself up unnecessarily?

 

[sr71plt]

One vote for beating yourself up unnecessarily.

 

[Libratine]

One vote for beating yourself up unnecessarily.

Appreciated.

 

[lovecraft68]

I'd say you're fine with some incidental bumping and grinding, people who read in erotic horror are looking more at the horror than the sex.

How do I know that?

Because if they were looking for just sex there are 30+ other categories to choose from. I think some would be expected, but it doesn't have to be an integral part of the story.

As a reader I find myself annoyed when I read a decent horror story here then all of a sudden someone is fucking and you can tell it was jammed in there because the author was worried about what you are.

 

[oggbashan]

When Erotic Horror was a new category, I wrote a Horror story that wasn't erotic. It is still low rated.

It is a reasonable question to ask, but as with most similar questions, my/your answer doesn't matter. If the readers, or some of them, think your story fits the category you have succeeded.

 

[Libratine]

I'd say you're fine with some incidental bumping and grinding, people who read in erotic horror are looking more at the horror than the sex.

How do I know that?

Because if they were looking for just sex there are 30+ other categories to choose from. I think some would be expected, but it doesn't have to be an integral part of the story.

As a reader I find myself annoyed when I read a decent horror story here then all of a sudden someone is fucking and you can tell it was jammed in there because the author was worried about what you are.

I've read through quite a few stories in the Erotic Horror section that have that feel that the sex was pretty much tossed in because it's expected from an erotic fiction website. That's what I'm trying to avoid. At the same time,I feel the obligation to make the story erotic, but without resorting to cliches and tropes. I guess we'll see if I succeed.

When Erotic Horror was a new category, I wrote a Horror story that wasn't erotic. It is still low rated.

It is a reasonable question to ask, but as with most similar questions, my/your answer doesn't matter. If the readers, or some of them, think your story fits the category you have succeeded.

And there's no way to know if I've succeeded until the votes and comments come in, of course. Some will like it, some won't, some will tell me I need to go fuck myself for sullying the floor with my filth. I'm expecting that.

Thanks for the comments.

 

[Rozalin_0123]

Making the sex an integral part of the story seems to be the way to go. I've had quite a bit of success in doing so. Writing a horror story with a "obligatory tit shot" equivalent when it comes to the sex will distract from the story. Likewise, writing a story that is sex heavy with a single jump scare or a sudden murder then calling it "Erotic Horror" is likely to have the same effect.

Good erotic horror finds a balance between fear and eroticism. Otherwise, why read it? There are plenty of pure horror and pure erotic stories to choose from.

 

[SecondCircle]

The stories I'm working on for the Halloween contest are making me wonder about the difference between erotic horror and horror with erotic content. For a purist, I guess, the term erotic horror implies that the erotic part of the story is integral; take away the juicy bits and you're left with half a story. On the other hand, horror with erotic content is just made spicier by adding the erotic parts. They aren't really necessary for the story to move along and are basically just eye candy. Tasty candy, but like the real thing it's not necessary for a good diet.

What I'm writing has gotten me thinking that I'm writing the second type of story, and that bothers me a little. These are the first stories I'll be submitting to Literotica since 2006. I guess I want to make the splash as big as possible, so to speak. I'm sure most of you will tell me I'm overthinking it and that the readership won't really care. But what about we writers?

Do you really care if you're writing pure erotic horror (or erotic anything for that matter), or is it enough that you splice in the expected bumping and grinding in order for it to be called erotica? Or is there really a difference at all, and all I'm doing is beating myself up unnecessarily?

I can only offer my own opinion on the category or the definition. It is the category I frequent the most, and the one I love to write the most.

Just about ANY category of normal fiction can contain erotic content in it. The erotic elements aren't necessarily the main theme in this case. Romance certainly. Thrillers can include it. Even comedies. Sex happens and can be a detail that adds to the overall idea.

Think of any action movie with the musclebound hero. Usually there's his love interest and at some point, they get it on, whether it is showed explicitly or not. Or in tune with the coming holiday, think of Friday the 13th. Mind you, the shock of blood and gore and sex were things that were added to keep the audiences coming back. But SEX itself was actually a detail that fit this horror movie's formula. Mr. Voorhees was exacting his revenge on young people that drank, smoked pot, partied, and fucked. Probably because it's what those damned camp counselors were doing when they should have been watching him as a boy... when he drowned. His mother started this vengeance, he carried it on for countless sequels.

This is an example of a "horror story with erotica". The erotic parts aren't the main idea, but they are a supporting detail to the main thing.

Oh and also... people fuck. Generally. So if an author of any kind of story decides his characters have reached that point and it's pertinent to read about them fucking, then so be it. You may very well read the sci-fi action thriller where the dashing space marine and the sultry scientist get it on because it's just what their characters would do.

Now, on the other hand is what you've called "Erotic Horror". Which we have a category for here. Many have asked how it is done. I experiment with it all the time. I wanted stories where you have the vulnerability of sex and the vulnerability of fear, both of these dynamic emotions, in ONE story.

I read there a lot. I love a lot of what I see. Some of it isn't my thing. True, you'll find a lot of werewolf/vamp/succubus stuff. Others think that the sex must somehow be horrific, and include death or torture of some form. In my opinion this is too direct. This is horror at a glance. I wouldn't look at Romance and say "Well just add some flowers and John Mayer and it should be romantic, right?"

To me, horror is a word taken too lightly nowadays. FEAR, extreme fear, can sum up horror. It doesn't matter about knives or torture chambers or shape shifters or serial killers. Those are just tools. To be a horror story, I think it must simply induce the feeling of fear. It must be eerie, or creepy, or disturbing, or downright horrifying. Fear is the key. Whatever you're writing about, it should induce fear. (IMO)

But how to make something sexy if it's scary? Or vice versa? As you asked, is it simply dropping a sex scene into a horror story?

I think not.

To me, to be an Erotic Horror story, the focus must be on both elements. Sexy AND Scary. Now, mind you... that doesn't HAVE to mean sexy and scary at the same time. Just that the story be both. At some point, you must be arousing the readers. At some point, they must feel fear.

I think it honestly starts in the concept. I wrote a story a couple Halloween Contests ago where a couple were struggling after finding out they couldn't have children. The wife was devastated, and turned to eh, black magic for the lack of better terms. She was determined to have a child, turning to her superstitious witch-like aunt for a "home remedy". The husband opposed this. But she took the concoction on Halloween night (veil between living and dead thinnest yada yada.) Turns out the aunt tricked her. It was always her plan. The woman wound up possessed, unbeknownst to the husband. The sex was graphic. I always saw movies where the devil possessed woman and used sex to tempt the holy man. So I depicted this insanely crazy sex scene.

At first, sex seemed normal to the guy... a lil kinky, but nothing he didn't like. Soon, he realized his wife wasn't acting like herself, wasn't even talking like herself. To his horror, something else was inside his wife, staring back with the black eyes of a shark. The "thing" kinda gets rough with him. It had sex with him for his seed basically. That was the ritual to bring it into the physical world... physical intercourse. His wife wakes up pregnant but births something... not a child, not of this world... a fully grown....

Well. That's the concept of what I'm getting at. The erotic elements are supposed to be forefront. So are the horrific elements. They are stirred right into the very idea of the story. The sexual tension of the characters, the stress surrounding that, and the terrifying mistake they make. Erotic and Horrifying.

There's an author here I like to read that does the erotic and terrifying well in the EH category. TamLin. Might be a good reference point.

So to me, to be Erotic Horror, both elements have to play a crucial part in the very plot itself. I want to be aroused when I read it. I want to be glancing over my shoulder at that movement in the dark. It makes for one hell of a ride.

I think sex and fear both make us reveal a very vulnerable part of ourselves, one we cannot hide.

 

[lovecraft68]

I think sometimes it depends on the horror. What I mean is what type of supernatural angle you are going for as to how believable it is or how much you can make it.

Every Halloween I cringe at what I know will be an endless array of bad succubus stories written by people who only know a succubus as "a sexy demon who has sex uh-huh uh-huh duh..."

But because of that they are common because its easy to explain flat out porno sex exploding in the middle of a horror story.

Last year I went with 'human horror' a female schizo serial killer so it was eay to work some sex in a natural flow.

This year I'm going with female psycho witch vs the mafia. Body count of 10 in the first section. I worked in a sex scene based on building up the fact that by nature this particular breed of witch thrives on two things "blood lust and lust" in that I tip my hat to Brian Lumley whose "Wamphyrie" his version of vampires gave me that idea.

I added in a little bit of a 'reason' for the sex as its a gift to the coven leader as well as a coming of age ritual of sorts for the young(but 18) gift.

It will tank I'm sure, way to vicious and its a whole different ballgame here when its a woman carving people up.

 

[Libratine]

SecondCircle, I'm not going to repeat your entire post, but I've read through it twice now and appreciate the points you brought up.

What you mentioned about your black magic story, I think, sums up what an erotic horror purist would expect. The story requires both the graphically erotic and graphically horrific in order to make it work. THAT is erotic horror as opposed to horror with erotic content.

Lovecraft68, good point on mentioning the "type" of story. One of the ones I'm working on is more suspenseful than horrific, while the other is graphic in all departments. I think both will fit nicely into the Erotic Horror category, though the first will depend on reader's suspension of disbelief and a little bit of faith before they get to the horror part.

 

[sr71plt]

I don't write many horror stories, but when I do, I'm thinking of the sex to begin with, but thinking what about the sex makes it conducive to a horror story--like a vampire wanting sex as well as blood from a victim and maybe the blood giving him enhancement. The sex isn't an add-on--it's central to why it's a horror story.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Do you really care if you're writing pure erotic horror (or erotic anything for that matter), or is it enough that you splice in the expected bumping and grinding in order for it to be called erotica? Or is there really a difference at all, and all I'm doing is beating myself up unnecessarily?

I have a pretty broad definition of "erotic"; for me attraction, without graphic sex, can still be erotic. The two stories I've posted in Erotic Horror had very little sex, none of it explicit, and readers still liked them well enough.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Erotic Horror as explained by Vince Masuka: "I got a reputation to live up to. I mean if my show does not make people vomit and have an erection at the same time then I've let my audience down."

The stories I'm working on for the Halloween contest are making me wonder about the difference between erotic horror and horror with erotic content. For a purist, I guess, the term erotic horror implies that the erotic part of the story is integral; take away the juicy bits and you're left with half a story. On the other hand, horror with erotic content is just made spicier by adding the erotic parts. They aren't really necessary for the story to move along and are basically just eye candy. Tasty candy, but like the real thing it's not necessary for a good diet.

What I'm writing has gotten me thinking that I'm writing the second type of story, and that bothers me a little. These are the first stories I'll be submitting to Literotica since 2006. I guess I want to make the splash as big as possible, so to speak. I'm sure most of you will tell me I'm overthinking it and that the readership won't really care. But what about we writers?

Do you really care if you're writing pure erotic horror (or erotic anything for that matter), or is it enough that you splice in the expected bumping and grinding in order for it to be called erotica? Or is there really a difference at all, and all I'm doing is beating myself up unnecessarily?

 

[Libratine]

I have a pretty broad definition of "erotic"; for me attraction, without graphic sex, can still be erotic. The two stories I've posted in Erotic Horror had very little sex, none of it explicit, and readers still liked them well enough.

So far, I've gone for some graphic depiction, enough, I hope, to engage the erotic-minded reader, but not so much that it reads like a teenager's attempt at emulating a Penthouse letter. It's been a strange exercise in my personal writing style to push the curtain aside instead of leaving the details to the reader's imagination.

Erotic Horror as explained by Vince Masuka: "I got a reputation to live up to. I mean if my show does not make people vomit and have an erection at the same time then I've let my audience down."

That is, well, twisted is the best word to describe it. I don't want to make anyone vomit. I just want them to shiver and look over their shoulder and maybe have a bad dream or two ... along with a wet one.

 

[Hypoxia]

I have edited EH and touched on it in a couple of my stories, especially Vamos! Day of the Fucking Dead and a bit less in A Taste of Incest - Spirits. I am reluctant to squeeze STRONG horror into an erotic story. (But that could change!)

My emphasis as a writer is on 1) telling stories with 2) erotic content that may be 3) serious or sarcastic. Their purpose is to provoke heat and/or laughter and/or thought, not fear and nausea. A piss-your-pants horror-show may indeed have strong erotic content but I'd prefer my readers' panties wet with something other than warm urine. (But that could change!)

Of course some of my writing is just plain horrible but that's another subject.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Well, I was sort of only joking, but there's some truth to it.

If you want to be a purist, true Horror, real Horror, is much more than just fear. There is fear and maybe terror in Horror, but there's not necessarily Horror within fear. Real horror does makes you want to retch. There's more of appalled disgust, rejection, trauma, the need to flee. It fills you with a very bad feeling, so the only thing to do sometimes is vomit. It's very different from the pleasant tingles of a ghost story.

Personally, I find Horror and Eroticism totally anti-thetical. Can you sustain them at the same time? Not usually . . . that's why most EH stories keep parallel lines, dipping into the "horror" at times and the "sex" at times, alternating one with the other. Any EH story I've ever read is Horror with Erotic Content and Vice Versa, not true Erotic Horror. Is there such a thing? Don't they cancel each other out?

So far, I've gone for some graphic depiction, enough, I hope, to engage the erotic-minded reader, but not so much that it reads like a teenager's attempt at emulating a Penthouse letter. It's been a strange exercise in my personal writing style to push the curtain aside instead of leaving the details to the reader's imagination.



That is, well, twisted is the best word to describe it. I don't want to make anyone vomit. I just want them to shiver and look over their shoulder and maybe have a bad dream or two ... along with a wet one.

 

[tishadomina]

I tend to personally prefer horror with erotic content. Both are strong points that I am good at writing, but in all fairness, I truthfully enjoy writing horror more; I get visceral, gritty and downright nasty.

But erotic horror is good too, plot/characters depending.

 

[SecondCircle]

Well, I was sort of only joking, but there's some truth to it.

If you want to be a purist, true Horror, real Horror, is much more than just fear. There is fear and maybe terror in Horror, but there's not necessarily Horror within fear. Real horror does makes you want to retch. There's more of appalled disgust, rejection, trauma, the need to flee. It fills you with a very bad feeling, so the only thing to do sometimes is vomit. It's very different from the pleasant tingles of a ghost story.

Personally, I find Horror and Eroticism totally anti-thetical. Can you sustain them at the same time? Not usually . . . that's why most EH stories keep parallel lines, dipping into the "horror" at times and the "sex" at times, alternating one with the other. Any EH story I've ever read is Horror with Erotic Content and Vice Versa, not true Erotic Horror. Is there such a thing? Don't they cancel each other out?

In my opinion, no.

No more than say, genius and insanity.

 

[lovecraft68]

Personally I tend to look at Halloween the same way who party all the time look at the people on New Years Eve.

Amateur night.

Mostly what I've found here in these contests-in the EH category, I'm not talking about Halloween themed romps in other categories-is too much "Look how dark I can be" "Look how scary I can be"

Contrived darkness is easy to spot, at least for me. That's not to say I haven't come across a few gems, but ironically they tend to be low rated. But then again most original things are here.

Lit-and erotica in general thrives on same old same old, when someone gives them something different they're not happy. "What, Ham and Cheese? But I've been eating PB&J for three years now!"

 

[SecondCircle]

Is EH not supposed to be dark and/or scary? I suppose it would be the same as Romance stories being too tender or gushy. Comes with the territory I think. At times it can seem a little contrived, but more of what I see is the great myths of horror such as Succubi, camps and the like. To each their own I say.

 

[lovecraft68]

Is EH not supposed to be dark and/or scary? I suppose it would be the same as Romance stories being too tender or gushy. Comes with the territory I think. At times it can seem a little contrived, but more of what I see is the great myths of horror such as Succubi, camps and the like. To each their own I say.

Course it is and I have no issue with dark or scary.

I think what I mean is its like anything else, you can tell if the person writing it is in a natural flow and this is what the muse is delivering or if its a "Okay, I gotta be scary, I gotta scare people or gross them out"

It the same effect of a stories here where you can tell they really forced the sex scene, its meant to be hot, but its mechanical.

So robotic/mechanical/uninspired....maybe that's a better way to say it.

Like in real life I can read a horror novel and think, "Wow, they were trying way to hard (Jack Ketchum's Off Season #1 example, of just piling on shock value) or "Damn, this guy is either really talented or really bent!"

If that makes sense...if it doesn't do a few shots and it might.

 

[Messier82]

I don't write many horror stories, but when I do, I'm thinking of the sex to begin with, but thinking what about the sex makes it conducive to a horror story--like a vampire wanting sex as well as blood from a victim and maybe the blood giving him enhancement. The sex isn't an add-on--it's central to why it's a horror story.

Given that vampirism is generally seen as an analogy of the sexual act, ie virgins, penetration (of the teeth), blood etc, a vampire wanting physical sex as opposed to analogous sex, might be interpreted as 'deviant'. Could be an interesting twist.

 

[SecondCircle]

Course it is and I have no issue with dark or scary.

I think what I mean is its like anything else, you can tell if the person writing it is in a natural flow and this is what the muse is delivering or if its a "Okay, I gotta be scary, I gotta scare people or gross them out"

It the same effect of a stories here where you can tell they really forced the sex scene, its meant to be hot, but its mechanical.

So robotic/mechanical/uninspired....maybe that's a better way to say it.

Like in real life I can read a horror novel and think, "Wow, they were trying way to hard (Jack Ketchum's Off Season #1 example, of just piling on shock value) or "Damn, this guy is either really talented or really bent!"

If that makes sense...if it doesn't do a few shots and it might.

I suppose that could be true of any category. Boils down to personal limits of taste. Mostly subjective. Some things can get extreme for my own tastes, but extreme isn't necessarily bad. It just has to fit in the overall story.

Some horror flicks put a little to much stock in say, gore, and it seems like they are trying too hard to please that specific audience. I don't particularly care for this level of gore because it goes after more of the repulsive response or catering to the "cheering gladiator crowd".

But I do not condemn all blood and gore. Sometimes it fits the bill. The Saw franchise catches a lot of flak for this. While I only followed the first three, I have to say, gore and torture is actually the entire point in the plot itself. The victims were put into various "traps", all the sick therapy of a man gone insane, to get them to make grueling choices about the value of their life, and the lives of others. The disturbing thought of bodily dismemberment, or simply gore, was entirely the idea. So it fits in its universe. But eventually, these elements became institution. That is, the audience was no longer awed by them. They cheered for them. Which loses its effect after a while (especially when you pair it with terrible plus moving forward).

It never matters. It is always in the eye of the beholder in the end.

 

[lovecraft68]

I suppose that could be true of any category. Boils down to personal limits of taste. Mostly subjective. Some things can get extreme for my own tastes, but extreme isn't necessarily bad. It just has to fit in the overall story.

Some horror flicks put a little to much stock in say, gore, and it seems like they are trying too hard to please that specific audience. I don't particularly care for this level of gore because it goes after more of the repulsive response or catering to the "cheering gladiator crowd".

But I do not condemn all blood and gore. Sometimes it fits the bill. The Saw franchise catches a lot of flak for this. While I only followed the first three, I have to say, gore and torture is actually the entire point in the plot itself. The victims were put into various "traps", all the sick therapy of a man gone insane, to get them to make grueling choices about the value of their life, and the lives of others. The disturbing thought of bodily dismemberment, or simply gore, was entirely the idea. So it fits in its universe. But eventually, these elements became institution. That is, the audience was no longer awed by them. They cheered for them. Which loses its effect after a while (especially when you pair it with terrible plus moving forward).

It never matters. It is always in the eye of the beholder in the end.

I grew up in the 80's the golden years of gore-when movies like gates of Hell was considered good And things like 2000 Maniacs was all the rage in how much fake blood can we spill during the filming of this.

I'm not a torture porn fan-saw most certainly falls under that- and am happy horror has come full circle to where movies like Insidious rely on suspense and well timed scares.

I like that in all horror, in your face, look how much blood or how many people I can hack up or how slowly I can kill someone falls short....for me and I'm the only person I can speak for.

 

[SecondCircle]

I grew up in the 80's the golden years of gore-when movies like gates of Hell was considered good And things like 2000 Maniacs was all the rage in how much fake blood can we spill during the filming of this.

I'm not a torture porn fan-saw most certainly falls under that- and am happy horror has come full circle to where movies like Insidious rely on suspense and well timed scares.

I like that in all horror, in your face, look how much blood or how many people I can hack up or how slowly I can kill someone falls short....for me and I'm the only person I can speak for.

Aye. I am the same. I'm glad for the current horror that's out like Insidious and Mama. You have my taste in horror.

But why the body count and extremes in your upcoming then?