Do You Think You Are A Writer?

[amicus]

I watched a film tonight. Early on, I thought as I shook my head slowly back and forth, "But I could not write this..."

I think I am a writer. I think one must think that if one is to even attempt to write.

I have been paid for my writing; and that helps enforce my thought that I can indeed write and communicate.

But I know I could not write what I saw this night on a television screen.

I suggest if you have not seen the film I am about to write about, that you do not follow the link I will provide, do not read the synopsis, do not read the review. See if first for yourself and reach your own conclusions and then perhaps see what others have said.

This film reminisces in a way about films like, "An Affair to Remember", and "Somewhere in Time" and perhaps a newer film, "Frequency"; but that is only part of the aura of this film.

It also speaks of architecture and art and light and fathers and sons and mothers and daughters, and it does more.

It made me think that with another lifetime to live, with what I have learned, or perhaps several more lifetimes of learning, that there are other lifelong pursuits I would endeavor. Such as screenwriting and direction and music.

I include the soundtrack from the film, for music plays such an integral role in film-making; as does The Director and the stage settings and photography, lighting and of course, the actors and actresses.

The original music for the film was written by Paul McCartney, the soul of the Beatles and the essence of Wings and a great musician and song writer.

I noted also that whomever selected the music for the film included Carol King, "It's Too Late", and O'Pato, a Brazilian piece, Jobim, I think, with Stan Getz, and of course the song Reeves and Bullock danced to, "This Never Happened Before" by Paul McCartney.

In the film, "Somewhere in Time", Rachmaninof's "Variations on a Theme of Paganini" was a centerpiece, and, although it is long ago that I last saw, "An Affair to Remember", it seems music played a large part in that also.

Well, enough digression and rambling. I again recommend you see this film, preferably alone and without distraction before you read the synopsis, It will just knock your socks off if you write and imagine how you might perceive and fashion such an idea into words and then into a film.

Oh, one more thing. I wanted to credit the writer of this film and was totally surprised to discover that it was a remake of a 2000 Korean film and that too, lead my thoughts in many directions.

~~~



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lake_House_(film)

The Lake House is a 2006 romantic drama film remake of the Korean motion picture Il Mare (2000).

It was written by David Auburn and directed by Alejandro Agresti and stars Keanu Reeves and Sandra Bullock as Alex Wyler and Kate Forster, as an architect and a doctor living in 2004 and 2006 respectively. It also reunites Reeves and Bullock for the first time since Speed in 1994.




#Directed by
Alejandro Agresti



#Writing credits
(WGA)
David Auburn (screenplay)


Eun-Jeong Kim (motion picture "Siworae") &
Ji-na Yeo (motion picture "Siworae")


Soundtrack
Release date: 20 June 2006, by Lakeshore Records

track listing

"This Never Happened Before" - Paul McCartney
"(I Can't Seem To) Make You Mine" - The Clientele
"Time Has Told Me" - Nick Drake
"Ant Farm" - Eels
"It’s Too Late" - Carole King
"The Lakehouse" - Rachel Portman
"Pawprints" - Rachel Portman
"Tough Week" - Rachel Portman
"Mailbox" - Rachel Portman
"Sunsets" - Rachel Portman
"Alex's Father" - Rachel Portman
"Il Mare" - Rachel Portman
"Tell Me More" - Rachel Portman
"She's Gone" - Rachel Portman
"Wait For Me" - Rachel Portman
"You Waited" - Rachel Portman
"I Waited" - Rachel Portman

During the movie Reeves and Bullock dance in 2004 to the Paul McCartney song "This Never Happened Before", but this is anachronistic. The song was released in 2005 on McCartney's album Chaos and Creation in the Backyard. How ever this can be argued due to the fact that the dance itself can be viewed as a recall of Bullock's character's memory in the film.

[edit] Songs appearing in the film, but not on the soundtrack

"I Wish You Love" - Rosemary Clooney
"There Will Never Be Another You" - Rosemary Clooney
"Pink Moon" - Nick Drake
"La noyée" - Carla Bruni
"Sentimental Tattoo" - Jukebox Junkies
"Chiamami Adesso" - Paolo Conte
"When It Rains" - Brad Mehldau
"Young At Heart" - Brad Mehldau
"Almost Like Being In Love" - Gerry Mulligan
"O Pato" - Stan Getz
"A Man and A Woman" - Sir Julian
"Bitter" - Me'Shell Ndegeocello

[edit] Songs associated with the film, but not in the film or on the soundtrack
The trailer features the song "Somewhere Only We Know" by the band Keane. It is available on the album Hopes and Fears.


amicus...

 

[maggot420]

I thought it was a pretty good film. Not great really but ok. I think movies are very subjective in how they appeal to people. Everyone gets very different things out of them.
Maybe I just missed something in this one but it didn't strike me the way it must have you.
And I'm a huge fan of films that play with time. 12 Monkeys being a great example. I know I couldn't have written that movie.

 

[Vermilion]

Amicus, I'd like to respond intelligently but, as with many of your posts, this was so long and in-depth/convoluted, I missed the point.

If you're asking do I consider myself a writer? I'd have to say yes. All I think about is writing, everything I see inspires me to write. I think up phrases in my head and plan storylines when I'm bored. If I'm not a writer then I'm batty, becuse why else would I be doing that all the time?

x
V

 

[amicus]

maggot420...thanks...yes...I guess we do respond differently and I suppose it is viewed as a fault of mine that I seek the 'universal' in all things.
Another 'time' film, Millenium, I think, Kris Kristofferson and an actress I know but cannot recall the name; another time theme I found interesting.

ah well..thanks again

amicus

 

[maggot420]

maggot420...thanks...yes...I guess we do respond differently and I suppose it is viewed as a fault of mine that I seek the 'universal' in all things.
Another 'time' film, Millenium, I think, Kris Kristofferson and an actress I know but cannot recall the name; another time theme I found interesting.

ah well..thanks again

amicus

I'm not so sure that could be considered a fault, mon Ami. Just a question of taste.

Cheryl Ladd. I particularly liked the lasers that put out your cigarettes in that movie.

Memento and Groundhog Day are another couple that you should check out if your interested in the theme. They are a little different as in not quite about travelling through time but interesting nevertheless.

 

[amicus]

[QUOTE=Vermilion]Amicus, I'd like to respond intelligently but, as with many of your posts, this was so long and in-depth/convoluted, I missed the point.

If you're asking do I consider myself a writer? I'd have to say yes. All I think about is writing, everything I see inspires me to write. I think up phrases in my head and plan storylines when I'm bored. If I'm not a writer then I'm batty, becuse why else would I be doing that all the time?

x
V[/QUOTE]


~~~

Hello red shoed lady....another fault of mine I guess, overly long and convoluted. I guess the point was, in a way, there are things as a writer I cannot do and when I am reminded of that, as I was, it gives me somewhat a humble feeling, which as you may suspect is alien to my nature.

And I am 'batty' also, as everything I see, seems to generate a story line.

Thanks for the response.

amicus...

 

[amicus]

[QUOTE=maggot420]I'm not so sure that could be considered a fault, mon Ami. Just a question of taste.

Cheryl Ladd. I particularly liked the lasers that put out your cigarettes in that movie.

Memento and Groundhog Day are another couple that you should check out if your interested in the theme. They are a little different as in not quite about travelling through time but interesting nevertheless.[/QUOTE]


~~~

Thanks again...Groundhog Day I saw but did not appreciate greatly, Memento doesn't ring a bell, but I will look for it; thank you.

amicus...

 

[CharleyH]

maggot420...thanks...yes...I guess we do respond differently and I suppose it is viewed as a fault of mine that I seek the 'universal' in all things.
Another 'time' film, Millenium, I think, Kris Kristofferson and an actress I know but cannot recall the name; another time theme I found interesting.

ah well..thanks again

amicus

Cheryl Ladd is the name you are looking for (aka - ex-Charlie's Angel). Seen both films and found the concepts interesting, although admittedly I am a huge fan of 12 Monkeys as opposed to millenium. More recently saw The Fountain (with Rachel Weisz and Hugh Jackman) another interesting, albeit more avant-garde time piece.

Time pieces have always been especially intriguing to me and I have written a couple of pieces, one 'Bathyl' which I had posted to lit (since removed to complete) a few years back. I loved working on that story, although I have been significantly sidetracked by other projects) and working on that particular piece (mainly because of the concept of time) is as much exhausting and challenging as it is fascinating.

A sample (context is that Eva receives and is reading a letter in the future, sent from the present which is set in the past):

Do you remember Eva? Can you remember Versailles?

Your Louvre inspired beauty eclipses the misting dusk over Paris tonight. As I write, you live in a different part of the world, exist in a place that does not breathe this same air, and even though I see you as clear as if you were here right now, you are a ripple of what you were before we lost each other to time, a dream spilling into my life, a memory almost too far away to remember, and yet too vivid to forget. You are the past that curses me, the present that haunts me – and your image now is my future just beyond grasp.

I know that you do not understand, yet. But you will.

 

[amicus]

Cheryl Ladd is the name you are looking for (aka - ex-Charlie's Angel). Seen both films and found the concepts interesting, although admittedly I am a huge fan of 12 Monkeys as opposed to millenium. More recently saw The Fountain (with Rachel Weisz and Hugh Jackman) another interesting, albeit more avant-garde time piece.

Time pieces have always been especially intriguing to me and I have written a couple of pieces, one 'Bathyl' which I had posted to lit (since removed to complete) a few years back. I loved working on that story, although I have been significantly sidetracked by other projects) and working on that particular piece (mainly because of the concept of time) is as much exhausting and challenging as it is fascinating.

A sample (context is that Eva receives and is reading a letter in the future, sent from the present which is set in the past):

Do you remember Eva? Can you remember Versailles?

Your Louvre inspired beauty eclipses the misting dusk over Paris tonight. As I write, you live in a different part of the world, exist in a place that does not breathe this same air, and even though I see you as clear as if you were here right now, you are a ripple of what you were before we lost each other to time, a dream spilling into my life, a memory almost too far away to remember, and yet too vivid to forget. You are the past that curses me, the present that haunts me – and your image now is my future just beyond grasp.

I know that you do not understand, yet. But you will.

~~~

Ah, Thank you Tracy and I did read the PM and apologize for not responding, a bit unforgivable.

There is another film, and I am stretching here to remember and meeting with no success... a woman somewhere in the Northeast of the US, Boston perhaps, has recurring dreams about a past life somewhere in Ireland or Scotland perhaps, a 'reincarnation' theme, I suppose would best describe it; perhaps someone will know.

I love this forum and the people here...they and you, at times, expand upon my thoughts and visions and referents and that is indeed a pleasure. There are many time related science fiction novels that spring into my mind, now that the scope of my feelings about, "The Lake House", have spread, like a ripple in a quiet pond.

And as a total aside, to add, a touch of levity, as I am wont to do at times, the television is still on and "Caveman" with Ringo Starr and Barbara Bach, and the blonde girl whose name I should remember, and I just love that film, one of the funniest I think I have ever seen.

Ciao!!!

amicus...

edited to add: I was so wrapped up in the thought I expressed, that I failed to acknowledge this: "Your Louvre inspired beauty eclipses the misting dusk over Paris tonight. As I write, you live in a different part of the world, exist in a place that does not breathe this same air, and even though I see you as clear as if you were here right now, you are a ripple of what you were before we lost each other to time, a dream spilling into my life, a memory almost too far away to remember, and yet too vivid to forget. You are the past that curses me, the present that haunts me – and your image now is my future just beyond grasp.

I know that you do not understand, yet. But you will..."

I have said before, elsewhere, your writing reminds me of another era, far removed and you do it well.

ami...

 

[JPMMURPHY]

Do I think myself a writer? Yes. Marketable? We have yet to see.

Yes, I saw Lake House in the theaters. It was one of those movies you walk out of saying 'damn, that was it, why didn't I come up with that', yet, if I had sent that idea to an agent, black and white, here's the blurb, I have no doubt they would have said, "Are you nuts?"

My wife and I recently rented the Lake House to watch again. Twenty minutes in I thought, "Where's the magic?" I didn't see it working, yet at the mid point, it was there. By the end I was as impressed as the first time.

 

[SesameStreet]

Do I consider myself to be a writer? I am published and I do earn money from my writing so, Yes, I consider myself to be a writer.

The movie, The Lake House..........I saw this recently on HBO. It appealed to me as it is a solid romance with a unique time distortion twist. I write solid romances in all my work so naturally a movie with a strong romance theme appeals to me. I also liked the Kevin Kline/Meg Ryan movie "French Kiss" for the same reason. I really can't see men liking them though. Men are not usually into romances.

 

[raphy]

For a good solid Time piece, check out "To Say Nothing Of The Dog" by Connie Willis.

Intelligent, well crafted and thorough.

Stunning.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

It's funny how often we writers admire the writing capabilities of others... interesting what we're drawn to. I know I admire the things I can't do... it's a sense of awe, like WOW, that's amazing, how did they do that?!

But writers have strengths in different areas. You may write in a way someone else can't, and they will stop and admire your work, and think, "Wow, I could never do that!"

Variety--the spice of life.

My husband was a graphic arts major in college, and he and his best friend would often be drawing or painting the same model, and their process was totally different. My husband would have a line here, a curve there... he'd spend a lot of time staring at the canvas. My husband's friend would be methodically drawing, concentrating, connecting all the lines, etc. Then, in the last fifteen minutes of class--whoosh! There would be this huge flurry of activity on my husband's canvas, and there would be a picture. Totally different from his friend's, and yet it was the same object.

And so we writers write... differently... process and creation and product... and yet it's all art... all beauty... so differently appreciated, but appreciated nonetheless...

 

[maggot420]

Do I consider myself to be a writer? I am published and I do earn money from my writing so, Yes, I consider myself to be a writer.

The movie, The Lake House..........I saw this recently on HBO. It appealed to me as it is a solid romance with a unique time distortion twist. I write solid romances in all my work so naturally a movie with a strong romance theme appeals to me. I also liked the Kevin Kline/Meg Ryan movie "French Kiss" for the same reason. I really can't see men liking them though. Men are not usually into romances.

I thought French Kiss was absolutely wonderful. I loved it. And I'm a man.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

It's funny how often we writers admire the writing capabilities of others... interesting what we're drawn to. I know I admire the things I can't do... it's a sense of awe, like WOW, that's amazing, how did they do that?!

But writers have strengths in different areas. You may write in a way someone else can't, and they will stop and admire your work, and think, "Wow, I could never do that!"

Variety--the spice of life.

My husband was a graphic arts major in college, and he and his best friend would often be drawing or painting the same model, and their process was totally different. My husband would have a line here, a curve there... he'd spend a lot of time staring at the canvas. My husband's friend would be methodically drawing, concentrating, connecting all the lines, etc. Then, in the last fifteen minutes of class--whoosh! There would be this huge flurry of activity on my husband's canvas, and there would be a picture. Totally different from his friend's, and yet it was the same object.

And so we writers write... differently... process and creation and product... and yet it's all art... all beauty... so differently appreciated, but appreciated nonetheless...

Oh Selena, I'm so happy you incorporated art and writing, they go together so well.

I marvel at something well written whether its in a movie or a good show on telly. Then to see how someone takes those words and give them life in a visual form just wows me.

 

[S-Des]

It's funny how often we writers admire the writing capabilities of others... interesting what we're drawn to. I know I admire the things I can't do... it's a sense of awe, like WOW, that's amazing, how did they do that?!

In my case, it's pretty much a constant, "Wow, how'd they do that?" It comes from people with so much background in poetry and literature. I read a lot when I was younger, but had to take a decade off due to my apnea (I couldn't concentrate enough to read). I have been told that I'm a good story teller, but I just don't have the influences to ever be a "writer". On the bright side, at least I can appreciate someone else's work and not be jaded (it's hard for me to watch any musician anymore unless he/she is very good).

 

[impressive]

Not only do I think I'm a writer, I know I am. Where I stack up to other writers, however, is a subjective matter. I like to consider myself better than average, occasionally much better -- possibly even brilliant once in a blue moon.

Yes, I do stumble upon material that impresses me. It might be an entire work or just a turn of phrase. I try to learn from it rather than simply envy it.

 

[The_Fool]

Amicus,

To go back to the original question, "Do you think you are a writer?" My interpretation of your post was that the question should have been:

Can we consider ourselves writers within the context of the quality presented by the examples shown? Do we speak to our audience on as many levels as a film of this caliber can?

I typically leave my hubris at home. Kind of worn out from playing with it too much. I too have been paid for various writings and readings. I understand that my work can impact others to varying degrees. But only in certain ways and only in terms of certain subjects. There is always someone out there to do it better. There is always someone out there that knows more than I do about everything. So I do consider myself to be a writer and successful at it as well. But I can look to those that do better and strive to improve.

 

[mikey2much]

liked all the movies mentioned

I think that it takes two things to be a good writer. The first and I think the most important is to have a good ideal. This demands a good imagination and a mind that can follow an ideal to its natural conclusion.

The second is the ability that is needed is to be able to convert into words the story that is playing in you mind.

I know that I am leaving out a lot of the details that make for a good story but you could group them into the second requirement.

Most of the movies mentioned by name share the common thread of time travel or trans-time communication. I loved them all, there was one other big hit that was overlooked, ‘The Terminator,’ where they played that sort of game with time. The writing was not as good or the ideal was less thought out with that film, although it did very well at the box office, it had a bad weak spot with the concept that the boy had sent his father back in time to find and breed with his mother. The boy could not have existed without his father and mother managing to get together without his help. The other movies left a lot unexplained and therefore left it up to the viewer to explain what wasn’t said or shown by the movie.

My question to you is this. Are you more impressed with the concept of the ideal, or are you impressed by the different authors ability to convey that concept to you with their screenplays?

A second question, can a good ideal carry a bad writer or a good writer carry a bad ideal and still have a good movie?

 

[3113]

Well, a couple of things....First point: I saw "The Lakehouse." It's a very nice, romantic film, but I can't say that I found any real magic in it. Maybe I've just read and seen too many time travel stories, but I knew every twist and turn before it happened. Could I have written it?

With my eyes closed.

The originial idea, which is a very *good* idea about letters written back-and-forth through time is the hard part. We'll give the writer complete credit for that, and if the question is, "Could I come up with an idea like that?"--I don't think any writer knows that. Ideas come to us, and a great idea can come to anyone at any time.

Once you've got that idea and are told this is a serious romance (not a romantic comedy), the rest is easy--it's even formulaic: Letters back and forth about the house introducing the characters, realization of the time difference--letters that this is impossible, accusations that it's a hoax, ephiphany letters as the two come to see no, it's not a joke. From there, it's getting to know you letters, talk about the future/past letters...it's all by the book, so to speak. And I'll go one step farther...I have some faint hope and enough hubris (as the Fool put it) that, given time to think on it and brainstorm it, I could have come up with a better plot and a less predictable result. But I don't blame the writers of this movie too much for that. It's the nature of time-travel stories that you can really go only one of two ways--either nothing changes by the time travel and what happens is predictable, or things keep changing and you get time paradoxes. And romances are, afterall, about the romances--not the twist that creates the romance.

FYI, as predictable time travel stories of that sort go (person from past talking to person from future), I'm much more fond of "Frequency," a time-paradox movie ("Lakehouse" is a circular time-travel movie which makes it more "realistic").

Second point: When you watch a movie and are moved or awed by it, it's not the same as being moved or awed by a book. You aren't reading the screenplay, which might well have been a piece of shit. As you, yourself, Amicus, pointed out, you were moved by a lot of things--the cinematography, the pacing, the talent and perhaps beauty of the actors, the music. But you didn't sit down in your chair and read the original screenplay, did you? The first version of that screenplay might have been awful--but it sold, and then it was rewritten. And rewritten.

And rewritten. Actors came on board. And it was rewritten again for those particular actors. The director decided on the music, location people found possible spots, and one was chosen not, perhaps, because it was perfect but because they could afford it. Or maybe it was perfect--for the mood the *director* decided to give to the movie. It goes on and on. But the thing is....though the movie could not have existed without that screenplay and the words written by the screenwriter, what moved you was not the writer's words or imagination--at least, not the writers words/imagination alone. If anyone had screwed up, the actors had been bad, the director had gone for the wrong tone, the music had been awful...you would have hated it. And that would not have been the writer's fault.

Movies aren't novels. Thinking "I couldn't write that" is nonsense--because it's not what was written or, rather, JUST what was written, it's what was created from a lot of different elements, all of them necessary for that collabrative magic.

 

[CharleyH]

Thinking "I couldn't write that" is nonsense--because it's not what was written or, rather, JUST what was written, it's what was created from a lot of different elements, all of them necessary for that collabrative magic.

In regards to the rest of your post (which I have not quoted) I agree, but then y'know, anyone who quotes Thomas Berger in their sig line must be right most of the time (hm, depending on which T. Berger the quote comes from and this is merely an aside to say I read your sig line).

I agree that a film is not the sole work of one individual (try as Eddie Murphy may) I do believe that we can say "I couldn't or even could write that better" in regards to a film, even when the end result of the writing is enhanced or marred (as the case may be) by other factors like an actors interpretation. The fact is that there's dialogue and sometimes the words (dialogue, monologue, narration) are simply (to quote Imp) brilliant. Actor and other factors or not, when the dialogue is masterful, the audience knows it and similarly when the dialogue can't even be improved by a great actor, the audience know that too.

An example of filmic dialogue brilliant on it's own in recent years (IMO) would be V's lengthy monologues in V for Vendetta. As much as I love the actor who interpreted them, I do believe that any number of actors could have breathed the same life into all those damned alliterations. However, without that techi-colourfully amazing dialogue, the film might have fallen flat.

An example of filmic dialogue that no actor on this planet could possibly improve on, and in recent days, is from 'Pathfinder'. Seriously, the phrase hang the writer rings true here.

My all time favourite fantastically cheesy dialogue made brilliant by Gloria Swanson resides in Sunset Blvd and admittedly, I can't think of anyone dead or alive who could have animated that dialogue with such beautiful melodrama like she did. And I am adding this little favourite just because.

 

[3113]

The fact is that there's dialogue and sometimes the words (dialogue, monologue, narration) are simply (to quote Imp) brilliant. Actor and other factors or not, when the dialogue is masterful, the audience knows it and similarly when the dialogue can't even be improved by a great actor, the audience know that too.

Heh. This reminds me of the first Star Wars movie--which, like so many, I loved. But I remember someone pointing out to me that if a lesser actor than Alec Guinness had said Obi Wan Kenobi's lines...the whole film might have flopped. And it's true. That genius of an actor said lines like "the Force...binds the universe together!" so effortlessly, so naturally and convincingly that, by gum, we believed in him AND in "the Force!" He was the salesman who sold us many of the most important elements of that movie, from the Force to light sabers to Jedi Knights.

You're absolutely right. Get a bad actor and even lines by Shakepeare can't save the play; get a great actor, and even bad lines sound like Shakespeare.

http://pub.tv2.no/multimedia/na/archive/00206/Star_Wars_206669m.jpg​

 

[CharleyH]

Get a bad actor and even lines by Shakepeare can't save the play; get a great actor, and even bad lines sound like Shakespeare.

lol Now that is a brilliant turn of phrase.












(edit to change there to that and for italic emphasis)

 

[elfin_odalisque]

Amicus,

Im sorry this thoughtful thread has gone a bit offline.

As a journo you know that your pearls will be wrapping tomorrow's cat litter. There are no writers on this site who will be read by the next generation. It may seem harsh, but that is what has happened since the printing press was invented.

The problem that most 'writers' seem to have is that they want to write for eternity rather than the here-and-now. The people writing Harlequin romances, op-ed pages in the NYT or proposals for the UN security council, knowone thing - it matterswho reads them tomorrow.

None of us (to our eternal regret) write 'literature'. Tenth grade students will not be poring over our scribblings in forty years time. Our novels will be pulped and be helping a tomato plant to grow; our incisive political analysis will be be flushed down the toilet - and the world will just move on.

 

[CharleyH]

As a journo you know that your pearls will be wrapping tomorrow's cat litter. There are no writers on this site who will be read by the next generation. It may seem harsh, but that is what has happened since the printing press was invented.

None of us (to our eternal regret) write 'literature'. Tenth grade students will not be poring over our scribblings in forty years time. Our novels will be pulped and be helping a tomato plant to grow; our incisive political analysis will be be flushed down the toilet - and the world will just move on.

I see what your saying, but wholly disagree - there could be one. It's not that much more optimistic, I know, but alas ... there could be one and why not me.