Do you own your body?

[deckardB26354]

Instead of saying, "Let the States decide." Try saying, "Let the women decide." It makes a lot more sense.

The way that I see is that if you can force all woman to carry a child to term that she doesn’t want, then you should be able to force all men to have a vasectomy.

No? Don’t like that? Then it’s none of your fucking business about what a woman does with her own body.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Instead of saying, "Let the States decide." Try saying, "Let the women decide." It makes a lot more sense.

A lot of them simply don't believe in "states rights". If they did, there wouldn't be talk of a nationwide ban or nationwide limit, and they'd be happy with the status quo.

 

[Bn2f]

A lot of them simply don't believe in "states rights". If they did, there wouldn't be talk of a nationwide ban or nationwide limit, and they'd be happy with the status quo.

Hey RR, how ya been? Family well?
I agree with you but would add that in the state of South Kack many actually do believe in states rights - as it applies to slavery.

 

[DeluxAuto]

A lot of them simply don't believe in "states rights". If they did, there wouldn't be talk of a nationwide ban or nationwide limit, and they'd be happy with the status quo.

Or having trump brag that he made it happen.

 

[ll74]

A lot of them simply don't believe in "states rights". If they did, there wouldn't be talk of a nationwide ban or nationwide limit, and they'd be happy with the status quo.

I believe in states' rights. However, healthcare should not be left to the states.

 

[SevMax2]

I believe in states' rights. However, healthcare should not be left to the states.

We've seen state after state botch the issue so badly that it's insane. Six week abortion ban? How many women don't even know that they're pregnant yet? That's just...wild.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Hey RR, how ya been? Family well?

We're mostly okay

You?

Or having trump brag that he made it happen.

The irony is that Trump wishes that the abortion issue would go away now, while he boasts about his part in getting Roe v Wade overturned. He knows that the issue hurts the Republicans electorally on a nationwide level, and is the reason why Ron DeSantis' bid to be president crashed and burned.

I believe in states' rights. However, healthcare should not be left to the states.

I believe that nationalized healthcare, free at the point of use, should exist everywhere.

We've seen state after state botch the issue so badly that it's insane. Six week abortion ban? How many women don't even know that they're pregnant yet? That's just...wild.

I believe that's deliberate, not a botch up. The states with a 6 week abortion limit are Florida, South Carolina and Iowa, and was in Georgia until about a week ago.

 

[DeluxAuto]

The irony is that Trump wishes that the abortion issue would go away now, while he boasts about his part in getting Roe v Wade overturned. He knows that the issue hurts the Republicans electorally on a nationwide level, and is the reason why Ron DeSantis' bid to be president crashed and burned.

Exactly this.

He doesn't stand for anything so he falls for everything.

 

[adrina]

Exactly this.

He doesn't stand for anything so he falls for everything.

Eh, he'd still sign a national ban for it. Even though he says he wouldn't. If it were lucrative enough for him, he'd have no qualms. Like crypto and EVs.

And if he gets 25th'd or has the 99 cent heart attack, we know that POS Vance would.

 

[DeluxAuto]

Eh, he'd still sign a national ban for it. Even though he says he wouldn't. If it were lucrative enough for him, he'd have no qualms. Like crypto and EVs.

And if he gets 25th'd or has the 99 cent heart attack, we know that POS Vance would.

He definitely would but can't say that during the campaign.

 

[adrina]

The vehemently "pro-choice" advocates hypocrisy on vaccine choice had always seemed strange to me, beyond the ordinary hypocrisy. I saw a comment elsewhere that finally makes sense: in both issues, there are drugs to sell.

The pro-choice partisans can firmly believe they make their own choices, but they are still marching and shouting in lockstep to the orders of their masters, the corporations that bought their party.

You don't understand the difference between pregnancy and a transmissible illness?

That tracks.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

In an interview with Shannon Bream on Fox News yesterday, Tim Walz was called for telling multiple lies, including two dealing with the subject of abortion. Walz not only told an objectively false lie about Trump’s position on abortion, he repeated a lie his running mate is fond of telling pertaining to the death of Amber Thurman. Bream flagged Walz on it and Walz deflected. This morning’s WSJ has a column explaining the real story.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/the-tru...2e4f9?st=UiSY61&reflink=article_copyURL_share

It’s paywalled, so for those who can’t access it, here are excerpts:


The Truth About Amber Thurman’s Death

His source was an article by Kavitha Surana of ProPublica. Ms. Surana reports that in August 2022, nine weeks pregnant with twins, Thurman made an appointment at a North Carolina clinic for a dilation-and-curettage procedure, or D&C, a surgical abortion. She drove there, arrived late, and was given mifepristone and misoprostol instead. After taking the first pill, she “insisted on driving home before any symptoms started.

“Days later, after vomiting and passing out at home, Thurman was taken to a suburban Atlanta hospital, where she reported a tender abdomen. Doctors noted a foul odor during a pelvic exam, and an ultrasound showed possible tissue in her uterus. Thurman needed a D&C, but according to Ms. Surana, the state had “criminalized” that procedure, “with few exceptions,” and practitioners who performed it risked “up to a decade in prison.” Physicians operated some 20 hours after her admission, after diagnosing her with acute severe sepsis. She died.

“In the 56th paragraph of the story, Ms. Surana acknowledges: “It is not clear from the records available why doctors waited to provide a D&C to Thurman.” Mr. Walz obviously didn’t read that far, and the article’s title is meant to give the opposite impression: “Abortion Bans Have Delayed Emergency Medical Care. In Georgia, Experts Say This Mother’s Death Was Preventable.”
Kamala Harris has also cited the Thurman case to support her claim that “the Trump abortion ban” means “doctors have to wait until the patient is at death’s door before they take action.” Both the Harris-Walz account and Ms. Surana’s gloss over several complications:

- The abortion pills. Thurman’s death affirms what antiabortion activists have argued: that the two-pill abortion regimen is far more dangerous than its advocates claim. The Food and Drug Administration in 2016 allowed nonphysicians to prescribe mifepristone, stopped requiring follow-up visits to evaluate patients for potential complications, and permitted use up to 10 weeks’ gestation from seven. Five years later, the FDA eliminated the requirement that women be evaluated in person by any medical professional.

Christina Francis, CEO of the American Association of Pro-Life OBGYNs, has written in these pages that the new protocols lead to far greater risk in the event of ectopic pregnancy, whose symptoms are similar to the normal effect of the abortion pills. According to the FDA’s label, after taking the regimen, between 2.9% and 4.6% of women visit the emergency room for an adverse reaction.

- Georgia’s statute. The law, which Gov. Brian Kemp signed in 2019 and a state judge in Atlanta enjoined last week, defines abortion as an act intended to “cause the death of an unborn child” when a “detectable human heartbeat” is present. Thurman’s unborn children were, it seems, already dead. Even if they hadn’t been, however, the law allows for immediate treatment “when a physician determines, in reasonable medical judgment, that a medical emergency exists” or that the “pregnancy is medically futile.”
Contrary to Ms. Harris’s claim, no abortion statute in the country requires doctors to “wait until the patient is at death’s door” to intervene. Several states with restrictive abortion laws—including Georgia, Florida and Texas—have taken formal actions to counter this misinformation. Other states with similar laws ought to communicate directly with hospitals and doctors to do the same.

- The hospital.Medicare’s rating of Piedmont Henry Hospital in Stockbridge, where Thurman died, gives it two out of five stars and reports that only 41% of patients with severe sepsis or septic shock “received appropriate care.” (The national average is 61%.) Patient reviews report lower-than-average satisfaction with the hospital’s cleanliness, responsiveness and communication. The hospital might have been underresourced: As Ms. Surana notes, “a D&C requires an anesthesiologist, nurses, attending physicians and others”—a host of staff that might have been more readily available elsewhere.

 

[adrina]

I find it fascinating when men have such strong yet erroneous opinions about abortion and they try to spread their propaganda far and wide.

 

[Bn2f]

I find it fascinating when men have such strong yet erroneous opinions about abortion and they try to spread their propaganda far and wide.

Dis muthafuka could give a rats ass about abortion. He’s here to stoke the rubes to vote to give him even more tax cuts.

 

[adrina]

Dis muthafuka could give a rats ass about abortion. He’s here to stoke the rubes to vote to give him even more tax cuts.

The majority of men who are against abortion think of it as a control issue. It is simply a matter of ego that a woman can undo what they believe they did. And they don't like that.

 

[adrina]

Supreme Court Upholds Order on Emergency Abortions That Violate Texas Law


The Supreme Court on Monday let stand a decision that bars emergency abortions that violate the law in Texas.

The justices rejected an appeal from the Biden administration, thus leaving in place an order from a lower court that said hospitals cannot be forced to perform pregnancy terminations that would break the law in Texas.

The Biden administration had previously urged the Supreme Court to overturn the lower court ruling, arguing that federal law requires hospitals to provide abortions in emergency situations. The administration referenced a recent Supreme Court decision in Idaho, where justices narrowly allowed emergency abortions to proceed while legal challenges played out.

The Biden administration had previously urged the Supreme Court to overturn the lower court ruling, arguing that federal law requires hospitals to provide abortions in emergency situations. The administration referenced a recent Supreme Court decision in Idaho, where justices narrowly allowed emergency abortions to proceed while legal challenges played out.

https://www.newsweek.com/supreme-co...gency-abortionsthat-violate-texas-law-1964946


On the grounds there is an exception for health of the mother.

But we've already seen how that plays out when doctors are threatened.

 

[deckardB26354]

In an interview with Shannon Bream on Fox News yesterday, Tim Walz was called for telling multiple lies, including two dealing with the subject of abortion. Walz not only told an objectively false lie about Trump’s position on abortion, he repeated a lie his running mate is fond of telling pertaining to the death of Amber Thurman. Bream flagged Walz on it and Walz deflected.

Link to derpy WSJ OPINION article about one person’s unqualified take on this issue

Wow…Faux News must have all the answers since they’re considered to be an entertainment channel and not a real news source.

The WSJ editor makes a lot of pro-life friendly cases here and tries (and fails) to push the point that an abortion can happen to save the life of the mother in Georgia. It just doesn’t let you make that choice willingly—you have to be in some sort of distress first. Reading some of the linked information in the WSJ article is nauseating because I can just see in my mind the authors on a soapbox with a bible in hand.

Why not just link to the actual article that the WSJ opinion shits all over? Here, let me help you…

https://www.propublica.org/article/georgia-abortion-ban-amber-thurman-death

The author of the PP article says—as was quoted in the WSJ article—that the records don’t really say why the doctors waited to do the D&C. Well, snitches get stitches (not sutures) because nobody wanted to go on the record with PP—so of course the medical record won’t admit that they feared legal consequences for performing a non-state sanctioned abortion.

Doctors and a nurse involved in Thurman’s care declined to explain their thinking and did not respond to questions from ProPublica. Communications staff from the hospital did not respond to multiple requests for comment. Georgia’s Department of Public Health, which oversees the state maternal mortality review committee, said it cannot comment on ProPublica’s reporting because the committee’s cases are confidential and protected by federal law.

You couldn’t care less about abortion rights, so please keep your religious pro “life” bullshit to yourself.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Wow…Faux News must have all the answers since they’re considered to be an entertainment channel and not a real news source.

The WSJ editor makes a lot of pro-life friendly cases here and tries (and fails) to push the point that an abortion can happen to save the life of the mother in Georgia. It just doesn’t let you make that choice willingly—you have to be in some sort of distress first. Reading some of the linked information in the WSJ article is nauseating because I can just see in my mind the authors on a soapbox with a bible in hand.

Why not just link to the actual article that the WSJ opinion shits all over? Here, let me help you…

https://www.propublica.org/article/georgia-abortion-ban-amber-thurman-death

The author of the PP article says—as was quoted in the WSJ article—that the records don’t really say why the doctors waited to do the D&C. Well, snitches get stitches (not sutures) because nobody wanted to go on the record with PP—so of course the medical record won’t admit that they feared legal consequences for performing a non-state sanctioned abortion.


You couldn’t care less about abortion rights, so please keep your religious pro “life” bullshit to yourself.

I get that you don’t like the interview Walz did where his lies were exposed, and I get that you found the WSJ piece “nauseating”, but you haven’t disputed any of the facts that are presented.

 

[deckardB26354]

I get that you don’t like the interview Walz did where his lies were exposed, and I get that you found the WSJ piece “nauseating”, but you haven’t disputed any of the facts that are presented.

What “facts” might those be?

 

[SevMax2]

Supreme Court Upholds Order on Emergency Abortions That Violate Texas Law


The Supreme Court on Monday let stand a decision that bars emergency abortions that violate the law in Texas.

The justices rejected an appeal from the Biden administration, thus leaving in place an order from a lower court that said hospitals cannot be forced to perform pregnancy terminations that would break the law in Texas.

The Biden administration had previously urged the Supreme Court to overturn the lower court ruling, arguing that federal law requires hospitals to provide abortions in emergency situations. The administration referenced a recent Supreme Court decision in Idaho, where justices narrowly allowed emergency abortions to proceed while legal challenges played out.

The Biden administration had previously urged the Supreme Court to overturn the lower court ruling, arguing that federal law requires hospitals to provide abortions in emergency situations. The administration referenced a recent Supreme Court decision in Idaho, where justices narrowly allowed emergency abortions to proceed while legal challenges played out.

https://www.newsweek.com/supreme-co...gency-abortionsthat-violate-texas-law-1964946


On the grounds there is an exception for health of the mother.

But we've already seen how that plays out when doctors are threatened.

When I was anti-choice, it was mostly from religious scruples that lingered well after I rejected Christianity. I gradually accepted that there is no way to confirm sentience at any point in the pregnancy, that I wouldn't actually be able to vote to convict due to reasonable doubt that would linger in my mind, and that ultimately, these were just decisions that were best left up to doctors, mothers, nurses, etc. Frankly, it didn't affect me and it wasn't my place to judge. It took me a long time to get past the propaganda that it was murder, though. Most of my family still honestly believes that it's murder, though.

 

[adrina]

Vance says a future Trump administration would defund Planned Parenthood

Sen. JD Vance, the Republican vice presidential nominee, confirmed to reporters Saturday that former President Donald Trump is "consistent" in his views on defunding Planned Parenthood.

A journalist asked Vance, R-Ohio, whether a future Trump administration would defund Planned Parenthood, the reproductive health care group that has garnered opposition from many conservatives for its pro-abortion-rights positions.

“On the question of defunding Planned Parenthood, look, I mean our view is we don’t think that taxpayers should fund late-term abortions," Vance said after Trump's rally in Butler, Pennsylvania. "That has been a consistent view of the Trump campaign the first time around. It will remain a consistent view."

https://www-nbcnews-com.cdn.ampproj...stration-defund-planned-parenthood-rcna174211

Ignorant men cause women's deaths. And the GOP shrugs because they actually think elective late term abortions exist, and that it's better for the woman to die.

 

[adrina]

The process of getting government out of abortion is as messy as government being in it now, like anything else in healthcare. There's no way to do it without tremendous amounts of shouting. But that is necessary and inevitable, because government won't have the money to stay in.

You don't even know anything about abortion to have an opinion.

 

[TastySuckToy]

Most of my family still honestly believes that it's murder, though.

Every pro life person I know, in and out of my family, thinks the same.

People like adrina try to claim it's about controlling women's bodies, but that isn't the case at all. It's a belief about human life and how abortion is killing it. Pro abortion people like her are just coming at it from their narcissistic point of view and trying to make it solely about them.

 

[deckardB26354]

Every pro life person I know, in and out of my family, thinks the same.

That’s because they’re inbred water headed morons. Go hug your bible, incel.

People like adrina try to claim it's about controlling women's bodies, but that isn't the case at all. It's a belief about human life and how abortion is killing it. Pro abortion people like her are just coming at it from their narcissistic point of view and trying to make it solely about them.

It’s completely about controlling women’s bodies. It’s also about science and that life begins at BIRTH and not conception. It’s funny that a narcissist worshipper like you would call her views on abortion narcissistic. Typical from a bible thumping trumptard.

 

[ll74]

Every pro life person I know, in and out of my family, thinks the same.

People like adrina try to claim it's about controlling women's bodies, but that isn't the case at all. It's a belief about human life and how abortion is killing it. Pro abortion people like her are just coming at it from their narcissistic point of view and trying to make it solely about them.

It's about a woman's body. You can make it about more than that all you want, but a pregnancy is the woman's to bear.

Whether a pregnancy can be terminated or not is always her choice. Whether you agree with her choices is what you're discussing.