Did I fail to put this across?

[YDB95]

There's a comment on my story American Lavender that's been making me wonder if I did a poor job on a fairly important plot point.

Here's the comment (or at least the relevant portion of it): "I also found it odd that Tom had no reaction at all when Renee essentially offered to sleep with him. She said something about "if you want to explore anything while you are here"... And he had 0 reaction instead he brought up Penny."


Here's the portion of the story the comment refers to (on page 4, in case you want to read the whole thing):

Soon we were settled at the freshly cleaned booth in the corner. "Well, this is cozy," I said. "I love it."

"Become a romantic in your old age, have you?" Renee asked.

"I always was! Don't you remember the other guys would never send me on a video run alone because I'd rent something sappy?"

"Hmm, no," Renee said. "I remember Steve always choosing the cheesiest blockbuster every time, and then of course he and I usually snuck off before the movie was over. I hope no one noticed."

"We did," I said. "But we all kind of expected it."

"Fair enough," Renee admitted. "Anyway, Tom, I never had you pegged as the romantic type. Maybe that's just as well, since I did think Steve was and look how wrong I was."

"You thought Steve was a romantic?! Why?"

"Oh, you know, little things he said now and then. Like, I don't know, well, remember that time we went out for pizza in town and it was snowing? On the way back he stopped right in the middle of 4th and High Street -- remember how it hadn't been plowed yet and there were no cars anywhere -- and he said how he just wanted to curl up by a fireplace and snuggle with someone. How cute, you know?"

"That was me, Renee."

"It was?"

I kept my irritation under wraps -- what good would that do now? "Yes, I was the one who said that, and Steve told me to grow a dick already."

Renee burst out laughing, then stopped just as quickly when she saw I wasn't amused. "I'm sorry, Tom. Yeah, that was rude of him. But it's funny, I was sure he was the one who'd said it! All these years, that was one of the things I reached back to when I was tempted to give up on Steve. I guess that's another reason why I should've walked away long ago." An awkward pause went by, and she continued, "Mind if I ask you, Tom, when did you first think. I ought to ditch him? Don't worry about hurting me, just be honest here."

"That's easy," I said. "In fact, I was just thinking about it last night." No need to tell her I had actually told Julia all about it. "That time at the library."

"What time at the library?"

"Senior year, when you'd broken up with him." I was sure that would jog her memory.

To my dismay, it didn't. "Our senior year? I broke up with him then? Strange, I don't remember that. So what did we do at the library?"

"Had one of the most soul-baring conversations we ever had, and went back to your room, and..." I couldn't remind her of her crying and my holding her if she couldn't remember it on her own. I just couldn't do it.

"Hmm, I wish I could remember!" She did look contrite, but that didn't help. "Well, I'm sure you were wonderful, whatever we said that night."

I focused on my glass of ice water rather than bother trying to respond to that.

"Anyway," Renee declared, "Enough of all that. Today is the day I'm back to being me on my own. And I'm curious about you, Tom. Are you going to move back over here? Maybe head up the company in New York?"

"Awfully early to say," I said. "Right now I just want to see how things go with the meetings while I'm here. I will say you get tired of Singapore, so button-down and so hot and humid all the time."

"And you can't chew gum!"

"I have never once missed that," I said. "That just means you won't step in it on the sidewalk."

"Always the optimist!" Renee said. "See, that's what I missed about you, not the imaginary bitterness."

"Thank you." I smiled and resolved to let bygones be bygones with the hurtful revelation of what she'd forgotten.

"So..." She gave me the same flirtatious smile and tilted head she always used to use with Steve. "What did you miss about me?"

"All the talking," I said.

"All the talking?"

"The way we used to be able to talk for hours about anything. Anything except Steve, of course. Freshman year, when everyone else was off drinking, the way we used to bond in the hallway outside your room...some of my favorite memories there."

"Mmm, yeah, that was nice," Renee said, though I had to wonder did she remember it at all. But I didn't pry. "Tell me, and again please be honest here, nothing to lose now, Tom, did you ever imagine us ending up together?"

"Not really," I lied.

"No?"

"Well, you were in love with Steve from so early on. And even then, we were friends for a year. I guess I figured if it were ever going to happen, it would've happened then."

"Oh my God, Tom, don't tell me you believe in the friend-zone!"

"I didn't say that."

"Okay, I guess you didn't. I just want you to know, if you'd like to explore anything while you're here..."

"We'll see if Penny leaves me alone," I said with a grin, hoping that would scare her off.

"Oh, don't tell me you heard about that!"

"I didn't just hear about it, Renee."

"Wait, are you saying it's true? She visited you? Come on, Dave!"

I smiled and nodded, but said nothing.

("Dave" was a misprint - that should say "Tom".)
Now, to me, it was - and still is - perfectly clear why Tom is not interested in jumping in bed with Renee at that moment. But it obviously went completely over the reviewer's head. I'd love to hear other people's take on the scene and whether or not they can see why he reacted the way he did. Was I too subtle with it?

 

[lovecraft68]

First, I wouldn't let the comment get to me. Readers are famous for making comments that make you wonder if they even read the story.

IN the excerpt, when you say "Tom lied" it game me the impression he was interested, but maybe worried about ensuing drama(not having read the story my guess is Penny is the drama" so I think he's being deliberately evasive and casual.


I also, and this is not what you asked, just something that jumped out to me.

"Is there anything you want to explore while you're here" now, again I have no context so maybe there's prior lines or points that make that an innuendo, but I don't see it as an offer to have sex, she was asking of he'd had prior interest, then taking it to the present, kind of a "that was then, this is now so..."

But that's kind of the point we'll all take something different out of a story or excerpt.

 

[YDB95]

"Is there anything you want to explore while you're here" now, again I have no context so maybe there's prior lines or points that make that an innuendo, but I don't see it as an offer to have sex, she was asking of he'd had prior interest, then taking it to the present, kind of a "that was then, this is now so..."

Correct. She wasn't talking about just jumping in bed with him, and he would know this because they'd been friends for years; she wanted to explore a possible relationship.

My point, though, is the reason why he said no was that she had just said two things that hurt him. First, she didn't remember the night in the library, which was a golden memory for him (the reader would know this, because he referred to it earlier on), and she remembered something wonderfully romantic he had said once - but she falsely remembered her soon-to-be-ex husband as the one who said it. So although Tom loves Renee as a friend, she has just given him two very good reasons to steer clear of anything more than that.

I don't know if that went over the commenter's head, or if he just thought, this is Lit, they ought to have sex, end of story. But you're right, I really shouldn't mind what commenters say too much.

 

[NotWise]

Correct. She wasn't talking about just jumping in bed with him, and he would know this because they'd been friends for years; she wanted to explore a possible relationship.

My point, though, is the reason why he said no was that she had just said two things that hurt him. First, she didn't remember the night in the library, which was a golden memory for him (the reader would know this, because he referred to it earlier on), and she remembered something wonderfully romantic he had said once - but she falsely remembered her soon-to-be-ex husband as the one who said it. So although Tom loves Renee as a friend, she has just given him two very good reasons to steer clear of anything more than that.

I don't know if that went over the commenter's head, or if he just thought, this is Lit, they ought to have sex, end of story. But you're right, I really shouldn't mind what commenters say too much.

I didn't get the impression he was that hurt. Maybe you needed to develop his feelings a little more.

 

[Bramblethorn]

There's a comment on my story American Lavender that's been making me wonder if I did a poor job on a fairly important plot point.

Here's the comment (or at least the relevant portion of it): "I also found it odd that Tom had no reaction at all when Renee essentially offered to sleep with him. She said something about "if you want to explore anything while you are here"... And he had 0 reaction instead he brought up Penny."


Here's the portion of the story the comment refers to (on page 4, in case you want to read the whole thing):



("Dave" was a misprint - that should say "Tom".)
Now, to me, it was - and still is - perfectly clear why Tom is not interested in jumping in bed with Renee at that moment. But it obviously went completely over the reviewer's head. I'd love to hear other people's take on the scene and whether or not they can see why he reacted the way he did. Was I too subtle with it?

It works for me. It comes across that Tom is peeved about the things Renee's forgotten (especially at Steve getting credit for them!) and that Renee is oblivious to that, which obviously makes Tom less than enthusiastic about what she's offering. It makes sense for him to deflect the offer, as he does there.

You didn't explicitly say "I was hurt", maybe, but you gave me more than enough to assume that he would be.

That said, there are a lot of readers out there who need a neon sign for that kind of thing.

 

[sdsioux]

my opinion

I think that she is willing to go to the next step with Tom not go to bed. I think you need to be less subtle.

 

[lovecraft68]

Correct. She wasn't talking about just jumping in bed with him, and he would know this because they'd been friends for years; she wanted to explore a possible relationship.

My point, though, is the reason why he said no was that she had just said two things that hurt him. First, she didn't remember the night in the library, which was a golden memory for him (the reader would know this, because he referred to it earlier on), and she remembered something wonderfully romantic he had said once - but she falsely remembered her soon-to-be-ex husband as the one who said it. So although Tom loves Renee as a friend, she has just given him two very good reasons to steer clear of anything more than that.

I don't know if that went over the commenter's head, or if he just thought, this is Lit, they ought to have sex, end of story. But you're right, I really shouldn't mind what commenters say too much.

Honestly, its a realistic touch because many people are oblivious to something that meant the world to another person, and people do misremember things. Then of course we get readers who no matter how clear you are just put what they think should happen into the story and like people who lie to themselves on a regular basis now think it was you who wrote it...
Guess this is why we shouldn't worry too much about reader interpretation, they're not always reading what you actually write, its like a glitch.

 

[AahhWhattheHell]

I didn't get the impression he was that hurt. Maybe you needed to develop his feelings a little more.

Honestly, its a realistic touch because many people are oblivious to something that meant the world to another person, and people do misremember things. Then of course we get readers who no matter how clear you are just put what they think should happen into the story and like people who lie to themselves on a regular basis now think it was you who wrote it...
Guess this is why we shouldn't worry too much about reader interpretation, they're not always reading what you actually write, its like a glitch.

My opinion is right in between both of them. While it's good to see feedback as a learning op, but not be so wrapped up in it. "Opinions are like assholes..."

1 or 2 lines to confirm up his inner thoughts would have gone miles to crystalize the intent of the scene.