Derivative works

[Omenainen]

I was thinking about this "who does it hurt" and "what does it matter" mentality. I was thinking about things like respect, and reputation, and honor, and integrity. I don't like how these conversations always wind up in "well nobody is making money off of this," as if making money is some kind of absolute divider. I think that in life in general, and especially in anonymous places like this, all we have is our name. You are what you bring forth in this community, and the stories you post, and I hold that in great value. And some of that prestige is irrevocably lost by the time when you have to say "oops, I'm sorry, I'll take it down."

For example, if someone got caught copying whole scenes of others' work, I would never read their stories again, because I'd always be thinking "oh, cool line, I wonder if this is theirs or if they stole it," and that would take me out of the story. No matter how profusely that person apologized. (Not that he has. And not that I read his stories before, but anyway.)

Or if someone asked me and AwkwardMD for a review, and then asked another review under another penname and didn't bother pointing out they're the same person asking for more of our time, it would lower my opinion of them from the basic level of respect I have for others to a kind of "oh here's this sneaky bastard again" level. Saying "sorry" is not some kind of magic undo button. It doesn't erase what has been done.

Obviously, some people don't care. They don't hold integrity to be as important as I do. In a place like this, I have nothing I can use against them. Even if I posted in my profile asking not to use my stuff without my permission, why would people like that honor my wish? If all that it boils down to is "will I get caught/will there be real, monetary consequences for me," then that is a pretty low bar indeed. It kind of disgusts me that people think like that. Since I still want to publish my stories, I have no other consolation but to hope that assholes don't happen to read my stories or don't find them worth stealing.

Times change and morals shift. Here in Finland we have this politician (and here I assume it's okay to talk Finnish politics here because none of y'all is interested in any of that) who, back when he was a prime minister, blatantly lied to the parliament about data concerning something they were voting on. Now, back in the olden days you would be forever shunned from politics for this kind of a stunt, but all he felt was needed was to say "oh, sorry 'bout dat!" And now, a few years later, he's running for president. So maybe I'm just old fashioned and getting obsolete. I'll soon be in a rocking chair muttering about the youth these days. O tempora, o mores.

From @Marvin2017 I'd like to ask why do you think it is so important for you to post this story? I get that you're obsessed with the story, but so what? Why can't you obsess over it in private like you've done for the past 13 years? You say you contacted the author in 2006, and they have published in 2010. They had years to continue that story, and if they chose not to, what makes you think you're righter than the original author? Who do you think cares how you think his story should end? If you're a writer, why don't you write your own story to make the point you want to make? If you're like "oh no, I'm not a writer, I was just so carried away by this one story," then why are you so hellbent in publishing this one story? You've written the conclusion you want, why do you want to "inflict it on the world"? How do you think his readers would ever hear that you have written this thing? I just really don't understand why you feel so entitled to someone else's story.

 

[MediocreAuthor]

Even if I posted in my profile asking not to use my stuff without my permission, why would people like that honor my wish?

For the record, if you posted it on your profile, that would be enough to stop me.

 

[lovecraft68]

For the record, if you posted it on your profile, that would be enough to stop me.

But where the difference lies is the person you're replying to is active and expressly saying no which would stop most people. That and if someone were dumb enough to do this to someone who is active its going to get found out...like the person who once lifted one of my stories word for word and posted it under a different title. I had no idea, but several readers sent me the link.

But this thread and others similar are involving people who have not been here for years in any capacity and have left behind no "Don't touch my stuff" warning. I don't recall anyone starting a thread here where they said an author said no, but I did it anyway. This is the usual example.

And there's two conversations here, one is straight up policy for this site-not the rest of the world so people need to just cut the shit with the "copyright laws" crap, we're here on this platform, and this platform doesn't have an issue. As an extension to this, people remove their stories here for whatever reason meaning they don't want them around and we have thread after thread of people posting they'll send them the link to the wayback machine to find them....the site doesn't see that as violating someone's wishes, so....same with something like this.

Second is morality/ethics. Those vary from person to person and some would do it, some won't. Among those who wouldn't there's "no one should do it" and like myself "If other people do it, that's their thing"

This is just air and bickering, the OP can do this if they want to is the bottom line. Not sure if anyone has mentioned it, but they could get some fallout from readers over it so the story could bomb....then again, maybe people who wished it was finished would enjoy someone picking it up and giving them some closure.

And it all comes down to being this simple. If you don't want your work stolen, rewritten, having unauthorized sequels published then....do not put it here or any other free site. Make it for sale and that way if someone does the above you have some recourse with the platform you're selling on as SW and anyone not named amazon will always-when presented proof will remove the infringing book.

I'll point out again that it would be nice to see the same outrage over under age rape stories on here that I see in this pissing contest.

 

[Omenainen]

I'll point out again that it would be nice to see the same outrage over under age rape stories on here that I see in this pissing contest.

And I'd like to see all the hungry children in the world being fed but that doesn't have much to do with this thread either.

 

[SimonDoom]

Can take a peek at this one too because maybe you have an explanation for how a site that will boot a story for "I kissed her when I was 15" allows this.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/how-in-the-hell-is-this-story-on-here.1591435/

You might not have noticed, but the story cited in that thread has been removed.

I never read it, but my understanding from others' comments is that it did not eroticize rape. If that's true, then it wouldn't violate site rules. Stories about non-eroticized violence are not prohibited at this site, or anywhere else, as far as I know. You can see rape and murder on television. The presence of rape stories at this site is not in any way inconsistent with its rules, so long as it's not presented as erotic.

 

[KeithD]

You're ignoring how fan fic works. There's no money being made here which makes a difference.

I'm ignoring fan fiction altogether (just as I haven't posted a damn thing about violence in Lit. stories). None of my comment have a damn thing to do with fan fiction. I haven't included fan fiction in anything I've posted.

 

[KeithD]

But at the end of the day, after 11 years, I'd borrow that mower, use it, refill the gas, and put a note on it letting the neighbor know that I borrowed it.

That isn't "borrowing." It's stealing and could and should send you to the slammer. It certainly illuminates how you justify riding on someone else's work without their explicit permission.

 

[MediocreAuthor]

That isn't "borrowing." It's stealing and could and should send you to the slammer. It certainly illuminates how you justify riding on someone else's work without their explicit permission.

While I disagree, I applaud your logical consistency.

I don't disagree that MAYBE you could end up getting arrested for borrowing the mower (you'd have to be very unlucky to get arrested for using something that had been abandoned for a decade).

I do disagree with the idea that such borrowing is immoral or should put you in jail.

Imagine the court case!

"Your honor! This woman used her neighbors mower, after it had been abandoned for merely 11 years!"

"I did, your honor. I tried to contact the original owners, but they could not be reached. I refilled the gas, cleaned it, and returned it when I was done."

"GUILTY!! TO THE GALLOWS WITH HER!!"

 

[MediocreAuthor]

You might not have noticed, but the story cited in that thread has been removed.

I never read it, but my understanding from others' comments is that it did not eroticize rape. If that's true, then it wouldn't violate site rules. Stories about non-eroticized violence are not prohibited at this site, or anywhere else, as far as I know. You can see rape and murder on television. The presence of rape stories at this site is not in any way inconsistent with its rules, so long as it's not presented as erotic.

You are correct. It didn't eroticize rape, torture, or murder, (although it featured all three) and as such, it did not violate the site rules.

That said, it was a miserable read, and while I didn't report it myself -- I'm secretly kinda glad it's gone

 

[KeithD]

Waste of time because you, I, and everyone who knows you also knows you're not going to read through these. But I'll give you a couple so you can't pretend no one here can ever prove anything which is your MO.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/the-competition-for-“most-extreme-violence”-heats-up.1583102/

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/mechanism-for-removing-reported-stories.1583930/

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/how-is-it-that-abuse-is-now-king.1595838/

Can take a peek at this one too because maybe you have an explanation for how a site that will boot a story for "I kissed her when I was 15" allows this.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/how-in-the-hell-is-this-story-on-here.1591435/

This is far from all of them, you want more do a search for any thread with Loving wives in the title because the topic is generally brought up.

Seeing you won't read them a summary is the debate isn't that there is no room for violence/abuse/rape and assorted nastiness in fiction as of course there is. The issue is when these stories are posted in an erotic category for titillation(there is supposedly a rule against torture for titillation here, but yeah...right). Also the argument that this site and its smirking 'no rape' stories, but much of what's discussed here falls under pure non consent.

Another debate is "context' as in if it fits the story or if its in a non erotic category. There's merit to that, but also the fact this is an EROTIC story site it draws people looking to be aroused and regardless of intent people are going to see it as sexually glorifying things. There is a no under age and no rape rule here, yet look at the last link I provided.

Violence is not a kink and should not be presented as one. But people here will argue over the right of rule breaking material to be here, then squeal over this topic which the site has chosen to allow.

I did look at this. I don't see where it is responsive to my question of who has done what you are asserting with, "The same people who defend stories featuring the glorifying and eroticizing of violence all of a sudden get on their moral high horse about writing a story based on someone else's characters. Says a lot."

Who has done this? Where?

 

[MediocreAuthor]

I will say this, and then bow out of this discussion (unless someone wants to bring me back in).

You can tell by this debate that many authors HATE the idea of their characters being used against their wishes, even if they aren't alive to read it or whatever.

With that knowledge in mind, it would probably be wisest to err on the side of caution.

Especially since you can clearly see that some people view fan-works/finishing other's stories as a HUGE slight against the original author and/or an unacceptable violation of decency.