Creating the villain people love to hate.

[Kantarii]

I like the heroes and heroines in storylines, but I will admit they only shine when they face a formidable foe that challenges them as a character. Would Batman and Sherlock Holmes have been great without their rivals? I think not. So few stories today take the time to develope the villain as much as the protagonist of the story. Sad. Kant

 

[OliviaM]

I love a good villain. They can be so deliciously evil. I also have a weakness for heel-face turns. I do have some fantastically wicked villains in my story notes that I hope to get to eventually.

 

[Hypoxia]

An awesome nemesis might not go over well in erotica. I'm cooking a story with just the opposite: an inept nemesis, of whom the main characters are never even aware. The hapless nemesis tries to sabotage the MC couple's projects but always fucks up.

 

[Kantarii]

An awesome nemesis might not go over well in erotica. I'm cooking a story with just the opposite: an inept nemesis, of whom the main characters are never even aware. The hapless nemesis tries to sabotage the MC couple's projects but always fucks up.

I suppose in erotica, the villainous action might be viewed as a cheater or have the uncanny power of cock blocking....haha....They might even be an ex trying to sabotage the new relationship out of jealousy or be a wicked in-law that tries to prevent a relationship from blossoming,etc. Kant.

Where's my note pad. I'm getting some wicked ideas flowing now

 

[lovecraft68]

My heroes more often than not are villains under most circumstances. I just play the game of matching against people more vile than them.

 

[Kantarii]

My heroes more often than not are villains under most circumstances. I just play the game of matching against people more vile than them.

Ah, the anti hero equation gotta love the unpopular hero doing his own thing for personal gains. What was that quote from Star Wars episode 3 Revenge of the Sith? Oh, yeah, " Evil is a matter of perspective." Or, something to that effect.

 

[Hypoxia]

I don't think I populate my stories with heroes & villains, or anti-heroes, anything like that. They're merely people with their own pros & cons -- the cons mostly involve stupidity, not evil intent, although I do manage to deal with a few rapists, jailbait predators, and other scum who will NEVER be much-beloved villains. Should I write more cartoonish?

Hmmm, maybe a possible spinoff. In LEFT BEHIND the narrator encounters (and bests) a would-be carjacker. Might be interesting to follow that young felon's sordid career, her ups and downs, and ins and outs, in-and-out, in-and-out... Could I write her as a memorable villainess? Will she need a single adversary to play against, a 'hero' trying to bring her down? How to make their struggle erotic? To go for comedy, the hero is an inept oaf. Our sly villainess specializes in black-widow relationships with wealthy folks who die or go comatose soon. The hero never quite catches her... but she always manages sneak in, tie him up, get him hard, and ride him relentlessly. And then escape till next time. Think I'd call that one FREAKY AND THE BEAN. (Guess which is which.)

 

[ColetteJulie]

LW readers don't like villains, especially if they're successful in their endeavours. And they will rank a good story lower because of the despicable asshole you wrote into the story. Jeffrey is still suffering because he's rich and and arrogant and has a fetish and everyone jmps hoops around him. They would have had a bigger soft spot for a serial killer...... Now there's an idea..
. I wonder how far they'll go?

 

[Hypoxia]

LW readers <snip> would have had a bigger soft spot for a serial killer...... Now there's an idea... I wonder how far they'll go?

That's why I suggested the Black Widow, especially if she targets UNPLEASANT older rich folks. To avoid murder / snuff, she merely fucks them to death. Allison knows how to overload old circulatory systems. she learned the tricks from a mentor woman while imprisoned for earlier escapades. She learned so well that she overloaded that mentor just before her release. Call it the graduation exercise.

Now Allison frequents the haunts of the rich and latches onto the loneliest and most disagreeable, any gender. She becomes their sex-toy, wins them over, gets something tangible, then fucks them till an artery or valve pops. A suspicious relative hires inept detective Dolph to get the goods on Ally. Every time he almost closes in, she sneaks into his hotel room at night, drugs him, fucks him almost to death, then goes on to finish-off her next victim. Why? For the lolz. Because she can.

Meanwhile, she is performing a public service by decimating the ranks of the obnoxiously wealth. Who could hate such a villainess?

 

[Kantarii]

That's why I suggested the Black Widow, especially if she targets UNPLEASANT older rich folks. To avoid murder / snuff, she merely fucks them to death. Allison knows how to overload old circulatory systems. she learned the tricks from a mentor woman while imprisoned for earlier escapades. She learned so well that she overloaded that mentor just before her release. Call it the graduation exercise.

Now Allison frequents the haunts of the rich and latches onto the loneliest and most disagreeable, any gender. She becomes their sex-toy, wins them over, gets something tangible, then fucks them till an artery or valve pops. A suspicious relative hires inept detective Dolph to get the goods on Ally. Every time he almost closes in, she sneaks into his hotel room at night, drugs him, fucks him almost to death, then goes on to finish-off her next victim. Why? For the lolz. Because she can.

Meanwhile, she is performing a public service by decimating the ranks of the obnoxiously wealth. Who could hate such a villainess?

You have a vividly, warped mind. I like that Fuck them old ass geezers! Who cares if she has to use popsicle sticks and scotch tape to keep their dicks hard... Haha. That's the cheap side of the fucking. Oh, lord.... I'm going to Hell for that one. Kant

 

[Hypoxia]

You have a vividly, warped mind.

Practice, practice, practice. I blame Tom Lehrer recordings in my youth. I was 10 or 12 when a friend gave me a 45 single with MASOCHISM TANGO and POISONING PIGEONS IN THE PARK. Changed my life forever. That, and the brain damage from when I cracked my skull.

But I digress. Who else could be a lovable erotic villain?

* The born-again Xian works in a condom factory, putting holes in everything so more babies will be born.
* Another religious fanatic works in some food or pharma facility, adding aphrodisiacs for the same end.
* A mad scientist mixes mind-control signals into TV and Net streams, signals driving viewers fuck-frenzied.

I suppose in erotica, the villainous action might be viewed as a cheater or have the uncanny power of cock blocking....haha....They might even be an ex trying to sabotage the new relationship out of jealousy or be a wicked in-law that tries to prevent a relationship from blossoming,etc.

Yeah, them too. But they must be persistent in their evildoing efforts. And somebody besides the evildoers must benefit, else they can't be sympathetic / lovable villains. Any cockblocking provokes other fucking. Any sabotage drives new relationships. Et cetera.

 

[OmnislashXX]

Villains can be fun if you do them right. I think for erotica though, they need to be interested in getting to that pussy somehow. Or like, if they're female and want to be all manipulative.

 

[Hypoxia]

Villains can be fun if you do them right. I think for erotica though, they need to be interested in getting to that pussy somehow. Or like, if they're female and want to be all manipulative.

So you're looking at small-scale villainy, then? The guy or gal who cuts a hot swathe through their community. The pastor who turns all the congregation women into his sex slaves -- or his wife and the congregation's men, likewise. Or both: Team Villainy!

But it's not enough to only fuck the victims. That's merely sex predation. No, they must also be fucked-over somehow. The lovable uncle who seduces his many nieces and arranges to pocket their inheritances -- or the aunt and her nephews, similarly fucked and plucked. Those are BAD. Going lighter, it's some player who screws and impoverishes (and infects) an entire social stratum.

Maybe a ROUTE-66-type road story. A couple (genders of your choice) drive their sports car from town to town, meeting locals sexually, ruining them and their friends and families, then rolling on to another town before the shotguns come out and chaos erupts. Their motivation? For the lolz. Because they can. Because they're fucking-A VILLAINS, hey! Probably spreading incurable diseases, too, diseases to which they are resistant. Yeah, they're evil.

But lovable.

 

[OliviaM]

You guys have some true evildoer ideas. My villains tend to be of the devilishly handsome bad boy variety who manipulates, schemes, or just outright kidnaps to get into the heroine's pants.

 

[OmnislashXX]

There's also blackmail too. Such as " Now girl. Start stripping off those clothes and maybe these pictures of you barking like a dog won't find themselves on any erotic message boards. And take your time. It takes me awhile to blow my load."

 

[lovecraft68]

You guys have some true evildoer ideas. My villains tend to be of the devilishly handsome bad boy variety who manipulates, schemes, or just outright kidnaps to get into the heroine's pants.

Thought you were talking about me there for a minute, but I never kidnap anyone. I get in their pants the old fashioned way....I beg.

 

[Kantarii]

Thought you were talking about me there for a minute, but I never kidnap anyone. I get in their pants the old fashioned way....I beg.

Getting a woman's pants off is easy. Just accidentally spill a glass of water in her lap. Now, you're on your own getting in her panties. But, hey, you can't do that until you get her pants off first. use that imagination and she'll take them off for youKant

 

[ColetteJulie]

That's why I suggested the Black Widow, especially if she targets UNPLEASANT older rich folks. To avoid murder / snuff, she merely fucks them to death. Allison knows how to overload old circulatory systems. she learned the tricks from a mentor woman while imprisoned for earlier escapades. She learned so well that she overloaded that mentor just before her release. Call it the graduation exercise.

Now Allison frequents the haunts of the rich and latches onto the loneliest and most disagreeable, any gender. She becomes their sex-toy, wins them over, gets something tangible, then fucks them till an artery or valve pops. A suspicious relative hires inept detective Dolph to get the goods on Ally. Every time he almost closes in, she sneaks into his hotel room at night, drugs him, fucks him almost to death, then goes on to finish-off her next victim. Why? For the lolz. Because she can.

Meanwhile, she is performing a public service by decimating the ranks of the obnoxiously wealth. Who could hate such a villainess?

Hmmm.... there is a male equivalent to a black widow, I forget now what the term is but the motive is usually the same as a black widow and with them, 80% of the time it's financial first. I do believe that the male and female killer both grow to love their 'sport', I have read a few cases when in the latter stages of their criminal careers, killing the victim was more fun that getting the booty. There was one woman who laid in bed with the son of her intended victim, while the victim lay dying of antimony poisoning in the room next door.

H. H. Holmes is probably the best male black widow up for comparison, his kill rate escalated, because he grew to like the killing.

Anyway, if you put a black widow story into LW shoot me a link, I'm dying to see the reaction. I'd also like to see what they think of males. I do know that they don't like males who beat women, or cold hearted males, and foolishly I'm going to give them a murder of a domestic abuse abuser..... I think I'm being stupid.

 

[Hypoxia]

Anyway, if you put a black widow story into LW shoot me a link, I'm dying to see the reaction. I'd also like to see what they think of males.

The tale I'm cooking has Ally (spun-off from another story) in prison for carjackings. She's mentored by a wickedly wise older Asian whore who teaches her how to orally invoke unbearable pleasure. With tight control, acupuncture meridians around a clitoris or penis can be stimulated so as to cause temporary heart stoppage, or a heart attack or cerebral stroke. Ally practices on inmates and guards and becomes very proficient.

Given early release (she nicely blew the warden) Ally changes ID and targets the unpleasantly rich as I wrote above. After obtaining something tangible from them like jewels, property deeds, negotiable bonds, etc, she sends them into terminal orgasms. I *think* I'm avoiding the no-snuff rule because they die cumming and Ally does not cum while killing them. For fun, I'll throw in Ally fucking and humiliating the inept detective.

I'm kind of stuck on a desired ending (but I only started this yesterday). Did the PI send her back to prison? Does she flip him so they retire together to a tropical paradise? Does she kill him too, then go into politics or evangelism or real estate? Does she open a Harlot's Academy, teaching her techniques to aspirants? (But she's careful to never let one do her.) Is she promoted to succubus, maybe after her unfortunate death in a falling gondola? I dunno.

 

[OliviaM]

A+++ would read

 

[ColetteJulie]

The tale I'm cooking has Ally (spun-off from another story) in prison for carjackings. She's mentored by a wickedly wise older Asian whore who teaches her how to orally invoke unbearable pleasure. With tight control, acupuncture meridians around a clitoris or penis can be stimulated so as to cause temporary heart stoppage, or a heart attack or cerebral stroke. Ally practices on inmates and guards and becomes very proficient.

Given early release (she nicely blew the warden) Ally changes ID and targets the unpleasantly rich as I wrote above. After obtaining something tangible from them like jewels, property deeds, negotiable bonds, etc, she sends them into terminal orgasms. I *think* I'm avoiding the no-snuff rule because they die cumming and Ally does not cum while killing them. For fun, I'll throw in Ally fucking and humiliating the inept detective.

I'm kind of stuck on a desired ending (but I only started this yesterday). Did the PI send her back to prison? Does she flip him so they retire together to a tropical paradise? Does she kill him too, then go into politics or evangelism or real estate? Does she open a Harlot's Academy, teaching her techniques to aspirants? (But she's careful to never let one do her.) Is she promoted to succubus, maybe after her unfortunate death in a falling gondola? I dunno.

Alternatively, don't kill her off or put her away, have her fuck him into a coma and then disappear, he can heal and come back for round two, or he can remain in stasis and you introduce a new hero to the next story or chapter. Perhaps this one is not inept but has a 'genious' handicap - like OCD or something that works against him, perhaps a professor who has keenly observed the news and wants to study her or is asked to profile her and gets involved. The end again is a rinse and repeat, his wings get singed, she gets away and the next story starts. Just an idea...

 

[Hypoxia]

Alternatively, don't kill her off or put her away, have her fuck him into a coma and then disappear, he can heal and come back for round two, or he can remain in stasis and you introduce a new hero to the next story or chapter. Perhaps this one is not inept but has a 'genious' handicap - like OCD or something that works against him, perhaps a professor who has keenly observed the news and wants to study her or is asked to profile her and gets involved. The end again is a rinse and repeat, his wings get singed, she gets away and the next story starts. Just an idea...

This approach is for a continuing series, maybe an endless stream of cliff-hangers. I'll have to consider whether I want to commit to such.

Meanwhile, let's consider villains. The most horrendous people in history are idealists with sure-fire plans to improve humanity -- idealistic plans resulting in millions of deaths in the name of religious-political purity. Alas, megadeaths are not erotic -- or they'd better not be!

So, idealistic erotic villains... how would that work? Maybe rival villains, holy zealots of monogamy vs polygamy vs polyamory vs celibacy vs prostitution vs teledildonics vs hallucinations vs various fetishes, etc. Each lovable villain recruits followers to their views, like the theory that the world's troubles will be eased if everyone gets a BBC slid up their butt, or that sex should be limited to mutual toe-sucking, or that humans should only fuck robots -- see Sex robots might be better in bed than real humans.

All sorts of villainy is possible. We've only begun to explore the possibilities.

 

[ColetteJulie]

I think if you create a horrendous villain readers will compare to real life evil people as I just did. Just reading the newspaper could supply you with the hero, the villain and the plot of a number of stories.... if you want to commit to something like that. If not, an act of God or everybody kills everybody else effectively gets rid of any left overs, but you are a good author and you already know that.

If I think of spectacularly evil fiction, Thomas Harris immediately comes to mind. And not Dr. Lechter but Francis Dollarhyde specifically, Dollarhyde is every kind of evil and no kind simultaneously. You can compare him to anyone, from Vlad the Impaler to Tommy Lynn Sells and you can't. He succeeded fantastically with Dollarhyde because the reader cannot compare him to a real life criminal/killer/villain.

Hitchcock's Bates was based on Ed Gein and you can clearly see the comparisons and similarities. My villains are only known to their little world, they are not widely known, I don't want the reader to compare to someone in real life. But that's just my preference.

As in real life, if the story continues with the same hero and villain, the evil of the deeds must accelerate, as they do in real life until the criminal is caught.

Manson wouldn't have had only ten followers if he had not been arrested, the cult would have grown, so involving a religious ideal or a political one complicates things greatly.

I think bringing any kind of villain into erotica would display a sexual perversion. And right there is where we run into a moral wall, at least here on Lit. Quite frankly, I'm glad of it most of the time, there are some disturbing perversions that I cannot believe an average person fantasises about but never acts on.

I wondered into the territory of the future with sex with robots, the problem is the robot. You may as well write about a sybian fucking machine then, even if the robot has a personality, it stays a robot. I eventually went further into the future and once again wiped out humanity because from desperation comes inspiration and wrote a story of people being bred for partners. You would raise your partner yourself in an accelerated growth chamber and when the partner goes to 'school', he she is taught how to please their partner sexually as part of the curriculum. It's sitting in my save for later file, I have the beginning, her schooling, but then she and her partner split because war is declared by naturally born people against those who are bred and of course each party in my couple choose opposing sides.

Because it's so far in the future I slipped in Gorean culture almost without realising it. I didn't intend going there, so for lack of inspiration I stopped writing it until I can come up with something better.

Good luck with whatever you decide and shoot me a link, as I said the reactions will be interesting to read.

 

[RetroFan]

I find it is easier to create female antagonists or female characters with strong negative qualities and that readers respond better to these characters than they would do with similar male characters. I do have some male antagonists in some of my stories and I am pleased with how they work, but I have more fun working with female antagonists.

For example, the titular character in Erotic Couplings story "Bridget the Bossy Bridezilla" is a controlling and spoiled Daddy's girl, who has a bad temper and a nasty vindictive streak in her personality, treating her fiancé like a combination of a doormat and a roll of toilet paper. Now try and make this character male. Would a vindictive, bad-tempered and spoiled Mama's boy who treats his fiancée atrociously by controlling every aspect of her life be a convincing character? No, he would be creepy and unrealistic, certainly not strong and definitely not erotic.

Likewise, college-girl Stacy from my first story 'Shy Steve Meets Sexy Stacy' is a bully who humiliates and ridicules her younger brother at every stage, and then seduces his friend. Would readers respond well to a college-guy who bullies his younger sister and sleeps with her best friend? In 99% of cases at least, definitely no.

Female characters I find can get away with a lot more. As a hypothetical, a hot but somewhat unbalanced 40-year-old woman who dresses like a teenager and has a fixation with an 18-year-old male pop-star, eventually making contact with and seducing the object of her affections would probably work well and prove a popular and well-rated story. A good-looking but crazy 40-year-old man who dresses like a teenager, is obsessed with an 18-year-old female pop star and eventually seduces her? That's just creepy.

 

[Hypoxia]

A good-looking but crazy 40-year-old man who dresses like a teenager, is obsessed with an 18-year-old female pop star and eventually seduces her? That's just creepy.

Men are creeps. That's a given. Women are creeped. That's natural. Predators always bother their prey.