Court Ordered Sterilization

[neci]

Mother of six 'can be sterilised' - court ruling

"This case is not about eugenics, this outcome has been driven by the bleak yet undisputed evidence that a further pregnancy would be a significantly life-threatening event."

Still, all I can think of is eugenics. There have been times in my life, I would love to have seen the courts order sterilization of someone. The addicts who continue to have drug addicted after drug addicted baby. You have to resign yourself to the fact that it's just never going to happen. It blows my mind that the English court would actually strip a woman of her reproductive rights. IQ of 70. It's a fucking slippery slope when you start involuntary sterilizations. I know she has six kids all ready, none of whom she is caring for. They state the next baby would be at risk of dying due to a thin uterus. Still, it is deeply ingrained in me to claim the right of reproduction. I am torn on this. What are your feelings?

 

[toubab]

Mother of six 'can be sterilised' - court ruling




Still, all I can think of is eugenics. There have been times in my life, I would love to have seen the courts order sterilization of someone. The addicts who continue to have drug addicted after drug addicted baby. You have to resign yourself to the fact that it's just never going to happen. It blows my mind that the English court would actually strip a woman of her reproductive rights. IQ of 70. It's a fucking slippery slope when you start involuntary sterilizations. I know she has six kids all ready, none of whom she is caring for. They state the next baby would be at risk of dying due to a thin uterus. Still, it is deeply ingrained in me to claim the right of reproduction. I am torn on this. What are your feelings?

Better late than never.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

At some point, means testing before procreation is going to become necessary.

 

[dolf]

I think sometimes we have to put our gut feelings and ideals aside to look at the individual. it's not about stopping her breeding, stopping her being naughty, stopping her costing the state money. it's an issue of saving her life, because she lacks capacity to make an informed and responsible choice herself.

 

[1sickbastard]

When the exercise of one's rights becomes and ongoing threat to one's self or others, then the governing institutions of a society are justified in curtailing the rights of the specified individual.

As this is not a case of a systematized, institutionalized sterilization, but a case of an individual having been demonstrated in a court of law to be a threat to herself and others, I hesitate to second guess the ruling, particularly as I'm completely unfamiliar with the case or the evidence presented.

I do think, however, that reacting emotionally and leaving it open to the 'court of public reaction' is not likely to end well.

It does bear watching, to see if more cases like this start popping up and how many cases do arise.

 

[Not His Toy]

I don't know about low IQs exactly, but isn't hers low enough that she should have a guardian that is appointed to help her make decisions like a parent would? I have seen disabled people who are adults have forms on file that someone, usually a relative, can make decisions for them? Not sure how that all works.

Does she get by day to day with basic decisions and self care?

 

[ms_ann_thrope]

What does Mike Yates say?

 

[snugglestruggle]

What happened to a woman's right to choose? Seems to me this is just such a case though the choice is different. I don't think she should be forcibly sterilized. A doctor needs to explain the risks to her and as long as she understands it's her decision.

There are times when you have to let people live and either make good decisions or bad ones and live with whatever the consequences are.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

One of my clients had ten children before she was 25 years old. She was a prostitute, and almost all of her babies came into the world premature, literally kicked out of her body by angry men. All the children lived, all of them required long term medical care, and I terminated her parental rights to them all. She had more children after I retired.

 

[parodyluvr75]

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCOP/2014/11.html

If you don't want to read that, this woman wrote a nicely organized piece with the facts from the court documents.

http://suesspiciousminds.com/2014/0...e-being-given-power-to-force-entry-to-a-home/

I'm surprised by the slanting of many of the articles I found, considering the facts were readily available with the release of the court documents.

This series of events scares the hell out of me. This woman and her partner had their previous children taken away for valid reasons. It is miracle any of the other kids didn't die.

I feel bad for her afflictions but the safety of the children is paramount. As far as the right to procreate, it's just that, since she and her partner have repeatedly proved they can't care for children. Not to mention the danger to her and a child if she got pregnant again, even in very controlled circumstances.

The general idea of forced sterilization is terrifying, knowing the history and how it was abused in the past, but in this situation, I don't see a better alternative.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I had a retarded client born to a woman who was raped at the state facility for retarded adults. John was 16 when he was assigned to me, my task was to determine if grandma was competent to care for John. Grandma was in her 70s, and John frequently beat her to steal money he spent on prostitutes. She couldn't control John.

So Disability Services removed John from grandma and put him in a state facility where he promptly died from alcohol intoxication. Someone (staff?) brought in a bottle of whisky and John drank it.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Very few people are going to make this poor choice.

In the interest of Liberty it is hers to choose.

But when I think of Eugenics...



I think of abortion.

 

[domroger]

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCOP/2014/11.html

If you don't want to read that, this woman wrote a nicely organized piece with the facts from the court documents.

http://suesspiciousminds.com/2014/0...e-being-given-power-to-force-entry-to-a-home/

I'm surprised by the slanting of many of the articles I found, considering the facts were readily available with the release of the court documents.

This series of events scares the hell out of me. This woman and her partner had their previous children taken away for valid reasons. It is miracle any of the other kids didn't die.

I feel bad for her afflictions but the safety of the children is paramount. As far as the right to procreate, it's just that, since she and her partner have repeatedly proved they can't care for children. Not to mention the danger to her and a child if she got pregnant again, even in very controlled circumstances.

The general idea of forced sterilization is terrifying, knowing the history and how it was abused in the past, but in this situation, I don't see a better alternative.

It is a worrying case but I agree with you that the judge made the best decision possible .
I just hope that this does not set a precedent and that all future decisions are judged case by case .

 

[oggbashan]

It is a sad one-off case with no winners.

It would have been a difficult decision for the court to take, but it doesn't set a precedent because it isn't the first such decision in England.

The critical point is that HER life could be endangered by a further pregnancy.

 

[dolf]

the reality of it isn't that far off forcibly tubing an anorexic child. it's an ugly last resort.

 

[Ishmael]

Mother of six 'can be sterilised' - court ruling




Still, all I can think of is eugenics. There have been times in my life, I would love to have seen the courts order sterilization of someone. The addicts who continue to have drug addicted after drug addicted baby. You have to resign yourself to the fact that it's just never going to happen. It blows my mind that the English court would actually strip a woman of her reproductive rights. IQ of 70. It's a fucking slippery slope when you start involuntary sterilizations. I know she has six kids all ready, none of whom she is caring for. They state the next baby would be at risk of dying due to a thin uterus. Still, it is deeply ingrained in me to claim the right of reproduction. I am torn on this. What are your feelings?

My thoughts are that in this case the state has every right to sterilize her. She has already bore 6 children, all of whom it appears are wards of the state and supported by the taxpayers. Her 'right to fuck' does NOT trump the interests of the state or the burden on the taxpayers. No one has the right to enslave others, in this case in a financial sense of the word, as this woman has done.

Ishmael

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

My thoughts are that in this case the state has every right to sterilize her. She has already bore 6 children, all of whom it appears are wards of the state and supported by the taxpayers. Her 'right to fuck' does NOT trump the interests of the state or the burden on the taxpayers. No one has the right to enslave others, in this case in a financial sense of the word, as this woman has done.

Ishmael

My sentiments, too. Six kids is no denial of maternal rights. I cut my wife off at 4. She woulda gone for more but I hadda pay the freight, and said O-NAY. She wasn't happy, too bad.