Cheating?

[Joe Wordsworth]

So, an ax sort of came down for me and I'm not well equipped to deal with it. I made a decision, and I'm far, far from being weak willed with regard to things I've put my foot down about... but this is a curious thing.

My girlfriend (My Girl and I finally started dating, formally) had a running affair of sorts with another woman. It was mostly just making out and kissing at parties (which boys ogle and drool over and whatnot) and sometimes going further in private. This pre-dated our going out and our responsibilities to the relationship. It wasn't ever my business before.

Beth is foxy, the other woman is also foxy (a charming Japanese girl). Well, a party gets underway and everyone's having a good time and I get to meet this other lady and she's nice and glad we're dating and all is groovy.

Then, whilst a little drunk, my girl walks over to me and asks if it'd be alright for her to make out with the other woman.

Immediately, I thought "no." I tried answering in the most rational way possible, explaining that while I don't have an emotional problem with it, it feels like an unequitable situation and fairness would say that I got to make out with other women as well (going on that making out with guys, as they are in no way attractive to me, is far from sufficiently the same with regards to her being bi). I said that it would, essentially, feel as though I was being taken advantage of--maintaining monogamy when monogamy wasn't maintained for me.

It seemed reasonable. She was not happy about it (far from upset or anything, just a little disappointed), the other woman was somewhat more vocal about being disappointed (I liked her just fine until about that point, somehow the phrase "I'm not happy about it, but I'll abide your decision" seemed arrogant... her abiding had nothing to do with anything, I didn't need her aquiescence).

All was fine in the aftermath, but I've a nagging feeling that I'm being to strict about this. I love my girl, and I trust her... so it's not that I think she'd leave me for any man or woman (I feel perfectly confidant that is not even an issue). I don't doubt her feelings for me (we've had years and years to develope them and we're just beyond those doubts). My apprehension stems from ideas like "I don't think I care right now if it happens, but I would feel as though it's an unequal relationship... and that could make me resentful after a while, one day" and general selfishness with regard to being unable to explore things, purely physically, with other women.

I just don't know of good ways to think about it. I don't want to deny her anything, but I'm looking down the road and believe I'm avoiding a potential catastrophe. I could be wrong though.

 

[cloudy]

I can understand you feeling that way.

Somehow, when a third person is brought into a relationship, things just seem off balance, or out of sorts, and most of the time, major problems go right along with that.

But, brushing all that aside...no matter what the "rightness," or whatever, of the feelings that you have, you do feel them. Your feelings are, or should be, just as important as hers, and she should respect that you're not entirely comfortable with bringing a third person into the relationship.

My $.02.

 

[Dar~]

I'm with Cloudy, so now you have $.04.
I would be really comforted by the fact that she asked how you felt about her making out with person #3. It shows that she truly cares about you.

 

[English Lady]

Hey Joe.

I think Cloudy has summed it up, it's not how "right" your feeling is, more that you feel that way.

I mean,I would encourage you to talk it over with "my girl" as maybe it's something that needs talking over, that might make you feel a little more comfortable with your feeling and the action and decision you took.

 

[elsol]

Doesn't sound like a 'third person in the relationship' situation?

That would be more equitable.

That's my rule... she can make out with whatever girl she wants as long as the girl is at least WILLING to make out with me.

And so on up the scale, she can boff the other girl as long as I can boff the girl (again given said girl's willingness) too.

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Oh, we're close... it's one of the great confounders to the problem. I don't believe for a second that she's even thinking of it like infidelity, and that she all mine, and that she care about me above everything else. Which, those given, means that she doesn't seem to feel conflicted about it, it's a black-and-white thing... it's just some act to her, and I wonder whether I ought muscle through my first reactions and accept that, too.

I don't know how I'd feel if it were a matter of "inviting someone else to the bedroom". I would like to think I wouldn't have anything but hard-ons and impure thoughts about a three-way with some foxy thing as an addition. But, I would be lying if I said I knew what I'd feel later based on what little I know now. Part of me wonders if I'd have different reactions were I invited along, too. Truth be told, I'm not sure I wasn't being invited along, to begin with.

I feel terrible I might be denying her some innocent fun.

 

[English Lady]

Joe, if you're worried that it will make you feel resentful in the long run,then maybe you're being sensible, that it's not a good idea to just brush it off if essentially it makes you feel uncomfortable. I think its a bit of a fear of the unknown..you don't know how you'd react...and i am pretty sure you don't like not knowing.

 

[elsol]

Do not play the 'innocent fun' game... it is a losing proposition.

What if the actual thought process were 'oh, fucking so-and-so is no big deal, I love YOU!'

How would you feel then?

It is the same problem on a higher level, but if you're a black-white guy then it's not really a higher level, is it?

You titled this thread, Cheating?....

Doesn't that tell you something about what you REALLY think about it?

Can you get over it? Sure, if after a thorough and personal investigation of your psyche you come up with the math MyGirl+OtherGirl = 'I'm cool, with this."

Right now, you're not cool with it.

What would you do if the positions were reversed?

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[impressive]

Wait. It's only out of balance (and hypocritical) if she has forbade you from your own on-the-side explorations. I didn't get that impression.

She asked your feelings -- that's cool.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

I think part of my problem is that I think that making decisions from a purely "gut feeling" or emotional feeling thing is a bad way to make decisions. I'd rather have long columns of pros and cons and possibilities and consequences and make an informed choice about what I can, minimally, live with and cannot. Of course, that's not really easy (if possible) in something like this. And all I have is that I feel it's a bad idea, but I don't "know" that it is. And that I'm choosing to bank on such ignorance decisively makes me uncomfortable.

Not that I see much of an alternative, really.

I think EL is right... not knowing is a huge peeve for me.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Wait. It's only out of balance (and hypocritical) if she has forbade you from your own on-the-side explorations. I didn't get that impression.

She asked your feelings -- that's cool.

Well, it was more like she didn't find that my comparing it to "me and other women" was accurate enough. She said comparable would be guys, I maintained a different categorization. It's at that point she sort of gave up the contestation, I think.

She doesn't really think that it's the same thing. I do.

 

[English Lady]

I think part of my problem is that I think that making decisions from a purely "gut feeling" or emotional feeling thing is a bad way to make decisions. I'd rather have long columns of pros and cons and possibilities and consequences and make an informed choice about what I can, minimally, live with and cannot. Of course, that's not really easy (if possible) in something like this. And all I have is that I feel it's a bad idea, but I don't "know" that it is. And that I'm choosing to bank on such ignorance decisively makes me uncomfortable.

Not that I see much of an alternative, really.

I think EL is right... not knowing is a huge peeve for me.

I'm right? well it happens occassionally.

I know how it is, I analyse everything myself, weighing up pros and cons and running myself in circles with worry and doubt and wonderment.

you'll get to a point where you'll just have to accept thr gut reaction thing i think, otherwise you'll go crazy...

 

[Wildcard Ky]

I think part of my problem is that I think that making decisions from a purely "gut feeling" or emotional feeling thing is a bad way to make decisions. I'd rather have long columns of pros and cons and possibilities and consequences and make an informed choice about what I can, minimally, live with and cannot. Of course, that's not really easy (if possible) in something like this. And all I have is that I feel it's a bad idea, but I don't "know" that it is. And that I'm choosing to bank on such ignorance decisively makes me uncomfortable.

Not that I see much of an alternative, really.

I think EL is right... not knowing is a huge peeve for me.

Isn't gut and emotion the things that a relationship are based on? You are attracted to this woman based purely on emotion. Love, liking, or whatever you choose to call it is an emotion.

You have to go with what's right for you. I think you're being worried about emotion being the driving force in this is a moot point. Relationships are all about emotion. It must be part of the equation.

 

[impressive]

She doesn't really think that it's the same thing. I do.

I do, too -- regardless of gender.

That playing with other girls is perceived as different than playing with other boys speaks to deeper issues. It's acting upon a sexual attraction to a person outside of the relationship. Either that is acceptable or it is not. Gender should not be a distinction.

 

[English Lady]

I do, too -- regardless of gender.

That playing with other girls is perceived as different than playing with other boys speaks to deeper issues. It's acting upon a sexual attraction to a person outside of the relationship. Either that is acceptable or it is not. Gender should not be a distinction.

I agree

 

[elsol]

*burp*

It's the inner voice warning...

"If you say yes, and you don't like it... you're going to blame HER for it even if you were the idiot that said yes."

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[Liar]

Well, it was more like she didn't find that my comparing it to "me and other women" was accurate enough. She said comparable would be guys, I maintained a different categorization. It's at that point she sort of gave up the contestation, I think.

She doesn't really think that it's the same thing. I do.

Have to agree. Gender is irrelevant. The kind that matches ones orientation, is.

However, these are the kind of things that have worn down relationships aplenty. The only advise I have is...get it out in the open what is cool and what is not, until you fins lines that you can agree upon. I didn't once, and that just made for some really uncomforetable situations along the road.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

*burp*

It's the inner voice warning...

"If you say yes, and you don't like it... you're going to blame HER for it even if you were the idiot that said yes."

Sincerely,
ElSol

Oooo....

I hadn't even thought of it like that. That seems like a good way to articulate one of my bigger concerns about "later on, what if?".

 

[kendo1]

Mm.
Difficult one.
You have to accept her for who and what she is: Bi.
How serious is the relationship if she feels the need to 'wander'.
Just because you don't want to 'wander' does that mean she has to do what you say?
It really comes down to how each of you see your relationship.

That clears things up nicely, doesn't it?

This coming from a guy who's been married for twenty years and has remained faithful, as has my wife.
But if my wife wanted to have a reationship with someone else I could understand that, I'm past the jealous stage! if there is such a thing.
I know she won't, and neither would I, but she is an adult afterall.

 

[TheEarl]

I do, too -- regardless of gender.

That playing with other girls is perceived as different than playing with other boys speaks to deeper issues. It's acting upon a sexual attraction to a person outside of the relationship. Either that is acceptable or it is not. Gender should not be a distinction.

Agreed. Cheating is cheating, no matter what hte gender. If you guys wanted to have an open relationship, then that's one thing. But making out with anyone on the side, no matter boy or girl, is going to matter.

My £0.02 or $0.016

The Earl

 

[elsol]

Cheating might be cheating... but it does make a difference.

Why?

Because my first thought when my girl asks if she can boff another man is not... "Threesome?"

But I'm shallow so...


Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[elsol]

It's also a directive I understand 'cause I was probably thinking...

"Damn, I'd like to kiss her."

So I understand what she's feeling, kinda selfish not to let her in that situation.

But again... I'm shallow.

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[Couture]

What if she asked to make out with another man? Would you be more sure of your decision then?

It IS bringing another person into your relationship. If your relationship is open to her having another girl, I don't see how that is any different than if it had been a guy. It isn't what I consider innocent fun, unless you are allowed to have the same innocent fun.

Regardless it isn't what I would consider a monogamous relationship.

 

[Just-Legal]

Doesn't sound like a 'third person in the relationship' situation?

That would be more equitable.

That's my rule... she can make out with whatever girl she wants as long as the girl is at least WILLING to make out with me.

And so on up the scale, she can boff the other girl as long as I can boff the girl (again given said girl's willingness) too.

Sincerely,
ElSol

<threadjack>

"I wish I'd just... boffed him, at least once!"

"Boffed?"

"It's the sort of thing he would have said..."

</threadjack>

 

[sincerely_helene]

If this is the same "my girl" from way back that was cheating on her significant other with you, I sure hope that her attraction to this female passes for the sake of your relationship.