Characters you love to hate

[poppy1963]

He was a butcher - literally! I recall a scene where he's chopping meat in a room full of his gang; I think at one point, he stops long enough to pick his teeth with the knife. His hair was so greasy. For some reason, one of the strongest memories I have of that film is that heavy, muffled sound of flesh on a chopping block, or flesh getting bludgeoned in fights. One cringe-inducing scene after another.

You are correct on all counts! My maternal poppy came over on one of those boats from Ireland...

I've not seen DDL in many roles where I find him to be initially physically attractive...it's only after getting to "know" the character, in all his complexity, that I almost ALWAYS fall for the guy.

 

[Salvor-Hardon]

Ok I will get raked over the coals but I see this slightly differently.

"love to hate" to me is always those characters that are so despicable, so loathsome and grotesque that hating them is cathartic in a way. The hate for them is a reminder that I have some good in me and that I am not irredeemable.

That being said, the first character I love to hate is Elmo. I hate the way he refers to himself in third person, I despise that laugh of his, I hate that he is so ubiquitous. I can't swing a flaming elmo doll on a rope without hitting 18 variations of plastic tripe in his image. Even my four year old finds him dull and mindless, and threw out his elmo stuff from the bad grandma 18 months ago.

Worst of all, he is taking screen time from Grover, the everyman of Sesame Street in whom those of us who were odd found a symbol to believe we could fly.

Ok I'm off my soap box now.

 

[slyc_willie]

You are correct on all counts! My maternal poppy came over on one of those boats from Ireland...

I've not seen DDL in many roles where I find him to be initially physically attractive...it's only after getting to "know" the character, in all his complexity, that I almost ALWAYS fall for the guy.

The character of William Cutting was deplorable in many aspects. He was rude, crass, foul-mouthed and really, nothing more than a brutal bully who had managed to solidify his influence.

The only redeeming quality to his character were his warped notions of solidarity and his fatherly outlook on Cameron Diaz' character. If you understood that the way he acted, and the thigns he did, were necessary in his mind, then you could feel for him. Understand him, even.

Still, I applauded in the theater when he got his.

 

[poppy1963]

The character of William Cutting was deplorable in many aspects. He was rude, crass, foul-mouthed and really, nothing more than a brutal bully who had managed to solidify his influence.

The only redeeming quality to his character were his warped notions of solidarity and his fatherly outlook on Cameron Diaz' character. If you understood that the way he acted, and the thigns he did, were necessary in his mind, then you could feel for him. Understand him, even.

Still, I applauded in the theater when he got his.

Yes...William Cutting (kinda looked like The Cat in the Hat). He had another (among a few more) redeeming quality. He recognized the value in his arch-rival, Liam Neesom's character, and honored him though he killed him dead himself. He was as sorry to lose him as he was glad he was gone and no longer a challenge.

I, too, applauded...but that did not diminish his interest to me. People who will "do whatever it takes" are fascinating...though I much prefer meeting such online as opposed to in real life.

 

[slyc_willie]

Yes...William Cutting (kinda looked like The Cat in the Hat). He had another (among a few more) redeeming quality. He recognized the value in his arch-rival, Liam Neesom's character, and honored him though he killed him dead himself. He was as sorry to lose him as he was glad he was gone and no longer a challenge.

I, too, applauded...but that did not diminish his interest to me. People who will "do whatever it takes" are fascinating...though I much prefer meeting such online as opposed to in real life.

The one character in that movie who was willing to do whatever it took was Priest Vallon's son, "Amsterdam." And he did. And he won.

Still, I understand the allure of characters like William Cutting. Ruthless, but with a touch of humanity that comes out at choice moments. Make you wonder if he really is evil.

 

[ImpishSeraph]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v200/NatShrapnel/Sign.jpg

 

[poppy1963]

The one character in that movie who was willing to do whatever it took was Priest Vallon's son, "Amsterdam." And he did. And he won.

Still, I understand the allure of characters like William Cutting. Ruthless, but with a touch of humanity that comes out at choice moments. Make you wonder if he really is evil.

Interesting for you to note that! He was the hero, wasn't he?

I find that all things are on a continuum...and that human nature is more gray than black & white. Sounds like you do as well!

 

[poppy1963]

This is something I sort of stumbled onto, got an idea to further develop, but the development appears to have gone awry - as they often do - but I still find it interesting. And it appears I have a rough sketch prototype to work with.

Love-to-hate characters that first pop to mind: J.R. Ewing, Archie Bunker, Eric Cartman.

Why? Why them?
What is it about them that 'works' to hook us? Had certain qualities or aspects of them gone in any other direction they wouldn't have the appeal.

Oh, MASH's Winchester (the stuffy one) was another.

So, hmmnmm...those are 4 very different characters! What are those things they hold similarly that makes us "love to hate" them? What's the prototype?

 

[slyc_willie]

Interesting for you to note that! He was the hero, wasn't he?

I find that all things are on a continuum...and that human nature is more gray than black & white. Sounds like you do as well!

Don't have much of a choice. No such thing as black and white when it comes to humanity.

Or, more to the point, just about anything . . . .

 

[hmmnmm]

So, hmmnmm...those are 4 very different characters! What are those things they hold similarly that makes us "love to hate" them? What's the prototype?

Well, poppy, the similarity I see is their ability to get into our minds and we get an immediate picture or idea of them, and we probably wouldn't want them for our neighbors but they have some sort of drawing power, that keeps people coming back (afterthought, major winchester on mash was less so, in my opinion). I mean, All in the Family, back in the day was criticized and maligned and people just hated Archie Bunker. Yet, people kept coming back, because of Archie Bunker.

JR Ewing. People around the world knew JR Ewing. And knew him as an unsavory character (personally I wasn't a dallas fan, so I wasn't drawn to him, but many were).

the failed prototype is a character that people seem to either hate or sympathize with. But not hating to the point of further curiosity. A successful development of the prototype will possess such qualities that even if the character is hated, there will be something - a humorous undercurrent, or a vulnerability - just enough, not too much, not too little - so to raise the odds of further interest.

It's an aspect I'd never really given much thought to, but since stumbling onto it, find it really interesting, and I began to think of such characters - why they do or don't 'work'.

Sumpin like dat.

 

[Katyusha]

Oh, MASH's Winchester (the stuffy one) was another.

DEFINITELY agree with this one. Winchester drives me bats. I love him for that.

Steve Stifler (American Pie)
Q (Star Trek: The Next Generation)
Quark (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine)
The heckler in Happy Gilmore that was always shouting things like, "You WILL not make this putt, ya jackass!" at Happy.

 

[Katyusha]

Londo: I swear it's like being nibbled to death by… What are those Earth creatures, have feathers, go quack.

Vir: Cats!

Londo: Yes. Nibbled to death by cats.

LMAO!!!! Never watched Babylon 5 but DAMN that's a great back-and-forth!!

 

[hmmnmm]

Ah! Here it is: Any or all of these characters could have easily failed to capture such popular interest. Somehow they achieved a mix that just Worked. Maybe there's no real answer.
Maybe because you forget they are acting or are mere characters in a story?!

Played or written with conviction?

 

[slyc_willie]

DEFINITELY agree with this one. Winchester drives me bats. I love him for that.

Steve Stifler (American Pie)
Q (Star Trek: The Next Generation)
Quark (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine)
The heckler in Happy Gilmore that was always shouting things like, "You WILL not make this putt, ya jackass!" at Happy.

Since we're on the topic of TV shows . . . .

I always loved/hated the character of Apothis from Stargate: SG-1. He had a certain style, was completely reprehensible, yet held to his flawed beliefs and honored family above all else (to a fault).

When he finally, and ultimately, died, I couldn't help but feel for the guy, asshole thogh he was.

 

[Boxlicker101]

This is something I sort of stumbled onto, got an idea to further develop, but the development appears to have gone awry - as they often do - but I still find it interesting. And it appears I have a rough sketch prototype to work with.

Love-to-hate characters that first pop to mind: J.R. Ewing, Archie Bunker, Eric Cartman.

Why? Why them?
What is it about them that 'works' to hook us? Had certain qualities or aspects of them gone in any other direction they wouldn't have the appeal.

Oh, MASH's Winchester (the stuffy one) was another.

I didn't watch Dallas or All in the family very much, and I wouldn't hate a little boy like Cartman. Winchester was a pompous ass, but at least he was a talented physician. Frank Burns, the weasel, was a more detestable character, and an incompetent besides. Somebody mentioned Ted Baxter on MTM. I disliked him, but "hate" would be too strong a word.

 

[Katyusha]

Since we're on the topic of TV shows . . . .

I always loved/hated the character of Apothis from Stargate: SG-1. He had a certain style, was completely reprehensible, yet held to his flawed beliefs and honored family above all else (to a fault).

When he finally, and ultimately, died, I couldn't help but feel for the guy, asshole thogh he was.

Yanno...I actually felt the same way about both James Norrington and Davy Jones in Pirates 3. I felt that Norrington had control issues and Davy Jones was just a villain, but when they died I was upset, and I felt sorry for them both.

 

[sister76]

I vote for The Talented Mr. Ripley. He was such a creepy guy that I couldn't bear to watch a Matt Damon movie for a while after seeing that, but I'll never forget that character.

 

[Katyusha]

I vote for The Talented Mr. Ripley. He was such a creepy guy that I couldn't bear to watch a Matt Damon movie for a while after seeing that, but I'll never forget that character.

He didn't creep me out, but I have more than a passing interest in psychology so I found myself trying to figure out just what his problem was instead.

 

[hmmnmm]

I also recall the old pro wrestlers. You had the good guy and the bad guy. The good guy was wholesome and humble and played fair and ate his wheaties. The bad guy was a braggart and played dirty. Sometimes they'd have the bad guy on a winning streak, and boy the crowds detested him, but he'd strut and boast and taunt them, made them hate him all the more. Then, he'd start pounding the good guy, and the crowd really hated that. The good guy's almost too far gone to make a comeback - but just then - he starts swinging and flinging the bad guy around, gets some new strength. The crowd goes wild, they stomp the bleachers, the bad guy's up against the ropes, then he's down on the mat, on his knees, begging the good guy to show mercy. And then just when it looks like the good guy's going to win - the bad guys pulls a dirty move, that the ref happens to miss - and wins another match, the crowd hating him all the more. But - it's the bad guy who they come to see. It wouldn't be the same if it was a good guy against a sorta bad guy who didn't win very often.

 

[elsol]

This is something I sort of stumbled onto, got an idea to further develop, but the development appears to have gone awry - as they often do - but I still find it interesting. And it appears I have a rough sketch prototype to work with.

Love-to-hate characters that first pop to mind: J.R. Ewing, Archie Bunker, Eric Cartman.

Why? Why them?
What is it about them that 'works' to hook us? Had certain qualities or aspects of them gone in any other direction they wouldn't have the appeal.

Oh, MASH's Winchester (the stuffy one) was another.

Because we don't really hate them... if we hated them, we'd turn the TV off.

We're fascinated by them, because for the most part they tell 'the truth' about how things are, how people really feel, what we think...

We LIKE them... we just don't want to admit we like them.

 

[slyc_willie]

Want a character you can really love to hate?

How about Gary Oldman in 'Hannibal?'

Sure, he's disfigured, confined to a wheelchair . . . a victim of life, right? And he blames Lecter for putting him there.

But it was his fault, really. He took the drugs, he gave in to madness. And it twisted him.

Now that's a guy I love to hate.

he got what he deserved.

 

[Guest]

Oh!

Alan Rickman in Costner's Robin Hood!

Such a delicious villain!

 

[hmmnmm]

! While not a fictional character, Howard Cosell also comes to mind. He had a way of getting on my nerves - but Monday Night Football was never the same after Howard Cosell.

 

[rbijon]

Oh!

Alan Rickman in Costner's Robin Hood!

Such a delicious villain!

Good one, I love it when he said, "cancel Christmas"

 

[rbijon]

Good one, I love it when he said, "cancel Christmas"

btw, i love Christmas