Character building through details

Colleen Thomas

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In a recent work, I backed off a god bit on my usual indepth back story and heavy emphasis on chearacter building. One fairly consistant complaint about my writing style is that I am overly telly.

I took this character, and tried to reveal a lot abou ther through her choice of Armor and weapon. Thus far, two people have commented on how much I was able to reveal about her via this method. Upwards of ten have complained I didn't do as through a job as I normally do of making the characters real.

My question then, is can you build a character through the details of their life and the things around them or is this technique too subjective?

Here are the passages:

Jade's suit was an old set of Mk XXVII ceramite combat armor. As an officer she had first refusal on new armor, but this set was customized to her frame and had been with her a long time. The overlapping, super dense ceramite plates were still the hardest substance in the known universe. The newer suits were less heavy, less bulky and more streamlined, but the new synthetic they used provided less ballistic protection. It just wasn't as tough as the old stuff and for Jade; she was willing to pay the price in reduced maneuverability for added stopping power. She often debated with her men who loved to rib her about her "old fashioned" armor. Her incredible reflexes allowed her to move as quickly as any of them on the confidence course, but they still kidded her whenever they sensed she was in a good mood.

Jade had another problem with the new suits, one she kept to herself. The new suits were too easy to take off. Her suit took over an hour to get on and the overlapping plates were such a bitch to remove because once they settled they often became jammed. Jade had fought in too many nasty suppressive little wars. Rape, castration, mutilation, even cannibalism; she had seen it all. She had been spared being raped to death by Tic'Chen separatists on New Madrid only because they had been unable to figure out how to remove the armor that covered her lower body before her squad mates arrived. Even their heavy cutting tools had failed to do much good when applied to the ceramite plates. It was a lesson she never forgot. The new armor was easy, just a couple of snaps and some buckles.

The new suits also lacked the nanoservos in the older, heavier armor. In the old suits, they were there to compensate for the additional weight. The new suits had no need for them. But they could give her bursts of superhuman strength if she really needed it. In an emergency, Jade could tear through a ship's bulkhead with just her suit. It was an ability she considered to be insurance in case all weapons failed.

Jade slowly put on her armor, checking each piece and each function. When she finally got the breastplate on and closed, she donned the heavy black battle helm and keyed the enviro-functions. Lines of code flashed across her HUD and rows of lights went from red to green. Rookies often took it for granted their suits were working and ignored the power up sequence, but Jade was too old a hand for making that mistake.

Oxygen, check. Water, Check. Painkiller, check. Stimdose, check. Through each of her suit's over one hundred functions she meticulously followed the check down procedure. From the radio check to the manual switch to her back up systems she tried everything before giving the suit the O.K. to go full active. From the charging stand she took her weapon and gave it the same careful, calculated once over.

Most of her troopers carried simple Mark V impact rifles. They were cheap, durable, put out a respectable volume of fire and could get decent penetration on most substances. The heavy weapons squad carried Mk XII plasma cannon and Dorntech Missile launchers. These weapons provided the heavy hitting power of the unit. Individual troopers also carried non-approved back up weapons. These ranged from single shot blast pistols to heavy combat shotguns. Theoretically she was supposed to make sure that no one was carrying anything other than standard issue before a drop. Theory stopped as soon as the unit was outside of the prying eyes of the security forces and Jade had never ordered anyone to leave a back up behind.

Jade's own weapon was non-standard and no one ever mentioned it on her annual evaluations. She carried a Tenbar Ltd. Mark II rail gun. The weapon had been designed for combat droids back before the authority realized there was no substitute for men in combat. The railguns were a masterfully designed weapon and much sought after, but each year there were fewer and fewer to be found. Tenbar had gone under when the droid experiment failed and now only a handful remained in service. Jade's had been with her since she was a raw second lieutenant. She had taken it off the body of her first sergeant after a mortar hit killed him.

The gun itself was basically a mass driver, using a series of electromagnets it accelerated the alloy shards it used as ammunition to almost incredible speeds. Jade had yet to encounter anything it wouldn't penetrate within reason. Certainly no personal armor could stop it and thus she favored it over all other weapons. She was a big believer in making each hit count.


My goal was to show her in several lights. First and foremost, I wanted to relay that she was a competant Marine officer. On a deeper level, I wanted people to see her as careful, pragmatic, a little deeper and more thoughtful than your average gun bunny and to add nuances to her character.

To those who picked up on it, I seem to have hit on all cylinders, but it seems very few actually got more out of it than she had kick-ass armor and weapons.

Could I have done more with it? Or is this technique simply too obtuse? Or is it just beyond my skill to attain?

The idea for character development in this vein comes from a book called Men of Iron. In it, the protag, a Christian knight, is not well defined, but through the process of him putting on his armor and his blade you get a very Rodrigo of Bivar/El Cid kind of impression of his personality. That impresson turns out to be correct as the later story shows.
 
Colly, I think I love you. I may have to kidnap you to the sci-fi section of my other home you know.

I think its wonderful, and it *does* give a good impression of the character, their attitude is displayed in their care and attention, and gives good insight into the reasoning, without being too "talky".
 
I thought that passage worked well, Colleen. It did draw out the character and it did make her appealing.

I found the fact that she was willing to bend the rules in order to do her job and well very enlightening.

Just my $0.02 worth.
 
I think it's a matter of assimilation. You got to be moderately interrested or at least not ignorant of armor and weaponry to get the picture. I think this kind of thing can be done effectively, but you have to find behaviour that the reader can refer to.

I saw a jaded, seasoned soldier, the kind that knows what have worked for her in the past, and who is unwilling to learn the new tricks, or following new regulations. I couldn't say if her gear was superior or if her meticulous procedures was sub- par- or above average. it didn't, to me, say that the other gun bunnies were less competent or serious. Only that she is a "My Way"-singer.

Which in itself is interresting enough to keep me reading.
 
I'm afraid you might have let your love of hardware run away with you, Colly. It eclipses any questions of character. We find out a little about her, but it's obvious that your real interest is in the equipment, which is described with an attention to detail that borders on the erotic. It's very fetishistic.

You are an army brat, aren't you Colly? ;)

I'm fairly certain I'm not the only one who finds the detailed mention of a soldier's armaments downright off-putting. I'd rather see her humanity than her guns.
 
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I'm wondering if you need to provide all that detail all at once.
Many of these details, such as the "new armor's drawbacks", could come up in conversation at some point. Maybe in a quickly quoted debate with one of her men.
"Jade, you move like a goddamn turtle in that old shit!" her point man said- once his glance at her face told him it would be safe to rib her this way.
"Wanna race, little bunny?" Jade knew her superior reflexes..."
etc, etc..
 
I must disagree. I know absolutely nothing about armor or weaponry and have no interest in these things in and of themselves. However, I thought this description an absolutely superb bit of characterization. I had a rich, developed idea of her personality and attitude by the time I had finished - not to mention a physical description.
 
My $0.02

She's a tough as nails, seasoned soldier. She's been around the battlefield and knows ann the ins and outs of modern warefare. She has the experience to know that flash and glitz don't make a soldier. THru trial and error she has found what works and she sticks with it and damn all what anyone else thinks.

THe image I get of her is a tall woman with short cropped dark hair. She's probablly mid 30's or so, older than her troops but not to old to be out in the mud. She's slender and well defined, not muscular but wirey and tough as they come, the kind of woman that can drink any man under the table.


I think you did a supurbe job of describeing Jade even if it was thru a different method.
 
Just-Legal said:
Colly, I think I love you. I may have to kidnap you to the sci-fi section of my other home you know.

I think its wonderful, and it *does* give a good impression of the character, their attitude is displayed in their care and attention, and gives good insight into the reasoning, without being too "talky".


thank Jl :)

thanks too rob & Cd & Shang :)
 
dr_mabeuse said:
I'm afraid you might have let your love of hardware run away with you, Colly. It eclipses any questions of character. We find out a little about her, but it's obvious that your real interest is in the equipment, which is described with an attention to detail that borders on the erotic. It's very fetishistic.

You are an army brat, aren't you Colly? ;)

I'm fairly certain I'm not the only one who finds the detailed mention of a soldier's armaments downright off-putting. I'd rather see her humanity than her guns.


ARMY??! Pershih the thought! Navy all the way. Well, cept one army, but he flew mustangs in the air corps so he gets a pass :)

The deep detail of "modern" weapons, armor, vehicles, ships etc. is pretty standard for the genre. You have to give details because, these things don't exist. I've read very few Sci-fi stories where the heavy detail on modern machines and equiptment is downplayed. I do possibly go overboard, but that's symptymatic of my writing style. I think a story I tell in 30 pages you could probably tell just as effectively in 15.

The fact that you got a kind of techno geek feel is interesting though. COuld you see a way I could have done better here?
 
Stella_Omega said:
I'm wondering if you need to provide all that detail all at once.
Many of these details, such as the "new armor's drawbacks", could come up in conversation at some point. Maybe in a quickly quoted debate with one of her men.
"Jade, you move like a goddamn turtle in that old shit!" her point man said- once his glance at her face told him it would be safe to rib her this way.
"Wanna race, little bunny?" Jade knew her superior reflexes..."
etc, etc..


ACk! Pffft! Arrrgh! Dialogue! No, no,no,no,no.

My dialogue sucks. I've come long way, at least I don't conciously go out of my way to avoid writing it, but I'll never be able to write believeable dialogue. Everything I do with it is stilted. I probably give less information via dialogue than any writer on the site. It's just outside my ability.
 
I started to read the other responses and stopped: I want to tell you what the passage said to me, not what I agree with that other people already said.

I read Jade as someone very confident in the value of her own opinion. Not arrogant necessarily, but she knows when she is right and she won't back down when she is. She is meticulous about things that she sees the value in and dismissive of things she does not.

She doesn't cut corners, but she is not stuck in the mud either; she is willing to see the value in innovation. She is not contemptuous of the newer armor...she just is happier with what she has.

I think if they issued her something newer that she saw as a true improvement, she would adopt it. Even given her comfort level in the "old school". Ever known a mechanic who would lament the times before computers , etc? but what does he have parked to to his old '67 Camaro? Right, a new car he sees the value of. That is Jade.
 
Colleen Thomas said:
ACk! Pffft! Arrrgh! Dialogue! No, no,no,no,no.

My dialogue sucks. I've come long way, at least I don't conciously go out of my way to avoid writing it, but I'll never be able to write believeable dialogue. Everything I do with it is stilted. I probably give less information via dialogue than any writer on the site. It's just outside my ability.


It is not outside your ability. You want an area you feel you need to focus on? Fine. But to say it is outside your ability is just plain silly...I disagree.
 
Um, my eyes crossed about the 3rd paragraph. :eek:

But, for every 10 people who say your style is wordy, there are more than a 100 who wouldn't want you to write any other way. Don't over compromise in attempt to please everyone. You have a style, stick to it :D Fine tune it, whatever, but don't think you have to lose it or justify it.

Okay, the reason my eyes crossed - all telling and no action for what would be a large chunk of a story. I would love to see it littered throughout the story, like her character is puzzle pieces slowly being put into place throughout the story.

Eg. Jade jumps out of a helicopter and pulls out her rifle and yells out for her troop to lock and load. her troopers carried Mark V impact rifles. They were durable, not much backfire, put out a respectable volume of fire and could get decent penetration on most substances including flesh :D Jade's own weapon was a Tenbar Mark II gun. it was non-standard and highly illegal. it never made a mention in her annual evaluations. The weapon had been designed for combat droids back before the authority realized there was no substitute for men in combat. The railguns were a masterfully designed weapon and much sought after, and not seen by many troops in their lifetime. Jade's had been with her since she was a raw second lieutenant. She had taken it off the body of her first sergeant after a mortar hit killed him. the battle lasted 10 hours, and only Jade survived in her troop.

As her and her troops ran bent over across the tarmac...

You don't need me to tell you how fantastic your writing is :kiss:
 
IMO... the technique works better with action.

Sincerely,
ElSol
 
Colleen Thomas said:
The fact that you got a kind of techno geek feel is interesting though. COuld you see a way I could have done better here?

To me, the soldier-hero is pretty much of a stock character. Maybe I read too much Heinlein as a kid or saw too many war movies, but I know the lead character is going to be quiet, brave, modest, tough, capable, loyal, noble etc. etc. That covers pretty much every soldier-hero from John Wayne to Rambo and Bruce Willis. They're of all a type, and that type verges on caricature rather than character - cliche.

To bring Jade alive for me, and to make me care about her as a person, I've got to find something I have in common with her. Maybe she has a sense of humor, or maybe beauty moves her, or maybe she's lonely, or shy, or hateful, or something. Those are things that get my sympathy up. I see expertise here, but no humanity.

I guess I found it strange that you're describing a character in terms of the armor she's putting on and the weapons she's going to use in case we get too close to her. It sends a definite symbolic message, like you and she are actually warning us to stay away. It made me feel immediately excluded, and my knee-jerk reaction was dislike.

But then, all soldiers make me nervous. I just don't like people with guns. Perverse bastard that I am, I always assume I'm the enemy. :rolleyes:
 
Oxygen, check. Water, Check. Painkiller, check. Stimdose, check. Through each of her suit's over one hundred functions she meticulously followed the check down procedure. From the radio check to the manual switch to her back up systems she tried everything before giving the suit the O.K. to go full active. From the charging stand she took her weapon and gave it the same careful, calculated once over.

Jade checked the stimdose by pressing down on the release gently, like she expected, the armor jockey set the trigger sensitivity to the exact book specification. Jade had read the book too; the bastard who wrote it never tried to go through a door shoulder first in armor. She took the armor piece off to tighten the trigger.

After putting the armor back on, she tested stimdose to make sure she had it right. She sighed before moving on to the hundred other little checks combat had taught her she needed to make before dropping into a shithole.

The fucking armorer had given her the painkiller she was allergic to again!


---It's not the character you wanted, but...

*shrug*

A different way of handling the 'detail' thing is to drill down into a single detail rather than lots and lots of them.

Sincerely,
ElSol
 
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BlackShanglan said:
I must disagree. I know absolutely nothing about armor or weaponry and have no interest in these things in and of themselves. However, I thought this description an absolutely superb bit of characterization. I had a rich, developed idea of her personality and attitude by the time I had finished - not to mention a physical description.
Yep, I had that too. Jader is very much alive and a fully realized charcter. But the problem is that in my head is a character slightly off course from the one Colly had in mind. Not by much, but enough to perhaps make actions and choices later in the story seem like out-of-character for me. This is a classic dilemma for any storyteller, and I'm not 100% sure that my intepretation is a direct result of Colly's way of describing her, but it might be.
 
Ok. You might not want this, but you know what I got? She thought she was a girl doing a man's job.

All the enhancements made her as big as a bloke and her own 'womanly' ways gave her the extra advantage.

Servos make her as strong as a guy. Tough plating made her as thick-skinned as a grunt. Her gun stopped anything with barely need for aiming. Nothing would go wrong with her suit because she wouldn't be able to improvise her way out of a failure. AND SHE COULDN'T BE RAPED.

Elsol, Wishful and Stella are so much more diplomatic than I, hence the title 'gauche'. The writing is as close to a list as you can come without using shorter sentences and you know you shouldn't write lists.
 
wishfulthinking said:
Um, my eyes crossed about the 3rd paragraph. :eek:

But, for every 10 people who say your style is wordy, there are more than a 100 who wouldn't want you to write any other way. Don't over compromise in attempt to please everyone. You have a style, stick to it :D Fine tune it, whatever, but don't think you have to lose it or justify it.

Okay, the reason my eyes crossed - all telling and no action for what would be a large chunk of a story. I would love to see it littered throughout the story, like her character is puzzle pieces slowly being put into place throughout the story.

Eg. Jade jumps out of a helicopter and pulls out her rifle and yells out for her troop to lock and load. her troopers carried Mark V impact rifles. They were durable, not much backfire, put out a respectable volume of fire and could get decent penetration on most substances including flesh :D Jade's own weapon was a Tenbar Mark II gun. it was non-standard and highly illegal. it never made a mention in her annual evaluations. The weapon had been designed for combat droids back before the authority realized there was no substitute for men in combat. The railguns were a masterfully designed weapon and much sought after, and not seen by many troops in their lifetime. Jade's had been with her since she was a raw second lieutenant. She had taken it off the body of her first sergeant after a mortar hit killed him. the battle lasted 10 hours, and only Jade survived in her troop.

As her and her troops ran bent over across the tarmac...

You don't need me to tell you how fantastic your writing is :kiss:


Thanks wishful. One thing I work for in all my Mil-sci-fi is a dichotomy I find in eery war diary or journal I have ever read. Combat action, even in something as recent as vietnam era first person accounts or even of those of Marines during the pacific campaigns, is the exception. The rule is a mind numbing monotony. I try, therefore, to limit combat sequencesand action sequences as much as I can.

I'm not trying to alter my style, I'm just experimenting with techniques. I want to be a good writer and I don't want to pidgen hole myself so I am trying to press my own boundaries. Sometimes that means trying new subject matter, sometimes it's working with a technique I've never or have under used.

thanks so much for the imput :)

:rose:
 
dr_mabeuse said:
To me, the soldier-hero is pretty much of a stock character. Maybe I read too much Heinlein as a kid or saw too many war movies, but I know the lead character is going to be quiet, brave, modest, tough, capable, loyal, noble etc. etc. That covers pretty much every soldier-hero from John Wayne to Rambo and Bruce Willis. They're of all a type, and that type verges on caricature rather than character - cliche.

To bring Jade alive for me, and to make me care about her as a person, I've got to find something I have in common with her. Maybe she has a sense of humor, or maybe beauty moves her, or maybe she's lonely, or shy, or hateful, or something. Those are things that get my sympathy up. I see expertise here, but no humanity.

I guess I found it strange that you're describing a character in terms of the armor she's putting on and the weapons she's going to use in case we get too close to her. It sends a definite symbolic message, like you and she are actually warning us to stay away. It made me feel immediately excluded, and my knee-jerk reaction was dislike.

But then, all soldiers make me nervous. I just don't like people with guns. Perverse bastard that I am, I always assume I'm the enemy. :rolleyes:


Thanks Doc, that's a perspective I wouldn't get usually, since I tend to hold soldiers in very high reguard. Of course, my experience isn't just from books, I spent a huge amount of time at the VFW with my grandfather coming up, so I met a lot of men from WWII. I assume humanity, beyond the facade, since I was exposed to them many years after their war was over and they were already grandfathers by then. I only knew they were ex soldiers and sailors because I got to hear them telling and retelling war stories and reminiscing about buddies long or recently departed.

I don't think Jade is a stock character. This isn't the only work I do on or with her character, but i never really thought about the type of character as being stock. It' a lot to think about and I appreciate the imput immensely :)
 
gauchecritic said:
Ok. You might not want this, but you know what I got? She thought she was a girl doing a man's job.

All the enhancements made her as big as a bloke and her own 'womanly' ways gave her the extra advantage.

Servos make her as strong as a guy. Tough plating made her as thick-skinned as a grunt. Her gun stopped anything with barely need for aiming. Nothing would go wrong with her suit because she wouldn't be able to improvise her way out of a failure. AND SHE COULDN'T BE RAPED.

Elsol, Wishful and Stella are so much more diplomatic than I, hence the title 'gauche'. The writing is as close to a list as you can come without using shorter sentences and you know you shouldn't write lists.

First and foremost, I don't mind using lists. If that is the best way I see of getting the points across.

I don't start with the assumption women are any less capable than men, so your take really came out of left field, so to speak. Many of the details you see as making her "as good as a man" are actually there as set up for future events down the plot line. The servos, for example, don't make her as strong as any guy, they make her superhumanly powerful, for very short bursts. Unless you know a fellow who can tear his way through a ships bulhead with his bare hands. Her suit dosen't make her tougher than men, it makes her tougher than her squadmates, both male & female etc.

Within the framework of the future story, events that occur make no sense, unless you understand her Armor is fundamentally different than that worn by her toopers. If I have to stop, as each event occurs, and tell you why it's different, her armor and weapon begins to feel like a deaux ex machina excuse.

I felt, that putting the information ahead of the events, strengthened the idea that newer is not always better, rather than giving it piece meal and having it become a story focused on the armor and weapon. I don't think you read as much military history as I do, so you are probably not as keenly aware as I am of many innovative things that were supposed to be better for whatever reason, but proved in the crucible of combat to be far inferior to the older implement they replaced.

This too is a perspective I would never have had if you hadn't spoke up and I really appreciate the input :rose:
 
elsol said:
Jade checked the stimdose by pressing down on the release gently, like she expected, the armor jockey set the trigger sensitivity to the exact book specification. Jade had read the book too; the bastard who wrote it never tried to go through a door shoulder first in armor. She took the armor piece off to tighten the trigger.

After putting the armor back on, she tested stimdose to make sure she had it right. She sighed before moving on to the hundred other little checks combat had taught her she needed to make before dropping into a shithole.

The fucking armorer had given her the painkiller she was allergic to again!


---It's not the character you wanted, but...

*shrug*

A different way of handling the 'detail' thing is to drill down into a single detail rather than lots and lots of them.

Sincerely,
ElSol


In an earlier work, I worked with this particular variation. Making the one function the character found amiss (her oxygen) the central focus of the story. It worked pretty well I think, in that story. In this one, I didn't have a single feature I intended to fail, I wanted an overall air of doing the little things and doing them correctly. Feeding more into Doc's perception of making my hero competant I think.
 
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