Bigley dead

[TheEarl]

Fuckers!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3727344.stm

I was hoping the Irish Foreign Office's efforts were going to yield results, but just read this grim report. The Government was right not to yield to the terrorists though; they might have saved one man's life, but as soon as the terrorists think that's the lever that'll move us, no British national will be safe.

For those not keeping up with the Irish situation, Bigley's family was trying to prove that he was Irish rather than British, due to his Irish mother. Apparently the terrorists feel an affinity for the Irish because 'they, like us, have struggled against the imperialist oppression of Britain.' Which loosely translates as they like Ireland because there were fuckheads with bombs who liked killing innocents there too.

Bastards! There are not enough curses to describe these fuckwits.

The Earl

 

[ABSTRUSE]

That's so heartbreaking to hear, I'm so sorry for his family's loss.

 

[Guest]

No words.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I have to agree with the Earl. Yielding to these assholes will just produce more and worse acts of terrorism. We can commiserate with the victims and their friends and famiies but we can't, for practical purposes, do anything to prevent further atrocities.

 

[Guest]

I have to agree with the Earl. Yielding to these assholes will just produce more and worse acts of terrorism. We can commiserate with the victims and their friends and famiies but we can't, for practical purposes, do anything to prevent further atrocities.

Yep, nothing can be done, exept to find every single one of them and...

I won't finish that sentence. Some things should be left unwritten, for reasons of taste on a public forum.

Lou

 

[TheEarl]

Yep, nothing can be done, exept to find every single one of them and...

I won't finish that sentence. Some things should be left unwritten, for reasons of taste on a public forum.

Lou

I can think of several ways to finish that sentence and most of them finish with the fuckbags having no testicles.

The Earl

 

[Guest]

That was a major downer.

We are all helpless here

 

[pop_54]

Yep, nothing can be done, exept to find every single one of them and...

I won't finish that sentence. Some things should be left unwritten, for reasons of taste on a public forum.

Lou

Fuck taste Nuke the bastards.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Fuck taste Nuke the bastards.

That would be too quick and merciful, besides killing some innocents. How about this: Once a terrorist has been absolutely positively identified, and assuming him to be a member of Al Qeada, strap him to a gurney Then, bring in a sedated pig, the grossest, piggiest pig you can find. The sedation of the pig is because you don't want to cause pain to an innocent creature. Strap the pig to another gurney and arrange for it to transfuse blood. Let the terrorist know that you are going to kill him by transfusing the blood from the pig into him. The transfusion will kill him, through blood clotting and arterial blockage and knowing that he will die with pig blood in his system will probably terrify him. Videotape the whole proceeding and show it over the evening news to scare other potential terrorists, letting them know what will happen to them.

 

[Boota]

After killing the two Americans I didn't see anyway that they weren't going to kill Bigley. That's their M.O. It was hopeful that things were taking so long that just maybe they were thinking about releasing him. Until he was actually free, though, I figured the bastards were going to kill him, too. No matter how long they stretched it out. It seems a little more cruel this time. Making his family believe that there might be a chance.

Now all we can hope is that some U.S. or British soldiers stumble across these evil mother fuckers and take them out before they kidnap anyone else.

 

[Lord DragonsWing]

I heard about Bigley getting killed today. I feel for his family and wish them the best to get through this tragic time.

But if I may give everyone something to think about? Nuke them? No good, too many innocents will be killed.

The problem is, when we kill a terrorist we create x many more. How so? Not as martyrs for their cause. That we will do no matter who is taken out in the war on terror. But hatred among their family. Today, the terrorist created lifelong enemies with the family of a man who was not at war. Who was there to serve and help the people. We do the same when we kill the terrorist. Should we stop killing them? Noooooooooo Wayy!!!!!!!!!!!!

We take each down no matter what the means. But what do we do about their families? Their children who will fight on in their names? Re-educate? How? Take them out? Is that morally or legally ethical?

We solve the immediate problem by taking out the terrorist now. What do we do about the future terrorist that are coming up to avenge their family?

They kill children in Russia. Do we kill theirs? This is a question no one seems to want to answer or face. This is the fact of war and what's ahead.

There are alot of intelligent authors here. Let's hear what everyone has to say.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

They kill children in Russia. Do we kill theirs? This is a question no one seems to want to answer or face. This is the fact of war and what's ahead.

There are alot of intelligent authors here. Let's hear what everyone has to say.

The answer is: No. We don't kill their children.

Revenge is not justice.

---dr.M.

 

[shereads]

When we begin to like the idea of nuclear holocaust, the bad guys will have won. They will have turned us into them.

I can't imagine where his family will find comfort, but at least the man himself is beyond it all now. God help us all. We're in an endless downward spiral.

 

[Lord DragonsWing]

The answer is: No. We don't kill their children.

Revenge is not justice.

---dr.M.

Then Doc let me ask this? We kill their father who is a terrorist. They hate the us all of that. They fight us in 10 to 20 years from now. We kill one terrorist, we gain x amount against us. How do we win?

 

[shereads]

Then Doc let me ask this? We kill their father who is a terrorist. They hate the us all of that. They fight us in 10 to 20 years from now. We kill one terrorist, we gain x amount against us. How do we win?

"The only way to end terror is to stop participating in it."

~ Noam Chomsky

We put the same effort toward ending the western world's dependance on fossil fuels as we once put into developing the h-bomb and later into a moon landing. Then we tell the Middle East to have a nice day and we go home.

 

[Guest]

Fuckers! . . .

Bastards! There are not enough curses to describe these fuckwits.

The Earl

I'm so sorry. As a U.S. citizen, I feel responsible.

 

[English Lady]

The answer is: No. We don't kill their children.

Revenge is not justice.

---dr.M.

I am with the Good Doc and Shereads here.


I was sickened when I heard the news. For me I know what I will do now. Pray. Pray for his family, the situation and this whole fucked up business.

Some of you will no doubt roll your eyes at that but it is what I will do!

 

[Lord DragonsWing]

I am with the Good Doc and Shereads here.


I was sickened when I heard the news. For me I know what I will do now. Pray. Pray for his family, the situation and this whole fucked up business.

Some of you will no doubt roll your eyes at that but it is what I will do!

Then pray for us all EL. Because as the years go by we will face more terrorist. Remember the pics of Bin Laden's kids waving rifles at jets. That will face us soon. It's long from over. They're only increasing.

 

[doormouse]

Sad fact is, it won't end quickly.

Those poor kids are brainwashed to hate westerners.

I can't believe some of those fuckers used to train an hour away from where I am now, and one of the bastards used to live in my street!!!!!!

I've reported this, not scared of the fuckers anymore.

In Melbourne, they're all taxi drivers. I can't remember the fuckers name, but he used to learn to fly at Moorabbin airport. That house housed five of them. They all drove taxis. That's how they'll hit Australia, no doubt. There were taxis pulling in there 24/7.

We have all the underground tunnels... As soon as I found out it was him, I reported the movement from his house. I used to live five doors down.


Sadly, it won't stop soon.

 

[Somme]

"The only way to end terror is to stop participating in it."

~ Noam Chomsky

We put the same effort toward ending the western world's dependance on fossil fuels as we once put into developing the h-bomb and later into a moon landing. Then we tell the Middle East to have a nice day and we go home.

<sighs>.........in a nutshell, eh?

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

Then Doc let me ask this? We kill their father who is a terrorist. They hate the us all of that. They fight us in 10 to 20 years from now. We kill one terrorist, we gain x amount against us. How do we win?

We don't.

You can't "win" against decentralized groups willing to die for a cause.

Violence begets violence and our xenophobic, everyone muslim is a terrorist, actions in the Middle East will just make shit like this more common and worse.

They kill to mourn the dead. We kill to mourn the dead. And now more dead to mourn.

Do we capitulate? No. Do we surrender? No.

But we never win.

Especially not this way.

Everyone here knows how I feel on terrorism, that I support revenge on al-queda and Islamic Jihad instead of creating new terrorist groups in Iraq. But my views matter shit, cause it aint tied to what's been happening and is going to keep happening.

Does my answer seem callous? Depressing? Yeah, it is. Deal. Welcome to the real Neverending War. You don't "win" wars on Terror, you just stack atrocities.

 

[oggbashan]

Re: Re: Bigley dead

I'm so sorry. As a U.S. citizen, I feel responsible.

You shouldn't. This is part of the war on terror and has nothing to do with normal Iraqis or even Saddam Hussein.

These people are killing far more Iraqis than Westerners. We have to stop them because their agenda is to make Iraq ungovernable by anyone.

The only way terrorists can be defeated is to win the hearts and minds of those among whom the terrorists operate. That takes years or lifetimes. Making it possible for Iraqis to live normal lives is the first step, and the step the terrorists are trying to prevent.

We must remember that two US citizens were killed as well. Mr Bigley's execution was extended so that the terrorists could get the maximum publicity from their acts. The terrorists wanted media attention. They wanted to extend the agony and generate hatred and an irrational response from the allies that would further alienate 'normal' Iraqis and moderate opinions.

Og

 

[Just-Legal]

I heard on the news this morning that one of his captors helped him attempt to escape, before he was recaptured and killed (presumably with the person who helped him).

There may be hope for some yet.

 

[steve w]

While I feel greatly for Mr Bigley and his loved ones, why does his death resonate more than any other death attached to the conflict in Iraq? Was his life worth more than any other? Or was he somehow "more like us" than some victims? Or was his death more fully covered, by a cynical media who like to imply that a whole geo-political and military scenario can be fully encapsulated by the story of one man?

There is no "war on terrorism". It's a fucking myth that you can fight a concept, like the "war on drugs" or the "war on poverty". It implies there is a clear and identifiable enemy, that we can win through military means, and that we will know when we have won. None of these things are true.

I'll repeat what I've said before, based on every attempt to defeat terrorism that has worked. Success comes from -

1 Continuing to live life as normally as possible. This doesn't mean pathetic attempts to fool the public into thinking airport security has improved by making them wait for hours to board a plane, or hand over their fucking nail clippers. And then ignoring every commercial aircraft flying out of JFK. For example.

2 Intelligence, intelligence and intelligence. Infiltrating the groups concerned, identifying their sources of funding and protection. The allies failed to do this to Al-Quaeda before Sept 11th, and still aren't doing this. Ergo, no success.

3 Deal with the root causes of unrest. This means political solutions that the majority of peace-desiring people concerned can live with. In this case, it means dealing with the Palestine question, even if this costs a few Jewish votes in the US, and trying to sort out the kind of mess that only comes with invading a country and having fuck-all idea what to do when you get there.

Anything else is a hollow sham designed to fool the public into thinking action is being taken whereas, as has been pointed out, all that is occurring is the storing up of future mayhem.

Yes, it does make me angry.

 

[dr_mabeuse]

Then Doc let me ask this? We kill their father who is a terrorist. They hate the us all of that. They fight us in 10 to 20 years from now. We kill one terrorist, we gain x amount against us. How do we win?

What steve w said.

Terrorism isn't hereditary and despite the current rhetoric, it's a criminal problem, not a political one. It needs a police solution, not a military one.

As long as we go after them with bombs and heavy weapons we're playing right into their hands, because we're going to breed more terrorists, which is just what they want. In fact, the idea behind terrorism is not to defeat your enemy, which they know they can't do, but to provoke such a disproportionate response that it breeds more terrorists for your side. That's why our invasion of Iraq was precisely the wrong thing to do.

They way you defeat them is through police and undercover tactics, and by getting the population on your side, thus depriving the terrorists of their cover. When the population hates the terrorists more than they hate you, the terrorists are through.

The children of criminals don't have to grow up to be criminals. People understand right and wrong and justice. Look at Japan and Germany where we killed I don't know how many tens of thousands in WWII. Their kids don't hate us. They know that they were in a war and that they were on the wrong side, and they can accept that.

But yes, as long as we continue to swat flies with 500-lb bombs, we're going to be breeding more terrorists. That's their plan.

---dr.M.