BDSM & Violence

[Chris_Xavier]

I was talking one of my online chat buddies the other night and she was floored to find out that I was into bdsm. During the course of the conversation, she said she had always associated bdsm with violence, specifically rape. She was open minded and intrigued by the thought of giving up control to a PYL.

As we continued the conversation, I put out the idea bdsm could be loving and considered foreplay.

So this thread was started for her and hopefully after a few posts she'll come out of hiding and pick up the conversation.

The question is for PYLs and pyls alike is what about bdsm does it for you?

She did open up an account on Lit and lurked around a bit.

Thanks in advance for the responses,

Chris

 

[catalina_francisco]

LOL, no offence meant, but I am always intrigued by people who act shocked and say they think of BDSM as being about violence etc., and then almost instantly saying they are interested in trying it. It makes me nervous I guess and is not a person I would be prepared to play with at that point.

As to what it does for me. The short answer is I love the power and control aspect, and definatley being challenged way beyond a level which is easy to cope with. I get bored very quickly if I am only asked to do things I will like or have little difficulty getting my head around. And I guess it goes without saying I love the sadism and masochism involved in our particular relationship, especially when blood is shed in some way.

Catalina

 

[Chris_Xavier]

LOL, no offence meant, but I am always intrigued by people who act shocked and say they think of BDSM as being about violence etc., and then almost instantly saying they are interested in trying it. It makes me nervous I guess and is not a person I would be prepared to play with at that point.

Catalina

Oh I'm not trying to get her play.. at least not yet.

 

[brioche]

LOL, no offence meant, but I am always intrigued by people who act shocked and say they think of BDSM as being about violence etc., and then almost instantly saying they are interested in trying it. It makes me nervous I guess and is not a person I would be prepared to play with at that point.

As to what it does for me. The short answer is I love the power and control aspect, and definatley being challenged way beyond a level which is easy to cope with. I get bored very quickly if I am only asked to do things I will like or have little difficulty getting my head around. And I guess it goes without saying I love the sadism and masochism involved in our particular relationship, especially when blood is shed in some way.

Catalina

I think that it is a case of challenging an instant assumption, Catalina. If you've never seriously thought about it at all, you will still have some opinion about it gleaned from the news, etc. Once hearing from someone whose opinion you trust giving you a nuts and bolts explanation, often people can realize that what they thought of as BDSM is nothing of the sort. Just MHO, though, YMMV.

 

[northwoods_sub]

I would have to agree with Cat in that I love the challenge of going beyond what I would do myself. I get bored really quickly with monotony and BDSM keeps things interesting and down right challenging. It is the adrenaline rush of the spankings, the loss of control of the bondage.
Honestly with all of the people I know right now who are getting divorced after many years of marriage I am so thankful that Sir and I have this to keep our communication open and our sex lives interesting.

 

[Chris_Xavier]

What about the so called "pain sluts" (not refuting their claims here) - wouldn't that be considered violent?

Or playing out a rape scene?

 

[Velvet Bubbles]

Giving up control. (I think I've said this before elsewhere.) I'm in so much control of myself that it's tiring. Giving it up to G is hugely relaxing to me. I also have an insatiable curiousity. This takes care of some of that. In a nice, SAFE way.

 

[Netzach]

Um, what if it is about violence?

I never scuffled, never hit anyone even in self defense, whereas my family was periodically violent with me. I never did a martial art, never dared to accept my own capacity to be violent, never took a physical risk.

My play partner who I've been switching with, said something profound. The clean white spot in your heart is never going to be bigger than the big black one. If it is, you are unbalanced, unchecked, and denying something.

It's so beautiful and so logical as to be obvious when someone says it, but not many people put it that well.

This is a place where you are free to explore, given a lot of mutual understanding and some groundwork and baseline common acknowledgement. Adults get to be adults. Know yourself really well, and what you do and don't want and can and can't take.]

 

[BiBunny]

My BDSM does involve violence, especially when I'm on bottom. I know everybody's doesn't, and that's fine. But mine does. The more roughly he treats me, the more I know he cares about me. And before anyone jumps on that statement, allow me to explain. We both like to play hard, but he has admitted that sometimes he can only push me so far because he doesn't want to let his full sadism loose on me for fear that I can't handle it. When he knows that I need it, though, he does. And I love him for it. YMMV.

ETA: Netz summed up my feelings about it perfectly and said it much more eloquently than I did.

 

[catalina_francisco]

What about the so called "pain sluts" (not refuting their claims here) - wouldn't that be considered violent?

Or playing out a rape scene?

We don't do role play so I won't comment on that but I tend to not equate S&M with violence in the sense which mainstream understand violence to mean, that being negative and/or abusive. That also is not the whole of BDSM and fits into only a fraction of what the whole picture is about. Some people never experience pain, or give it. Once again I guess it comes down to your interpretation of a word. For me when I hear the word violence mentioned, I tend to think in terms of non-consensual abuse, not something within a consensual relationship where limits may be adhered to, care taken, and aftercare applied. Others like to think of it as violence.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

My BDSM does involve violence, especially when I'm on bottom. I know everybody's doesn't, and that's fine. But mine does. The more roughly he treats me, the more I know he cares about me. And before anyone jumps on that statement, allow me to explain. We both like to play hard, but he has admitted that sometimes he can only push me so far because he doesn't want to let his full sadism loose on me for fear that I can't handle it. When he knows that I need it, though, he does. And I love him for it. YMMV.

ETA: Netz summed up my feelings about it perfectly and said it much more eloquently than I did.

LOL, seems pretty much where we are at, but not how I think people who do not understand it interpret it. Perhaps it fits better for me to think of some of the actions as violent in nature, but the overall picture to not be best described as violence. Perhaps this comes from my also thinking in a more mainstream way about violence in general which doesn't fit with what we do and who we are...for instance, in any other situation, there is no way either of us fit the example of violent people, in fact we are both so quiet we tend to fade into the background and strongly oppose violence within the community etc. One of those multi-layered questions I guess.

Catalina

 

[BiBunny]

LOL, seems pretty much where we are at, but not how I think people who do not understand it interpret it. Perhaps it fits better for me to think of some of the actions as violent in nature, but the overall picture to not be best described as violence. Perhaps this comes from my also thinking in a more mainstream way about violence in general which doesn't fit with what we do and who we are...for instance, in any other situation, there is no way either of us fit the example of violent people, in fact we are both so quiet we tend to fade into the background and strongly oppose violence within the community etc. One of those multi-layered questions I guess.

Catalina

Ok, gotcha. We're just splicing words again, as usual. We're on the same page, but I wasn't thinking about the nuances of the words. You're right to point out that "violent acts," which is what we're talking about, and "violence" are two different things.

 

[Marquis]

LOL, no offence meant, but I am always intrigued by people who act shocked and say they think of BDSM as being about violence etc., and then almost instantly saying they are interested in trying it.

I was thinking the same thing.

I run into this comically often.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Ok, gotcha. We're just splicing words again, as usual. We're on the same page, but I wasn't thinking about the nuances of the words. You're right to point out that "violent acts," which is what we're talking about, and "violence" are two different things.

A fine line but I guess it comes from my former need to justify my choice to a few people close to me when I first made a conscious decision to follow this path, one of them being the person I had been in a relationship with for 5 years. He just could not appreciate how anything which involved pain could be loving or consensual and thought it would only be desired if there was something wrong with your self esteem, or you were forced to accept it. I found that was a misconception of many, including the people within the feminist organisation I worked in. They had no idea about any of it, had never spoken to anyone who lived or played in the lifestyle, and yet felt they had all the answers as to why women would allow themselves to be 'abused' like this...none of it good. So when I hear people who are new or mainstream say BDSM is violence, I tend to jump in to clarify the fine line.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

I was thinking the same thing.

I run into this comically often.

Ah, maybe it is my cautious genes talking but I always need time to think about, process and check out from more than one source anything I have negative ideas or thoughts about before feeling comfortable with even contemplating jumping in and trying it.

Catalina

 

[brioche]

Okay, so I seem to have misread what your OP is saying. When you said "violence, specifically rape," I assumed you meant rape and violent acts, not any pain or violence that may occur as part of a play session etc. I thought you were saying that she associated it with people who were violent.

 

[LadyAmaranth]

When I told a friend of mine that I was interested in BDSM, she was shocked as well. She was under the misconception that it involved great violence and when I asked her to elaborate she said "well isn't it just people whipping each other bloody." I tried to enlighten her, and I think she did understand the concept better, but said that she would not ever be interested in anything that involved pain.

What can you say to someone or namely how can you tell someone exactly what BDSM involves? I think it must be something that must be explored by the individual even if they find it is not for them, but at least we would not fear such uninformed responses.

I would not use the term "violence" to describe what goes on, perhaps pain given in a safe, and trusting environment that provides stimulus for all participants. Perhaps it is a little more wordy, but I think more accurate. As for rape or anything else that is considered particularly dangerous, those would be scenes that are previously agreed on and I think would still go under the definition I put above.

 

[Shankara20]

When I read the title I go to the question about BDSM vs domestic violence/spousal abuse/intimate partner violence (pick a label) - the non-consensual kind. I have material that discusses the difference and will share it should someone thinks it would be helpful.

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

I have material that discusses the difference and will share it should someone thinks it would be helpful.

Sounds prudent

 

[NYCgirl26]

Giving up control. (I think I've said this before elsewhere.) I'm in so much control of myself that it's tiring. Giving it up to G is hugely relaxing to me. I also have an insatiable curiousity. This takes care of some of that. In a nice, SAFE way.

I agree with VB. My job requires me to be in control and on top of things at all times...very demanding. Submission allows me to give up all that and relax. It allows me to focus on one thing (someting in the rest of my life I almost never do), that is whatever is being done to me at that moment or that I am doing to please him. Trust is HUGE in this because while limits are ment to be pushed, but if things go to far I trust he will stop.

As for the pain of so called violent acts, like other ppl have said, it is consentual. For me it rarely registers as "PAIN" but as intense stimulation. But again I think this is as indivdual as the players involved.

Not sure I expalined this all that well but, I tried to give my take on things.

 

[littlegirlslut]

This was actually huge issue for me when I first realized this was something I was interested in. This was when I was about 15 or so, yes I was on the boards and IRC underage - although I didn't partake in anything - I just read. I didn't want to get anyone in trouble but there was no where else to find the information. I was never looking for a partner but trying to learn and figure out what the heck I was thinking. I was also glad to find out I was not a total alien and that there were others out there like me.

I found in the beginning that I seemed to run into people that were just very different from me - from upbringing, to life experience, to needs and wants, but at the same time that were the same. One of the issues I had was that many of the submissive females I met had at one time been in very abusive situations in their life as children and/or adults. This was not at all the case for me. So I worried that I was going to lose myself in this lifestyle.

I have found in the last 10 years, much of that being in a very vanilla relationship that well, 'nilla doesn't work for me but neither does a 24/7 D/s relationship. I like my independence too much and I can't stand to be micromanaged. I also will always demand to be able to stand on my own two feet and take care of myself. I would in a nilla relationship as well.

For me I LOVE THE PAIN. I didn't know I was as into pain as I am or as dark as I can be. But I love the knives and canes the most. For me though it's based on the immense trust that must happen. I'm in a POLY/LD relationship and well, it's been rocky but it's lasted and they are my family no matter what happens to our D/s relationship. I always need to gentle reassurance that she gives me while He is beating the hell out of me. He also can read me better than I can read myself and when I say I need PAIN, he'll recognize that it might not be what I need. Is it violent - HELL YES - is it dangerous - NO - as long as we all remain under control. Is it completely consensual and desired absolutely.

For me it's everything, the power control and loss of it, it's the Daddy/daughter thing we have that works so well, it's knowing that He knows I am intelligent and capable and that I give myself to Him and love doing so. He also knows that there are very few that I would do this for.

 

[Life_Noir]

My BDSM does involve violence, especially when I'm on bottom. I know everybody's doesn't, and that's fine. But mine does. The more roughly he treats me, the more I know he cares about me. And before anyone jumps on that statement, allow me to explain. We both like to play hard, but he has admitted that sometimes he can only push me so far because he doesn't want to let his full sadism loose on me for fear that I can't handle it. When he knows that I need it, though, he does. And I love him for it. YMMV.

ETA: Netz summed up my feelings about it perfectly and said it much more eloquently than I did.

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh Klingon Sex.... Gotta love it..

 

[RJMasters]

I was going to say something about violence and then was completely distracted by Cat's pic and those crystal clear marks around F's brand. Unlike other images where there is just this huge blotching red zone, these marks are clear and singular in nature laid with purpose and enough force to create a perfect outline.

One of the more erotic pics I have seen on Lit in a while. ty for sharing it.


*goes and sits down and tries to dial back down my sinewave....

 

[catalina_francisco]

I was going to say something about violence and then was completely distracted by Cat's pic and those crystal clear marks around F's brand. Unlike other images where there is just this huge blotching red zone, these marks are clear and singular in nature laid with purpose and enough force to create a perfect outline.

One of the more erotic pics I have seen on Lit in a while. ty for sharing it.


*goes and sits down and tries to dial back down my sinewave....

LOL, glad you like it...is one of my faves also.

Catalina

 

[RJMasters]

LOL, glad you like it...is one of my faves also.

Catalina

So you add a shibari and a blood dripping....

Your not helping