Ask a MtF TG a question

[stickygirl]

Detransitioning - the stick to beat us with

also, the UK sucks

Detransitioning isn't something I have first hand experience of - I don't know anyone who has put the brakes of their transition either MtoF or FtoM and I know a fair number of trans people, so that's significant. I found this video from Claire Michelle who is one of those horribly upbeat people from the West coast . I like her breezy presentations and this video she focuses on de-transitioning, so I gave it a watch and I checked her facts too. So she's right - around 1% of trans people express regret and de-transition and of the 1%, the majority are doing so because of societal pressures: family, work ... external crap.

The other topic she has raised a few times, is how bad things have become in the UK for trans people. I'm not sure if it's demand or a decision made behind closed doors, but although the UK is ahead of the curve for legal rights, they have become pretty crap when it comes to offering professional medical services. This has nothing to do with Covid - it's been creeping up for a few years. The average time to get a first 'appointment' around 18mths and often that is a group meeting with some forms to fill in. Then people will often have another year before they get any kind of feedback or contact from their clinic, never mind actual prescriptions.

So let that sink in. When someone claims that there is a transgender 'craze' 'fad' 'fashion' they probably have in mind it's like a flu-jab. It isn't. It isn't a choice. It isn't our fault and it certainly isn't this year's fashion.

Waiting lists have got much longer since I had my GCS and I was lucky my family could afford my surgery in Thailand... almost exactly six years ago. If I hadn't had that opportunity I cannot think what my life would have become or if I could have survived a further 2 or 3 years on a UK waiting list.

Stay safe all - wear your mask - think of others

 

[stickygirl]

Sport and ignorance

Sport and trans people - you know, man pops a skirt on, throws the shot and walks away with a trophy. WRONG!!

I get really tired about this one. Transgender people deserve to compete in sports and they can, but the transphobes on Lit have it in their thick skulls that there are a crack team of men ready to subvert the girls by IDing as women for medals. Or worse still that there are trans women who have been using HRT for years, have less testosterone, bone density and muscle mass and they are still called out by transphobic ignorance that doesn't look at the science.
Look - here's a link to the research at Loughborough University

Let me grab the other links from the GB where this all started

Transgender women in sport: Are they really a 'threat' to female sport?

Martina Navratilova explores issues faced by trans athletes in BBC documentary

LGBT group drops Martina Navratilova over transgender comments

Do transgender athletes have an unfair advantage?

Here's both sides on CBC

Why We Need To Let Trans Athletes Play

Of course, people need to be able to compete on fairly, but should we ban cis-gender women over a certain height competing with shorter women in the long jump? Should we ban people like Usain Bolt because he is black and it's unfair that his natural energy burn ratio is better than white people?

The science is on-going, but that does not mean we ban transgender people from competing - we need everyone to enjoy sport, preferably from the trackside, not the keyboard end of a web connection.

I'm sorry/not sorry if I'm angry about this - sport matters to me. Fairness matters to me. Taking the trouble to learn the facts before you spout off your bigotry on Lit or anywhere else MATTERS to me. So fuck you twats, making judgements on my people from your sofas.

Sport is a human right

 

[AlexBailey]

Sport and trans people - you know, man pops a skirt on, throws the shot and walks away with a trophy. WRONG!!

I get really tired about this one. Transgender people deserve to compete in sports and they can, but the transphobes on Lit have it in their thick skulls that there are a crack team of men ready to subvert the girls by IDing as women for medals. Or worse still that there are trans women who have been using HRT for years, have less testosterone, bone density and muscle mass and they are still called out by transphobic ignorance that doesn't look at the science and frankly are barely able to move their pudgey fingers over a keyboard, never mind play GK in netball.

***

Of course, people need to be able to compete on fairly, but should we ban cis-gender women over a certain height competing with shorter women in the long jump? Should we ban people like Usain Bolt because he is black and it's unfair that his natural energy burn ratio is better than white people?

The science is on-going, but that does not mean we ban transgender people from competing - we need everyone to enjoy sport, preferably from the trackside, not the keyboard end of a web connection.

I'm sorry/not sorry if I'm angry about this - sport matters to me. Fairness matters to me. Taking the trouble to learn the facts before you spout off your bigotry on Lit or anywhere else MATTERS to me. So fuck you twats, making judgements on my people from your sofas.

Sport is a human right

Hi Sticky,

Sorry that I have not read through all of the links yet. I appreciate your passion.

The best solution I see is in a quote from the BBC Transgender People in Sport article:

"If the size or strength of competitors is a concern, size categories can be developed that are independent of gender"



In conjunction with this, I'd like to see all sports become gender inclusive. Why not have all Olympic events open to any gender? If you happen to be a man who is great at the uneven parallel bars or synchronized swimming -- go for it! The same for professional sports.


Certainly, not all sports have advantages or disadvantages related to size. Are there any sports that would be unfair to any particular gender if athletes are judged solely by their performance and relative size? Do you think it would be a bad thing to not have separate leagues of women's sports?

 

[stickygirl]

Thanks AB - this is something that has been on my mind the last few days after a spat on the GB. Without revisiting that, there is too much knee-jerk reaction to the topic arising from misinformation ( lies ).
Sport already has categories based on weight: contact sports and power-based but a person's height is not considered - why not? There now rules limiting the level of testosterone and the duration that trans athletes need to have been taking hormones to ensure their body matches levels found in their gender type. Claiming that bone density, muscle strength, skeletal leverage give trans women advantage has been widely disproved and in every trial, a trans women's performance is reduced 10-15% from the pre-transition state: about the same performance level we see between cis gender men and women in equivalent sports.

Some sensationalist reports have surfaced where trans women have beaten cis-gender women on the track: in Connecticut the angry parents of competing girls sued the school for their inclusive policy, because two trans girls won some track events. What was not reported was that these trans women were nowhere close to state or national selection levels: it was a storm in a teapot.
A trans track cyclist won a world event agains two cisgender athletes, even though the winner had won only two recent races out of twelve against the second placed woman.

If sports want to be fair, then maybe Kenyan and Ethiopian distance runners shouldn't be allowed to compete with the rest of the world, because they have a natural advantage for some reason. Maybe black people and white people should run separate sprint events - and swimming events come to that.

A troll on the GB cited Russian bloc athletes, who in the 1970s were given hormones to improve their fitness and they swept the boards, until doping caught up with them. Tour cyclists have been investigated for having blood transfusions the day before their big event. These are cheats: trans women and men are not.

If there was an obvious natural advantage gained by trans athletes, the IOC would not have made its recommendations: it was not due to 'woke' liberal pressure groups. The pressure on the IOC for particular sports to be included in the Olympics is intense and often down to commercial interests: a number of sailing events have been dropped in favour of kite-surfing - or would have been in 2020. Same with snowboarding. I'd say we need to bring back competitive poetry writing and tiddlywinks - something we can all get behind!

Testosterone gives a natural advantage to a wide range of physical events: both sexes have it naturally and it can and is measured with blood samples and spot checks at any time during training. Being tall or looking a little different or even having an Adam's apple does not make you faster. Sure, more research needs to be done and it's underway. The problem is that trans people are 1-ish % of the population so gathering meaningful information is difficult. It isn't a topic that can be debated on Breakfast TV for entertainment.

I was training with the Uni swimming team and regularly got my arsed kicked by cis gender women. I am a woman, so I will continue to compete and enjoy the companionship of my fellow women team mates: we share the same dressing rooms, the same sense of humour, we lend each other kit.

To go back to your point: yes, I'm open to any mixed events provided the rules are met and agreed on. No one is going to train to compete in events unless they can be sure it is as fair as it can be.

 

[AlexanderBly]

Ha! chuckling here



Quick answer
I'm meaning sexuality as sexual orientation. The most common form of gender/sexuality is a man knows he's a man and is heterosexual ( that's just the numbers talking, nothing more ). Most men and women never question their gender in their whole life - why would they? However many will question their sexuality.

Longer ramble/incisive examination
A trans woman has either 'just known' her gender from a pre-school age or she's had to figure it out later on, say at puberty. If later, she may already be confused about which sex she's attracted to (because her sexuality doesn't fit the hetero norm), along with trying to figure which gender they are themselves, because "just knowing" ones gender isn't always black and white. Confused? Too frigging right!! ... and they're often teenagers!!

Soooo... one of the ways of making sense of this is to clearly identify those two components in oneself "This is my gender" and "This is the gender I am sexually attracted to".
This is a problem a trans woman can face, if she finds she is still attracted to women even after starting hormones, because it can lead to a lot of name-calling and suspicion "You are woman now, so how can you be a lesbian as well?!" This is actually the million dollar question for a lot of so-called liberal people: they can tolerate 'a man thinking she's a woman', but still being attracted to women - that's a step too far for them.

It's what is behind a lot of the problems over access to restrooms because the suspicion is that these "so-called women" are nothing more then predatory men gaining access to women's spaces by deceit. You have to put this mistaken assumption into a bigger context: does an individual really put themselves through all the trauma of coming out as trans*, being shunned by family and friends, being pilloried by strangers and being scrutinized by health care professionals for months, to take a leak in a womens restroom?? FFS. There are easier ways of getting covered in hairspray and discovering some women's hygiene is no better than mens!

But as you've said "we're just like other people" so why wouldn't we be gay or straight? because - Sexuality has NOTHING to do with gender.

So, yea - trans* folk give this issue a good deal of thought.

Sexuality has nothing to do with gender, for sure, as people are sexual across the spectrum. Pretty much everyone grasps this. But once we start down the rabbit hole of subdividing gender into fractional identities, it enters a kind of theater of the absurd, best left to psychiatry.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Sexuality has nothing to do with gender, for sure, as people are sexual across the spectrum. Pretty much everyone grasps this. But once we start down the rabbit hole of subdividing gender into fractional identities, it enters a kind of theater of the absurd, best left to psychiatry.

Everybody knows there are only seven colours: red, orange, yellow, green, blue, indigo, violet. But the other day at the hardware shop I saw a sampler claiming to have 57 different colours of paint - political correctness gone mad! All these made-up names like "burgundy" and "scarlet" and "crimson" don't change the fact that red is red and that's that. These so-called "painters" need psychiatric help.

 

[stickygirl]

Sexuality has nothing to do with gender, for sure, as people are sexual across the spectrum. Pretty much everyone grasps this. But once we start down the rabbit hole of subdividing gender into fractional identities, it enters a kind of theater of the absurd, best left to psychiatry.

Thanks for your post. I guess you're reacting to the zillion gender descriptors that Facebook and large corporations have adopted. I'm sure you're right, psychiatrists could make a fortune trying decide if someone is genderqueer, NB, demi-something but generally they get lumped in under the heading transgender, the umbrella term. Psychologists have a more scientific approach.

When I've spoke to my mother about this, she commented that in the 70s and 80s boys grew their hair long because it was cool and annoyed the older generation; then in the 90s punk appeared with much the same social effects. These days all those fashions have blurred - you can meet a goth, a punk and hippy all in the same street. I don't take the gender descriptions too seriously and neither do the majority of students I meet. What they do have is a more holistic outlook to let people be who they want to be and play with labels if they choose. It's not something that occupies much of their time other than a few after pub conversations amongst friends.

TLDR Don't take it too seriously or you'll sound like your Dad.

 

[coati]

These days all those fashions have blurred - you can meet a goth, a punk and hippy all in the same street. I don't take the gender descriptions too seriously and neither do the majority of students I meet.

Is a person considerate? Do they help you learn new things about yourself and about the world? Do you look forward to hanging out with this person?

Gender descriptions fall to the side,

 

[stickygirl]

I'm at an age where I've detached myself from the overly sensitive mindset teens have. Give them a break - they're trying to figure out life, themselves, their sexuality and facing the inevitable pressure of good grades. Throw in exploding hormones for good measure and its no wonder they get disorientated.

Some of them will keep their descriptors, some may have a dalliance with bisexuality - it's their journey not ours, so as older adults we shouldn't lose sight of how shit been a teenager is - really - and offer them some positive support. Nothing offers better support than genuine curiosity: judging people based on stuff they're trying out or uncertain of, will only mean they stop listening to everything you say and do the opposite. Cos that's their job!!

 

[stickygirl]

There's always someone who says things better, or has a different angle on things.

I'd liked that Maya, pointed out that 'yes. trans people are binary' and although the trans umbrella has been extended to be inclusive, it doesn't really help people like Maya and me who have a more conventional attitude to gender: m/f

https://youtu.be/iyeo5P6sWk0

 

[yukonnights]

As promised: Estrogen in the environment

This is not a new discovery and while I've read about the sex of fish being changed close to sewage outlets, and laboratory tinkering with frogs and mice, I hadn't heard of the effects, both past and present, on human fetuses. I picked up this info from a book 'The Riddle of Gender' by Deborah Rudacille, who is a scientific journalist and author, from her book published in 2005.

The book opens by putting LGBT history in context, running from Stonewall and into second wave feminism. It then examines, with scientific research and interviews, intersex variations and how they might be affected by environmental and pre-natal hormones. The results of animal tests, that had been exposed commonly found compounds, such as DDT to particular plastics using DES ( both of which cause estrogen mimicking effects in the body ) have been studied. These have been shown to produce corruption to the genetic profile of fetuses, resulting in intersex gonad formation. Some of these can occur naturally, but the lab tests were statistically significant, particularly in male reproductive organs.

The use of DES as a plastic in food packaging was outlawed a few years ago. This stemmed from a cluster of daughters of mothers, exposed to DES as a food supplement (!) that resulted in rare cancers. Despite parallel evidence of undescended testes or mutations of their genetic markers to sons of these mothers, no follow up work has been undertaken.... (abbreviated to keep the size down.)

While I don't disagree with the science and conclusion that man-made chemicals can and do impact both human and animal fetal development; It's important to not overlook the facts of non-binary gender humans being recognized long before such chemicals were set loose to poison the Earth. Personally, I've always placed a lot of weight on this fact which supports the normalcy of transgender humans long before the current quagmire of misinformation. I can just hear it now how anti-trans groups can twist this to blame everything on a "sickness" or "chemical poisoning".

For those interested, there's a number of such historic sociology studies to be found online. I think it's hard to argue against historic fact. And I think what stickygirl has uncovered about environmental contamination from chemicals should encourage a large movement over to organic foods That's all I've eaten for years.

Here's a snippet from a Penn State project study;

The Evolution of Human Sexuality

Third Genders: New Concept? Or Old? February 19, 2014 Lee Bader

In nearly all of human history and, in particular, human culture, we have recognized and integrated at least two genders. For most societies, this means labeling two sexes (male/female) and two genders (man/woman) with the ideas of transsexualism and homosexuality being their own separate sect as novel and unprecedented, however cases of a “third gender” are well documented in multiple societies.

There are an overwhelming amount of examples of another or “third gender” in cultures in the past:

1. In indigenous Hawaii, before its colonization, there was a long standing multiple gender tradition, where the mahu could be a male or female biologically, but decide to inhabit a gender role either opposite theirs, somewhere in between the traditional sex roles, or even both masculine and feminine roles. Instead of being written off as outcasts, as persons of atypical gender identities often are today, these mahu were revered in their social roles as sacred educators of ancient traditions

2.In ancient Incan culture, the Incas worshipped a “dual gendered god” known as chuqui chinchay, who could only be attended and honored by third gender shamans or servants who wore androgynous clothing as “a visible sign of a third space that negotiated between the masculine and the feminine, the present and the past, the living and the dead.”

3.Among the Sakalavas of Madagascar, there is a third gender group reserved especially for little boys thought to have a feminine appearance and personality. These boys, rather than labeled as “gay men” after maturing and experiencing the upbringing of a male, are instead raised by their parents as girls from a young age.

For anyone interested, there's more at Penn State: https://sites.psu.edu/evolutionofhumansexuality/2014/02/19/third-genders-new-concept-or-old/

 

[yukonnights]

Hey gang! I think stickygirl is probably too well mannered to put in a good word for her most recent story — but I'm not. Just finished reading Under The Ice and can honestly say it's one of the best Transgender themed stories I've read. So if you're looking for something to read, I encourage you to give this one a look.

 

[coati]

Hey gang! I think stickygirl is probably too well mannered to put in a good word for her most recent story — but I'm not. Just finished reading Under The Ice and can honestly say it's one of the best Transgender themed stories I've read. So if you're looking for something to read, I encourage you to give this one a look.

It definitely is steamy, and it ends with the lead character ready for more adventures.

 

[stickygirl]

Hey gang! I think stickygirl is probably too well mannered to put in a good word for her most recent story — but I'm not. Just finished reading Under The Ice and can honestly say it's one of the best Transgender themed stories I've read. So if you're looking for something to read, I encourage you to give this one a look.

It definitely is steamy, and it ends with the lead character ready for more adventures.

Thanks both - you're awesome. So yes, I do some writing too and my character has moved on with her life. All the Under series are hot and I'm pleased with them. Post-op trans girl having fun!

Since you've bullied me into it, here's the link to the latest one, which is a hetero tale, but the other ones in the series mix things up.

 

[Sign54]

Anyone here identify as cisgender but have a trans or non-binary partner? I’m not trans myself but I’ve seen relationships with people I know where this happens.

 

[stickygirl]

Anyone here identify as cisgender but have a trans or non-binary partner? I’m not trans myself but I’ve seen relationships with people I know where this happens.

I just serve the coffee, but people stop by and chew the fat. Trans folk often hook up with each other because they understand each other. It can be tough for cis-gender people to deal with that or get a handle on the problems they face. I've seen relationships cis/trans that started out ok but then fell apart for those reasons.

But... never say never. It's all just a question of mindset, not body parts. If both sides are open-minded, supportive... all the usual things there's no reason they can't get on.

 

[stickygirl]

Thought the better of it re Anonymous story feedback

 

[timreh]

I just serve the coffee, but people stop by and chew the fat. Trans folk often hook up with each other because they understand each other. It can be tough for cis-gender people to deal with that or get a handle on the problems they face. I've seen relationships cis/trans that started out ok but then fell apart for those reasons.

But... never say never. It's all just a question of mindset, not body parts. If both sides are open-minded, supportive... all the usual things there's no reason they can't get on.

From watching my friends in the regional trans community, cis women and trans masc folks seem to have better chances at making a relationship work than cis men and trans femme folks. Two trans femme folks seem to do okay, much like two cis folks of differing genders would do okay.

But those are just off-the-cuff observations, with no scientific or mathematical precision applied.

 

[AlexBailey]

What a great resource!

I first came to this site as part of my own journey of self-discovery. I found a lot of what I was looking for in this thoughtful, insightful, painstakingly indexed thread. Judging by the fact it has received over a quarter million views and two thousand posts, I'm not the only one who feels this way.



Thank you, stickygirl. You are truly a treasure.

 

[coati]

Thank you, stickygirl. You are truly a treasure.

I'm a fan, also. She always has something interesting to say, and her honesty is compelling and sexy.

We are lucky to have her on this funky board.

 

[stickygirl]

I first came to this site as part of my own journey of self-discovery. I found a lot of what I was looking for in this thoughtful, insightful, painstakingly indexed thread. Judging by the fact it has received over a quarter million views and two thousand posts, I'm not the only one who feels this way.
Thank you, stickygirl. You are truly a treasure.

I'm a fan, also. She always has something interesting to say, and her honesty is compelling and sexy.

We are lucky to have her on this funky board.

https://64.media.tumblr.com/4a0fc97b7e27b17468497808b3cb3d3d/tumblr_inline_n0o0t3xZhb1sqtwiy.gif
https://64.media.tumblr.com/2fe06725a52bacc50bef552f6227a7b3/tumblr_noejq9bYxR1rw490go4_400.gifv

Thanks both... I thought a couple of pages maybe, answering questions.... yet here we are

 

[stickygirl]

Lets talk about pee

Lets give pee a shout out

As a kid, before I came out as trans, I hated going to public toilets, like the ones at ice rinks or parks. My Mum used to think I simply found them gross. She was right, but why did I find them gross? I'll let you fill in the blanks but ~hint~I was in the wrong one is why they were gross.

Anyway, being a smart kind I figured, if you don't want to pee, then don't drink. I guess my mother was too busy to chase me on that. Later as a transitioning teen, I had to avoid (why won't you guys call them toilets - it's where you pee, not rest or take a bath? ) toilets because I didn't pass well enough to use the Ladies. The same tactic of not drinking worked pretty well...

...except that I used to get massive headaches. Headaches that got so bad I'd vomit. I'm not sure if they were migraines or not, but I recall particularly embarrassing events with shame. Like the time some family friends took us to the next city to go skating and they had to stop on the motorway shoulder because I needed to vomit. Or being at a wedding and doing the same, or the zoo... On the back of my bulimia I think people thought I was attention seeking, but quite the reverse was true.

I missed out on the fad for carrying a water bottle with you like a teddy bear... drinking water was never fashionable in my home. It took me years to figure that drinking liquids-is-a-good-idea. I didn't understand that becoming dehydrated = headaches.

So Aunty Jane's advice to parents and relatives is: if you have a dysphoric kid, or one who's transitioning, and they get massive headaches/vomiting, then please ask the simple question "When did you last drink anything?" and then work out a plan about where they can take a pee without fear.

 

[timreh]

Lets give pee a shout out

As a kid, before I came out as trans, I hated going to public toilets, like the ones at ice rinks or parks. My Mum used to think I simply found them gross. She was right, but why did I find them gross? I'll let you fill in the blanks but ~hint~I was in the wrong one is why they were gross.

Anyway, being a smart kind I figured, if you don't want to pee, then don't drink. I guess my mother was too busy to chase me on that. Later as a transitioning teen, I had to avoid (why won't you guys call them toilets - it's where you pee, not rest or take a bath? ) toilets because I didn't pass well enough to use the Ladies. The same tactic of not drinking worked pretty well...

...except that I used to get massive headaches. Headaches that got so bad I'd vomit. I'm not sure if they were migraines or not, but I recall particularly embarrassing events with shame. Like the time some family friends took us to the next city to go skating and they had to stop on the motorway shoulder because I needed to vomit. Or being at a wedding and doing the same, or the zoo... On the back of my bulimia I think people thought I was attention seeking, but quite the reverse was true.

I missed out on the fad for carrying a water bottle with you like a teddy bear... drinking water was never fashionable in my home. It took me years to figure that drinking liquids-is-a-good-idea. I didn't understand that becoming dehydrated = headaches.

So Aunty Jane's advice to parents and relatives is: if you have a dysphoric kid, or one who's transitioning, and they get massive headaches/vomiting, then please ask the simple question "When did you last drink anything?" and then work out a plan about where they can take a pee without fear.

(((HUGS)))

 

[stickygirl]

Thanks Timreh

Following up my 'safe to pee' suggestion, I found this on Pink News today. I don't read it often because it is so depressing, but here's a timely post about trans folk using public bathrooms

I started to read the article and thought 'I'm so lucky that I don't fall into the categories described, such as transphobia and hate crimes.' Then I found myself going 'Oh, yea, well I've had that, and I've had that too'.

Looking at my initial observation makes me realise how punch-drunk I've become to anti-trans sentiment. I have to remind myself that cis-gender people don't get harassed or abused for being men and women or using a public bathroom. I'd forgotten that, because I'm so used to keeping my head down in a loo. I'd forgotten that readers on Lit are happy to use the word Tranny in reference to my writing, but maybe cis-gender women get called sluts so.... so that makes it 'ok'?!

Of course - I'm being a snow flake. Words mean nothing so don't let them get to you. 'Words' on an author's site. Yea, right. So JK Rowling's words mean nothing right? Her $670 million means nothing.

 

[stickygirl]

This whole bathroom thing. My girlfriend is transgender and she lives in the Philippines. I think she is very passable but she says Filipinos always know that she is transgender. She always uses the women’s restroom and she never gets any flak for it. I never saw anyone complain and it’s not that LGBT friendly a country. On this issue though they have us beat.

I'm not sure, but is there more of cultural recognition in the Philippines as there is in some Pacific countries?

The bathroom thing comes down to 'passing' which too many cis gender people interpret as vanity. Passing is safety, or as safe as it is for any woman. The Pink News article points out that it is trans women who have the problems far more than trans men - in case readers thought I was being biased.

In the UK, things used to be better: when I started transitioning it certainly was, in terms of social resources and tolerance.