As writers, what's your view of the whole George R. R. Martin writers block brouhaha.

[TheRedChamber]

So, George R. R. Martin's name crops up quite a lot on this forum, especially when anyone mentions writer's block. In case anyone has been living under a rock this past decade and in case that rock didn't have HBO, he's been struggling to finish his epic fantasy series A Song of Ice and Fire for the past twelve years and isn't even optimistic (as of this week) that it'll get published by 2025. Each of the books is between 290k and 415k words long and he has so far published five out of a planned seven. At this point, and at the age of 75, even if he does publish book six, very few people expect him to be able to finish book seven.

Book 1 - A Game of Thrones - 1996
Book 2 - A Clash of Kings - 1999
Book 3 - A Storm of Swords - 2000
Book 4 - A Feast for Crows - 2005
Book 5 - A Dance with Dragons - 2011
Book 6 - The Winds of Winter - "Who the hell knows" - Martin this week.

As someone who is struggling to finish even a single 40k novel, I can empathize, but the time it has taken him has caused a lot of controversy - some fans, having paid for the first five books, just want him to get on with it publish the damn thing, whereas others reply that 'he doesn't owe you anything'.

I appreciate the pressure on him and can certainly understand writer's block taking over for even a year or two, it amazes me that he doesn't seem to have the drive to finish what is already a million+ word long book which is already beloved.

(While I can't ban people talking about the TV show and it certainly has had something to do with his writing issues, this thread is really about the creative process of one man)

 

[ElectricBlue]

I appreciate the pressure on him and can certainly understand writer's block taking over for even a year or two, it amazes me that he doesn't seem to have the drive to finish what is already a million+ word long book which is already beloved.

Why would he need to? He's got several mega-bucks in the bank, he's getting on a bit, and there are any number of script-writers who can finish the television thing.

Maybe he just wants to grow roses, I dunno. Maybe he's like a Lit endless series writer, and has no idea how to finish the thing, or has just got bored.

It's a shrug from me, my heart doesn't bleed.

 

[StillStunned]

I wonder whether there's an element of stage fright as well. Back when he published the first books, he was largely unknown. He could write his books, knowing that they'd be read mostly by pretty serious fantasy readers. With the success of the TV show, however, he's got the eyes of the world on him. Everything will be under much closer scrutiny, and there will be the inevitable comparisons - favourable or unfavourable - with the show.

Personally, I gave up hope that the series would finish years ago. Same with Patrick Rothfuss and Scott Lynch. The one author who kept on writing who I wanted to stop was Robert Jordan.

 

[TheRedChamber]

Why would he need to? He's got several mega-bucks in the bank, he's getting on a bit, and there are any number of script-writers who can finish the television thing.

Maybe, and I think wealth definitely brings its own problems and distractions, but I don't fully buy this. I suspect that most of us, if we had a few extra million dollars put in our bank balance would be inclined to write way more, rather than less. I'm reminded of Terry Pratchett who continued to write while suffering from Early Onset Alzheimer's even though he needed to dictate books to his aid. People write for different reasons, and it's kind of weird to me that, having achieved what he already has, it's doesn't seem to be a priority to him. But who really knows what is going on in his head or his private life. I suspect, when he dies, series finished or not, there will be an interesting biography behind the story.

I wonder whether there's an element of stage fright as well. Back when he published the first books, he was largely unknown. He could write his books, knowing that they'd be read mostly by pretty serious fantasy readers. With the success of the TV show, however, he's got the eyes of the world on him. Everything will be under much closer scrutiny, and there will be the inevitable comparisons - favourable or unfavourable - with the show.

This is more possible. By book three it was also widely regarded as being 'the best fantasy series since Lord of the Rings' and all he had to do was stick the landing. But he was clearly struggling to produce work to a reasonable schedule even before the show began.

Personally, I gave up hope that the series would finish years ago. Same with Patrick Rothfuss and Scott Lynch. The one author who kept on writing who I wanted to stop was Robert Jordan.

I gave up on Wheel of Time around book 7, I think it was. That thing slowed to a crawl.

 

[HordHolm]

Honestly, I think he simply bit off more than he can chew.

 

[sister jenny]

Honestly, I think he simply bit off more than he can chew.

I think the TV show ruined it. Suddenly his vision changed too much and got compromized and now he can not find his way back to his old vision.

 

[sister jenny]

I wonder whether there's an element of stage fright as well. Back when he published the first books, he was largely unknown. He could write his books, knowing that they'd be read mostly by pretty serious fantasy readers. With the success of the TV show, however, he's got the eyes of the world on him. Everything will be under much closer scrutiny, and there will be the inevitable comparisons - favourable or unfavourable - with the show.

Personally, I gave up hope that the series would finish years ago. Same with Patrick Rothfuss and Scott Lynch. The one author who kept on writing who I wanted to stop was Robert Jordan.

Don’t say that!!
I am still hoping for Ruthfuss

 

[Voboy]

I don't think he's motivated anymore. He's written a million characters each needing a score of motivations and dealing with a dozen other characters. And by now, he's lost track of a lot of that. The prospect of starting back up is probably very draining.

And besides, he's made his money off that series already. And the readers "know the ending." Why bother? That's an easy argument for him to make to himself.

I accepted long, long ago he'd never finish. I've seen nothing since then to change my mind.

 

[StillStunned]

I gave up on Wheel of Time around book 7, I think it was. That thing slowed to a crawl.

I managed until the beginning of book 10. Book 9 ended with something actually happening, and I had high hopes of the story actually moving forward again. But 100 pages into book 10, and all there was was more and more new characters, I just lost interest.

I tried the audiobooks, and got to the start of book 7. The thought of hundreds more hours of absolute drivel and whining - Perrin and Faile not understanding each other, the whole Rand and all his women - it was just too much.

People say the last few books are good, but I doubt I'll ever know. There are more interesting things to read.

 

[onehitwanda]

Patrick Rothfuss

You shut your foul mouth! He's just... he's... he's got a cramp! okay?!?!

Sigh. I really need to find time to read The slow regard of silent things but I'm scared it's going to make me sad. Auri is I think my favourite character in the Kingkiller Chronicles.

 

[SimonDoom]

I assume he's run out of motivation. The TV series passed the books and revealed the ending, which I assume is pretty similar to the ending in the books, although he probably could do a better job of it in the books.

I WISH I had his problem! Ha.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I assume he's run out of motivation. The TV series passed the books and revealed the ending, which I assume is pretty similar to the ending in the books, although he probably could do a better job of it in the books.

I WISH I had his problem! Ha.

Hey, don't beat up on yourself. Didn't you get something done this week?

 

[lovecraft68]

He doesn't have writers block, he's an arrogant blow hard who spends all his time running his mouth in between stuffing triple cheeseburgers in it.

He has always been a very slow writer, and HBO's biggest mistake was paying him bank without the series being finished.

He's not even done with the next to last book, and between his age and cholesterol level, he's not living long enough to finish the next one, or maybe even this one.

Slob has a lot to say about how HBO botched the last couple of seasons, but of course puts none of the blame on himself for not finishing it himself.

Tits, underage sex, rape and over the top torture was all that series had. Over rated garbage that should never be on a shelf next to Tolkien.

 

[StillStunned]

He doesn't have writers block, he's an arrogant blow hard who spends all his time running his mouth in between stuffing triple cheeseburgers in it.

He has always been a very slow writer, and HBO's biggest mistake was paying him bank without the series being finished.

He's not even done with the next to last book, and between his age and cholesterol level, he's not living long enough to finish the next one, or maybe even this one.

Slob has a lot to say about how HBO botched the last couple of seasons, but of course puts none of the blame on himself for not finishing it himself.

Tits, underage sex, rape and over the top torture was all that series had. Over rated garbage that should never be on a shelf next to Tolkien.

 

[SimonDoom]

Hey, don't beat up on yourself. Didn't you get something done this week?

I was thinking more about his royalties.

 

[Rob_Royale]

It's not writer's block. It's fear. Fear or building up so much story and beloved characters and then totally screwing up the ending. Do you think Robert Jordan wrote the eleven books of the WOT because he had that much story in him? No, he just didn't know how to write a decent ending. Like a kid who keeps riding his bike because he doesn't know how to stop without crashing.

It's a common phenomenon. Read any Dean Koontz novel and you'll see what I mean.

 

[alohadave]

At this point, he's trolling the hardcore fans who haven't moved on.

 

[SeraphNocturne]

He's proving how being a panster can come back to bite you in the ass for it. If he had plotted it out and knew where he was going with it from the beginning, we'd have never gotten that dumpster fire HBO series ending, and his following would at least have the solace that he'd get it written some day... but yeah, he's pretty much just basking in novel-to-television money, why the hell would he bother to sort out his ending now?

 

[Bramblethorn]

So, George R. R. Martin's name crops up quite a lot on this forum, especially when anyone mentions writer's block. In case anyone has been living under a rock this past decade and in case that rock didn't have HBO, he's been struggling to finish his epic fantasy series A Song of Ice and Fire for the past twelve years and isn't even optimistic (as of this week) that it'll get published by 2025. Each of the books is between 290k and 415k words long and he has so far published five out of a planned seven. At this point, and at the age of 75, even if he does publish book six, very few people expect him to be able to finish book seven.

Book 1 - A Game of Thrones - 1996
Book 2 - A Clash of Kings - 1999
Book 3 - A Storm of Swords - 2000
Book 4 - A Feast for Crows - 2005
Book 5 - A Dance with Dragons - 2011
Book 6 - The Winds of Winter - "Who the hell knows" - Martin this week.

IIRC, up to #5 he was actually writing at a fairly constant rate, but the books were getting longer and so it was longer between installments. And then, yeah, the TV show happened.

Charles Stross recently mentioned that he's wrapping up his Laundry Archives series after about 12 novels - probably about the same word count as GoT altogether? - because it was just getting way too much work to keep track of all the stuff from previous books that he needed to maintain continuity with.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I believe he has written himself into a corner, creating too many characters and plot lines and he is unable to resolve them all in a satisfying manner, especially considering the poor reception of the show's ending, which was probably very similar to his own. He is probably trying to come up with a different one now, but he is just too lazy and unmotivated.

As much as Jordan had stalled with his own books, a few among them containing barely any plot, the guy actually spent his last weeks in a hospital, telling his ideas to his wife and his associates, and writing the material for the conclusion of his series. It is hardly the same

 

[MelissaBaby]

I believe he has written himself into a corner, creating too many characters and plot lines and he is unable to resolve them all in a satisfying manner, especially considering the poor reception of the show's ending, which was probably very similar to his own. He is probably trying to come up with a different one now, but he is just too lazy and unmotivated

HBO scripted the final season from an outline that he gave them. He bears responsibility for the appallingly bad plot choices.

 

[samhasstories]

As a fan of the series, it bums me out. As a writer, I'm sympathetic. The story got too big, I think, and it got muddled by the TV series. I feel pretty confident that the version of the ending he would have written, if not substantially different from what happened in the show, would have felt developed, rather than tossed together on a whim. But we'll probably never know.

 

[MillieDynamite]

Ah, another bad ending... Never watched or read any of this. I, therefore, have no horse in this race. If his juice don't flow, it just won't go. What incentive does he have to finish something that's already finished and no one like how he thought it should end?

 

[SimonDoom]

I believe he has written himself into a corner, creating too many characters and plot lines and he is unable to resolve them all in a satisfying manner, especially considering the poor reception of the show's ending, which was probably very similar to his own. He is probably trying to come up with a different one now, but he is just too lazy and unmotivated.

As much as Jordan had stalled with his own books, a few among them containing barely any plot, the guy actually spent his last weeks in a hospital, telling his ideas to his wife and his associates, and writing the material for the conclusion of his series. It is hardly the same

I suspect his resolution of the Daenerys story arc is more satisfying and convincing than the show's was, but he's probably not inspired to do it because there were so many complaints.

Daenerys's character is an interesting Rorschach test. People saw different things in her depending upon their underlying views, and that led some to be much more surprised and disappointed about what happened than others. I saw her as a potential villain from the beginning, because of her very obvious penchant for cruelty, so I wasn't as surprised as some. But I still think the show handled her evolution badly.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I suspect his resolution of the Daenerys story arc is more satisfying and convincing than the show's was, but he's probably not inspired to do it because there were so many complaints.

Daenerys's character is an interesting Rorschach test. People saw different things in her depending upon their underlying views, and that led some to be much more surprised and disappointed about what happened than others. I saw her as a potential villain from the beginning, because of her very obvious penchant for cruelty, so I wasn't as surprised as some. But I still think the show handled her evolution badly.

I agree about Daenerys. Her whole arc is based on her "right" to be the queen of Westeros. There is nothing she would be liberating the people of Westeros from, no slavery, no true tyranny. She is going to be the queen because it is her right, no matter how much blood will be spilled for it. There is no inherent righteousness to her cause. Cersei's arc is similar, she just wants to be the queen who actually rules, not just the wife of the ruler.
From a philosophical point of view, Jon Snow and Tyrion are the ones who actually deserve to rule.