Wildcard Ky
Southern culture liason
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Another teacher student sex scandal.
- Thread starter Wildcard Ky
- Start date
lucky-E-leven
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Too weird. I can't help but wonder why no eyebrows went up about all of the 'chaufering' she did for the kid. 
Either way, it's a damn shame and a frightening prospect. There were several similar cases of this in my state last year and not one of them received press coverage (I'm assuming) because they were all male teachers.
This leaves me feeling confuddled. Why is it that the only time the rest of the media wants to play this out to the entire nation it is when a female teacher is doing the molesting? The instances I recall from here last year were horrendous, involving many students over long periods of time. Neither is better or worse, but it amazes me what gets media attention and what does not.
~lucky
Either way, it's a damn shame and a frightening prospect. There were several similar cases of this in my state last year and not one of them received press coverage (I'm assuming) because they were all male teachers.This leaves me feeling confuddled. Why is it that the only time the rest of the media wants to play this out to the entire nation it is when a female teacher is doing the molesting? The instances I recall from here last year were horrendous, involving many students over long periods of time. Neither is better or worse, but it amazes me what gets media attention and what does not.
~lucky
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lucky-E-leven
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Belegon said:
I'm fairly certain it's less common, but that doesn't make it any less wrong. Any adult that actively seeks sexual contact with a minor is outside the law and should be processed accordingly. It just gets under my skin to see the blatant imbalance in reporting. Those children are victims no matter who the offender is and that should be the real news. Actually, I hate that things like this become so public because of the children. It seems a certainty that his identity will become known through it all and I can't help but think that will further hamper his ability to cope and deal with the entire ordeal.
~lucky
p.s. Not preaching to you, just quoting where these thoughts came from.
minsue
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I'm not sure why some cases hit the natl new and some don't. My first instinct is to agree with Belegon, but there have been a disgusting number of molestation cases involving teachers around here recently including at least one in which the teacher was a woman.
===========================Wildcard Ky said:
Actually, two of them, and both involve 14 year olds.
Jack "Goose" Givens, the star basketball player from Kentucky, and sports analyst for the Magic's basketball team also was charged, but with fondling a 14 year old girl several times (3?).
mismused
cheerful_deviant
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Belegon said:
BINGO!
You just nailed that one right on the head.
And bigger headlines make bigger ratings. Bigger ratings = $$$
Virtual_Burlesque
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I do not intend to diminish the crime of the teacher. She trampled two social barriers. One is the barrier between an adult and a minor, the other, the bond of trust between a teacher and her student. There is no excuse for her, either in life, or in law.
The overt damage done to this particular child is – I believe – minimal. He appears to have been a willing, even bragging, conspirator in the events. His cousin acted as both a beard and an active assistant.
For a child fourteen years of age, sexual intercourse is not necessarily a totally unheard of event. Neither, can I discover any hint of coercion on his teacher’s part. The boy seems to have a typically egocentric fourteen-year-old’s cavalier attitude toward sex, bragging about getting it in with a hot teacher.
The molested children for whom I feel sorriest, are those manipulated, coerced, or forced into the act before they are psychologically prepared for the experience. The sense of helplessness and self-loathing of a child in clutches of a molester, and the alienation caused by people who will not, or can not see the hints, nor even acknowledge outright testimony, is part of the burden of a truly molested child.
The boy may be damaged, but I tend toward doubting that.
The teacher must be removed immediately from any position of trust, before she victimizes more innocent prey.
The overt damage done to this particular child is – I believe – minimal. He appears to have been a willing, even bragging, conspirator in the events. His cousin acted as both a beard and an active assistant.
For a child fourteen years of age, sexual intercourse is not necessarily a totally unheard of event. Neither, can I discover any hint of coercion on his teacher’s part. The boy seems to have a typically egocentric fourteen-year-old’s cavalier attitude toward sex, bragging about getting it in with a hot teacher.
The molested children for whom I feel sorriest, are those manipulated, coerced, or forced into the act before they are psychologically prepared for the experience. The sense of helplessness and self-loathing of a child in clutches of a molester, and the alienation caused by people who will not, or can not see the hints, nor even acknowledge outright testimony, is part of the burden of a truly molested child.
The boy may be damaged, but I tend toward doubting that.
The teacher must be removed immediately from any position of trust, before she victimizes more innocent prey.
Virtual_Burlesque
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I doubt it because he is fourteen years old, a boy, and he was bragging about the experience amongst his contemporaries.minsue said:
He is old enough chronologically, and by his reactions, is not suffering from shame or mortification. That he is a boy does have some bearing in the case. Even were he too young to handle the events psychologically, some segment of society would see his experience as positive. (Note: the original “Woo Woo Kid" from 1944 was also 14 years old.)
In cases like this, some moral condemnation always accrues to a female victim. At this minute, a female who was raped, is defending her morals in a court of law, against the claims of her rapist. This, despite the fact that her morals have nothing to do with whether or not she was raped. (Note: The Kobe Case.)
I know that considering the social repercussions for a male less than for a female in a similar position smacks of the double standard, but quite obviously, a double standard against females still exists.
cantdog
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I'm with Burley on this one
Folks will not stigmatize him, condemn, or even pity him or mourn over his traumatic loss. The neighbors' reaction to a girl in that situation would be really quite a bit harder to endure, reinforcing all the negatives. Even if she, too, were bragging to her friends because a hot teacher had gone down on her, the reactions of people around her would make it a misery.
Rape victims have too little support. As Burley says:
I bet it was scary, especially at first, though, to have an authority figure make that kind of demand. It's one thing to masturbate and "wish you could," but quite another to have it expected of you all of a sudden , and from a teacher. I hope Burley's right; I wish the young man a smooth recovery and a good ability to adapt.
Folks will not stigmatize him, condemn, or even pity him or mourn over his traumatic loss. The neighbors' reaction to a girl in that situation would be really quite a bit harder to endure, reinforcing all the negatives. Even if she, too, were bragging to her friends because a hot teacher had gone down on her, the reactions of people around her would make it a misery.
Rape victims have too little support. As Burley says:
I bet it was scary, especially at first, though, to have an authority figure make that kind of demand. It's one thing to masturbate and "wish you could," but quite another to have it expected of you all of a sudden , and from a teacher. I hope Burley's right; I wish the young man a smooth recovery and a good ability to adapt.
Virtual_Burlesque
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ABSTRUSE said:
http://www.sendit.com/img/video/cover_big/front-sorted/7000000/01/44/67.jpg
Starring: Talia Balsam, Patrick Dempsey, Beverly D'Angelo
Directed by: Phil Alden Robinson
A true story about a fourteen-year-old kid who gets thrown into jail for falling in love, twice.
It is 1944 and the world is at war. In the United States, war-weary Americans have grown tired of gasoline rationing, food shortages and blackouts, and are in the mood for something to take their minds off Hitler and the Japanese.
No-one ever expected that the something would be provided by Ellsworth “Sonny” Wisecarver, a precocious 15-year-old who lived in the sleepy town of Willowbrook, California.
“Sonny” set the United States on its ear to the point where adults were so incensed by his actions that a judge sentenced him to prison.
Teenagers made him a national hero, Boys cut their hair and dressed like him, girls giggled at his exploits and the press labelled him “The Woo Woo Kid.”
Technical Details
Certification: PG
Duration: 94 mins
Cat. No: 0598723 (4 FRONT VIDEO)
Category: Comedy:General
Virtual_Burlesque
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ABSTRUSE said:Thank you Virtual, you're a vault of wonderful info!
A vault sounds rather imposing, but I suppose it could have been worse.
You could have called me a bag!
Pure
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I find Virtual makes good points. There's no dispute about the law, but is there evidence of any serious harm to the boy? His talking about it, or even bragging, does not seem to indicate shame. Admittedly we are not told much about him. (Was he a virgin?)
Is the argument is that any such event must seriously harm the boy? I'd like to see it.
Perhaps this is a case where the law--being utterly PC-- is, just on principle, striving for complete gender neutrality, assuming this is what the God/dess wants. Does anyone have the feeling that some of these prosecutions have a basis in trying demonstrate such exemplary principle?
I agree that taking the virginity of an underage *female *--by a much older person--should be against the law (regardless of her 'consent'). In part, this is because of the social stigma. Is the male case at all parallel? If some are parallel, are all? Is the harm comparable (male and female)?
Is the argument is that any such event must seriously harm the boy? I'd like to see it.
Perhaps this is a case where the law--being utterly PC-- is, just on principle, striving for complete gender neutrality, assuming this is what the God/dess wants. Does anyone have the feeling that some of these prosecutions have a basis in trying demonstrate such exemplary principle?
I agree that taking the virginity of an underage *female *--by a much older person--should be against the law (regardless of her 'consent'). In part, this is because of the social stigma. Is the male case at all parallel? If some are parallel, are all? Is the harm comparable (male and female)?
Pure
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The Woo Woo Kid
http://articles.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1346/is_12_43/ai_57564132/pg_8
{Los Angeles Magazine, 1998}
[start]
WOO WOO BOY: MASTER OF THE FEBRUARY-APRIL ROMANCE.
When Seattle schoolteacher Mary Kay LeTourneau made headlines last year for rolling in the hay with her 13-year-old student, at least three notorious Angelenos might have yawned, "Been there, done that."
In May 1944, Elaine Monfredi ran off to Yuma with Ellsworth "Sonny" Wisecarver: She was 21 and a mother of two; he was 14 and the son of her neighbor. The honeymoon ended when Wisecarver's mother swore out a complaint for child stealing and Denver police nabbed the couple. Monfredi was sentenced to three years' probation and ordered to attend church once a month, while the L.A. press nicknamed Wisecarver "the L.A. Lothario" and "the Compton Casanova."
A year and a half later, he eloped with Eleanor Deveny, a 25-year-old housewife. This romance ended with a trip to youth camp. At 17, Wisecarver finally decided to date someone his own age, and the resulting marriage lasted 22 years. When asked his secret to attracting older women, Wisecarver said he behaved like a gentleman, bought them gifts and asked for their opinions. The young lover was the inspiration for the 1987 film In the Mood, starring Patrick Dempsey and Beverly D'Angelo. --J.H.[end excerpts]
http://articles.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1346/is_12_43/ai_57564132/pg_8
{Los Angeles Magazine, 1998}
[start]
WOO WOO BOY: MASTER OF THE FEBRUARY-APRIL ROMANCE.
When Seattle schoolteacher Mary Kay LeTourneau made headlines last year for rolling in the hay with her 13-year-old student, at least three notorious Angelenos might have yawned, "Been there, done that."
In May 1944, Elaine Monfredi ran off to Yuma with Ellsworth "Sonny" Wisecarver: She was 21 and a mother of two; he was 14 and the son of her neighbor. The honeymoon ended when Wisecarver's mother swore out a complaint for child stealing and Denver police nabbed the couple. Monfredi was sentenced to three years' probation and ordered to attend church once a month, while the L.A. press nicknamed Wisecarver "the L.A. Lothario" and "the Compton Casanova."
A year and a half later, he eloped with Eleanor Deveny, a 25-year-old housewife. This romance ended with a trip to youth camp. At 17, Wisecarver finally decided to date someone his own age, and the resulting marriage lasted 22 years. When asked his secret to attracting older women, Wisecarver said he behaved like a gentleman, bought them gifts and asked for their opinions. The young lover was the inspiration for the 1987 film In the Mood, starring Patrick Dempsey and Beverly D'Angelo. --J.H.[end excerpts]
psychocatblah
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From the article, it does sound like the boy was bragging about it. I don't think all 14 year old boys would, and it's hard to get a real feel for who the boy is, especially with this rather poorly-written choppy article that actually had me snorting from time to time unintentionally from its odd phrasing.
Afterward, Lafave drove the boys to Ocala, deputies said. During the trip, she performed oral sex on the student in the back seat of her vehicle, the report states.
She performed oral sex on the student in the back seat while they were driving? Whoa. Flexible AND dangerous.
Afterward, Lafave drove the boys to Ocala, deputies said. During the trip, she performed oral sex on the student in the back seat of her vehicle, the report states.
She performed oral sex on the student in the back seat while they were driving? Whoa. Flexible AND dangerous.
cantdog
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Whether he consented or not, the woman must of course be removed from positions of trust and of authority over minor children.
But without a victim who feels victimized, ought she to do a lot of jail time? Why would a consenting sex partner's age mean that, if he bore her no ill will?
But without a victim who feels victimized, ought she to do a lot of jail time? Why would a consenting sex partner's age mean that, if he bore her no ill will?
G
Guest
Guest
Thing is, with 'children' you may not really know how they feel or what they think, esp. in this boy's situation. It seems he was willing and I'd presume received great pleasure many boys his age only fantasize about, but we can't know what he will think aoubt himself next year, or the following year, or in ten years. That's why the law has to make these decisions.cantdog said:
Re. the teacher, I can't say what her punishment should be, but I do think it should be as lenient as many male rapists receive after they've emotionally and physically brutalized a woman (whatever her age). There are hardcore rapists and child molesters who do little time in prison. The article says the sentence could be up to 15 years in prison for "lewd and lascivious battery on a person".
What happens to the teacher in this case I can hardly care about.
Perdita
edited for glaring grammatical error
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pop_54
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Lucky little bastard... at 14 the best I got was a slap round the face or kick in the nuts from a 14 yr old girl for daring to ask... Now I am 'NOT' advocating that adults should have sex with young teens... or should even be allowed the choice... but let us not all get too uptight about certain elements of this case.
Having been a 14 yr old boy... a very long time ago... I can say with almost certain confidence that this young chap won't wind up in a long sleeved jacket babbling incoherently as a result of this episode... more likely he'll have a hell of a lot of beer paid for on the strength of the story over the years... He will no doubt have regrets... regrets that his bloody stupid cousin had to go and tell on them and put a stop to his fun.
Mind you I'm looking at this from a European viewpoint... where sexual taboo's are a little more relaxed at times... and where in several states and countries the legal age of sexual maturity is actually 14... in a couple as low as 13... A 14 yr old is in no way treated as a minor... young adult being more the term... Hell in some places a 14 yr old virgin is as rare as rocking horse shit.
Let's not scream it's against nature either cos it isn't... nature has even lower age restraints... If 14 yr old boys weren't meant to have sex, they wouldn't be able to get a hard-on... As a lot of you girls are fully aware, girls actually mature earlier than boys in most cases, mentally and physically... A lot of people say, "wow kids are maturing earlier these days", they aren't, they are just reverting to the natural state.
Many years ago before the sexual revolution of the 60's and 70's started bringing this natural act of passion into the public eye a lot more... sex was an almost universal taboo imposed on the masses by the ruling few who knew best law makers... even sex between adults was only permitted if they were married by the church... and then only in a darkened room for reproduction purposes... It was also compulsory for the couple to feel filthy and disgusted with even that legalised action... Ok it was a dirty job, but someone had to do it in order that man should survive... That situation was what made kids seem young and innocent longer... Many, many, years ago before the law makers cut loose... kids matured a lot earlier than they do now, cos nobody told them not to.
Ok that's nature, and the likely effects on this randy lucky little sod out of the way.
Now this teacher... Sack the filthy horny bitch... put her on the sex offenders register so she can never get a teaching job again... Then send her over here, No!! stop it pops... Ok maybe she never hurt anyone, but she has betrayed her position of trust, and she has broken the law of the land... she needs to be punished and a message sent out to others in her kind of position, and of course the public in general... Also whether you agree with them or not, laws are law and should be adhered to.
As darling Perdita has pointed out, in the light of other sex offence cases, what should her prison term be... I for one would not support a 15 yr sentence when child rapists are walking free after a couple of years... When rapists of legal age females are walking free because it was proved in court the victim wasn't a virgin and therfore asking to be raped... I think her banishment from teaching and embarrassment of being a registered sex offender will be plenty good enough to start with... plus maybe 18 months inside as a wake up call.
pops UK angle on it all.
Having been a 14 yr old boy... a very long time ago... I can say with almost certain confidence that this young chap won't wind up in a long sleeved jacket babbling incoherently as a result of this episode... more likely he'll have a hell of a lot of beer paid for on the strength of the story over the years... He will no doubt have regrets... regrets that his bloody stupid cousin had to go and tell on them and put a stop to his fun.
Mind you I'm looking at this from a European viewpoint... where sexual taboo's are a little more relaxed at times... and where in several states and countries the legal age of sexual maturity is actually 14... in a couple as low as 13... A 14 yr old is in no way treated as a minor... young adult being more the term... Hell in some places a 14 yr old virgin is as rare as rocking horse shit.
Let's not scream it's against nature either cos it isn't... nature has even lower age restraints... If 14 yr old boys weren't meant to have sex, they wouldn't be able to get a hard-on... As a lot of you girls are fully aware, girls actually mature earlier than boys in most cases, mentally and physically... A lot of people say, "wow kids are maturing earlier these days", they aren't, they are just reverting to the natural state.
Many years ago before the sexual revolution of the 60's and 70's started bringing this natural act of passion into the public eye a lot more... sex was an almost universal taboo imposed on the masses by the ruling few who knew best law makers... even sex between adults was only permitted if they were married by the church... and then only in a darkened room for reproduction purposes... It was also compulsory for the couple to feel filthy and disgusted with even that legalised action... Ok it was a dirty job, but someone had to do it in order that man should survive... That situation was what made kids seem young and innocent longer... Many, many, years ago before the law makers cut loose... kids matured a lot earlier than they do now, cos nobody told them not to.
Ok that's nature, and the likely effects on this randy lucky little sod out of the way.
Now this teacher... Sack the filthy horny bitch... put her on the sex offenders register so she can never get a teaching job again... Then send her over here, No!! stop it pops... Ok maybe she never hurt anyone, but she has betrayed her position of trust, and she has broken the law of the land... she needs to be punished and a message sent out to others in her kind of position, and of course the public in general... Also whether you agree with them or not, laws are law and should be adhered to.
As darling Perdita has pointed out, in the light of other sex offence cases, what should her prison term be... I for one would not support a 15 yr sentence when child rapists are walking free after a couple of years... When rapists of legal age females are walking free because it was proved in court the victim wasn't a virgin and therfore asking to be raped... I think her banishment from teaching and embarrassment of being a registered sex offender will be plenty good enough to start with... plus maybe 18 months inside as a wake up call.
pops UK angle on it all.
