An editor really does make a difference

[sr71plt]

Thanks, Rob.

Oh - but be careful about invoking that name. Competition against Word is dangerous. Microsoft has spies everywhere . . .

This obsession of yours (and a few others) for me is touching--and a bit touched, I might add. Looking for any chance of an "evil intent" interpretation you can put on one of my posts and pouncing from out of the blue. Can't imagine what you find so threatening. But it's certainly amusing.

No, I don't think Word is wonderful--just after editing nearly 140 book manuscripts for publishers (and innumerable shorter works), I've yet to get a project that wasn't in Word and on a PC. Both my MAC and my WordPerfect bit the dust from nonuse years ago. This gives me a pretty good signal of the best program/platform for me to use in writing for publication.

And I, at least, remember that the original problem posed was one of nonconnection on computer programs being used. I think my suggestions for avoiding that in the future were both helpful and well meaning (as did the person I was addressing--or at least that's what he said here. But perhaps he just didn't get the memo from "the regulars.").

 

[Guest]

This obsession of yours (and a few others) for me is touching--and a bit touched, I might add. Looking for any chance of an "evil intent" interpretation you can put on one of my posts and pouncing from out of the blue. Can't imagine what you find so threatening. But it's certainly amusing.

No, I don't think Word is wonderful--just after editing nearly 140 book manuscripts for publishers (and innumerable shorter works), I've yet to get a project that wasn't in Word and on a PC. Both my MAC and my WordPerfect bit the dust from nonuse years ago. This gives me a pretty good signal of the best program/platform for me to use in writing for publication.

And I, at least, remember that the original problem posed was one of nonconnection on computer programs being used. I think my suggestions for avoiding that in the future were both helpful and well meaning (as did the person I was addressing--or at least that's what he said here. But perhaps he just didn't get the memo from "the regulars.").

What are you talking about?

You were not mentioned in my post. The word I posted in white was Microsoft, smart guy. Highlight it and you'll see.

Wow.

Who is the obsessed one around here?

 

[Stella_Omega]

If I may interject-- OpenOffice works very well, translates all Microsoft documents without trouble and is a free download; http://www.openoffice.org/

Also, for those of us who have gmail accounts-- I have been using googledocs in preference to any of the word processors on my mac. You can do a great deal of editing, notation, highlighting, insert comments. You can upload pretty much any type of text file from your computer, and download it in a number of formats. You can invite people to view or collaborate, your choice. It ain't perfect yet, but one of the most fun things about it is two or more people can work on a document at once-- in realtime.

 

[sr71plt]

What are you talking about?

You were not mentioned in my post. The word I posted in white was Microsoft, smart guy. Highlight it and you'll see.

Wow.

Who is the obsessed one around here?

Talkin bout you, sweets, talkin bout me. All that bile for little ole me.

Have a nice evening.

By the way, read a couple of the stories you identified as going over 100 votes. Nice vignettes; pretty good writing. I can see why they were well-voted over the years they've been up.

 

[Guest]

If I may interject-- OpenOffice works very well, translates all Microsoft documents without trouble and is a free download; http://www.openoffice.org/

Also, for those of us who have gmail accounts-- I have been using googledocs in preference to any of the word processors on my mac. You can do a great deal of editing, notation, highlighting, insert comments. You can upload pretty much any type of text file from your computer, and download it in a number of formats. You can invite people to view or collaborate, your choice. It ain't perfect yet, but one of the most fun things about it is two or more people can work on a document at once-- in realtime.

I love googles docs!

I agree it is not perfect but I'm loving the possibilities.

 

[sr71plt]

If I may interject-- OpenOffice works very well, translates all Microsoft documents without trouble and is a free download; http://www.openoffice.org/

ConversionPlus works real well too--but with either one, you need to know that one of you has conversion capability or you have the problem originally posted here. It's iffier to convert from WordPerfect or Works to Word or vice versa. Stuff gets lost and/or corrupted. It's not trustworthy when file integrity is important.

 

[Stella_Omega]

ConversionPlus works real well too--but with either one, you need to know that one of you has conversion capability or you have the problem originally posted here. It's iffier to convert from WordPerfect or Works to Word or vice versa. Stuff gets lost and/or corrupted. It's not trustworthy when file integrity is important.

I think OpO works pretty well.

 

[cantdog]

I saw the same thing as sarahh. There was a strong taste of 'there's only one way to write' in your post to cant. With a fillip of 'If you don't, suffer the consequences' at the end.

I don't have Word, and I don't intend to. I've been published with little problem. My editors just send me a pdf file and it has all the change tracks in it. I send files as rtf which is readable by a lot more programs than Word. Hell, Word often can't read Word files since Microsoft changes the format every couple of years. Like crack dealers they like to keep you addicted.

As I told you, I had two such programs, and neither could read the file. Strange choice for a standard.

 

[cantdog]

If I may interject-- OpenOffice works very well, translates all Microsoft documents without trouble and is a free download; http://www.openoffice.org/

Also, for those of us who have gmail accounts-- I have been using googledocs in preference to any of the word processors on my mac. You can do a great deal of editing, notation, highlighting, insert comments. You can upload pretty much any type of text file from your computer, and download it in a number of formats. You can invite people to view or collaborate, your choice. It ain't perfect yet, but one of the most fun things about it is two or more people can work on a document at once-- in realtime.

You say 'translates,' Stella. What does it translate them to? Or does it merely read them?

 

[Stella_Omega]

You say 'translates,' Stella. What does it translate them to? Or does it merely read them?

You can open, read and edit Microsoft documents in open office, and you can save as a microsoft doc. Also, you can-- I think-- open a MSWord doc in googledocs, and --I think-- read the tracked changes. Most of them, anyway. Maybe.

 

[Guest]

You can open, read and edit Microsoft documents in open office, and you can save as a microsoft doc. Also, you can-- I think-- open a MSWord doc in googledocs, and --I think-- read the tracked changes. Most of them, anyway. Maybe.

It will even open Word Perfect documents if you've saved them in a text format.

Amazing stuff.

 

[sr71plt]

As I told you, I had two such programs, and neither could read the file. Strange choice for a standard.

I thought what you were saying was that they used Word tracking change and you couldn't use that because you weren't using Word. (Which is an upfront communications problem on how to mark the editing; it's not a technical "failure.") And, in contrast to what was assumed by a couple others who wanted to see a hard answer, I didn't say you had to use Word with tracking change and nothing else (although I suggested you'd save headaches by getting it and learning to use it)--I actually gave you an alternative way of getting the job done if you didn't have program compatibilities but still could e-mail each other. This after the barn door closed, however (which was when the problem was posed here).

That said, neither publishers nor freelance editors keep up with the Microsoft "advances." They can't afford to reprogram that fast. I recently bought Word 2007 and put it into my computer and, sadly, found that it couldn't/wouldn't (probably by Microsoft design) read any of the Word files being sent to me (some in Word 97). It didn't "offer" the step-up feature in opening files. So Word 2007 sits in my main computer just waiting for a day when it actually works for my publisher/author clients.

The publishing world had the same "can't keep up" problem with floppy disks. Mac decided on their own that no one uses them and stopped putting them in their computers--what, 5 years ago?--and then PCs followed suit. Well, we still use them in publishing and are only slowly moving to other storage systems. I have to have a separate floppy disk attachment on all of my computers to be able to keep in business.

One of my main publisher clients--one where I work in-house part of the time--hasn't progressed beyond WordPerfect Mac 5.0 equivalent in what it needs to feed into its book-setting production program. It does all of its work with authors in World 97 PC and then converts it get the production program to take it (and then has to proof everything an extra time at the other end to find all of the mistakes that have been introduced by conversion).

Hell, I still work with an author who turns her manuscript into her publisher in longhand on yellow legal pads--and they take it that way because she's one of their bread and butter authors.

This thread, though, does go back to communications up front on who will/can use what. The original problem wasn't just a technical one.

 

[sr71plt]

You can open, read and edit Microsoft documents in open office, and you can save as a microsoft doc. Also, you can-- I think-- open a MSWord doc in googledocs, and --I think-- read the tracked changes. Most of them, anyway. Maybe.

Then it clearly beats ConversionsPlus, because it's free and CP will corrupt most of the tracking change stuff in conversion.

But, going back to the thrust of the original thread, whatever you use needs to be something you have and have coordinated with the person on the other end that you're going to use.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I ...One of my main publisher clients--one where I work in-house part of the time--hasn't progressed beyond WordPerfect Mac 5.0 equivalent in what it needs to feed into its book-setting production program. It does all of its work with authors in World 97 PC and then converts it get the production program to take it (and then has to proof everything an extra time at the other end to find all of the mistakes that have been introduced by conversion).

Hell, I still work with an author who turns her manuscript into her publisher in longhand on yellow legal pads--and they take it that way because she's one of their bread and butter authors.
...

Gotta love it!

What is the production program they use?

I used Quark for years and years-- both for my freelance lay-out jobs and as my basic word processor. I can't afford it, now, and I miss it.

 

[cantdog]

You can open, read and edit Microsoft documents in open office, and you can save as a microsoft doc. Also, you can-- I think-- open a MSWord doc in googledocs, and --I think-- read the tracked changes. Most of them, anyway. Maybe.

That redline thing may be a bit too much, then. I know WordPerfect will attempt to save things in Word format, and xywrite, and Wordstar, all in various versions. But those features (which Word will also attempt to do) are unreliable as to formatting. Even plain ass paragraphing will be altered, let alone really complex stuff, like newsletter boxes and columns. A person has to go over the converted documents and fix things like hyphenation, indenting, and such. BUT at least you get to read the converted documents!

Thanks for the information. My workplace doesn't have Word, now, either, and the state organization has some officials who don't fucking seem to get it, any more than the Señor did. I tell the assholes dozens of times "I got your poster, but it's a Word file. I can't read Word files. You should know that I can't possibly print copies of your poster." And the asses send another one the next time.

Something that could help with that would be very useful.

 

[sr71plt]

Gotta love it!

What is the production program they use?

I used Quark for years and years-- both for my freelance lay-out jobs and as my basic word processor. I can't afford it, now, and I miss it.

Beats me. God knows I asked, but no one was able to figure out what it was and why it worked like it did--just that it worked without repair for the last twenty years, so they weren't taking chances with it (and claimed they couldn't afford to retool). A major academic press churning out 80 books a year.

I substituted for their managing editor three months this year and fed a Word file into it without them noticing and it worked--but they still didn't change what they were doing. Yes, though, it is Quarked--in Mac--before it gets sit in whatever this equipment does.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Then it clearly beats ConversionsPlus, because it's free and CP will corrupt most of the tracking change stuff in conversion.

But, going back to the thrust of the original thread, whatever you use needs to be something you have and have coordinated with the person on the other end that you're going to use.

yep, communicatoin is the key-- and cantdog, in his very first post on the topic, says quite clearly that the problem was communication;

"...We had sent six emails back and forth over a period of many days before I sent her the file, because I had to make absolutely certain that she understood I don't own Word and can't read Word files, and that she could read rich text files all right..."

 

[sr71plt]

Thanks for the information. My workplace doesn't have Word, now, either, and the state organization has some officials who don't fucking seem to get it, any more than the Señor did. I tell the assholes dozens of times "I got your poster, but it's a Word file. I can't read Word files. You should know that I can't possibly print copies of your poster." And the asses send another one the next time.

Something that could help with that would be very useful.

I can hear the howls start up again, but the answer to that is that Word, in fact, is taken as the standard in publishing, and those folks are thinking that you are the "asshole" and can't get with the standard.

I know this starts up the letters from "the regulars" all over again, but there you have it. You against the world. That may not make you an "asshole," but it doesn't make them ones either, really--they are the ones working to standard. The world assures them they aren't the problem.

 

[Stella_Omega]

It's worth it to download OpO and try it out. There's a learning curve, of course, especially if you haven't used Works-- and if you have, not everything works the same way.

Although OpO claims to be cross platform, it doesn't work all that well on macs. For mac users, NeoOffice is another freeware, and it's written mac native.

 

[cantdog]

It's worth it to download OpO and try it out. There's a learning curve, of course, especially if you haven't used Works-- and if you have, not everything works the same way.

Although OpO claims to be cross platform, it doesn't work all that well on macs. For mac users, NeoOffice is another freeware, and it's written mac native.

I'm actually going to buy a Mac laptop for my next computer. I been bitching about MS all this time, and I'm taking the plunge. There are a lot fewer games, they tell me, but nowadays I don't game much on the things. OS X is fuckin Unix! What more do you want? It ought to take to the 'net like butta. I'm going for it.

I used to like PCs because they let you have some control, but they have stopped letting you in, now. They are deliberately secretive and opaque. They 'update' themselves, now, behind your back without a by-your-leave, so you have no idea what the OS is like after six months. Fuck MS.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I'm actually going to buy a Mac laptop for my next computer. I been bitching about MS all this time, and I'm taking the plunge. There are a lot fewer games, they tell me, but nowadays I don't game much on the things. OS X is fuckin Unix! What more do you want? It ought to take to the 'net like butta. I'm going for it.

I used to like PCs because they let you have some control, but they have stopped letting you in, now. They are deliberately secretive and opaque. They 'update' themselves, now, behind your back without a by-your-leave, so you have no idea what the OS is like after six months. Fuck MS.

the problem with mac is the fucking high price of the things. I really need a laptop, and it will have to be MS. I can't spend the money on any decent notebook--I can get twice as much for half the price.

 

[cantdog]

There you go again, srplt. Me against the world, you say. I said it was my workplace computer which didn't have Word now. Nothing to do with me, except incidentally. Where they were asses? I told them flatly their communication had failed. They changed nothing. If they intend communication, they should start by listening. I recommend that to you as well.

What I did with their posters was to extract the text from the documents, by bringing them up in a text-only editor. Then I cheerfully designed a poster around the text content. I had fun doing it, but it shouldn't have been necessary. And, as I say, if they really desired me to print their poster, they would have done something to make it possible. Mailing me a printed copy would work. I have a copy machine.

 

[sr71plt]

There you go again, srplt. Me against the world, you say. I said it was my workplace computer which didn't have Word now. Nothing to do with me, except incidentally. Where they were asses? I told them flatly their communication had failed. They changed nothing. If they intend communication, they should start by listening. I recommend that to you as well.

What I did with their posters was to extract the text from the documents, by bringing them up in a text-only editor. Then I cheerfully designed a poster around the text content. I had fun doing it, but it shouldn't have been necessary. And, as I say, if they really desired me to print their poster, they would have done something to make it possible. Mailing me a printed copy would work. I have a copy machine.

The "you" is your system, not you personally. You had said this was the system you were given. But it also is a little (no, a lot) extreme to be calling them assholes, isn't it, when they also are working with the systems they are given to work with--with the difference being that the systems they are working with are the standard and yours aren't? If they can only afford one system, why are they assholes for buying the standard system? Where's the difference between them and you that makes them assholes?

I know the Internet is where people come to rant and to have people agree with them simply because they are all posting to the same chat board, but I think calling them assholes for being in the same bind you are--except more up-to-date in what they have--is a little unreasonable and sort of useless, as the world isn't going to volunteer to revolve around you. (And, no, it doesn't revolve around me either.)

In all you've posted on this thread you've just seemed to be blaming the problems you have on everyone else--with, surprise, no effect on your problem. *Shrug*

Guess when your problems posted here are going to be fixed.

 

[knitedreams]

I'm actually going to buy a Mac laptop for my next computer. I been bitching about MS all this time, and I'm taking the plunge. There are a lot fewer games, they tell me, but nowadays I don't game much on the things. OS X is fuckin Unix! What more do you want? It ought to take to the 'net like butta. I'm going for it.

I used to like PCs because they let you have some control, but they have stopped letting you in, now. They are deliberately secretive and opaque. They 'update' themselves, now, behind your back without a by-your-leave, so you have no idea what the OS is like after six months. Fuck MS.

I converted to a Mac a few months ago because I didn't want to deal with that stupid Vista (I need my iPod!!!). I absolutely love it and will most likely not go back to PC. You can get the Mac version of Microsoft Office. Word for Mac is much better than Word for PC, in my opinion. If you still don't want to deal with Word, I highly recommend Pages that comes with iWork. It opens everything including Word documents. I hear it's good with editing, but I haven't tried it yet.

 

[Guest]

Talkin bout you, sweets, talkin bout me. All that bile for little ole me.

Have a nice evening.

By the way, read a couple of the stories you identified as going over 100 votes. Nice vignettes; pretty good writing. I can see why they were well-voted over the years they've been up.

Thank you.