Amtrack

[SINthysist]

Does it affect your life? Do you care if it goes? Should it be privatized? It means nothing out here except we can see some more tax dollars being siphoned off very soon this week. I'd write a letter, but I'm saving to buy stamps...

 

[WriterDom]

Fuck Amtrack. They lose a billion dollars a year. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. There are a few routes in the northeast that are profitable. Open them up to private bids. Let Amtrack die along with the pony express, 8 track tapes, and the slide rule.

 

[bored1]

Fuck Amtrack. They lose a billion dollars a year. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. There are a few routes in the northeast that are profitable. Open them up to private bids. Let Amtrack die along with the pony express, 8 track tapes, and the slide rule.

LOL Now if they would take a look at the Postal Service! They lost 3Billion last year,and what do they do? Raise their rates . I want to manage a business like that. Lose money, we dont care. We answer to no one.

 

[Etoile]

I ride Amtrak fairly frequently to visit friends in Manhattan; it's really the best way to get between here (DC) and there - that would be the most profitable Northeast route. So yes, I would care a lot if it went away...and we can't just say "fuck Amtrak" because there is nothing to replace it. When it was created, it absorbed almost all the local railroad companies, and now there are none left. I was hoping it could work as a semi-private organization, but obviously that's not going to happen, so I would definitely like to see it privatized to keep it from going away.

If it goes, though, it's going soon. I took my usual trip to NYC this past weekend, and overheard a conductor talking with a woman who apparently rides every three or four weeks for something. As he finished the conversation, he said "okay, well, see you next time, if we're still running." If they are going to figure something out, they better hurry up.

 

[Etoile]

LOL Now if they would take a look at the Postal Service! They lost 3Billion last year,and what do they do? Raise their rates . I want to manage a business like that. Lose money, we dont care. We answer to no one.

Amtrak is raising rates too. I noticed the price for an off-peak DC-to-NYC ticket went up a dollar a year or two ago, and suddenly it's gone up something like four or six dollars.

As for the postal service, well, they're losing a lot of revenue to the Internet. Amtrak doesn't have that excuse.

 

[perks]

I remember taking the Montrealer from Philly up to Vermont When I was in College. It was a great experience, awesome memories.

The problem is going to be with commuters. I mean what about NYC? So many people rely on Amtrack to get to their jobs.

Privatize, but keep the routes open.

Everyone is bitching about ecology and then they talk about closing down an Institution that helps people get where they need to go and keeps plenty of cars off the road and emissions lower than they would be.

Shutting down Amtrack might be great for that company, but it won't be great for the commuters or our lungs in the long run.

 

[Etoile]

The problem is going to be with commuters. I mean what about NYC? So many people rely on Amtrack to get to their jobs.

In the NYC area there are actually several alternatives to Amtrak. PATH and NJ Transit are popular, people also take Metro North and sometimes even SEPTA from Pennsylvania. It would be a big hassle for them to change, but it's the slightly longer distance people (Boston to NYC, DC to NYC) I think would really be affected.

 

[perks]

In the NYC area there are actually several alternatives to Amtrak. PATH and NJ Transit are popular, people also take Metro North and sometimes even SEPTA from Pennsylvania. It would be a big hassle for them to change, but it's the slightly longer distance people (Boston to NYC, DC to NYC) I think would really be affected.

And I am such a nitpicker...but please, people, it's Amtrak! No c. (I know, I'm too picky. )

I know there are alternatives. I lived there for 7 years. However, can you imagine cutting out Amtrack? The overcrowding of the other systems, the delays. I mean how many people commute with Amtrack in NYC, you're talk a huge influx into the other choices. It will be horrible.

 

[alildevilish]

It affects me

I ride the train every week. I have a rail pass right now that I have to use up... I hope they dont go out of business or at least my route... were a busy route...

 

[WriterDom]

Like I said, some of the routes can be profitable. Instead of pouring billions into Amtrak, the money could be diverted to help private companies with start up costs. How much sense does it make to run a train from Ca to FL when Amtrak loses 347 dollars a passenger?

Would you be willing to drive someone 3000 miles if they paid you $400 and you knew your costs were going to be 747? Would you buy a bus so you could carry more? Or how about a train, then you could really lose a lot of money?

 

[perks]

Like I said, some of the routes can be profitable. Instead of pouring billions into Amtrak, the money could be diverted to help private companies with start up costs. How much sense does it make to run a train from Ca to FL when Amtrak loses 347 dollars a passenger?

Would you be willing to drive someone 3000 miles if they paid you $400 and you knew your costs were going to be 747? Would you buy a bus so you could carry more? Or how about a train, then you could really lose a lot of money?

your logic isn't at question here, although, if a cab is going somewhere the price is X amount, do you charge passengers a b c and d each x amount or charge them fractions of x. Your analogy was off. Even though I understand your point.

The problem with Amtrack is they're not just talking about shutting down the routes that don't make money. There is a bigger picture here than just the lack of monetary intake.

 

[TWB]

Like I said, some of the routes can be profitable. Instead of pouring billions into Amtrak, the money could be diverted to help private companies with start up costs. How much sense does it make to run a train from Ca to FL when Amtrak loses 347 dollars a passenger?

Would you be willing to drive someone 3000 miles if they paid you $400 and you knew your costs were going to be 747? Would you buy a bus so you could carry more? Or how about a train, then you could really lose a lot of money?

Hmm, Why should we put any money into the national highway system when it costs billions and billions of taxpayer dollars? Maybe we should scrap it and just give GM & Ford a billion or two and let them continue to maintain it, develop it, and charge people to drive on it.

Privatizing certain things makes no sense. Amtrack is one of those things.

 

[desert spike]

Transportation is inheritly a government function to help our modern society achieve and maintain a properous economy. People and goods have to move about this country. There are lots of modes of transportion for sure, some are profitable other will not be. Amtrak has both types of routes. so what if they loose a few billion. We are spending nearly 300 billion (and climing) on national defense. Spending a few billion on mass train travel is worth it to keep ecomony humming along and mass transit helps environment.

 

[perks]

Well said, TWB and desert spike!

 

[Guest]

It will affect my life. Amtrack has been my bridge from one family in NC to my other in NJ for 4 years, now.

It's all about priorities. And, I guess I don't get how one crisis is more important than another. Desert spike hit the nail on the head.

 

[markb325]

Transportation is inheritly a government function to help our modern society achieve and maintain a properous economy. People and goods have to move about this country. There are lots of modes of transportion for sure, some are profitable other will not be. Amtrak has both types of routes. so what if they loose a few billion. We are spending nearly 300 billion (and climing) on national defense. Spending a few billion on mass train travel is worth it to keep ecomony humming along and mass transit helps environment.

DS,

Your anology is a little skewed here. The military was never designed to make money where as Amtrack was. Although I do not want to see rail travel die I would like to see other options besides more federal dollars being spent. The arguements for keeping it federalized or pirvitation are excellant on both sides, but there is a reason why rail companies ceased passenger service. It was no longer profitable. Rail freight is just now getting back on its feet so to say. Given time Passeger service may do the same.

As far as spending money to keep the econmony humming along. That is fine if the money spent for a service that is suppose to make money increases instead of disappearing into a hole.

For a final statement like I said I do not wish for Passenger rail to vanish and would love to see options to keep it a float. This has to do with the fact that I am an avid railfan.

 

[perks]

As far as spending money to keep the econmony humming along. That is fine if the money spent for a service that is suppose to make money increases instead of disappearing into a hole.

amtrack in itself might be a hole, however, that it brings employees to workplaces that aren't holes is the reason for it's necessity and thus the reason, gov't resources will be sunk into it.

As you said, rail freight is making a comeback, shouldn't we float passenger amtrack, until it makes a stronger showing. It is a support of our economy indirectly.

 

[TWB]

DS,

Your anology is a little skewed here. The military was never designed to make money where as Amtrack was. Although I do not want to see rail travel die I would like to see other options besides more federal dollars being spent. The arguements for keeping it federalized or pirvitation are excellant on both sides, but there is a reason why rail companies ceased passenger service. It was no longer profitable. Rail freight is just now getting back on its feet so to say. Given time Passeger service may do the same.

Who says it has to make money? By having a public transportation system that favors the automobile, do we "make" money? No, of course not. It allows others to make money, though. We subsidise all kinds of transportation. Rail is the black sheep because the auto industry wants you to think that it is somehow different than rail. Would you buy a car if you only had dirt roads to run on? No. Roads are a big fat subsidy for the auto industry. Why not rail?

Pollutes less
Faster for long distances
You can drink or have sex while driving.

 

[Skibum]

When it costs more to travel by train than it does to travel by air, it is time to let the rail line die. Amtrak has never been able to wean themselves off the public dole, and it should just go away and let someone else take a crack at making rail travel economical.

The same should happen to PBS.

 

[teddybear4play]

If you ask me, they should EXPAND small-distance commuter train services to take some of the heat off the airlines. If you want to go from DC to NYC, or Chicago to Detroit, or LA to San Francisco, you ought to be able to take a high-speed train to get there and not have to sit at an airport.

But transcontinental rail travel will likely never be profitable anymore. Let it die.

TB4p

 

[Guest]

When it costs more to travel by train than it does to travel by air, it is time to let the rail line die. Amtrak has never been able to wean themselves off the public dole, and it should just go away and let someone else take a crack at making rail travel economical.

The same should happen to PBS.

It has never costed me more to ride the train. In fact, it has been less of cost, more dependable, and a more pleasant experience- for myself.

And, not that every single soul in this country is your responsibility- but, there are those that are unable to fly for whatever reason. I would hate to see folks stop travelling due to this situation.

 

[RhumbRunner13]

TWB.......

Who says it has to make money? By having a public transportation system that favors the automobile, do we "make" money? No, of course not. It allows others to make money, though. We subsidise all kinds of transportation. Rail is the black sheep because the auto industry wants you to think that it is somehow different than rail. Would you buy a car if you only had dirt roads to run on? No. Roads are a big fat subsidy for the auto industry. Why not rail?

Pollutes less
Faster for long distances
You can drink or have sex while driving.

You might be interested to know that the Interstate Highway system has returned $6 for every dollar spent on it. That doesn't take into acount the hundreds of thousands of lives that have been saved or the millions of hours of productive time.

Public transportation should only be provided where public demand is great enough to fully support it.

Rhumb

 

[Guest]

DS,

Your anology is a little skewed here. The military was never designed to make money where as Amtrack was.



The Federal highway system was never designed to be profitable either, but the trucking industry benefitted tremendously. The american economy and people benefitted imeasurably. It has been financed through taxation because it was deemed a high priority for military and commercial reasons. My analogy was right on. I was making a point on priority and need not one of pure capitalism, ie, profit/loss.

Isn't government here to exist where commercial processes can not be fully successful. Like can't turn a profit, but the service it provides in necessary to make society function efficiently. IMHO, that's exactly why government exists, to fill that void. Yes it takes taxation. I don't like to pay taxes either and I bitch every 4/15. And I don't agree with all the federal/state/local government allocates their taxation resources. But, I see value in Amtrac. Mass transit systems are needed because our roads, highways, airways can not support the whole load.

That is fine if the money spent for a service that is suppose to make money increases instead of disappearing into a hole. The world is not black and white like profit we do, not profit we don't do.

 

[TWB]

Re: TWB.......

You might be interested to know that the Interstate Highway system has returned $6 for every dollar spent on it. That doesn't take into acount the hundreds of thousands of lives that have been saved or the millions of hours of productive time.

Public transportation should only be provided where public demand is great enough to fully support it.

Rhumb

Whose statistics are those? Who has this $6 been returned to? How many lives have been lost on the interstate highway system? Where does that statistic come from? Saved lives??

 

[RhumbRunner13]

TWB.....

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Without a first class system of interstate highways, life in America would be far different --- it would be more risky, less prosperous, and lacking in the efficiency and comfort that Americans now enjoy and take for granted. People would be crowded into more densely packed inner cities, intercity travel would occur less often and be more cumbersome; freight charges would be higher and, as a consequence, so would prices. Vacation travel would be more restricted.
The Dwight D. Eisenhower System of Interstate and Defense Highways is in place and celebrating its 40th anniversary, must surely be the best investment a nation ever made. Consider this:
• It has enriched the quality of life for virtually every American.
• It has saved the lives of at least 187,000 people.
• It has prevented injuries to nearly 12 million people.
• It has returned more than $6 in economic productivity for each $1 it cost.
• It has positioned the nation for improved international competitiveness.
• It has permitted the cherished freedom of personal mobility to flourish.
• It has enhanced international security.
It is not an exaggeration, but a simple statement of fact, that the interstate highway system is an engine that has driven 40 years of unprecedented prosperity and positioned the United States to remain the world's pre-eminent power into the 21st century.

http://www.publicpurpose.com/freeway1.htm#exec

Rhumb