Ambivalent after humiliation play?

[AAkasha]

I've had encounters with male subs that have a real love/hate relationship with humiliation. During the act, they are disgusted with themselves and have to be pushed/led through it. Afterward, they get moody and confused. Sure enough, though, the next day they think it was the hottest thing ever and can't wait to do it again.

It really messed with my confidence and headspace when I had subs acting terribly confused and regretful for what they had experienced. I learned that for some it's a process they go through, and that it always ends up ok. However, I always have to be careful with humiliation whores who are newbies because they don't know what hit them.

Subs who are into hardcore humiliation, how do you deal with your ambivalence? Are there acts you crave, but when it is happening, you need to be forced, only to find out later that you could have handled even more?

Akasha

 

[jwolff]

Perhaps I’m not the right one to answer, I’ve never felt disgusted with myself, during or afterwards, though I have needed to be coaxed and pushed. Since discovering my “humiliation fetish” my gf has pushed and led me through several very humiliating situations.
When it’s happening I’m dealing with thoughts of saying no, refusing, leaving the room. I don’t crave the situations she sets up, I don’t ask her set something up. When she surprises me with a situation a feeling of dread sweeps over me, I wish I had told her not to do this anymore, but I still haven’t said no.

 

[TinyDancerGirl]

it's a hard one...

Subs who are into hardcore humiliation, how do you deal with your ambivalence? Are there acts you crave, but when it is happening, you need to be forced, only to find out later that you could have handled even more?

Akasha

i have to be forced into it... afterwards i hate it as soon as i get cuddles i love it and want more... i think as long as i get the reassurance i'm fine with it...
ah. that don't help does it...

 

[Pure]

to ms akasha,

Subs who are into hardcore humiliation, how do you deal with your ambivalence? Are there acts you crave, but when it is happening, you need to be forced, only to find out later that you could have handled even more?

any ambivalence is the client's responsibility, since he or she accepted the episode to begin with. there will always be ambivalence since, at least in the foresable future, there is a part of self there, saying, as it were, 'i'm worth something.'

yes, 'force' is appropriate and probably ultimately desired provided one is voluntarily present in the setting and has indicated an overall commitment to or acceptance its structure and events. iow, as long as the bottom wasn't kidnapped, s/he, once generally informed, takes what the person/place has to offer.

i don't think one knows what one can handle ahead of time. so it is clearly a mistake if the top simply takes the bottom's opinions on these matters as any type of rule.

i'm not sure if this answers the questions, but it indirectly addresses your statement:

It really messed with my confidence and headspace when I had subs acting terribly confused and regretful for what they had experienced. I learned that for some it's a process they go through, and that it always ends up ok. However, I always have to be careful with humiliation whores who are newbies because they don't know what hit them

i don't think you should let a sub's 'confusion' undermine your confidence. it's a compliment, as it were, to your power. it's the same as if they go to one of those 'paintball' recreation areas and pay to be involved: if they get a few surprises and take some stinging hits, that's part of the scene.

[revised, 7-18]

 

[saw_man1]

Not exactly on subject but

This thread brought to mind a series of articles by one of my favorite writers, Tristan Taormino. She has a column in the Village Voice which I never miss.
Do read them if you have the time. I think most will find them enlightening.

Loving Humiliation Part 1

Loving Humiliation Part 2

Loving Humiliation Part 3

 

[Pure]

nice links sawman. i've heard of this columnist and she gave the subject a fair --also vivid-- treatment.

 

[s'lara]

i think the ambivalence is a coping mechanism. i can't say i've achieved a level of ambivalence regarding my own desire for heavy humiliation, but i can carry only so much emotional baggage before my back caves.

i can tell You that the desire for, and arousal by, humiliation is rooted in area of self worth and self-assessment of that worth. All the while the humiliation is enacted, the sub has to achieve a level of belief that he/she is deserving of such treatment. This belief directly serves the arousal/satisfaction associated with heavy humiliation. That said, once the arousal/satisfaction is achieved, that belief cannot be, nor should it remain a longlasting headspace. For those who like their humiliation a bit deep, those moments are delicious and if we're not careful, constantly plugging into that feeling can be damaging in the long term. Well, speaking for myself, i believe that to be true.

So, pushing on from the act allows it to remain in that time in space without it hooking into the psyche and planting deep, negative roots. Some of us can move on easily from that space, and some of us can't. i think the shared commanality is the need to disassociate from the negative side of humiliation in order to continue to find enjoyment and fulfillment in being subjected to such treatment. Otherwise, we'd never get up from those depths and might find ourselves wandering down halls of thought that are not in anyway about self-preservation.


In any event, it sounds like You found a way to handle the uncertainty.

lara

 

[subbie_333]

I've had encounters with male subs that have a real love/hate relationship with humiliation. During the act, they are disgusted with themselves and have to be pushed/led through it. Afterward, they get moody and confused. Sure enough, though, the next day they think it was the hottest thing ever and can't wait to do it again.

It really messed with my confidence and headspace when I had subs acting terribly confused and regretful for what they had experienced. I learned that for some it's a process they go through, and that it always ends up ok. However, I always have to be careful with humiliation whores who are newbies because they don't know what hit them.

Subs who are into hardcore humiliation, how do you deal with your ambivalence? Are there acts you crave, but when it is happening, you need to be forced, only to find out later that you could have handled even more?

Akasha

i can't say that i qualify as experienced in "hardcore humiliation", but, i have thought a lot about why i like humiliation. Sometimes i think about it with the desired conclusion as to having a good explanation for a Domme was to why and how i want/need it.

But, i would like to offer up a theory as to what You are talking about. Perhaps these subs are getting *exactly* what they want. They want to feel that confusion, dread, pain, and, loneliness that comes after humiliation. The "idea" is for them to *experience* that real life feeling. The thing is that they were able to do that in the controlled environment of a BDSM scene with a trusted dominant and a safeword. After they have finished with a certain amount of the after-effect, they come out of it feeling exhilarated, especially knowing that there is the "protection" of not having to deal with the real world and a real world humiliation event. Perhaps like feeling a near death experience by riding an amusement park ride.

After rereading this several times, it occurred to me that perhaps that is what many subs feel about the things they crave in a BDSM scene. They get to safely explore scary dangerous painful things in the secure environment provided by a trusted dominant. Perhaps Your experience with the aftermath of humiliation scenes proves that different things result in different feelings, which would be expected.


subbie_333