After the "2nd American Civil War": What then?

[Veroe]

I've seen threads discussing whether or not a 2nd civil war can happen or not, however I haven't really gotten a good sense of what would happen next. The whole concept seems a little weird to me. As much as the US population was divided for the first civil war it wasn't clearly by which side of the overton window you fell on like the 2nd one would be.

So let's get into a hypothetical exercise here. Let's say a 2nd civil war happens and the right wins it. To all those on the right what do you do then? What policies do you put in place? What laws do you enact? What do you do with democrat politicians, democrat donors, democrat voters? What do you do with the democrat party all together? Do you just get rid of it and have only one political party in the US now?

 

[Rightguide]

We have to relegate the Communists in the Democrat Party back into the social closet our grandfathers put them in. Americans writ large are not interested in fundamentally changing their nation into the old Soviet Union. We need a nation wide governmental house cleaning. We have to put teeth in the oath of office that requires government officials to support and defend the Constitution, especially when they don't, or openly refuse to do so.

 

[ll74]

Translation- disregard any form of democracy and dictate.who is allowed to participate.

 

[Sean Renaud]

We have to relegate the Communists in the Democrat Party back into the social closet our grandfathers put them in. Americans writ large are not interested in fundamentally changing their nation into the old Soviet Union. We need a nation wide governmental house cleaning. We have to put teeth in the oath of office that requires government officials to support and defend the Constitution, especially when they don't, or openly refuse to do so.

You realize depending on your age your grandfathers summoned us because the system thre parents and them lived under just wasn't working right?

 

[Veroe]

We have to relegate the Communists in the Democrat Party back into the social closet our grandfathers put them in. Americans writ large are not interested in fundamentally changing their nation into the old Soviet Union. We need a nation wide governmental house cleaning. We have to put teeth in the oath of office that requires government officials to support and defend the Constitution, especially when they don't, or openly refuse to do so.

What does "putting them back into the social closet" mean? What do you with those that you'd put into that "Social closet"? Does that mean prison time? Does it mean reeducation? Does it mean banishment from the country? What does it mean?

 

[oggbashan]

And who are the communists? Back to the McCarthy era when anyone accused of being a communist was one?

Soviet-style Gulags? Chinese reeducation centres.? Or the Final Solution?

The US communists are a myth. How do you eradicate a myth that is only believed in by the extreme Right?

 

[Rightguide]

What does "putting them back into the social closet" mean? What do you with those that you'd put into that "Social closet"? Does that mean prison time? Does it mean reeducation? Does it mean banishment from the country? What does it mean?

No, not at all. It means to expose the dangerous ramifications of their ideas. It means to ridicule their ideas, expose their lies and present the true history of what happens in Totalitarian communist societies. Explain the threat this ideology presents to individual freedom. Just like we'd look askance at a snake oil salesman, and walk away, we need to instinctively do the same when when Marxists attempt to buy our freedom with promises they cannot keep. That is the closet I'm talking about. We need to look at them like we would any other bad idea.

 

[Rightguide]

And who are the communists? Back to the McCarthy era when anyone accused of being a communist was one?

Soviet-style Gulags? Chinese reeducation centres.? Or the Final Solution?

The US communists are a myth. How do you eradicate a myth that is only believed in by the extreme Right?

Don't be an idiot. A communist in anyone proposing and supporting Marxist solutions to economic and social problems. The CPUSA is a fact of life that apparently you are ignorant of. They have infiltrated the Democrat Party. BLM was founded by two self admitted Marxists (Communists). Don't try and piss on our heads and tell us it's raining.

 

[CornusKousa]

I've seen threads discussing whether or not a 2nd civil war can happen or not, however I haven't really gotten a good sense of what would happen next. The whole concept seems a little weird to me. As much as the US population was divided for the first civil war it wasn't clearly by which side of the overton window you fell on like the 2nd one would be.

So let's get into a hypothetical exercise here. Let's say a 2nd civil war happens and the right wins it. To all those on the right what do you do then? What policies do you put in place? What laws do you enact? What do you do with democrat politicians, democrat donors, democrat voters? What do you do with the democrat party all together? Do you just get rid of it and have only one political party in the US now?

Personally no.

I would re-structure the USA and it's government in a way that allowed a lot of the polarizing issues that caused conflict in the first place to be put to rest, live and let live.

Restructure the states along geographical, cultural and political areas that make far more sense than what we have leftover after 245 years of development. I've seen several maps drawn up with different things considered in making them all something worth looking at.

Strip the federal government of most if not all the controversial items back to the newly restructured states. Make the federal government a trade/commerce/currency and defense union. Not a 1 size fits all control freak nanny state.

"The South" can be a religious conservative state, ban abortions, teach their people Jesus rode a T-Rex and the Earth is flat.

The "Pacific Coast" state can disarm everyone, eliminate private property to support their open borders welfare state where nothing is illegal except defending yourself from violent rapist and attackers because violent criminals are a privileged class.

The Northern Rockies and Alaska get to be very libertarian/classical liberal/neo-liberal minimal government states.

And everyone can mind their own fucking bidnizz until we decide that needs to change again.

We have to relegate the Communists in the Democrat Party back into the social closet our grandfathers put them in. Americans writ large are not interested in fundamentally changing their nation into the old Soviet Union. We need a nation wide governmental house cleaning. We have to put teeth in the oath of office that requires government officials to support and defend the Constitution, especially when they don't, or openly refuse to do so.

I understand the sentiment, but the time has passed. They are way to popular... you ready to kill 80+ million people??? That's fucking crazy.

The "progressives" need a place to live just as much as Mormons in Utah.

Give them the left coast and New England where they can "progress" to their hearts content. Show us all how great that open borders welfare nanny state works. Don't want to live in a hyper "progressive" state that forces "equity" at the end of a gun?? Don't live there.

Translation- disregard any form of democracy and dictate.who is allowed to participate.

Like you give a fuck about democracy....LOL

 

[oggbashan]

BLM is NOT a Democrat organisation. Point to any legislation proposed by the Democrats that is Marxist or Communist.

You are chasing shadows.

 

[PaxNurgle]

(Directed at original post)

but...but... You have absolutely no problem of totalitarians, fascists and white nationalist extremists infiltrating the Republican party, however. And those ideas are as un-american as communism and Marxism. Whether you like it or not.

And you have a very warped idea of what communism and Marxism really is. Building infrastructure is NOT Marxism. Health care is not "communism." Public education, public lands and parks, and environmental protections are not "Communism," nor are civil rights- despite what you may wish to believe; like many you simply label things as "Communist" because for whatever reason you don't agree with them. And you also seem to have a very warped idea of what "Following the constitution" is. Guess what...overturning an election and falsely claiming "Fraud" because it didn't go your way, is NOT in the Constitution. (Go re-read it and you'll see.)

Government takeover of private buisnesses, widespread confiscation of private property without compensation, widespread restrictions of personal freedom (this last thing which oddly you seem to support)- THIS is socialism/communism. Only the most extreme Left wing fringe ever advocates these things.

 

[Veroe]

No, not at all. It means to expose the dangerous ramifications of their ideas. It means to ridicule their ideas, expose their lies and present the true history of what happens in Totalitarian communist societies. Explain the threat this ideology presents to individual freedom. Just like we'd look askance at a snake oil salesman, and walk away, we need to instinctively do the same when when Marxists attempt to buy our freedom with promises they cannot keep. That is the closet I'm talking about. We need to look at them like we would any other bad idea.

But you already do that now. Just watch Fox or newsmax or OAN or any number of right wing news sources and that message is being stated 24/7.

Also it seems to me from your statement that the problem you seem to have isn't exactly with the "Snake oil salesmen" but the number of people that find their message appealing.

So fine. Let's say you do that after your victory in the 2nd American Civil War. How do you achieve that? What do you do with liberal media that would give these "Snake oil salesmen" a platform?

 

[CornusKousa]

BLM is NOT a Democrat organisation.

So then why do the Democrats shill for their terrorist activities and why have they adopted their racist bullshit into their official platform??

Riiiight...... and Proud Boys and MAGA are NOT Republican !!!"

https://media3.giphy.com/media/JmsG1PY1K94hyOa1v9/giphy.gif

Point to any legislation proposed by the Democrats that is Marxist or Communist.

You are chasing shadows.[/QUOTE]

Green New Deal, and their official platform.....all about equity, especially racial and economic equity.

 

[CornusKousa]

(Directed at original post)

but...but... You have absolutely no problem of totalitarians, fascists and white nationalist extremists infiltrating the Republican party, however.

Because that's just a "progressive" fantasy... no such thing is actually happening.

 

[Rightguide]

BLM is NOT a Democrat organisation. Point to any legislation proposed by the Democrats that is Marxist or Communist.

You are chasing shadows.

They are a militant arm of the Democrat Party, like the KKK used to be. It wasn't shadows burning down cites, uprooting statues, burning federal court houses, attacking the White House, and killing and maiming Americans all over the country.

Do I have personal knowledge they were Democrats, no, but it was the blue state and federal Democrats who protected them, and are still protecting them. Just a day or so ago, the BLM leader in NYC made a terrorist threat against the city if the Democrat Mayor put police street crime units onto the streets of the city. Why wasn't he immediately arrested by the FBI and investigated by the DOJ joint Terrorism Task Force? Like he would be if he were a right wing white man?

https://nypost.com/2021/11/11/blm-l...reatens-riots-after-sit-down-with-eric-adams/

 

[oggbashan]

...

Green New Deal, and their official platform.....all about equity, especially racial and economic equity.

BLM the organisation is toxic. But Black Lives killed by police when white guys wouldn't have been?

If you don't recognise that being black in America can mean you will be treated unfairly ? You are part of the problem.

Aiming for racial and economic equity is a laudable, but probably unachievable aim. But if it is done by legislation and democratic process, it would make the BLM organisation unnecessary and irrelevant. BLM thrives on the real sense of injustice. Remove that? BLM will be history.

Why shouldn't blacks aim for the American Dream?

 

[pecksniff]

The CPUSA is a fact of life that apparently you are ignorant of. They have infiltrated the Democrat Party.

The CPUSA exists. The Democrat Party does not.

 

[Veroe]

Personally no.

I would re-structure the USA and it's government in a way that allowed a lot of the polarizing issues that caused conflict in the first place to be put to rest, live and let live.

Restructure the states along geographical, cultural and political areas that make far more sense than what we have leftover after 245 years of development. I've seen several maps drawn up with different things considered in making them all something worth looking at.

Strip the federal government of most if not all the controversial items back to the newly restructured states. Make the federal government a trade/commerce/currency and defense union. Not a 1 size fits all control freak nanny state.

"The South" can be a religious conservative state, ban abortions, teach their people Jesus rode a T-Rex and the Earth is flat.

The "Pacific Coast" state can disarm everyone, eliminate private property to support their open borders welfare state where nothing is illegal except defending yourself from violent rapist and attackers because violent criminals are a privileged class.

The Northern Rockies and Alaska get to be very libertarian/classical liberal/neo-liberal minimal government states.

And everyone can mind their own fucking bidnizz until we decide that needs to change again.

Interesting. However I think that sort of decentralization can bring up a whole host of problems that only a one rule for all states approach can effectively deal with. However that may just be because of my "leftist" point of view.

What if the pacific coast makes weed legal but someone there moves to Louisiana where it isn't legal at all?

What if someone who loves owning guns has to move to california where they've banned guns?

What if a pregnant woman from New England moves to Florida that bans abortion, and she doesn't want the baby? I suppose she'll have a road trip to above the mason dixon line. But what if its a ban like the one in Texas now and she has to worry about someone there suing her for getting an abortion?

 

[CornusKousa]

BLM the organisation is toxic. But Black Lives killed by police when white guys wouldn't have been?

What are you even talking about here?

If you don't recognise that being black in America can mean you will be treated unfairly ? You are part of the problem.

Everyone treats everyone differently based on initial impressions.

I'm a 6'4" mutt with tattoos from throat to toes and some gnarly scars.... I scare old ladies and have made small children cry by simply standing in line behind them in public.

People judging you on your appearance is not a "problem" it's just the way shit is.

Aiming for racial and economic equity is a laudable, but probably unachievable aim.

I understand you're a leftist, but a large number of Americans still prefer freedom over equity and consider that commie shit totally un-American.

Considering how horribly bad every attempt to FORCE equity upon a society full of people who aren't actually equals in all ways..... I would say it's not laudable, is an absolutely psychotic goal and will never happen because it ignores human nature.

But if it is done by legislation and democratic process, it would make the BLM organisation unnecessary and irrelevant. BLM thrives on the real sense of injustice. Remove that? BLM will be history.

BLM thrives on feelings and tribalism.... they promote injustice base on racist ideals.

K. Rittenhouse is just the latest in a long list of examples.

Why shouldn't blacks aim for the American Dream?

They should.

But the discrepancy here is what the American Dream is.

American Dream is about life, LIBERTY and the pursuit of happiness.

Life but only as needed, well kept by the state and the pursuit of equity is the Soviet dream.... not the American one.

 

[CornusKousa]

The CPUSA exists. The Democrat Party does not.

Peck always in with the "2+2=600!!!! " delivery.

 

[pecksniff]

Let's say a 2nd civil war happens and the right wins it.

They won't. Redneck Revolt will.

 

[Sean Renaud]

No, not at all. It means to expose the dangerous ramifications of their ideas. It means to ridicule their ideas, expose their lies and present the true history of what happens in Totalitarian communist societies. Explain the threat this ideology presents to individual freedom. Just like we'd look askance at a snake oil salesman, and walk away, we need to instinctively do the same when when Marxists attempt to buy our freedom with promises they cannot keep. That is the closet I'm talking about. We need to look at them like we would any other bad idea.

You would basically have to 1984. Which you've done a damn good job of in this country already. You would have to teach why hospitals to save lives are good once something goes wrong but easy access to prevent bad things is evil. That if you can afford dangerous animals it's your money. If they escape and start breeding people mad choices. They shouldn't have lived so close to your property which could easily be hundreds of miles away.

This is what happens in free countries, this is why eventually every single one of them gets taken over by dictators because it encourages gathering power rather than controling it.

 

[pecksniff]

Peck always in with the "2+2=600!!!! " delivery.

You know there is no "Democrat Party."

 

[LittleDixie]

If there is another Civil War, I will be very sad. The fact that two sides could be so hateful and have drifted so far apart from one another is terrible to witness, and I hope that we can do something to mend this country and find at least a peaceful center - we don't all have to agree, but we can stop short of violence, can't we?

But, if one happens and the Right wins, then I hope that they spend time taking apart the machinery of government. I hope that they start passing laws and taking stands for individual freedoms and personal responsibility and property rights. We need to get back to living and letting people live without trying to control everyone.

I'm not happy being under anyone's control, and I doubt I'll be happier under a Right wing King than a Left wing one. But if we want peaceful co-existence, then we need to maximize freedoms for everyone and destroy as much of the parasitic government as we can, and salt the Earth behind us to prevent it from re-emerging.

 

[oggbashan]

There have been Civil Wars in Europe during the 20th Century. Even now, the scars are still raw and forgiveness is difficult. The Spanish Civil War wrecked Spain for decades and still festers even when most who were involved are long dead.