A woman on top: A Writerly Thread

[angela146]

Consider the role of strong women in our stories...

All too often, if a woman is "on top" in a story, it is usually in the context of a BDSM story, a situation where the man is somehow weak or inexperienced, or a story where the woman uses extraordinary psychological force to "bend" the man.

I find myself guilty of this as much as anyone.

How about if we try writing some stories where a self-confident woman pursues and seduces a strong man without the use of bondage or force, without "taking advantage" of him and without emasculating him.

Can we do it? Shall we do it?

Oh, and let's have some variety in author gender and story perspective. I would love to see a man write one of these from the perspective of the seduced.

 

[Guest]

 

[Boxlicker101]

In most of my stories the woman or women are in charge. Most of them involve meeting for sex and there is only one that is actually seduction, and the seducee is very willing in that one. (I Critique Jennifer). In all of them written in the first person the women set the limits and the men abide by them. Even in role-playing a rape, the women are in charge.

 

[Guest]

I'm not sure of if you're referring to Literotica authors or women when you say "our stories".

If you want to write women as unself-confident and passive, that's fine; lots of women are. It certainly shouldn't be something you should consider "being guilty of". But a lot of female authors write about the sort of woman you describe. At least they have for the last thirty or so years.

Lit authors will write whatever turns them on. I find self-confident women attractive, and, like Box, in most of my stories the women are generally in control. And I've only written one BSDM story.

 

[Boxlicker101]

I think in real life the women set the limits. The men do too, of course, but they will usually do whatever the woman wants to do or is willing to do. If a woman wants to do some specific sex thing, the man with her is usually willing, even eager. I am referring here to equals. A groupie with a rock star or a man committing sexual harassment or a rapist are not equals.

 

[Guest]

giggling just a bit

Sure the gals are in charge!

Why, in porn movies the women make much more than the men!

 

[Guest]

But seriously,

I like the idea.

I have a feeling readers will like it, too. Some men would probably enjoy being pursued!

 

[Boxlicker101]

Re: But seriously,

I like the idea.

I have a feeling readers will like it, too. Some men would probably enjoy being pursued!

I think most men would enjoy it very much. Except for a few highly desirable men, most men are not actually pursued. When I say "pursued", I mean openly pursued. Sometimes a woman might think of herself as pursuing a man but she is so subtle and indirect that he is not aware of it and might ignore her efforts. Nothing against her, it's just that he isn't aware of her interest.

RE: your previous post, I don't know what porn movies have to do with real life but women in the movies get paid more than the men because they are the stars. Most people watching porn movies are men and they watch mostly the women. The men in the shows are not much more than part of the scenery. Necessary, like the bed is necessary, but easily replaceable.

When you said "Sure the gals are in charge!" I get the feeling you are being sarcastic. If this is a reference to my previous post, then yes, the "gals" are in charge. If a man and a woman go out together, it is almost a given that he wants to have sex. If she wants to also, they do. If she doesn't want to, they don't. I am aware that sometimes rape happens but it usually doesn't. If the woman says "No", that stands.

 

[Guest]

No offense intended -

That was meant to be being flippant and silly - not sarcastic.

(I wasn't referring to your post at all, just the topic in general.)

My husband just said that he would be ok with sex anytime. It is usually me that has the final say - LOL

 

[angela146]

If you want to write women as unself-confident and passive, that's fine; lots of women are.

For sure I will continue to do so, but I don't want to be trapped in a rut of doing it all the time.

It certainly shouldn't be something you should consider "being guilty of".

Good point. Maybe I still I find myself "guilty" of a lack of creativity and of making the false assumption that women have to dominate in order to lead.

But a lot of female authors write about the sort of woman you describe. At least they have for the last thirty or so years.

Any recommendations for reading along those lines?

... I find self-confident women attractive, and, like Box, in most of my stories the women are generally in control.

I guess I'm thinking of stories where women "take the lead" without necessarily being in control.

It's one of my personal quirks. I can lead without dominating (and do it easily) in a business situation. I can also do it with my husband. But I have a bit of a blind spot in my writing and even in my extramarital flirtations.

 

[angela146]

Re: Re: But seriously,

I think most men would enjoy it very much. Except for a few highly desirable men, most men are not actually pursued. When I say "pursued", I mean openly pursued. Sometimes a woman might think of herself as pursuing a man but she is so subtle and indirect that he is not aware of it and might ignore her efforts. Nothing against her, it's just that he isn't aware of her interest.

This hits the nail on the head!

I really would like to read, and write, some stories where a woman pursues but is somehow able to thread the line between being too subtle and being overbearing.

 

[angela146]

Re: But seriously,

I like the idea.

I have a feeling readers will like it, too. Some men would probably enjoy being pursued!

And perhaps some of the men will write stories showing us how they want it. If a man were to be pursued, how would he want it to be done?

How would he know that the woman is serious and not just toying with him? How can she be direct without stepping on his ego, or forcing him to set it aside?

 

[angela146]

I think in real life the women set the limits. The men do too, of course, but they will usually do whatever the woman wants to do or is willing to do. If a woman wants to do some specific sex thing, the man with her is usually willing, even eager.

So let's turn it around. Let's write about men who are a bit reluctant and need to be persued for some reason. Perhaps a history of being treated as a "success object" or perhaps he is married and not quite ready to step out on his wife.

Perhaps he finds the woman attractive, desires her, is willing to be seduced by her but wants the chance to be the one whose "yes" is a cherished and desired.

 

[Guest]

angela, I don't know exactly what your taste in fiction is, but I really like the way Margaret Atwood writes some of her women. Her book "The Edible Woman" was written at the end of the 1960's, and, like her next novel "Surfacing", sort of anticipated the feminist movement, without being too "in your face".

I think "taking the lead" is sort of being "in control"; but there again I think I understand your concern that when men think "women in control" they end up with an image that's different from what you're trying to convey.

Sounds like you have a story to write there!

 

[damppanties]

So let's turn it around. Let's write about men who are a bit reluctant and need to be persued for some reason. Perhaps a history of being treated as a "success object" or perhaps he is married and not quite ready to step out on his wife.

Perhaps he finds the woman attractive, desires her, is willing to be seduced by her but wants the chance to be the one whose "yes" is a cherished and desired.

You know, as I read this, I thought about the kind of story this could make and then what entered my mind was that such a guy would be considered 'different'. I mean most men are, and are supposed to be sexually aggressive. When someone isn't he will be looked at in a different way and then, "Hey, you're the okay type, aren't you?"

He wouldn't be a manly man I guess.

Just my thoughts.

That said, I think what you're aiming at is a nice thing, but I'd like to see it as a female dominated story without the man being the dominated one. There's a subtle difference.

 

[Dirt Man]

Congratulations, so you want to write a science fiction novel of what you think the future would be like if both sexes were truly equal natured. What's that you say? You aren't talking about a science fiction story? How strange then, and how are you going to make it believeable when everybody knows that in every relationship there is a dominant partner, and a submissive one? If the woman is Dominant, she's called a bitch, if the man is submissive he is considered a whimp by his peers. And yet most civilized couples these days consider their marriage partners equal in every reguard. I know I do. And personally, I don't give a damn about what my peers think. So, what is the real problem then?

It stems from each writer's own insecurities actually. If you don't consider your own relationships equal as partners how are you going to convince others to think that your story is anything other than science fiction bull shit? In life we carry a lot of garbage on our backs for no reason other than to please other people because we think that's what they want. And that crap is as usualy as far from the truth as it could be. If you take away all of the male dominated pay scales, sexual harassment, and such, and wash it out of your mind. Then put two strangers in an equal environment, and let nature take its course you'll be surprised at what you find happens. For instance, instead of the man using a pick up line have the woman use one.

"Buy you a drink?" Sheila inquired. Knowing full well that the drinks at the catered party were free.

"That depends," Mark replied after turning around to see who was offering the drink, "what are your intentions?"

"First, to find out if your brains are as interesting as your cute butt."

"And after that?"

"Anything is possible," she smiled crinkling her freckled nose, her eyes sparkling mischiviously, "but there's no such thing as a sure bet."

Here is an almost perfect female seduction in an equal environment. The woman has made the first move, the man is not intimidated, and even a bit flattered. As he should be. He doesn't need to flatter her back by saying something crude like; "Nice tits," as he knows at the moment she wants to get to know him, and it would sure as hell lose him points. However, the ball is now in his court to seduce her right back with his mind, and mannerisms. True character will always win out, and playful debate, and reparte stimulates, and is always more interesting than what people already have in common. Thus by moving the role of seducer back and forth we create a better, more believable scenario. This actually works in real life. So use that as well. The best place to be in your own head for this is to always be thinking what you'd like if you were that character whether the character is male or female. You see, that is what equal really means.

As Always
I Am the
Dirt Man

 

[Vincent E]

Oh, and let's have some variety in author gender and story perspective. I would love to see a man write one of these from the perspective of the seduced.

If I can ever get a fire lit under my ass to finish the next chapter of a saga I have been writing for over a year, it would include a woman on top element as more of a sexual position that dominance.

 

[NoJo]

angela,
When I was much younger I was pretty shy and passive. The only women I only got to with were women pretty much like you describe. There were enough of them around so that I didn't feel too bad about myself. Things may have changed in the last twenty years.

I do remember that in Salsa dancing, which I learned, it was almost unheard of for the women to lead, or even to ask the men to dance: Salsa comes from a very macho culture. I found asking women to dance very nerve-wracking. Which is why I became a punk, so I could instead pogo dance in a crowd of beer and gob-soaked blokes.

 

[Linbido]

That said, I think what you're aiming at is a nice thing, but I'd like to see it as a female dominated story without the man being the dominated one. There's a subtle difference.

Hmm, I'm not quite sure what you're aiming at, but I think you just described my so far one-and-only Lit story. A (kind of) confident, (kind of) experienced woman takes the initiative and first steps with a too shy man. But once there, they're pretty equal. And I guess the story is dominated by the woman's, well, conquest.

 

[rainyguy]

Personally I love it when you have a strong willed confident woman acting as the pursuer.
I wrote a story with this in mind and I just need to write a follow up to bring that idea more out into the open.
But a woman with a "want, drive, will and opinion" is one of the most erotic and enticing things, at least for me.
I don't believe you have to sacrifice one gender as the submissive ,
these rolls, both dominance and submissiveness are not necessarily things that must be and have to be carved in stone.

A strong woman doesn't need to be cloaked in leather as an explanation.

 

[A7inchPhildo]

I guess my thought never considered that the woman on top means she is in control.

I have written stories that actively describe the female on top and in my own life the female has been on top. Never once did I feel like she was in control.

I don't think she ever thought I was in control when on top either. I don't know and sure as hell am not going to ask. I suppose it strikes everyone different in their own thoughts.

I could be wrong but I think some of the best voyeristic sex happens when the female is on top. I guess I have been to consumed to stop and focus on who was in control. Then again it really didn't matter because I was getting what I wanted. So having her on top was still leaving me in control I guess?

Phildo

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I don't write stroies with men as characters in the naughty bits, but this might be pertinent to your discussion, if not feel free to deep six it

In any human relationship there are several dynamics in play at once. In most of my stories there is a confident, agressive, more dominant peronality and a shyer, softer more passive one. In some stories however, I attempt to write something that I think is truer to life and in those cases both personalities can be shy or agressive, submissive or dominat etc. The real motivator in those stories is not only situation, but how the characters play off one another.

My borther is a very strong, dominat, forceful personality, but like me he suffers from Social Anxiet Disorder. While his is much milder than mine, a large crowd of stangers can unnerve him. His wife is a very submissive, retiring peronality, but she is extremely gregarious. I have little doubt in their bedroom he is the dominant force, they are both very traditional, but if you saw them in a crowded theatre you could easily get the idea she was the dominat force in the marriage and he was "hen-pecked".

Situation, and the way your characters relate to one another in a situation can give you a great deal of lee way to protray either or both as "on top". I think in all really strong relationships there is some interplay on the roles of pasive/agressive, Dominant/subissive, shy/outgoing.

Hope this helps,

-Colly

 

[damppanties]

Hmm, I'm not quite sure what you're aiming at, but I think you just described my so far one-and-only Lit story. A (kind of) confident, (kind of) experienced woman takes the initiative and first steps with a too shy man. But once there, they're pretty equal. And I guess the story is dominated by the woman's, well, conquest.

Yes, I remember that. (And that's quite a feat with the amount of stories I read here. It was really good.) I wouldn't call your story a female dominated one. The story concentrated on the female character but that is not domination by the character.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Even though the ongoing character in my stories, George Boxlicker, is a man, the women are basically in charge. This is especially so in "Pamela" and "Amy" and "Lotchie". In the first two the women are in the middle of a gangbang and in the other, she is just bossy.

 

[Guest]

I do remember that in Salsa dancing, which I learned, it was almost unheard of for the women to lead, or even to ask the men to dance: Salsa comes from a very macho culture. I found asking women to dance very nerve-wracking. Which is why I became a punk, so I could instead pogo dance in a crowd of beer and gob-soaked blokes.

Aw, Joe, you're just the type of bloke that would have interested me. In my youth I loved shy, ackward men. Love the image of you pogo dancing.

Perdita