A weighty issue

[Homburg]

I do have a good bit of muscle. Especially in my upper body from lifting patients for some many years. Now I'm wondering about this. I don't want to hinder myself. I'm 5'2. If I told you my weight would it help any?

They way to do it would be to take various measurements, plus weight and height, and get a basic idea of body fat percentage. That allows a rough determination of lean muscle mass. Eating to feed the lean muscle mass is, in theory, healthy maintenance. Going into a lightly hypo caloric situation with help. Exercise will boost it further.

Eating clean does more than anything else, as it sorts a lot of issues out on its' own.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

.... Right now I'm paying $5.50 a pack for Marlboro's. They were $2.00 a pack when I was buying them 8 years ago.

When I first started buying cigarettes:

There were only premium brands;
A pack cost $0.25 in a civilian store, $0.11 in a base exchange (PX/BX);
A carton cost $2.40 civilian, $1.05 PX/BX;
There were no Surgeon General's warnings on the packs.

I had a hissy fit and almost quit smoking when they went from $0.25 to $0.35 a pack civilian price. "Almost." Damnit.

 

[nh23]

They way to do it would be to take various measurements, plus weight and height, and get a basic idea of body fat percentage. That allows a rough determination of lean muscle mass. Eating to feed the lean muscle mass is, in theory, healthy maintenance. Going into a lightly hypo caloric situation with help. Exercise will boost it further.

Eating clean does more than anything else, as it sorts a lot of issues out on its' own.

Got a good site that will help me figure it all out? The body fat percentage.

 

[graceanne]

I've kept track of my caloric intake before. I'm doing well if I get over 500. I try to keep over 1000, and at 1500 I'm really proud of myself. And full.

I think most people would be surprised at how many calories they eat. It's interesting to keep track, and there are websites that will help with that.

 

[nh23]

I've kept track of my caloric intake before. I'm doing well if I get over 500. I try to keep over 1000, and at 1500 I'm really proud of myself. And full.

I think most people would be surprised at how many calories they eat. It's interesting to keep track, and there are websites that will help with that.

Yep, I keep a food diary.

 

[graceanne]

I read somewhere, once, that if you keep your fat intake below . . . 15%? I think? that it'll help you lose weight. So when you go to eat something, look at the label. If the fat is more than 15% of the total calories, find something else.

 

[satindesire]

I try really hard to make sure I'm eating my fruits and veggies (which I really like anyway!) and avoid processed foods. However....

I've never been this big. At my appointment today I weighed in at 202 pounds.

I know I'm supposed to gain this much weight, but CRAP. Even at 5'10 I'm still freaking out!!

Christinne said that 30 pounds is totally normal. Normal. Normal. Keep repeating this to yourself Meg. Normal.....Breathe.

Normal normal normal.

 

[intothewoods]

FYI - I checked this past weekend and my farmer's market accepts food stamps. I know Netz said the same thing about hers.

 

[the captians wench]

Labels on fast food, and listed on menu's.

I do know that every box and wrapper at mcd's (for lunch items) has the nutrition facts on it. And every tray liner has the entire menu's nutritian facts.

Also something neat to look up at mcdonalds.com, you can build your sandwhiches and find out how that effects the calories and such. Like if you get a grill classic but with out mayo, how many less calories that is.

Cooked shrimp is about 5 dollars a bag there. Pinch of the tails and put half a bag in spaghetti sauce over whole wheat pasta. Or better yet make my own sauce once the tomatoes and peppers come in. That I've never done but I'm sure I can find a ton of recipes on the internet.

And I like to make a huge bowl of veggie soup seasoned with some good sirloin or something. Cook up some cornbread in a iron skillet to crumble into the soup. mmm...

My favorite sause to cook up:

1 lb roma or grape tomatoes cut in quarters
1 can black olives sliced
1/2 a bunch fresh parsly chopped
about a cup of white wine (I usually use a simi sweet mead myself)
salt and pepper to taste

You want to cook the tomatoes until they just start to wilt, then add the other ingrediants. You can add a little corn starch if you want to thinken it, but I prefer to just let it simmer a bit and leave it thin.

That's it, you're done. Takes about 10 mins. I usually throw in some left over chicken and what ever noodle I have around. Then I top it with some fresh parm

 

[BiBunny]

And hypo-calorie diets make you feel like utter and complete shit, so exercise (which is what REALLY boosts your metabolism) is pretty much out of the question.

Ok, here's a thought of mine about how we can improve overall health. It could be totally wrong. But since my PCOS diagnosis, I have done a LOT of my own personal research about metabolism, how it works, etc.

All people who have been overweight for any length of time are insulin resistant, but not necessarily diabetic. Insulin resistance cause blood sugar to skyrocket and then bottom out, which fucks up your metabolism and MAKES YOU FATTER. So if you're trying in vain to lose weight and not getting anywhere, this is most likely the reason. There are several tell-tale signs, but I won't get into that.

There are, however, things that can be done to minimize insulin resistance, chiefly eating foods that are low on the glycemic index (GI) scale. Most people will say, "Don't eat sugar." Well, that's all well and good, but there are tons of food that are touted as "healthy" when, in fact, they're almost as high on the GI scale as sugar.

I think educating people on the effect that certain foods have on their blood sugar and what that does to their bodies would help tremendously.

 

[Keroin]

I am of the train of thought, and this is something Netz touched on as well, that various populations evolved eating a certain diet. While diets of other regions might be effective at keeping them alive, it is not going to be effective at keeping them healthy.

So, in the case of your islanders, they evolved as a people eating fish, locally grown fruits, etc. This was an effective and functional diet for them. Other food sources and dietary memes arrive and displace the traditional ones by virtue of ease. Junk food is cheap and easy compared to fishing and gathering mangoes. But the wheat, corn, etc in these products has no place in the gut of these peoples, and is slowly killing them.

Much of this is based on the enzymes present in your system, as these determine what you can efficiently digest, versus the things that you can basically digest. In the wayback days, people ate foods because it was what they could get. Certain foods tasted good (fruit as an example) because of nutrients present in those foods. If you think about it, a lot of nutritional foods do taste good. The problem is that junk food tastes better.

Modern junk/processed food makes liberal use of cheap sweeteners (corn syrup), MSG, and salt to increase the taste factor, and the addictiveness of the foods. While we as humans can still enjoy, and get happy brain chemicals, from a handful of blueberries, we get FAR more of those same happy brain chemicals from the purpose-engineered junk foods available now. Food has become a drug.

So, as our theoretical islander, if you can find a tasty mango and enjoy it, fine. But if you can hit the store and buy a twinkie, and fireworks go off in your brain, so much the better. The fact that you can't really digest it right is immaterial.

I would love to see some sort of way to figure out the enzyme profile in a given individual to be able to produce a range of dietary choices that make sense. For me, pasta is a horrible thing. Yet when I eat rice, I'm good. And give me cabbage and pork, and I'm just ducky. My Japanese and Scottish/Polish ancestry at work? Or just foods I grew up on? Fuck if I know. I've never tried to live on that sort of thing sufficiently to make the call. It might be dead tough, as there are other people living in this house too, and their enzymatic profiles may well be different.

Interestingly, we all have slavic foods in our background. Makes me wonder if we should be eating more foods along those lines.

I think genetics plays a part, for sure, to a point. My bio ancestry is German/Russian (to the best of my knowledge), and yet my body thrives best on fish, beans, rice and fresh veggies, which is more Japanese than European. I cannot tolerate wheat or cow dairy. My uneducated guess is that these people would have inevitably put on *some* fat with the introduction of European foods but it is the processed sugar, chemicals, and other crap that is doing them in at such a fast pace. As I mentioned before, no one on the planet can remain healthy on that kind of diet.

If you like rice, try rice pasta. That's what I eat, back in the world, and my body loves it. YOu have to fool around a bit with the cooking times but it's every bit as tasty as wheat pasta.

You mentioned the sweetness thing, this is really critical. I had to completely abstain from all sugar, once, for a three week period, as part of a naturopathic diet I was put on to help combat some severe health issues. I could not even eat a carrot. I had to read every label and could not use a spice if it had any form of sugar in it. First week was hell, (I was drinking a can of Coke per day at this point in my life), headaches, sleeping round the clock, cranky as hell. By week two life was easier. By week three my crazy diet seemed normal and I felt awesome. Energy through the roof. My doc slowly let me reintroduce foods. I'll never forget my first bite of fruit. An apple. I couldn't believe how sweet it was. Seriously, I couldn't finish it, that's how overwhelming it was. That's when I realized how drastically my ability to recognize sweetness had been altered by eating junk food. Natural food suddenly became every bit as yummy as cake, cookies and chocolate. Scary when you think that this is happening on a large scale and most people will never know what's been done to them.

I would love to see it. I've read that milk, as said before, carries sex hormones, and have also read some stuff that implies that meat does as well. Big Ag pumps cows, chickens, etc chock full of what amounts to steroids and growth hormone to force them to grow as quickly as possible. That shit pervades the muscle cells of those creatures, and is still present when they hit the market. Does that have an effect on us? I'd love to know.

Giving up on cow milk was one of the best things I've ever done. I'm not a big dairy person anyway but just changing to goat and soy products has made an enormous difference in my overall health. I'm looking forward to getting back to somewhere where I will know exactly where my meat, (and fruits and veggies), comes from.

The problem is that vegetarian diets will flat kill a certain portion of the populace. Some people literally must have meat proteins in their diet. Not saying that people should be dependent on meat, but veg is not the answer for everyone.

Agreed but my observation is that the western diet is far too meat heavy. I need red meat because I am borderline anemic. A steak about once per week is perfect but I know other people need more. I think if people just tried eating even one vegetarian meal per week, they'd notice a difference.

This is fluid too. Portion size that is right for you would be a few bites for me. A skinny little slip of a girl like yourself has vastly different caloric needs than someone my size. And that comment is only taking my lean muscle mass into account.

Part of the problem is that portions aren't variable. Most restaurants put a pile of food on the plate (often too much for me, frighteningly enough), and that's that. Smaller portions are generally not available. That said, I've noticed a small, but growing trend, towards having smaller portion options. Usually it is a "seniors" menu, but sometimes it isn't. MIS and I stopped at a Denny's (breakfast all day, om nom nom), and they had a section of smaller portion meals called "Just right". I thought it was a fantastic idea.

Honestly though, when I was in the best shape I've been in in recent years, I ate like a horse. I *HAD* to have huge amounts of food to be able to recover from the pounding I was putting my body through under the bar.

When I was marathoning, I could pack away as much food as a man twice my weight. Calories in - calories out. I was in great shape and at my heaviest weighed in at 125lbs (5'7"). Then I took a break from the training, but my body was used to taking in a lot of calories so I kept it up. In three months I was up to 142lbs, the heaviest I have ever weighed. So, portion sizes are about size, are about activity level, are about a lot of things. The problem with restaurant portion sizes is that people have this "finish everything on your plate" mentality. I have no problem taking just a few bites and pushing my plate away but I know most folks won't or can't.

When I was home in October, I went out for breakfast with a friend and ordered French toast. The portion I was given was six slices of that "Texas toast". I ate one and a half slices and was full. When the waitress collected my plate, she said, "Wow, you didn't even eat any of it." This is the kind of attitude that guilt people into eating more than they should.

I love the "Just right" idea. Hooray for Dennys!

They redesigned it. I have looked too much, but it is set up differently.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/nation/daily/graphics/diet_042005.gif

(Linked instead of posting it as the gif is somewhat large)

Heaviest by volume is dairy (3 cups), then veggies (2.5), and then fruits (2). 6oz of grains, then 5.5oz of meats. A sliver of it is devoted to oils. I dislike that,a s we need more healthy oils in our diets, but I can understand that they want to reduce the use of shitty oils.

A 2000cal diet, however, is a joke.

I cannot believe how much emphasis they are still putting on grains and dairy! Vegetables, people, vegetables. Why should only half the grains be whole grains? Why not all? 3 cups of milk? Why? I like that they mention to go easy on juices - I would say avoid all juices but that's just me. Also, it's good they've added the bit about exercise.



I saw a good episode of "American Scientific Frontiers" a few years back that dealt with diet and weight loss. The part I found most enlightening was the fourth bit down on the list, "Eat Less - Live Longer".

 

[the captians wench]

And hypo-calorie diets make you feel like utter and complete shit, so exercise (which is what REALLY boosts your metabolism) is pretty much out of the question.

Ok, here's a thought of mine about how we can improve overall health. It could be totally wrong. But since my PCOS diagnosis, I have done a LOT of my own personal research about metabolism, how it works, etc.

All people who have been overweight for any length of time are insulin resistant, but not necessarily diabetic. Insulin resistance cause blood sugar to skyrocket and then bottom out, which fucks up your metabolism and MAKES YOU FATTER. So if you're trying in vain to lose weight and not getting anywhere, this is most likely the reason. There are several tell-tale signs, but I won't get into that.

There are, however, things that can be done to minimize insulin resistance, chiefly eating foods that are low on the glycemic index (GI) scale. Most people will say, "Don't eat sugar." Well, that's all well and good, but there are tons of food that are touted as "healthy" when, in fact, they're almost as high on the GI scale as sugar.

I think educating people on the effect that certain foods have on their blood sugar and what that does to their bodies would help tremendously.

This is yet another area where my body decides it want to be different, I produce too much insulin.

You are right about the GI thing. I know I have to watch how much citrus and most tropical fruit I eat because it fucks with my sugal levels. I've just reciently discovered blue agave, I won't go back to fructous unless I'm making marange.

 

[Keroin]

And hypo-calorie diets make you feel like utter and complete shit, so exercise (which is what REALLY boosts your metabolism) is pretty much out of the question.

Ok, here's a thought of mine about how we can improve overall health. It could be totally wrong. But since my PCOS diagnosis, I have done a LOT of my own personal research about metabolism, how it works, etc.

All people who have been overweight for any length of time are insulin resistant, but not necessarily diabetic. Insulin resistance cause blood sugar to skyrocket and then bottom out, which fucks up your metabolism and MAKES YOU FATTER. So if you're trying in vain to lose weight and not getting anywhere, this is most likely the reason. There are several tell-tale signs, but I won't get into that.

There are, however, things that can be done to minimize insulin resistance, chiefly eating foods that are low on the glycemic index (GI) scale. Most people will say, "Don't eat sugar." Well, that's all well and good, but there are tons of food that are touted as "healthy" when, in fact, they're almost as high on the GI scale as sugar.

I think educating people on the effect that certain foods have on their blood sugar and what that does to their bodies would help tremendously.

Bingo! Yes. When people think of "sugar" they think of that white stuff that you put in your coffee. But really, it's about the foods that spike blood sugar quickly and send it crashing down, these are also foods to avoid.

I call white flour products "White death". Tropical fruits should only be eaten in moderation. Juice = not good. I could go on and on.

*Some people have special dietary needs, I'm referring to the average person.

 

[intothewoods]

Keroin - I noticed the difference cutting out baked goods and white flour foods recently. It was hell the first week and then I felt a lot more energetic after that.

 

[satindesire]

When I eat read meat I puke for a day and a half afterwards. I have no idea why, my body simply CANNOT tolerate almost any form of beef, even in small portions.

I miss steak.

 

[BiBunny]

Bingo! Yes. When people think of "sugar" they think of that white stuff that you put in your coffee. But really, it's about the foods that spike blood sugar quickly and send it crashing down, these are also foods to avoid.

I call white flour products "White death". Tropical fruits should only be eaten in moderation. Juice = not good. I could go on and on.

*Some people have special dietary needs, I'm referring to the average person.

Yep. Sugar. White flour products. Corn. Potatoes. All kinds of stuff that you never really realize are that bad for you until dig for some information.

Just trying buying something in a grocery/store restaurant that doesn't have one or more of those things in it. And I won't even get wound up on the inflammatory properties of corn and corn products. Ugh.

 

[Keroin]

Keroin - I noticed the difference cutting out baked goods and white flour foods recently. It was hell the first week and then I felt a lot more energetic after that.

Good for you. Yeah, the first part is the hardest. That's really when I began to see how addictive these foods are. I mean, I went through serious physical withdrawals.

I'm lucky that when I did this I had access to lots of alternatives, like rice flour or chick pea flour, as well as other pre-made, non-wheat products.

My skin improved too. So soft and smooth!

 

[LilyBart]

I mostly do my shopping at trader joes, but not for my meat - I can't afford their prices and they don't sell bulk.

I've been looking online for co-ops in my area and not having a lot of luck. Most of the ones I've found are big on the whole 'peace' thing and I don't think the wife (and sister) and children of a soldier would be welcome.

I keep trying to talk my mom and/or sister into going into a cow with me but neither can afford it.

Gracie, I am sort of stunned by your observation. I think of Oregon as a place that would be rife with co-ops. (Am I off base here?) And honestly, your status as the wife or sister of a soldier is irrelevant. If there is a co-op that can provide an affordable alternative, then you should participate. And the benefit is that you can shine as an example as the wife/sister of a soldier.

I've always thought that the one thing that all humans have in common is that we must all buy/get/grow/cook and ultimately eat food. Judging the occupation of the eater/chef is not an option, IMO.

~LB

 

[Netzach]

Thank you! We don't have a trader joe's around here. I've actually never heard of it. We have a Walmart, Sam's club, and Kroger. Those are our biggies. I can get some things at Aldi for cheap, but the quality sucks. We do have a local farmers market that I haven't been to yet. Mostly because of social anxiety, but I may have to just get over it and go.


Oh yeah. I'm a pack a day+ smoker. (I know it's horrible and I don't want to hear any shit about it. I'm aware) Right now I'm paying $5.50 a pack for Marlboro's. They were $2.00 a pack when I was buying them 8 years ago.

Aldi is the low-cost arm of Trader Joe's. The quality I've heard is here and there, but a lot of TJ's goods are the same as Aldi only relabeled and sold to yuppies for more $$$ - bulk and nuts for the most part.

 

[Netzach]

Keroin's sugar anecdote is so true.

I went about 2 years with no grain and no myriad other things and no complex sugars. I could have sweets made with honey fruit dates, but no long chain carbs of any kind.

I really lost a lot of my taste for certain things. I like me some cake again, but cheap and crappy sugary things are unbearable where I could sit through them happily before.

M's an "energy drink" fan, omg, I can't even sip those things, I can't even believe something can be that sweetened. It makes ye olde quarter water taste like health food.

 

[Homburg]

Got a good site that will help me figure it all out? The body fat percentage.

http://www.linear-software.com/online.html

I've used this one before. Scroll down to the one for women,a nd use the "tape measure" method. All you'll need is a regular tape measure of the sort a seamstress would use. Lacking that, you can use a piece of string and a regular measuring tape.

This will not give you a totally accurate result. Calipers are a better method, and the various displacement style tools are even better. But this is better than nothing. Once you have your bodyfat percentage, just multiply it by your total weight to see what the poundage is. Subtract that from your total and you have your lean muscle mass.

You'll probably find that the super-diet pages will produce absurdly low numbers for caloric intake at that point.

Here's an alternative that doesn't use bodyfat or LMM, but is still well-respected in the areas I read.

http://www.bmi-calculator.net/bmr-calculator/

Fill it out, see what it says, then click the equation that talks about finding specific caloric needs.

I'm a fan of bodyfat percentage when dealing with people what carry muscle, as it gives a better picture of body composition than the scale alone. Using bodyfat % and your tape measure, you can produce much more precise metrics than looking at poundage alone.

--

And hypo-calorie diets make you feel like utter and complete shit, so exercise (which is what REALLY boosts your metabolism) is pretty much out of the question.

Ok, here's a thought of mine about how we can improve overall health. It could be totally wrong. But since my PCOS diagnosis, I have done a LOT of my own personal research about metabolism, how it works, etc.

All people who have been overweight for any length of time are insulin resistant, but not necessarily diabetic. Insulin resistance cause blood sugar to skyrocket and then bottom out, which fucks up your metabolism and MAKES YOU FATTER. So if you're trying in vain to lose weight and not getting anywhere, this is most likely the reason. There are several tell-tale signs, but I won't get into that.

There are, however, things that can be done to minimize insulin resistance, chiefly eating foods that are low on the glycemic index (GI) scale. Most people will say, "Don't eat sugar." Well, that's all well and good, but there are tons of food that are touted as "healthy" when, in fact, they're almost as high on the GI scale as sugar.

I think educating people on the effect that certain foods have on their blood sugar and what that does to their bodies would help tremendously.

Spot on. All of it.

 

[graceanne]

FYI - I checked this past weekend and my farmer's market accepts food stamps. I know Netz said the same thing about hers.

Mine doesn't. I've looked into it.

Bingo! Yes. When people think of "sugar" they think of that white stuff that you put in your coffee. But really, it's about the foods that spike blood sugar quickly and send it crashing down, these are also foods to avoid.

I call white flour products "White death". Tropical fruits should only be eaten in moderation. Juice = not good. I could go on and on.

*Some people have special dietary needs, I'm referring to the average person.

I've also noticed that when I (a) don't eat and (b) forget my diabetes meds I CRAVE simple carbs. Normally in the form of candy, but orange juice will do it for me.

I don't eat bread - I don't particularly like bread and I'm gluten intolerant. I also don't eat/drink milk products because I'm lactose intolerant and it makes me very gassy.

When I eat read meat I puke for a day and a half afterwards. I have no idea why, my body simply CANNOT tolerate almost any form of beef, even in small portions.

I miss steak.

Is this a pregger thing, or something that happened before you get pregnant?

Gracie, I am sort of stunned by your observation. I think of Oregon as a place that would be rife with co-ops. (Am I off base here?) And honestly, your status as the wife or sister of a soldier is irrelevant. If there is a co-op that can provide an affordable alternative, then you should participate. And the benefit is that you can shine as an example as the wife/sister of a soldier.

~LB

I would think so. We have a million hippies and wanna be hippies, but I'm not having any luck finding one that doesn't have a whole bunch on their front page about peace and finding peaceful solutions, etc etc. They might still be ok, but the only way to find out is to put myself in a situation that might be very uncomfortable.

I can't afford to put myself in situations that end in my puking blood right now. We'll see after K gets back.

M's an "energy drink" fan, omg, I can't even sip those things, I can't even believe something can be that sweetened. It makes ye olde quarter water taste like health food.

Amen! I used to be a huge pop-o-holic, but I don't do well with corn products (namely corn syrup) so I switched to iced tea (unsweetened). Now I can't drink more than a sip or two of pop - and normally I do because my throat is sore.

How 'bout aspertame? There have been studies that show it gives you a sweet tooth. Personally, it gives me HEARTBURN. But I'd be interested in people's feeling on it.

 

[satindesire]

It's been pretty much my whole life.

Not really sure why. I've searched online to see if it's a common problem and there's not a whole lot of information about it. *shrugs*

I just avoid it by this time. At this point, that's all I can do.

 

[graceanne]

It's been pretty much my whole life.

Not really sure why. I've searched online to see if it's a common problem and there's not a whole lot of information about it. *shrugs*

I just avoid it by this time. At this point, that's all I can do.

I had a friend who was like that, but she was raised on a macrobiotic/vegan diet. As an adult she tried to start eating meat, because her husband (the fucker) wasn't a vegetarian, but any time she ate read meat she hurled. I always figured that her stomach just wasn't used to processing meat, and honestly didn't think she should worry about it.

 

[satindesire]

I had a friend who was like that, but she was raised on a macrobiotic/vegan diet. As an adult she tried to start eating meat, because her husband (the fucker) wasn't a vegetarian, but any time she ate read meat she hurled. I always figured that her stomach just wasn't used to processing meat, and honestly didn't think she should worry about it.

My family had a typical home-cooked Southern-food diet. Bacon and eggs with toast in the morning, pancakes, sandwiches for lunch with salad and fruit and milk...dinner was BBQ, roast, grilled chicken, with corn on the cob, macaroni salad, etc etc etc. Meat and potatoes kind of food. Stuff that makes people fat unless you work out on a farm for 12 hours a day. =P And honestly, a lot of my family DID when they were younger, that's what their moms made for the sake of loading them with calories and it was cheap to boot. So they grew up eating it, they cooked it for us kids, and it goes down the generational chain.

I ate beef as a kid but remember quite clearly around puberty-time I started hurling after eating it. It's gradually gotten worse as I've gotten older, like the longer I go without it the worse my little 'allergy' or whatever it is gets. It used to be just stomach aches, nausea, severe fatigue...but it's gotten to the point now where I'll VIOLENTLY vomit, repeatedly, over the course of a 24-or-so hour period after eating it until I'm just dry-heaving and I don't even have bile left. It's awful!

I don't know if I just can't digest it or what, but I just stay away from it now. At this point it's been so long I rarely miss it. Since I've gotten pregnant I've had some serious cravings, but it's not worth the time spent praying over the toilet for God to just kill me now.