A question of what to expect on this forum...

[WickedSpitFire]

I've made a couple postings, and I realize this is often a bit of an invitation. I realized this when I posted and I accepted that. However...what I received, has made me curious.

In my introduction, I made mention to the difficulty I've had labeling myself. I don't like labels which is in part my problem. However, at the moment, I'm currently in the midst of self discovery. I'm learning the differences between submissive and slave, my own interpretations of the two, what my interpretations mean, specifically to me, and where I feel as though I belong. I'm uncertain, and I'm not ashamed of this.

Anyway. I received some...rather...unwelcome messages, which I will paraphrase.

In response to my plight, I was told my response to his message would help him help me label myself.

Slightly awkward, but ok. I was polite. I was a little offended because I'm of the opinion only I can label myself, through experience, and even then, I look at labels fluidly. They're not static. They're subject to change. I was honest and said thanks but no thanks.

The again paraphrased response was that, by the look of it, I'm a switch at best, and not a full submissive.

Uhm. I'm not of the opinion that this observation is true or even the slightest insightful. But I'm kinda really irked by it. I'll let it go by the end of the night. I'm just wondering if this kind of response is something I should expect of this forum. If it's typical, or non normative. Because it was certainly unappreciated, and if it's commonplace I can't say I'll be sticking around very long...

 

[graceanne]

I've made a couple postings, and I realize this is often a bit of an invitation. I realized this when I posted and I accepted that. However...what I received, has made me curious.

In my introduction, I made mention to the difficulty I've had labeling myself. I don't like labels which is in part my problem. However, at the moment, I'm currently in the midst of self discovery. I'm learning the differences between submissive and slave, my own interpretations of the two, what my interpretations mean, specifically to me, and where I feel as though I belong. I'm uncertain, and I'm not ashamed of this.

Anyway. I received some...rather...unwelcome messages, which I will paraphrase.

In response to my plight, I was told my response to his message would help him help me label myself.

Slightly awkward, but ok. I was polite. I was a little offended because I'm of the opinion only I can label myself, through experience, and even then, I look at labels fluidly. They're not static. They're subject to change. I was honest and said thanks but no thanks.

The again paraphrased response was that, by the look of it, I'm a switch at best, and not a full submissive.

Uhm. I'm not of the opinion that this observation is true or even the slightest insightful. But I'm kinda really irked by it. I'll let it go by the end of the night. I'm just wondering if this kind of response is something I should expect of this forum. If it's typical, or non normative. Because it was certainly unappreciated, and if it's commonplace I can't say I'll be sticking around very long...

If you are sure you're a sub or slave, why do you care if someone else thinks youre a switch? This, right here, is why most of us won't get drawn into a discussion about your label - because often when we make suggestion it annoys the person who's asking for our opinions.

And that's what it is - an opinion. Only you can look inside yourself and figure out what you are or are not. We only see a very thin slice of you - that which you choose to show to us. Therefore, how can we be considered good judges for how you choose to label yourself?

Beyond that, have you ever heard the phrase HNG? It means horny net geek, and we get more than our share of pimply teenagers thinking that if they tell all women that they aren't really submissive those women will throw themselves over in an attempt to prove otherwise. Most of us don't even respond to PM's like that.

The rest might not answer your question, but it will answer the title of this thread. The you's are general and not directed necessarily at you.

What you can expect from this group is humor and a little bit of impatience. We get people often coming in here trying to get us to label them (something we aren't able to do because of the aforementioned reasons) and when they don't like the answer we give them they leave in a huff. I'll say it again - what do you care what we think? We are strangers in a forum.

You can also expect that you will not just suddenly become part of the crowd, we are all a bit standoffish with newbies because we get a lot who come here, in short, to use us for our knowledge and then leave. Consequently, we don't make friends with everyone who comes here. Stick around, and you'll find a niche, I promise. Even our most annoying and obnoxious have a place.

Furthermore, you can expect us to bicker, fight, and talk ourselves in circles. We do that, without exception, about every subject that shows up on these boards. You can also expect the subject of cookies to show up in the random places.

And, we will not hold your hand and guide you through this. We will show you to the tools you need, but we expect you to do the leg work. We don't come here just to nurture the new, we come here to spend time with friends who have a similar life style. If you don't like us, join the club. We aren't all nice, we aren't all helpful, and we aren't all patient. In fact, the more newbies we get in here annoyed because we won't look into their souls and tell them what they are, the less helpful, nice, and patient we become. If you don't like us, feel free to join the crowds of 'use em and lose em' that we've seen.

 

[BiBunny]

Oh, noez! A switch! The fucking horror.

 

[WickedSpitFire]

I realize I should've made the point of my question a little more clear. That was my mistake. Quite simply put, my question was not on the basis of labels, but rather how people here interact with, respond to, and use labels.

My plight is my own, I quite often ask for opinions, online as well as off, as a way to help me form my own opinion. Which is the important part. Switch, sub, or slave it makes no difference which if any that I am or am not. It makes no difference to me what others think.

I also realize that a conversation of labels is, as always, a politically and emotionally motivated one. Again, the plight is my own. I haven't come here as a way to develop my own definitions of sorts. I didn't come to suck information out of anyone, or everyone. I'm not here to use this community for personal selfish reasons. I came for chatter and to stave boredom. And I most certainly didn't solicit assistance in trying to label myself.

But I got an offer, misconstrued as it might have been, anyway. An uninvited judgment. I may not care what judgments people make, but feel free to keep them to yourself. Feel free to even post about it if you'd like. But most of all feel free to NOT message me privately about it. Don't need it, don't want it, didn't ask for it, not interested in it. If my inbox starts to fill up with messages like these I'll have my answer, I was just curious.

In regards to the rest of your message...I don't expect nor did I anticipate being a welcomed member of the crowd. Not even because I at least claim to not be newbie. As with most communities, online as well as off, the BDSM one is one that is quite often "cliquey." I wouldn't expect Lit to be any different. It's the nature of the beast of tight knit social community's. It's lends also to their appeal.

I also don't expect nor anticipate nor would I respond well to someone trying to hold my hand. The poor sap who messaged me made a failed attempt at doing so and, as per my prerogative, I responded poorly.

It happens.

 

[graceanne]

Oh, noez! A switch! The fucking horror.

Switches have yard gnomes, too, you know.

 

[graceanne]

I also don't expect nor anticipate nor would I respond well to someone trying to hold my hand. The poor sap who messaged me made a failed attempt at doing so and, as per my prerogative, I responded poorly.

It happens.

And, if he messaged you, he opened himself for rebuff. You really might want to check out the asshat thread in the cafe. It's where people post unwanted PM's they get (minus any identifying information) and we all laugh.

 

[Netzach]

You're a woman. Your av has bewbs anyway. It's up to men to explain you to yourself, then, because your sexuality belongs to us all, not you.

Something like that.

Welcome! It's not half bad as that, for the most part.

 

[WickedSpitFire]

And, if he messaged you, he opened himself for rebuff. You really might want to check out the asshat thread in the cafe. It's where people post unwanted PM's they get (minus any identifying information) and we all laugh.

Aha! This I will find and there I will post.

 

[seela]

Go invisible. That'll help you fight a lot of the unwanted PMs.

I don't really see what's the problem with the PM you got, at least it was a response, even if an unwanted one, to your post. You can't really control that kind of things, unless you turn off your PMs, which is also a possibility.

And like gracey said, it doesn't really matter what other people say you are, if you don't feel it fits you. This is interent. Sticks and stones etc.

 

[desertslave]

First, hiya!

Second, trolls abound, especially in PM's. If the message feels unwelcome to you, you can always just ignore it and block the perpetrator. It's amazing how many hit&run PM'ers are around here. No matter what you say, they'll never respond, OR they'll write something stupid just to provoke you.

Third, whatever labels you decide on are yours and/or any SO you match with. Master calls me 'slave.' That may or may not meet up with anyone else's definition of the work, but it's what works for us. Those simple words are, in practice, entirely too restrictive and unhelpful. Understanding only comes through taking the time to have a more meaningful dialog with those you choose to share the details.

Finally, you kind of need to be ducklike around here: just let the unhelpful stuff roll off your back and paddle along to a better spot. BDSM is so all-encompassing that despite the richness of what we share, someone(s) is inevitably bound to find something with which to disagree.

Hope you stick around.

 

[WickedSpitFire]

First, hiya!

Second, trolls abound, especially in PM's. If the message feels unwelcome to you, you can always just ignore it and block the perpetrator. It's amazing how many hit&run PM'ers are around here. No matter what you say, they'll never respond, OR they'll write something stupid just to provoke you.

Third, whatever labels you decide on are yours and/or any SO you match with. Master calls me 'slave.' That may or may not meet up with anyone else's definition of the work, but it's what works for us. Those simple words are, in practice, entirely too restrictive and unhelpful. Understanding only comes through taking the time to have a more meaningful dialog with those you choose to share the details.

Finally, you kind of need to be ducklike around here: just let the unhelpful stuff roll off your back and paddle along to a better spot. BDSM is so all-encompassing that despite the richness of what we share, someone(s) is inevitably bound to find something with which to disagree.

Hope you stick around.

Well hi there and thanks. Especially for the bit of an answer to my question. Trollers abound about sums it up, I suppose. If trolls are common here, then they're common here. They're not always common. It never hurts to ask. Well. Maybe it does. Anyway. Everyone is bound to be at a different level, or at a different point in their own personal processes and journey's etc etc. I just made mention to where I'm at in terms of my own. But I do realize it's me and my own perspective and a plight only I can solve.

I kinda giggled at the reference to ducks, though.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Trolls abound here, most especially because there is a free speech policy on these forums which include waste-of-time trolling in the definition of "free Speech."

It still seems stupid to me, but that's the way the owners roll-- and you'll notice that my distaste has never driven me away in these umm.. seven years? holy shit.

 

[SalviaDivinorum]

On a practical note, if you don't want uninvited PMs you can restrict who can message you by only allowing messages from people on your buddy list.

 

[Licia]

Most of the time I ignore stupid PMs; however, sometimes I must play whack-a-troll.

 

[ecstaticsub]

Most of the time I ignore stupid PMs; however, sometimes I must play whack-a-troll.

It can be a rather amusing way to past the time

 

[WickedSpitFire]

It still seems stupid to me, but that's the way the owners roll-- and you'll notice that my distaste has never driven me away in these umm.. seven years? holy shit.

I agree. It seems a little silly. Simply because you have the right to speak certainly doesn't mean you have the right to be heard. And all that jazz.

Seven years, huh? I originally joined back in 2006. I was around til about 2008 and then I took my hiatus.

On a practical note, if you don't want uninvited PMs you can restrict who can message you by only allowing messages from people on your buddy list.

Okay so I'm not inept, I know this is a possibility. And because I opt not to I ought not complain...but really. That's just not fair. I mean, I have gotten a couple of at least polite and well intended messages, too. My fingers are just crossed that the quantity of one type doesn't overwhelm the quantity of the other not so desirable type.

Most of the time I ignore stupid PMs; however, sometimes I must play whack-a-troll.

I almost spit my coffee at that. Well played...

 

[Sir_Winston54]

....

In my introduction, I made mention to the difficulty I've had labeling myself. I don't like labels which is in part my problem. However, at the moment, I'm currently in the midst of self discovery. I'm learning the differences between submissive and slave, (1) my own interpretations of the two, (2) what my interpretations mean, specifically to me, and (3) where I feel as though I belong. (4) I'm uncertain, and I'm not ashamed of this.

Anyway. I received some...rather...unwelcome messages, which I will paraphrase.

In response to my plight, I was told my response to his message would help him help me label myself.

Slightly awkward, but ok. I was polite. I was a little offended because I'm of the opinion only I can label myself, through experience, and even then, I look at labels fluidly. They're not static. They're subject to change. I was honest and said thanks but no thanks.

The again paraphrased response was that, by the look of it, I'm a switch at best, and not a full submissive.

Uhm. I'm not of the opinion that this observation is true or even the slightest insightful. But I'm kinda really irked by it. I'll let it go by the end of the night. I'm just wondering if this kind of response is something I should expect of this forum. If it's typical, or non normative. Because it was certainly unappreciated, and if it's commonplace I can't say I'll be sticking around very long...

First, welcome to the BDSM Talk and BDSM Café fora. The addition of an organized and literate poster is a beauteous thing!

Second, love lurve LUV your opening post for this thread, especially the underlined portion, more especially the bolded portions within that, and even moreso the portion that magically turned red. What really matters in this whole "labeling" thing is what works for you. You're the one who has to live with it, and your ability to recognize that and the fact that whatever label(s) you may choose could be at least somewhat fluid is a breath of fresh air to those of us who have seen thread upon thread upon thread of people wanting someone else to pin a label to their labia (or lingam) *for* them.

....

I'm not here to use this community for personal selfish reasons.

Why not? Most of the rest of us do. Anything we might do or post to help others is because it's something *we* want to do. If we don't want to do it, we don't. That's selfish, by my definition.

....

In regards to the rest of your message...I don't expect nor did I anticipate being a welcomed member of the crowd. Not even because I at least claim to not be newbie. As with most communities, online as well as off, the BDSM one is one that is quite often "cliquey." I wouldn't expect Lit to be any different. It's the nature of the beast of tight knit social community's. It's lends also to their appeal.

The crowd here *is* a little bit clique-y, in the sense that there are some folks who have been here for years and sort of constitute a core constituency. Then there are people who have been here for months, and by virtue of their contributions (see sharing themselves, below), become a part of that core constituency. HOWEVER, it's one of the most *open* cliques I've ever experienced, and I'm >60 years old! This group welcomes just about anyone who comes in with an open mind and a desire to learn, or share what they've learned, or just come in and share of themselves a little bit (whether deep philosophical or life lessons, or jokes and puns and things we've found that entertain us on the Interwebz or things that have pissed us off in the past day or three). I think you have the potential to fit into this group without running into many potholes. Time will tell.

I also don't expect nor anticipate nor would I respond well to someone trying to hold my hand. The poor sap who messaged me made a failed attempt at doing so and, as per my prerogative, I responded poorly.

It happens.

Hand-holding can be fun, but only for those who already have the predisposition to enjoy that sort of thing. Just cuz you slapped him down a little bit doesn't mean anyone but he is going to get all snarky and ostracize you.

Again... Welcome to the Talk and Café fora! I've got a feeling you could be here for years.

....

Third, whatever labels you decide on are yours and/or any SO you match with. Master calls me 'slave.' That may or may not meet up with anyone else's definition of the work, but it's what works for us. Those simple words are, in practice, entirely too restrictive and unhelpful. Understanding only comes through taking the time to have a more meaningful dialog with those you choose to share the details.

<Like button pushed on bolded part>

DAMMIT, LIT! We need a freakin' "LIKE" button!

 

[CutieMouse]

My unsolicited advice... (Oh the irony of offering unsolicited advice, in a thread wondering if this unsolicited advice thing is the norm around here... )

1) If someone PMs you and starts asking uncomfortable/intrusive questions, you're under no obligation to answer. In my world, "intrusive questions" can (and occasionally does) extend to "Here, lemmie help you ID yourself... you know, me being such a generous person and all. All ya gotta do answer XYZ [usually rude*] questions, in detail."

My response to that is usually "So sorry, but my journey is my own; I don't discuss details of my proclivities with strangers."

2) There are people who rarely (if ever) contribute to BDSM Talk/Cafe, but follow the forum specifically to "help" newbies. I'm not a big fan of "vetting", but if you get a PM from someone who's posting history is primarily BDSM Personals or The Playground... IMO the odds of being a HNG looking for someone to manipulate goes up.

3) It's been tossed around before that we offer newbies the suggestion of turning off PM's for a bit, for their own protection. The argument being that although there are reasons to take conversation private, that is a decision that should be made by you, not some stranger offering "helpful" (and unsolicited) "advice". Just something to think about.

And finally

4) I've been told I'm not submissive, and of a slave mindset... all in the same week. One of The Men™ let a friend watch us in bed one day, and at the end (when asked - J is a very curious sort), the guy informed us that what we do might qualify as rough sex, but has nothing to do with D/s. We had a really good chuckle over that after he left. Worry about living Your Truth; not someone else's.

* Rude = questions one wouldn't ask if we'd met at an art gallery opening, book shop, or under more "normal" circumstances than Literotica.

 

[Miles Long]

What to expect on this forum

As long as I'm around you can expect some sarcasm here.

 

[WickedSpitFire]

Gah. Holy crap. Good morning again all.

As long as I'm around you can expect some sarcasm here.

Nice to hear. I like sarcasm.

My unsolicited advice... (Oh the irony of offering unsolicited advice, in a thread wondering if this unsolicited advice thing is the norm around here... )

I like irony. It's at least entertaining. Sometimes. Not always.

3) It's been tossed around before that we offer newbies the suggestion of turning off PM's for a bit, for their own protection. The argument being that although there are reasons to take conversation private, that is a decision that should be made by you, not some stranger offering "helpful" (and unsolicited) "advice". Just something to think about.

This forum isn't the only one I participate in, is the thing. I actually created a brand new account because for the life of my I couldn't remember the username OR password to the original two I'd had before. Anyway. Holy shit! The messages I got, JUST FROM JOINING. It made me hustle up to remember. Or at least reset my password.

The original email account I'd linked this account to was so old...it had been deactivated. And I didn't remember my password to that, either. And I didn't remember my security questions. I'd thankfully set up a secondary, newer email account which I do on occasion use. Anyway. Point being. I went through a lot of trouble, 2 email accounts and 2 password resets in fact, to not technically be a NEWBIE dammmmit and I'm not turning off PM's!

First, welcome to the BDSM Talk and BDSM Café fora. The addition of an organized and literate poster is a beauteous thing!

Haha. Hi. Much appreciated.

Second, love lurve LUV your opening post for this thread, especially the underlined portion, more especially the bolded portions within that, and even moreso the portion that magically turned red. What really matters in this whole "labeling" thing is what works for you. You're the one who has to live with it, and your ability to recognize that and the fact that whatever label(s) you may choose could be at least somewhat fluid is a breath of fresh air to those of us who have seen thread upon thread upon thread of people wanting someone else to pin a label to their labia (or lingam) *for* them.

So. Okay. If we have to get caught up in the conversation of labels...at least I know one or two people got my meaning. The topic of labels wasn't necessarily the main point. It's a hot topic though, so it's going to get discussed, into the ground, for what's likely the umpteenth millionth time. But hooray! It's nice to see more than one person picked up on the irony of my post and question.

Why not? Most of the rest of us do. Anything we might do or post to help others is because it's something *we* want to do. If we don't want to do it, we don't. That's selfish, by my definition.

Touche.

The crowd here *is* a little bit clique-y, in the sense that there are some folks who have been here for years and sort of constitute a core constituency. Then there are people who have been here for months, and by virtue of their contributions (see sharing themselves, below), become a part of that core constituency. HOWEVER, it's one of the most *open* cliques I've ever experienced, and I'm >60 years old! This group welcomes just about anyone who comes in with an open mind and a desire to learn, or share what they've learned, or just come in and share of themselves a little bit (whether deep philosophical or life lessons, or jokes and puns and things we've found that entertain us on the Interwebz or things that have pissed us off in the past day or three). I think you have the potential to fit into this group without running into many potholes. Time will tell. ......Again... Welcome to the Talk and Café fora! I've got a feeling you could be here for years.

Dawww. Thanks. And I support addition of like button. No website is complete without a like, or love, button.

 

[Shankara20]

in these umm.. seven years? holy shit.

You "old timer" you.....

 

[Shankara20]

Nice to hear. I like sarcasm.

Then you will do well here...

Welcome.

 

[Primalex]

Can someone summarize this thread for me?

Right now it looks to me like some SRP chick with tits wondering about PMs from guys and she even asks whether her future will hold more or less stupid PMs for her. I don't think any PM can be much more stupid than these questions...

 

[WickedSpitFire]

Can someone summarize this thread for me?

Right now it looks to me like some SRP chick with tits wondering about PMs from guys and she even asks whether her future will hold more or less stupid PMs for her. I don't think any PM can be much more stupid than these questions...

So. Tell me how you really feel.

 

[Primalex]

So. Tell me how you really feel.

Before your reply I was worried that my assertion was wrong. Now I'm relieved.