A Happy Medium

[SecondCircle]

We've all read every sort of story. Some seem to be complete fantasy, others are grounded in reality.

I've noticed that some readers like fantasy. You know... big breasted blonde with legs up to heaven that's just dying for a taste. Cute sensitive fit guy with the perfect smile. While these are quite "unrealistic" compared to what we actually come across in the world, stories can fill that hole with the fantasy they bring.

On the other hand, other readers prefer "realism". Down to earth, flawed characters that are attractive in their very own way, but with more realistic traits and appearances.

I prefer the middle ground. That middle ground in between.

As pertains to Lit, do you prefer one or the other? Or both at desperate times? Or that "Happy Medium?"

 

[mikoli5763]

Depends

It depends on the mood I'm in. As an avid reader of almost anything, sometimes I want fantasy, sometimes I want realism, and sometimes I want a little of both together.

 

[peterlychen]

I prefer a flawed character. In that way I can see a bit of myself in the character. In addition, it is encouraging to see him or her either overcome the flaw or use it to an advantage to solve the dilemma.

 

[StrangeLife]

I don't really care as long as the characters act in a plausible way. And of course are "plausible of build" - I usually stop reading when I encounter the first 15" cock or the first set of 87DD boobs.

 

[SamScribble]

I like characters to be interesting and engaging. This seldom has anything to do with how the characters look. For me the interest lies in how they behave, how they react to events and other characters, and how they speak. And, above all, I want them to be 'fictionally convincing'; they need to abide by a logic which, while it may be very different from a real-life logic, is still logical and consistent.

 

[slyc_willie]

We've all read every sort of story. Some seem to be complete fantasy, others are grounded in reality.

I've noticed that some readers like fantasy. You know... big breasted blonde with legs up to heaven that's just dying for a taste. Cute sensitive fit guy with the perfect smile. While these are quite "unrealistic" compared to what we actually come across in the world, stories can fill that hole with the fantasy they bring.

On the other hand, other readers prefer "realism". Down to earth, flawed characters that are attractive in their very own way, but with more realistic traits and appearances.

I prefer the middle ground. That middle ground in between.

As pertains to Lit, do you prefer one or the other? Or both at desperate times? Or that "Happy Medium?"

I'm assuming you meant "disparate."

Asking this question of a bunch of authors is, I think, asking the blind to lead the blind. What the hell do we know about what readers want, after all? If we make the effort to see the trends, to follow the current hot topic, we cease to be writers and instead become assembly-line manufacturers of erotic trope.

Of course readers want the fantasy. They want to read about perfect humans having perfect sex so that they can interject themselves into a fantasy realm and thereby escape the boring humdrum of their lives. They want to pretend they are Joe. T. Stud with a massive cock and a swimmer's body boning that cute girl next door who acts like a high school freshman but is actually of age.

And yet . . . .

Of course readers want realism. They want explanations as to why sex and relationships are so much more convoluted and confusing than they think they should be. They want to know that the imperfect woman with sagging breasts and a little too much flesh on her hips can still be sexy, and that the man with the average cock can still be a demon in bed.

What it comes down to is whether or not we, as authors, want to serve a particular audience, or simply write what we want and let the chips fall as they may. Do you want to be Stephanie Myers, or Elmore Leonard? Do you want to be remembered for writing something popular, or remembered for writing well?

When it comes to what I want to read, I want to read something that makes me want to turn the next page. I couldn't possibly tell you what criteria would be in order for that. All I can say is that if knowing what the readers want is such a big concern, then you're not writing. You're churning.

 

[lovecraft68]

I go for flawed. These days society and the people who make up that society are so screwed up that even "happy medium" is unrealistic expectations.

Having said that, there are not a lot of stories (that I have read anyway) that aren't mostly fantasy.

the others that do ground their work in reality are considered dark.

The majority of readers here are looking for the light and fluffy porno "Hey baby let's go" read.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, to each their own, but for my tastes a lot of what's here makes me roll my eyes.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I go with the people I know, and what I've witnessed.

Sex is a stage upon which people perform their scripts, if their lives are roles, and most lives are roles or banal routines.

I assume all are flawed because I've never met anyone who isn't flawed. Most people aren't interesting. Most people cheat...the boss, their partner, the IRS, themselves. They take whats okay and ruin it. Some times theyre heroic and noble.

So I strive to depict people as they are. I think its useful for readers to see characters fuck up, fail, and be miserable like they are when they pull the same stupid stunts.

Raymond Chandler observed that most writers go for the bullshit the mob demands, and are forgotten; the realists hook the few people who really do know, and endure because their stuff is accurate and valuable.

 

[Bramblethorn]

As pertains to Lit, do you prefer one or the other? Or both at desperate times? Or that "Happy Medium?"

I like realistic characters, though I'm not so fussed about the settings.

 

[PennLady]

Generally, I prefer realistic characters, although I have to say a lot of it depends on my mood. I may be in a mood to overlook some of the cliche characters -- the Adonis-like guy, the amazingly gorgeous woman -- if the story itself is interesting, or the style of writing, or something.

I definitely prefer writing more realistic characters. In terms of physical description, I often forget to do it at all. I usually leave it pretty vague and let the reader fill in as they like.

Personally, I do *not* care for the DD-women and the men with 12" dicks. It seems like a cliche that many authors write because they think readers want it. And many readers do, and that's fine -- I don't care to read it, but I'm not going to tell anyone else what to write or read. OTOH, I think some people write that because they think that's what porn or erotica should be, and that's not the same.

 

[TxRad]

I knew this "Happy Medium" once a long time ago.... But that was a whole different story.

I leave my characters on the vagish side so the reader can fill in their own preferences unless it is something needed for the story.

Real characters? I use a mix or at least try to keep them real but sometimes it's fun to work off the edge of the page so to speak. Fantasy characters are easier as they come to mind fully formed to fit the story.

A lot of my stories come from pictures and other visual things. Duh, I'm a guy, what can I say. Then the description might be more complete as I have the picture or image fully in my head.

Which do I prefer to read? It's all according to the story.

 

[LaRascasse]

When reading, I prefer the characters to have some features beyond oversized bodyparts. I especially like interesting character studies.

When writing, I prefer a bit of both actually. My characters are usually physically flawless, but I give them deep psychological issues. For instance, I have an ongoing set of stories based on a lesbian corporate lawyer who hates herself because of what she does for a living, but does it anyway. Those flaws are what drives the story.

It's an erotic site after all. The mental image of a woman with saggy breasts and a spare tyre does not exactly let libidos on fire. I am sure you can make attractive characters who (only) have single digit inches of cock and women whose breasts aren't large enough to sustain a Haagen-Dazs. Keep them good lookers but give them interesting personalities and I believe you can get good feedback.

 

[sr71plt]

Is a happy medium anything like a well-fucked clairvoyant--or, in the States, just any form of fortuneteller with premises on the side of the highway?

 

[soflabbwlvr]

As pertains to Lit, do you prefer one or the other? Or both at desperate times? Or that "Happy Medium?"

When reading, I prefer characters who are drawn to a realistic scale. I like them to resemble the people I interact with on a daily basis. That's where my fantasies are derived, i.e., the women I see every day.

Writing is probably closer to a 75/25 split, realistic to fantastic. If there are conventionally beautiful characters, it is because they fit the story and not the other way around. If they are athletes, then they have athletic bodies. A lot of my stories are set in Miami (most, actually) and, well, there are a lot of beautiful people here. But the over riding theme in my stories is that ordinary people with average looks can have great sex, too. Effort is more important than attributes.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Is a happy medium anything like a well-fucked clairvoyant--or, in the States, just any form of fortuneteller with premises on the side of the highway?

I was hoping it would be the perfect blouse at last.

(The one that doesn't have a bit of a gap constantly popping open between the two buttons just above and below your boobs, which reveals the tiny bow and heart-shaped diamante stud in the centre of your bra.)

 

[SecondCircle]

I was hoping it would be the perfect blouse at last.

(The one that doesn't have a bit of a gap constantly popping open between the two buttons just above and below your boobs, which reveals the tiny bow and heart-shaped diamante stud in the centre of your bra.)

... that's very specific....

It seems that many people prefer a more realistic take on their characters. They're easy to relate to, they don't tip the suspension of disbelief too far, and they can still be just as sexy or hot as any impossibly perfect and slutty porn goddess. But there does have to be a little bit of the impossible hidden in the character, be it obvious or subliminal, as in the actions they pursue within the story. 70/30 kinda thing.

Now as it pertains to what I write (it's usually horror, both on and off site) I often have to stop and think about how the characters behave. As in asking, "would she realistically say that? Or react that way?" Especially when it comes to injecting fear into the story. A lot of people read horror or watch movies and they always say, "oh my god, really? She tripped over a log? How stupid! She dropped the keys? Why did she run upstairs? Why not bust the window open? I would have done this and that and this and blah blah blah blah..."

Fear is a powerful emotion, as is passion. In the throes of passion, we do things impulsively sometimes. Ever noticed a guy will act differently around a pretty girl? He'll say things that are sorta out of character, or do things that seem irrational. Even during sex, when the testosterone or estrogen or whatever is pumping, people will let themselves go when they would normally be shy, or lose a bit of confidence where normally they are bold and outgoing.

Just like when we are terrified and running through the woods, we trip over logs that we can't fucking see. Because we are freaking out. We are in the moment, shitting our pants, and not thinking realistically or logically at all. At the watering hole near potential mates, we act like idiots or talk differently, still shitting our pants so to speak, on into the bedroom and so on and so forth.

Are there ever any times, while typing away at your computer, thinking to yourself, "I would do this," or "it makes sense for my character to do this or react this way"... that it occurs to you that given a realistic scenario a character would act irrational or almost unbelievably unrealistic? How do you tackle these instances? How do you convey it in a way that it doesn't repulse the reader's senses with behavior that they "think" is logical?

... my Samoan guy told me I've reached my word limit, so I'll leave that complicated question as is. Sorry.

 

[NaokoSmith]

Was the unhappily small blouse unrealistically detailed?

What actually happens in 'real life' and what comes across as 'realistic' in a story are two different things. In the FAWC thread there is an argument about whether it was realistic for one character in a story to enjoy sucking off a guy. Do women get that much pleasure out of giving head? 'Do they in real life?' is actually a different question to 'Is it convincing?' when they are shown slavering all over some man's piece of meat in a story.

For this reason, it can be good to get a beta reader. You might not need help with your grammar or spelling. However someone-else can flick over your story and tell you whether they were convinced by what happens in it, or if they suddenly lost the suspension of disbelief.

'Oh, what?! She tripped over a log? Stupid woman, that is obviously just a trick to allow the person chasing to catch up with her. Now I dropped out of the story and I am aware I'm just sitting on the bus reading it on a tiny phone screen instead of in the forest, running along with a pain in my side and so scared that I'm going to be caught that I look behind me, miss seeing a log and fall over it.'

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

When reading, I prefer characters who are drawn to a realistic scale. I like them to resemble the people I interact with on a daily basis. That's where my fantasies are derived, i.e., the women I see every day.

Writing is probably closer to a 75/25 split, realistic to fantastic. If there are conventionally beautiful characters, it is because they fit the story and not the other way around. If they are athletes, then they have athletic bodies. A lot of my stories are set in Miami (most, actually) and, well, there are a lot of beautiful people here. But the over riding theme in my stories is that ordinary people with average looks can have great sex, too. Effort is more important than attributes.

If looks mattered there wouldn't be so many ugly people.

 

[SecondCircle]

Was the unhappily small blouse unrealistically detailed?

What actually happens in 'real life' and what comes across as 'realistic' in a story are two different things. In the FAWC thread there is an argument about whether it was realistic for one character in a story to enjoy sucking off a guy. Do women get that much pleasure out of giving head? 'Do they in real life?' is actually a different question to 'Is it convincing?' when they are shown slavering all over some man's piece of meat in a story.

For this reason, it can be good to get a beta reader. You might not need help with your grammar or spelling. However someone-else can flick over your story and tell you whether they were convinced by what happens in it, or if they suddenly lost the suspension of disbelief.

'Oh, what?! She tripped over a log? Stupid woman, that is obviously just a trick to allow the person chasing to catch up with her. Now I dropped out of the story and I am aware I'm just sitting on the bus reading it on a tiny phone screen instead of in the forest, running along with a pain in my side and so scared that I'm going to be caught that I look behind me, miss seeing a log and fall over it.'

I suppose it's mainly all about your choice of words and how you write it. This can get into that red zone that people here talk about, with too many adjectives and long drawn out paragraphs or scenes.

But I've posted before about how sometimes, everything counts. A passage could be written with an intended pacing, word connotations, seemingly too descriptive sentences, etc. There are also the warnings about only writing what's "relevant" to the story, when different readers have different views on what's relevant.

For instance, I could just disclose that a girl is fleeing through a dark, dense wooded area from some terrible unseen assailant. Her foot catches a stump and she is sent tumbling to the ground. She panics as a shadow draws closer. I could write that a woman flirts and teases with a man at the table, then decides to plunge beneath the table and bring him to glorious orgasm, and rise from the table satisfied and giddy, dabbing at the corners of her mouth with a napkin.

Both do the trick. They use a few strong adjectives (if written to format) and are descriptive enough to let the reader know what's going on. The stories will maintain a decent word count, cover the themes in the story, and entertain on some level.

But for me? As a reader? That's not enough. Strong adjective here and straightforward description there. Why did that chick go down on the guy under the table? Because of the paragraph or few sentences that detail the bottled emotions boiling within her. A hunger that will not remain caged. She may not seem like it on the surface, but she LOVES sex and bring naughty. She might even love the taste of dick. It aint implausible. (Cue JBJ) Explain the thoughts that are bouncing around in her head, and the tremors in her hips and the wetness beneath her tongue.

Show that girl's panic in the woods. Her mind is a jumble of thoughts and fears that read just like they are to her. Her every sense a dark haze, sharp shallow breath, teary eyes that cannot find their way through the abysmal shapes of the trees. The thorns that claw and clutch at her calves, the hair matted to her forehead. The gnarled trunk that collides with her foot, twisting it aside and flinging her to the earth.

Too much perhaps. (The post is, definitely) But leaving things to the readers imagination and letting the story unfold in their head doesn't mean that you always need less. It shouldn't mean that you trim so much fat that you have writers anorexia. Too much trimming leaves a perfectly correct but skeletal story that will not convey the powerful emotions that drive the story.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I suppose it's mainly all about your choice of words and how you write it. This can get into that red zone that people here talk about, with too many adjectives and long drawn out paragraphs or scenes.

But I've posted before about how sometimes, everything counts. A passage could be written with an intended pacing, word connotations, seemingly too descriptive sentences, etc. There are also the warnings about only writing what's "relevant" to the story, when different readers have different views on what's relevant.

For instance, I could just disclose that a girl is fleeing through a dark, dense wooded area from some terrible unseen assailant. Her foot catches a stump and she is sent tumbling to the ground. She panics as a shadow draws closer. I could write that a woman flirts and teases with a man at the table, then decides to plunge beneath the table and bring him to glorious orgasm, and rise from the table satisfied and giddy, dabbing at the corners of her mouth with a napkin.

Both do the trick. They use a few strong adjectives (if written to format) and are descriptive enough to let the reader know what's going on. The stories will maintain a decent word count, cover the themes in the story, and entertain on some level.

But for me? As a reader? That's not enough. Strong adjective here and straightforward description there. Why did that chick go down on the guy under the table? Because of the paragraph or few sentences that detail the bottled emotions boiling within her. A hunger that will not remain caged. She may not seem like it on the surface, but she LOVES sex and bring naughty. She might even love the taste of dick. It aint implausible. (Cue JBJ) Explain the thoughts that are bouncing around in her head, and the tremors in her hips and the wetness beneath her tongue.

Show that girl's panic in the woods. Her mind is a jumble of thoughts and fears that read just like they are to her. Her every sense a dark haze, sharp shallow breath, teary eyes that cannot find their way through the abysmal shapes of the trees. The thorns that claw and clutch at her calves, the hair matted to her forehead. The gnarled trunk that collides with her foot, twisting it aside and flinging her to the earth.

Too much perhaps. (The post is, definitely) But leaving things to the readers imagination and letting the story unfold in their head doesn't mean that you always need less. It shouldn't mean that you trim so much fat that you have writers anorexia. Too much trimming leaves a perfectly correct but skeletal story that will not convey the powerful emotions that drive the story.

RULE OF THUMB: The less experience you have the more details you require. Hemingway suggested that writers trim it down to the essentials with the biggest bang and wallop.

 

[SecondCircle]

RULE OF THUMB: The less experience you have the more details you require. Hemingway suggested that writers trim it down to the essentials with the biggest bang and wallop.

Empty to me. Direct, correct, and boring. Doesn't do very much to immerse me or put me in the scene. Doesn't get me nervous or worked up or hot and bothered or on my seat's edge or gripped by terror or anything.

It becomes a PowerPoint presentation, with all the main ideas highlighted and the emotion peeled away. To each their own though. Imagination need not be forgotten. It's our most powerful tool. But sometimes I don't want to be told about the bird and imagine what it would be like to fly.

I wanna feel the wind in my feathers.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Empty to me. Direct, correct, and boring. Doesn't do very much to immerse me or put me in the scene. Doesn't get me nervous or worked up or hot and bothered or on my seat's edge or gripped by terror or anything.

It becomes a PowerPoint presentation, with all the main ideas highlighted and the emotion peeled away. To each their own though. Imagination need not be forgotten. It's our most powerful tool. But sometimes I don't want to be told about the bird and imagine what it would be like to fly.

I wanna feel the wind in my feathers.

I'll tell you what I usta say to my patients when they accused me of pissing them off.

IF I HAD THE POWER TO MAKE YOU FEEL ANYTHING I'D MAKE YOU WANNA GIMME ALL YOUR MONEY OR SPREAD YOUR LEGS. Own your feelings.

 

[TxRad]

Hemingway was like a machine gunner. He sprayed short choppy sentences everywhere. Like the machine gunner, some hit and some didn't. But in the end, they all made you duck and cover.

The essence, maybe. More like a writing style, IMHO.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Right now I prefer outrageously unrealistic action. bottoms that can live in contorted bondage for three days straight, no one ever has to pee, no one ever bleeds from ten hour gangbangs, no one cramps up in the sling.

The characters doing these stupid and implausible things? They have a flaw or two, (if there's any character development going, at least). otherwise, I don't feel sexiness from them.

 

[Ironiclaconic]

I write what I would call realistic fantasy, where the fantasy elements are made far more realistic by stories and characters that reveal themselves plausibly within the internal logic of the world I have created.

Realism is boring. Realism is average looking, insecure people fumbling at each other and then feeling awkward afterward, as they realize they don't like each other very much. Realism is STDs, headaches, kids interrupting, and inconveniently timed farts.

Fuck realism.

Pure fantasy is too impossible. Perfect people are annoying. Partners who exist soley to fulfill our sexual fantasies don't exist. I am knocked out of the story when I roll my eyes.

Fuck perfect fantasy.

But make the fantasy something I can believe, immersed in a story, with realistic characters I love, and I am lost. The supermodel roommate who walks in during see and says "may I join?" makes me snort. However, if the far-more-beautiful-than-she-thinks roommate with a cloistered upbringing listens to the sounds of sex through the walls, feeding her fertile imagination to the point where she hides in their closet the next night, peeking through the slats. Oh my God, what's he doing to her? She shifts to a better angle and slips, making a sound. The sex stops, and resumes with whispers. They know she is there...

Yeah, I can buy that, and when done right, it's fucking hot.