64 Years Ago, Today…

[amicus]

64 Years Ago, Today…




Japan already had a conquering army in China, Great Britain had survived the London Blitz, The City of Light was occupied by the Germans and North Africa was a tank battleground for Rommel, the Vichy French and the Italians. An idyllic day in Honolulu, a Sunday morning.

I check the date each day when I arise, either on the computer monitor or the television program menu; December 7th.

December 7th, 1941.

Not a mention all morning long on any of four cable news outlets. Out of 900 cable channels, only the History Channel was showing a war film, “Tora, Tora, Tora.”(Tiger, Tiger, Tiger), not the movie but a documentary.

It is time, I guess, here in the 21st century, to leave the past behind, it must be. I admit a mild surprise that the producers and directors of all the cable news programs chose not to include a memorial piece.

There never was and never will be a war quite like World War Two. Yes, I know, WW1 was once called ‘the big one’, the war to end all wars. But it wasn’t.

The second world war was truly a global conflict. The entire population of most nations went on a total war effort with conscription, forced military service, rationing of essential supplies, cessation of civilian production of goods to concentrate on military hardware, blackouts and marital law, except of course, those occupied countries in Europe and the Far East.

Yes, there will never be another conflict quite like that one.

Not that one should glorify war, but this was the Big Band Era, Swing music swept what was left of the world. Women left the home in droves for the first time to become part of the war effort. Young men and old alike lined up to volunteer for military service; National Pride was high and growing with War Bonds and metal collections of pots and pans and plowshares to be turned into tanks and guns.

I imagine that as this day wears on in the year 2005, a news outlet here and there might do a short piece. I am sure that the remaining veterans of that era, now in their 80’s will hold parades and marches here and there.

I do not complain at the lack of news reports and remembrances, it is as it should be, I suppose, history.

Amicus…

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I think Amicus with the 60 year anniversary not toolong ago, that most media outlets really burned out every possible angle, memorial, human interst story, etc. trelating to Pearl Harbor.

I do not think people have forgotten. I do think the rememberance will be more subdued and solemn for a while. Which to me, is entierly approrpriate.

 

[amicus]

I think Amicus with the 60 year anniversary not toolong ago, that most media outlets really burned out every possible angle, memorial, human interst story, etc. trelating to Pearl Harbor.

I do not think people have forgotten. I do think the rememberance will be more subdued and solemn for a while. Which to me, is entierly approrpriate.

Perhaps you are correct, Colly, but I recall that year as the year of 9/11, I really don't remember much of the 60th anniversary celebrations, probably just me though.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Nevertheless, it was the most galvanizing and horrifying attack on this country until 9/11.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

It's a day I won't forget.

 

[zeb1094]

It's a day I won't forget.

Me either, as a tailgunner on a blimp it was my job to keep the little buggers off our tail.

Wait, no that was a dream I had last night. Nevermind.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Nevertheless, it was the most galvanizing and horrifying attack on this country until 9/11.

I think many people forget that, just as one day they will forget 9/11.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

I hope not.

 

[oggbashan]

Starts and Finishes

We usually remember the end of wars, not the beginnings.

The date on which WWI or WWII started? I doubt that many people know because the dates vary for each country.

Pearl Harbor is different and a memorable beginning because there was no declaration of war. That attack changed the US public's attitude to war. If there had been a referendum on December 6th - the US citizens would have voted against war. On December 8th?

Pearl Harbour should be remembered. So should many other days on which people died defending freedom but November 11th is enough for most. For each family affected by war there will also be personal dates when a father, a grandfather or another relation died.

We should not forget but we should also aim to ensure that the sacrifices for freedom were not in vain.

Og

 

[ABSTRUSE]

I hope not.

Ditto, but do you feel we are really prepared against another attack?

 

[Guest]

From December 7, 1941 to VJ Day on August 15, 1945, were 1,347 days.

In those 1347 days in the 1940's, the Allies :

invaded & liberated North Africa
invaded & liberated Sicily
invaded & liberated Italy
invaded & liberated France and all of Europe
liberated survivors from Nazi deathcamps
invaded Guadalcanal, Ima Jima, Okinawa, and the Phillipines
invented the Atomic Bomb
made the helicopter operational for war
built 155 aircraft carriers
built 1100 convoy escort ships
built 422 submarines
built 633,000 aircraft
destroyed Nazi Germany
destroyed a militaristic Japan
help with the liberation of vast parts of China


* production figures from Wikipedia , accuracy assumed but not confirmed.

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

We usually remember the end of wars, not the beginnings.

The date on which WWI or WWII started? I doubt that many people know because the dates vary for each country.

Pearl Harbor is different and a memorable beginning because there was no declaration of war. That attack changed the US public's attitude to war. If there had been a referendum on December 6th - the US citizens would have voted against war. On December 8th?

Pearl Harbour should be remembered. So should many other days on which people died defending freedom but November 11th is enough for most. For each family affected by war there will also be personal dates when a father, a grandfather or another relation died.

We should not forget but we should also aim to ensure that the sacrifices for freedom were not in vain.

Og

Amen. Although, for some reason, 9/1/39 always sticks in my mind.

However, since today is the 64th anniversary of Japanese carrier-based aircraft blowing the hell out of Pearl Harbor, I'm going out and kick a Mitsubishi.

By the way, they're having a "Blowout Sale." Don't you just love the timing?

Rumple Foreskin

 

[amicus]

From December 7, 1941 to VJ Day on August 15, 1945, were 1,347 days.

In those 1347 days in the 1940's, the Allies (aka a US led coalition)

invaded & liberated North Africa
invaded & liberated Sicily
invaded & liberated Italy
invaded & liberated France and all of Europe
liberated survivors from Nazi deathcamps
invaded Guadalcanal, Ima Jima, Okinawa, and the Phillipines
invented the Atomic Bomb
made the helicopter operational for war
built 155 aircraft carriers
built 1100 convoy escort ships
built 422 submarines
built 633,000 aircraft
destroyed Nazi Germany
destroyed a militaristic Japan
help with the liberation of vast parts of China


* production figures from Wikipedia , accuracy assumed but not confirmed.

633,000 aircraft...that is astounding, thanks Ted E. Bare...

Tailgunner on a blimp? I love that one...

Ogbashan...was hoping for a comment from you

many regards...

 

[LadyJeanne]

64 years ago today, my country had been under occupation by the Axis Powers since spring of 1941. They resisted. Many died anyway. The world is a bloody place.

for those who fought on their behalf!

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

What country? Greece? Croatia? Slovenia? Bosnia? Serbia? Montenegro? Macedonia?

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Ditto, but do you feel we are really prepared against another attack?

Hopes so. Fears not.

 

[LadyJeanne]

What country? Greece? Croatia? Slovenia? Bosnia? Serbia? Montenegro? Macedonia?

Yes, one of those.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Yes, one of those.

Just listing the countries (not counting the USSR) that the Germans invaded in that year. Incidentally, I like Eastern European and Mediterranean girls. Very exotic.

 

[amicus]

SeverusMax "...Originally Posted by ABSTRUSE
Ditto, but do you feel we are really prepared against another attack?



Hopes so. Fears not...."

Going out on a limb here, carefully, feeling my way...

The United States has become what is called a 'hard target' at the present time and getting harder every passing day.

A couple levels to approach this: I suspect that some terrorist attacks against the United States have already been thwarted but we have not been told. Not been told so as not to inform the terrorist leaders and planners that we either foiled a plot or have cell members in custody and under interrogation.

Secondly I am a history and military buff and watch and read the newest technological advances as much as possible. Even the declassified information that is available hints at tremendous advances in surveillance, detection and tracking of threat possibilities.

The latest take on the direction of terrorism I have heard is that Iran will complete a nuclear device soon, but not for use against Israel, as would be expected, or even against coalition assets, per se, but rather to trigger an electro magnetic pulse in the middle east region.

Such a device would/could disable all energy sources, electricity generators, power lines and grids in a wide area. The Pulse would also destroy existing communications devices for both military and civilian users, thereby rendering the entire area incapable of defending itself against a combined Iranian/Syrian invasion.

It would also destroy economies in the region, curtail all forms of transportation and basically paralyze the entire area.

The assets in Iran and Syria would no doubt be protected from the Pulse as they would know before hand when the event was due and simply shut down the systems and they would not be damaged.

I read of this several days ago and thought it rather far fetched at the time and perhaps it is. The US conducts a very high tech war effort with great dependence on computer technology; all un protected computers would be fried by the Pulse.

The interruption of energy supplies by hurricane Katrina must have been a clue as to how a terrorist attack might best affect the US economy. Port Everglades in Florida, the Port facilities in New Orleans and Houston and Brownsville, Texas and the Port of Los Angeles would be prime targets for that kind of attack.

Shipping and air cargo are considered to be the next most vulnerable assets and I will not believe that strong measures have not been taken to protect them.

Again, I am somewhat of an optimist in terms of the ability of the US to defend itself from this kind of attack.

That being said, a chemical or biological attack against a large number of people, say a superbowl crowd or dusting an entire city with a bacteriological element also remains a possiblity.

amicus...

 

[amicus]

Just listing the countries (not counting the USSR) that the Germans invaded in that year. Incidentally, I like Eastern European and Mediterranean girls. Very exotic.

I would have added Poland, as the Soviet Union gobbled half of that, and the Low Countries, as the Soviet Union, after the pact with Germany, also moved into Finland.

amicus...

 

[LadyJeanne]

Just listing the countries (not counting the USSR) that the Germans invaded in that year. Incidentally, I like Eastern European and Mediterranean girls. Very exotic.

It wasn't until college that I realized men would find me exotic. Until then, I was just a damn foreigner.



On behalf of all the Eastern European and Mediterranean girls out there, I thank you!

 

[Guest]

It wasn't until college that I realized men would find me exotic. Until then, I was just a damn foreigner.



On behalf of all the Eastern European and Mediterranean girls out there, I thank you!

No, thank you.

 

[LadyJeanne]

No, thank you.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

 

[TheEarl]

Again, I am somewhat of an optimist in terms of the ability of the US to defend itself from this kind of attack.

That being said, a chemical or biological attack against a large number of people, say a superbowl crowd or dusting an entire city with a bacteriological element also remains a possiblity.

amicus...

I really wish I shared your optimism. But to quote the murdering fuckwits of the IRA, "Remember, we only have to be lucky once. You will have to be lucky always."

I don't think there is a way to defend against all terrorism, no matter how much you clamp down.

Interesting theorising on the Iranian EMP. However, with the US in Iraq, would they dare when there is so much military force on their doorstep. I'm sure the US would like any opportunity to invade Iran and, even if they could knock out all of the equipment, the US's resources worldwide would overwhelm. Iran might take Israel, but they'd never be able to hold it.

The Earl