Can a recovering alcoholic ever get better?

There`s this guy, he`s a recovering alcoholic, has been for a while, although he has had a few relaspes in the past, he`s divorced with 2 young children.

I want to know if it`s possible he`ll get better, he wants to stay sober and doesn`t drink alcohol, i don`t want to see him dead because of his disease

This is a topic that I can personally say a lot about. I know a LOT of alcoholics, and my genes make me predisposed towards it.

It IS possible to get sober. But its damn difficult for some and for a select few maybe impossible. A good friend of mine tried so hard to stay sober and no matter how much rehab he went through couldn't stop himself until a drunk driving experience left him paralyzed.

Sometimes the worst of alcoholics need wake up calls like this. Others don't. I can't say what it is about certain people that make them doomed alcholics and those who can recover.

They often find support in the care of those who love them. But be VERY careful not to cater. A degree of tough love is needed; too little or too much is destructive.

PM me if you want to talk more about my experiences from alcohol.

deepstare said:

This is a topic that I can personally say a lot about. I know a LOT of alcoholics, and my genes make me predisposed towards it.

It IS possible to get sober. But its damn difficult for some and for a select few maybe impossible. A good friend of mine tried so hard to stay sober and no matter how much rehab he went through couldn't stop himself until a drunk driving experience left him paralyzed.

Sometimes the worst of alcoholics need wake up calls like this. Others don't. I can't say what it is about certain people that make them doomed alcholics and those who can recover.

They often find support in the care of those who love them. But be VERY careful not to cater. A degree of tough love is needed; too little or too much is destructive.

PM me if you want to talk more about my experiences from alcohol.

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Ditto what deepstare said.

also, please note alcoholics are master manipulators.

I not trying to be mean here , I'm only stating facts.

Hell, I helped start an AA one time. Not being one I could only get it kicked off and hand it over to some other people.

The guy i`m talking about has 2 alcoholic parents although i don`t know if they`ve admitted to having a problem, plus his ex wife did make his problems public, every little detail of his private life was exposed for the whole world to see, that seemed to drive him further into his alcohol and drug addiction.

The guy has a disease that he brought on himself, if he had self control he wouldn`t be a recovering alcoholic but i guess the type of job he has didn`t help.

ITA with deep, one of my friends' is a hopeless alky....

My family has a good number of recovering alcoholics, most of them have had some relapses but quite a few have stayed sober for many years (20 years or more).

I'm also pre-disposed towards being an alcoholic, something that has made me monitor myself carefully. I enjoy the occasional drink but have always stayed aware of my tendancies.

My father, several uncles, and 3 of my grandparents were alcoholics.

I have been exposed to many people with many different addictions ranging from alcohol to perscription drugs, illegal drugs, even normal smoking, etc.

It comes down to the person and their motivation to staying sober and clean, in my own experience most people who are addicted wont stay clean until a major life changing event occurs (hitting bottom).

If the person is truly committed to staying clean and sober in the long run and get the help and support that they need both in the present and the future it is entirely possible to overcome addiction but it isn't something you can battle once and just leave behind you.
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I can only speak for the people I've known and my own experiences.

I've been sober for 13 years now, and the Birdman is going on 18 years, but it is still a constant struggle. There are days when I can literally feel the craving for alcohol throbbing in my veins, but I know that one little sip will be the first step in destroying my family and myself.

Bird and I both do our best to keep ourselves away from temptation, so there is not one drop of alcohol in our house, not even in our cold medicine. We don't socialize with many drinkers because we've found most are uncomfortable with us not imbibing right along with them. Most importantly, we are teaching our children that for our family, drinking alcohol is tantamount to drinking poison. I can only hope they don't end up learning that lesson the hard way.

Alcoholism isn't a matter of self-control...

Anyone who cares about a recovering alcoholic can do two huge things to help them: support them in their program, and go to Al-Anon, and work a program of their own.

Mary Hall said:

The guy has a disease that he brought on himself, if he had self control he wouldn`t be a recovering alcoholic but i guess the type of job he has didn`t help.

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No one brings a disease onto themselves.

BirdsWife said:

No one brings a disease onto themselves.

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To elaborate on this...I had a drinking problem for a long time, but I don't think I could ever have been classified as an alcoholic. I don't have the gene or the switch or whatever it is that makes a drinking into an alcoholic. When I chose not to drink, the drinking just stopped, and I didn't have any withdrawl symptoms or anything. It wasn't a matter of willpower, it was the simple fact that my brain chemistry doesn't respond to alcohol the way an alcoholic's does.
For those people with the disease, they have no choice in the matter. It isn't a matter of them drinking for too long, too much, and then the become an alcoholic; instead, that switch gets thrown, and they wake up with the disease. I drank almost every day for years, and that switch never turned on. Someone predisposed to alcoholism can drink only on weekends, and suddenly find themselves in the grip of the disease.

Mary Hall said:

I want to know if it`s possible he`ll get better, he wants to stay sober and doesn`t drink alcohol, i don`t want to see him dead because of his disease

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I's been nearly 25 years since I woke up one morning and said, "never again," and meant it for a change.

I consider myself a "Reformed Lush," because I don't subscribe to AA's belief that an an alcoholic can never take another drink.

It depends on the individual as to whether it's possible to"get better" but your friend will always be an "alcoholic" -- it's not something that can be cured; it can only be managed by changing lifestyles.

In my case, I learned that I can't have three drinks, but I can have two drinks. However, I only have those two drinks when there is a reason to have a drink -- a toast at a wedding, a formal dinner where wine is served, or other situation where refusing a drink would require an explantion or special arrangement just for me.

I often find it difficult now to be around people who are drinking, so the support and understanding of those around me is important to help me resist temptation.

With support -- or at least understanding -- from those around him, and by avoiding situations where drinking is "expected" (i.e. other drunks) your friend should be able to beat his alcoholism and other addictive behaviors, but the key is that HE must want to stay clean and sober and constantly work at it.

There are thousands of alcoholics and reformed lushes in this world that you'd never recognise as such, because, like me, they've managed to get control of their problem. I've mastered turning down a drink politely so that the subject of why I don't drink seldom comes up.

Ask another alcoholic, you'll get another answer.

I, unlike Weird Harold, do believe that I cannot ever take another drink again. I believe if I pick up that first drink, I'll be dead within a few months. I am a recovering alcoholic. I will be a recovering alcoholic till the day I die, and with the help of the fellowship of AA, my higher power, and people who are supportive of my program I don't ever have to drink again. I've got some years behind me now, but you don't get "better." Your life changes for the better, yes. But I don't believe I can control my drinking, and I wouldn't dare try.

I had to change everything. The people I hung out with? Gone. They enabled my drinking. The job I had when I was drinking? Gone. It gave me an excuse to play the victim...a great reason to drink. My marriage? Gone. He didn't think I had a problem and resented the time spent at "all those stupid meetings." I made many and huge amounts of sacrifices for one simple thing:

I didn't want to die.

I keep going to those meetings 4 times a week, 4 years later, because:

I don't want to die.

It's pretty simple for me. I won't wish your friend luck, cause it has nothing to do with luck. Its hellish hard work. But I'd rather have the work, and see my kid grow up.

~anelize

Exactly!

Johnny Mayberry said:

Alcoholism isn't a matter of self-control...

Anyone who cares about a recovering alcoholic can do two huge things to help them: support them in their program, and go to Al-Anon, and work a program of their own.

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I encourage you to go to alanon and learn more about this disease. And go to open meetings with him, if you can. My ex was in AA (& Alanon, CODA, & ACA, etc. -it's a family affair), and I learned a lot about it. Many of my/our friends are recovering alcoholics, some for well over 30 years. AA works.
I was also fortunate to listen to many tapes, seminars, group therapy meetings run by an AA member, Books like "Handbook To Higher Consciousness", and more. The experience has made me a better person.

HOWEVER, She is still disfunctional and we are divorced now!
Being sober alone is not enough if the reasons behind the drinking are still there to muck up the rest of your life.
So, learn, get a plan, work it, learn how to best help him and yourself.

AnelizeDarkEyes said:

Ask another alcoholic, you'll get another answer.

I, unlike Weird Harold, do believe that I cannot ever take another drink again. I believe if I pick up that first drink, I'll be dead within a few months. I am a recovering alcoholic. I will be a recovering alcoholic till the day I die, ... But I don't believe I can control my drinking, and I wouldn't dare try.

I had to change everything. ...

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The details change from person to person, but the essentials are pretty basic:

"Everthing has to change"

The amount of alcohol and circumstances where control is lost is unique to each alcoholic. There are many, like you, where that limit is picking up the first drink, and many, like me, who are not as seriously afflicted and can tolerate special occasions.

I hope you enjoy as many years of sobriety as I've managed -- it's difficult, but it does get easier to say, "no thank you" every time you say it.

Just my .02 worth

There is no such thing as a recovering alcoholic in my personal opinion. An alcoholic is either drinking or they are not drinking. In my case, not drinking. For many years.

I don't do bars, I don't associate with people who drink, I just don't believe in tempting faith. I do believe that it is genetic in some. I know that in my family, none of us drink. Simply because we are all aware of what can happen.

If you want to know more about this feel free to pm me.

I too am a recovering alcoholic and so is my wife.There is hope.Alot of people gave up on me years ago.Went to rehab 4 times and still drank and used drugs.The wife had left me and said no more drinking or I will never come back.So I tried to quit and had severe D.T.'s and a seizure in a detox clinic and woke up not knowing where I was at and strapped to a bed and was covered in sweat and I honest to God thought someone had figured out I was insane.Because I had come to the conclusion I was insane and not a worthless drunk.That was my bottom.Now 13 years later I can not even imagine drinking again.My life is so much better now even though a bunch of health problems directly related to my drinking and using have came up now.We do not stay away from people who drink,in todays society that is almost impossible but we don't go hang out in bars etc.We go to parties etc. if we have a good reason to be there.Hell we even have a bottle of unopened whiskey sitting on top of our entertainment center(over 90 years old).People come to our house and sometimes they bring alcohol and that is Ok.Sometimes it is good to be around someone drinking.Fun to watch them at times and also at times see how much of an ass they are and it further reinforces the fact I don't want to drink.So good luck and remember no one is hopeless,but you have to decide how far you will go before you are done.

Thank you all for the great advice, it`s helped me understand his problem a lot more

I often tell people that eating disorders are like alcoholism.... well, I'm going to switch that for you.

Alcoholism is like eating disorders.. you can stop ACTING on the disorder, but it's still there in the back of your mind.. and even if you don't think about it all the time, you might, when really stressed, consider falling off the wagon.

I have an uncle who's an alcoholic... he's been sober for 5 years now. Doesn't mean he's not an alcoholic.. and it doesn't mean he's not tempted... it's really difficult for him to not drink sometimes...

Mary Hall said:

The guy i`m talking about has 2 alcoholic parents although i don`t know if they`ve admitted to having a problem, plus his ex wife did make his problems public, every little detail of his private life was exposed for the whole world to see, that seemed to drive him further into his alcohol and drug addiction.

The guy has a disease that he brought on himself, if he had self control he wouldn`t be a recovering alcoholic but i guess the type of job he has didn`t help.

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OH shit, He's ACOA on top of that.

You do have Your hands full don't you?


I'll bet he doesn't have to have a drank to react strangely to anything or nothing at all.

Here is a link to part of the problem.

http://www.recovery.org/acoa/acoa.html

I am one of them.

Interesting opinions

Weird Harold and Anelize both have very valid points.
It is absolutely imperative that one simple fact be understood:

Every Body Is Different

Some medications work for some people but not others.
Different recovery methods work for some but not others.
Every person has that "switch" in their brain (As Johnny said), but different things will trigger that switch. With any luck, a person will never have to encounter that one thing. Or things.
Some alcoholics must refrain from ever taking another sip of alcohol EVER again. Others have trained themselves and their minds to forcibly control the intake.
I feel that it is incredibly important for people to understand that although some people say the ONLY way is to never touch alcohol again, that is not necessarily true.
If someone must refrain, that is their method and more power to them. However, in my experience, people who subscribe to the 'end-all be-all' approach to alcoholism and other addiction often hurt the recovery process when attempting to help someone. Anelize, I am very impressed with your openmindedness and admission that what works for one may not work for another. The one alcoholic closest to me will never admit to that. He reminds me of a religious fanatic, who believes that their way is the ONLY way and everyone else is totally, unescapably wrong. He believes that anyone who doesn't subscribe to his beliefs will fail.
Huzzah to all the people who have found their own way, be it already developed or not, to heal their addictions.
Okay... I'm going to back slowly away from my soapbox now.

Ang

I also forgot to mention the guy is on medication, it`s something called Antabuse

Johnny Mayberry said:

Alcoholism isn't a matter of self-control...

Anyone who cares about a recovering alcoholic can do two huge things to help them: support them in their program, and go to Al-Anon, and work a program of their own.

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I can guarantee you that many victims of alcoholics will disagree.

I DO NOT believe it is a disease, I DO NOT believe that it is something beyond ones control, I DO NOT think that it qualifies as a medical condition - simply because it IS a matter of choice.

Whether it be alcohol, drugs, food, etc. One choses what they put into their body. If one abuses a substance, it is because they chose to do so. Rehab doesn't work unless the person involved CHOSES to make it work, the same works in reverse - which still makes it a matter of CHOICE.

I understand these things, from both personal and medical stand points. I know all of the arguements to the contrary, and still would not agree that it is an illness. I have gone with others to AA, and Al-Anon. Regardless of the amount of support one has, they have to chose to want help and chose to quit. To say I can't help doing "insert weapon of choice here" because I am predisposed to it, negates personal responsibility for the consequences. How come it is a matter of choice to quit, but not one to start? Regardless of the addiction, it destroys not only the addicts life - but many of those around them - simply because they chose to put their own personal demons above all other aspects of life.

As with any addiction, it is a matter of treating the root of the problem. The addiction itself is not the problem, but a symptom.
Fix the true problem, cure the addiction. Unless a person is willing to address the true problem, I have no tolerance for them, nor their "illness". I have lost people to addictions, and I have chosen to cut out people from my life because of addictions. If your friend is sincere Mary, he will be able to find what works for him. If he wants to continue to hide and escape from life, there is nothing you can do for him.

<off soap box now - flame away>

I don't intend to demean any of the comments made, nor belittle the efforts made by people who have choosen to change their lives for the better.

No need to flame you, cc...you are simply wrong, and all the medical and psychological evidence is against you.

I think alot of people take your view because they see the damage cause by addicts, and want to blame them for it, and calling it a disease 'lets them off the hook'. The other side of dealing with the disease is getting the addict to take responsibility for their disease. Addicts do have a choice about getting help or not, but they also have no choice about the physiology. An act of will alone usually isn't enough. For the true addict, alcohol is like oxygen...and if you don't believe me, talk to anyone you know who absolutely has to have that first cup of coffee in the morning...they are addicts too, and you can see how they suffer physically without caffeine. Multipy that by 1000, and that's how alcoholics feel without their drink.

Ah, but the root of the problem for those that use caffeine is most likely lack of sleep, or the inability to sleep.

If addicts can chose to get help, why cant they chose to not start to begin with? How is this not a choice from the first moment?

Calling it a disease does let an addict off the hook - it negates personal responsibility for their actions. "I am sorry for all the damage caused because I was under the influence, but really it wasn't my fault, you see I have this disease".

A disease is something that invades the body, not something one puts there of there own will.

capricious_chic said:

Ah, but the root of the problem for those that use caffeine is most likely lack of sleep, or the inability to sleep.

If addicts can chose to get help, why cant they chose to not start to begin with? How is this not a choice from the first moment?

Calling it a disease does let an addict off the hook - it negates personal responsibility for their actions. "I am sorry for all the damage caused because I was under the influence, but really it wasn't my fault, you see I have this disease".

A disease is something that invades the body, not something one puts there of there own will.

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I don't think you understand addiction recovery very well...saying that you are not responsible for the addiction does NOT mean that you are not responsible for your actions. In fact, one of the major steps in recovery is admitting to the damage you are responsible for, and trying to make amends for it. No recovery expect would claim someone is progressing in their recovery without owning up to the blame they carry for their actions.