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wetsawdust said:
There's valuable stuff in here, and I appreciate you opening yourself up. As someone who is real time going through what is either a major identity/orientation shift (likely) or a self-absorbed midlife crisis (possible, but it feels too bottled up), and has SO many questions but isn't confident to ask, being able to pop into a thread like this and gain insight is super helpful and keeps insecure fuckers like me from having to ask a potentially sensitive question in a potentially (but totally accidentally) insensitive way. There's a million roadmaps for this, but they're all different, and I feel like I was handed the wrong one. <3
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First rule of the thread is 'There's no such thing as a stupid question' and the second 'We've all got to start somewhere and most of us started knowing zip' so ask away. Some questions may be answered already in the thread, but it has grown to an extent that it can be difficult to find specific topics, although there's a basic index at the start.

So long as you're respectful and accept that personal questions might not always be answered, then don't worry about mentioning body parts and what they do, and often the questions can be emotional ones.
 
stickygirl said:
First rule of the thread is 'There's no such thing as a stupid question' and the second 'We've all got to start somewhere and most of us started knowing zip' so ask away. Some questions may be answered already in the thread, but it has grown to an extent that it can be difficult to find specific topics, although there's a basic index at the start.

So long as you're respectful and accept that personal questions might not always be answered, then don't worry about mentioning body parts and what they do, and often the questions can be emotional ones.
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OK, here's one. My first exposure to trans porn blew my mind. It wasn't about the cock.....yet. It was about just an insane level of hyperfemininity I saw. Everything was so deliberate, but yet there would be a certain point in a scene where she would flash just a hint of masc, and that would just get me going. Of course, I know now what I didn't know then. But my question is....I have a friend who is trans on FB, and she's always posting those angry memes about not fetishizing transpeople. I'll be the first to admit that I do that....but I feel like I do it while maintaining respect for their passion, struggle, and identity. Also, it's kinda my type. Is that kind of attraction offensive? And if so, how can I be more sensitive about it, since the attraction ain't gonna go away? <3
 
wetsawdust said:
OK, here's one. My first exposure to trans porn blew my mind. It wasn't about the cock.....yet. It was about just an insane level of hyperfemininity I saw. Everything was so deliberate, but yet there would be a certain point in a scene where she would flash just a hint of masc, and that would just get me going. Of course, I know now what I didn't know then. But my question is....I have a friend who is trans on FB, and she's always posting those angry memes about not fetishizing transpeople. I'll be the first to admit that I do that....but I feel like I do it while maintaining respect for their passion, struggle, and identity. Also, it's kinda my type. Is that kind of attraction offensive? And if so, how can I be more sensitive about it, since the attraction ain't gonna go away? <3
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I'll take that as an honest question but you've mostly answered it yourself.

I may be stating the obvious but porn is about as close to real trans women as Hamlet is to a yellow cab driver.
Porn stars are in it for money: they'll take the minimum amount of hormones to soften their features, often have breast implants and then take viagra to get an erection for the camera. Some never feel the need for further surgery, but I think most would, if they could afford it. tbh I'm not sure of the percentages.

A transgender person doesn't transition for sex - in fact it's often well down the list and once starting hormones, their libido falls back to pre-puberty levels for quite some time. It's super annoying when people make the assumption that we are sexually motivated and just as horny as any regular man.

What we have to face in real life is discrimination, insults and threats. We find it hard to get jobs or even somewhere to live. Our families and friends will often reject us and will be suffering from depression and anxiety from those pressures, as well as any internal battle with dysphoria. It can take years to sort out your life after transitioning.

Take a look at the cartoon I posted above. Someone thought it was funny enough to post a reaction, but a trans person reading it will nod and hopefully realise from the irony that they are not alone and that other people are in the same predicament. The artist who makes those is trans herself and I was lucky enough to go to one of her lectures. She is not a porn star and looks like any regular girl down the street: kinda plain, a bit scruffy, trying to make a living from her art.

So yes, I totally understand why your friend posts angry memes and I'd be adding thumbs up support. If you want to date a trans woman you need to look past the body and see the person. It's very offensive to make assumptions about her body - would a woman ask you about your dick as casual chit-chat?

What she really needs is someone dependable, who will offer her a floor to sleep on and never even consider taking advantage of her. If she fancies you, she will let you know - she already knows you find her attractive: she's a woman and we know.

Hopes this helps.
 
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stickygirl said:
I'll take that as an honest question but you've mostly answered it yourself.

I may be stating the obvious but porn is about as close to real trans women as Hamlet is to a yellow cab driver.
Porn stars are in it for money: they'll take the minimum amount of hormones to soften their features, often have breast implants and then take viagra to get an erection for the camera. Some never feel the need for further surgery, but I think most would, if they could afford it. tbh I'm not sure of the percentages.

A transgender person doesn't transition for sex - in fact it's often well down the list and once starting hormones, their libido falls back to pre-puberty levels for quite some time. It's super annoying when people make the assumption that we are sexually motivated and just as horny as any regular man.

What we have to face in real life is discrimination, insults and threats. We find it hard to get jobs or even somewhere to live. Our families and friends will often reject us and will be suffering from depression and anxiety from those pressures, as well as any internal battle with dysphoria. It can take years to sort out your life after transitioning.

Take a look at the cartoon I posted above. Someone thought it was funny enough to post a reaction, but a trans person reading it will nod and hopefully realise from the irony that they are not alone and that other people are in the same predicament. The artist who makes those is trans herself and I was lucky enough to go to one of her lectures. She is not a porn star and looks like any regular girl down the street: kinda plain, a bit scruffy, trying to make a living from her art.

So yes, I totally understand why your friend posts angry memes and I'd be adding thumbs up support. If you want to date a trans woman you need to look past the body and see the person. It's very offensive to make assumptions about her body - would a woman ask you about your dick as casual chit-chat?

What she really needs is someone dependable, who will offer her a floor to sleep on and never even consider taking advantage of her. If she fancies you, she will let you know - she already knows you find her attractive: she's a woman and we know.

Hopes this helps.
Click to expand...

....And yet there are some trans folks who are kinky and sex crazed. I know, I've spoken with several and been with some who weren't porn stars or some other sort of professional.

Outliers among outliers. 🤷‍♀️
 
AlexBailey said:
....And yet there are some trans folks who are kinky and sex crazed. I know, I've been with some who weren't porn stars or some other sort of professional.

Outliers among outliers. 🤷‍♀️
Click to expand...
Huh? The poster specifically asked how he could be more sensitive and avoid fetishising her, which was something she made clear on FB she was offended by. I made the reasonable assumption that this poor girl was not an outlier, but someone who found the assumption she was kinky and sex crazed offensive.

FB is a shit forum for trans folk. My advice to her would be to stop using it.
 
stickygirl said:
Huh? The poster specifically asked how he could be more sensitive and avoid fetishising her, which was something she made clear on FB she was offended by. I made the reasonable assumption that this poor girl was not an outlier, but someone who found the assumption she was kinky and sex crazed offensive.

FB is a shit forum for trans folk. My advice to her would be to stop using it.
Click to expand...

The poster asked another question too.

"Is that kind of attraction offensive? "

My answer would be that fetishized attraction is offensive to some yet it's embraced by others. I occasionally deal with parts of the kink community and there are many trans folks among them.

This is more obviously true among cis women, probably simply because there is a larger visible sample . While some like to dress to be provocative others are offended when someone is 'provoked'.

I haven't been on FB in years, but I can imagine what a cesspool it can be regarding gender issues.

I like the advice you gave about how the poster can be supportive to his friend.
 
I find Lit an odd place. One moment discussing how it's okay to fetishise trans women, then posting this about Brianna Ghey who was murdered last year and whose two teenage murderers have been convicted. Notably, and in reference to another thread on Lit where pronouns have caused a heated debate, one of the killers referred to Brianna as "it". I have no words and tears seem out of place.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/dec/20/brianna-ghey-found-guilty-murder
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/b7485fc6c81e1dcf9ff5f5ec0154afd7b8d34c45/0_318_549_329/master/549.jpg?width=620&dpr=1&s=none
 
stickygirl said:
I find Lit an odd place. One moment discussing how it's okay to fetishise trans women, then posting this about Brianna Ghey who was murdered last year and whose two teenage murderers have been convicted. Notably, and in reference to another thread on Lit where pronouns have caused a heated debate, one of the killers referred to Brianna as "it". I have no words and tears seem out of place.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/dec/20/brianna-ghey-found-guilty-murder
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/b7485fc6c81e1dcf9ff5f5ec0154afd7b8d34c45/0_318_549_329/master/549.jpg?width=620&dpr=1&s=none
Click to expand...

😥
 
Oh, dear stickygirl,

I don't think we mean the same thing when we refer to something as 'fetishized'. To me it refers to an attraction and a somewhat objectified desire. It may be difficult to understand for an outsider, but it comes with a predisposition of great respect - perhaps unsettling to the 'object of desire' because it isn't based on a personal relationship. And while it doesn't necessarily correlate to personal relationships it can certainly enhance them.

That same fetishization can also be unhealthy, especially within a conflicted mind. I've had a guy express attraction to me in private who later threatened me in front of peers because of his own internal conflicts. I'm sure this same dynamic can make some people dangerous for the trans community.

Still, that kinky feeling, that inexplicable attraction is real for me. I'm very sad that it can be and feel threatening to others.
 
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Escierto said:
I have never understood why a guy attracted to a woman with a penis is a fetishist while a guy attracted to a woman with a vagina is not.

In the case of the guys attracted to women with vaginas, one might say that their attraction is not based on a body part but yes it is. If overnight their wives and girlfriends bodies were magically transformed and their vaginas replaced with a penis, I have absolutely no doubt at least 95% of those relationships would immediately end. So yes, it is a fetish.

BTW, I have told my girlfriend that if she had bottom surgery it would make no difference to me - she is the one I love.
Click to expand...

Interesting...

I don't have the objectifying "girl with a dick" fetish. I've always felt like I was a girl - with a dick. In fact I've been yelled at that I wasn't a girl because I have a dick.

Most of my non-cis attractions have been with people who were born with vaginas. I definitely have a kink for tomboys. I love rugged tomboys. I relate to them I feel 'among my people' around girls who are more masculine than me. The sad thing is that so many of them have no interest in anyone like me. :rolleyes:

More than any other fantasy I've wished I could simply trade bodies with an ftm. How would it it go? Would we both suddenly be without dysphoria?
 
If a guy is attracted to me simply because I am a woman with a penis. That is a fetish
If a guy is attracted to me simply because I am a woman with a vagina. That is a fetish
I guess one's person's fetish is another person's reason to post angry memes. I know who I stand with.
 
stickygirl said:
If a guy is attracted to me simply because I am a woman with a penis. That is a fetish
If a guy is attracted to me simply because I am a woman with a vagina. That is a fetish
I guess one's person's fetish is another person's reason to post angry memes. I know who I stand with.
Click to expand...

I that vein, is it a fetish to be initially attracted to anyone only because of superficial reasons?

Does healthy attraction only begin once there is a meeting of hearts?

I can understand that as beautiful and authentic, but are preferences and attractions to particular intimate traits demeaning?
 
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Wow lots of discussions on all of this so I hope my 2 cents worth is worth reading:

1) to me a fetish is twofold both being an inanimate object of that is idolized or worshipped that is believed to have magical powers or being inhabited by spirits, the 2nd meaning is something which causes sexual arousal which could be an object or parts of a body other than sexual organs.

2) also I believe a person only drawn to a persons sexual parts is a shallow way to start a relationship

3) a question asked here about attraction only beginning once there is a meeting of the hearts and I think the answer may be both yes and no, physical attraction can happen in a matter of seconds whereas heartfelt attraction takes time, yes there are persons believing in love at 1st sight but that feeling is only lust or interest that needs time to build or confirm into something more

Lastly I would say I think/hope a persons gender or gender identification is something in a better world that should not matter, now myself I married a woman and would not change that as far as the person I married, however I would like to believe even back then if I found her to be a woman trapped in a mans body I still would have loved and married her.

Now that I have said all this and who knows if it matters to anyone that I did, I have one thing to say let's just all get along.
 
stickygirl said:
I'll take that as an honest question but you've mostly answered it yourself.

I may be stating the obvious but porn is about as close to real trans women as Hamlet is to a yellow cab driver.
Porn stars are in it for money: they'll take the minimum amount of hormones to soften their features, often have breast implants and then take viagra to get an erection for the camera. Some never feel the need for further surgery, but I think most would, if they could afford it. tbh I'm not sure of the percentages.

A transgender person doesn't transition for sex - in fact it's often well down the list and once starting hormones, their libido falls back to pre-puberty levels for quite some time. It's super annoying when people make the assumption that we are sexually motivated and just as horny as any regular man.

What we have to face in real life is discrimination, insults and threats. We find it hard to get jobs or even somewhere to live. Our families and friends will often reject us and will be suffering from depression and anxiety from those pressures, as well as any internal battle with dysphoria. It can take years to sort out your life after transitioning.

Take a look at the cartoon I posted above. Someone thought it was funny enough to post a reaction, but a trans person reading it will nod and hopefully realise from the irony that they are not alone and that other people are in the same predicament. The artist who makes those is trans herself and I was lucky enough to go to one of her lectures. She is not a porn star and looks like any regular girl down the street: kinda plain, a bit scruffy, trying to make a living from her art.

So yes, I totally understand why your friend posts angry memes and I'd be adding thumbs up support. If you want to date a trans woman you need to look past the body and see the person. It's very offensive to make assumptions about her body - would a woman ask you about your dick as casual chit-chat?

What she really needs is someone dependable, who will offer her a floor to sleep on and never even consider taking advantage of her. If she fancies you, she will let you know - she already knows you find her attractive: she's a woman and we know.

Hopes this helps.
Click to expand...

Absolutely! And thank you for the insight. It, and a lot of the other wisdom in this thread has completely changed my perspective for the better. There was a point that I didn't put in my post (I'm a wordy bastard at times).....and it's a moot point now, but please know that I asked because I wanted to have a more respectful outlook. So thanks. <3
 
To try to conclude this... you need to appreciate my side of things and imagine seeing through the lens of my personal experience as well as your own. If I recoil from the topic it's because of how I've been treated in the past, every snide comment and creepy dude making comments about my genitals.
That experience is not an uncommon one for other trans woman. If you beat a dog with a shoe, every time it sees a shoes it'll react. A dog might snarl or whimper. Perhaps if you are the type of trans person who is very sexualised, then maybe you welcome being objectified if it ends up with getting laid - maybe they like dick pics or guys grabbing at your crotch to see what's there?
If I'm not mistaken this thread is to ask questions and if I answer frankly and honestly at times then you're gonna have to live with that. I know this is a sex site so it goes without saying everything has that twist to it. There is a fetish forum and endless threads with chicks with dicks pics. It's rare that I see a photo of a girl with a dick and a cheesy smile and don't wonder what her life is really like.
That's enough of this discussion.
 
I sincerely apologise for pressing such a sensitive issue. I will not persist with this idea except to say that not every kinky sexualized person is predatious or inappropriate in social settings, and anyone who callously makes others uncomfortable is a creep. 🥀
 
stickygirl said:
A transgender person doesn't transition for sex - in fact it's often well down the list and once starting hormones, their libido falls back to pre-puberty levels for quite some time. It's super annoying when people make the assumption that we are sexually motivated and just as horny as any regular man
Click to expand...
Pretty sure stickygirl has been there, I'm about 14 months into my transition. I've been on estradiol for the 14 months and sex? I have like zero interest in sex. I know everyone is different but I find sex something I never think about, and really have no interest in, at least now. I have read this is not unusual for people on hrt, and most often the desire returns in time
I'm in no hurry at all, and reading how some accuse transgender folks of being sexual predators is just laughable!

It's no secret that some of my transgender sisters ( and maybe brothers) have to resort to sex work to keep their lives together. I know I (so far) am lucky and am able to eat and have a home, and yep, I'm so thankful for this! But I also know how fast things can change. Even as fortunate as I am, I still have to put up with those whispers, and snide remarks during my day.

And than there are those that accuse transgender folks, especially trans women of transitioning for an advantage in sports....it's like, what? I've been harassed, bullied, mocked... seriously do some think I would go through all this pain just for a supposedly advantage in women's sports?

I'm not looking for sympathy, I just want to be left alone and able to live my life same as everyone.
 
stickygirl said:
I find Lit an odd place. One moment discussing how it's okay to fetishise trans women, then posting this about Brianna Ghey who was murdered last year and whose two teenage murderers have been convicted. Notably, and in reference to another thread on Lit where pronouns have caused a heated debate, one of the killers referred to Brianna as "it". I have no words and tears seem out of place.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/dec/20/brianna-ghey-found-guilty-murder
https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/b7485fc6c81e1dcf9ff5f5ec0154afd7b8d34c45/0_318_549_329/master/549.jpg?width=620&dpr=1&s=none
Click to expand...
I don't know....it is a deep hurt just seeing her picture....I cried seeing this, thinking of her....
 
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