For Those Who Might Be Wondering Why We Might Be In Ukraine

[JohnEngelman]

We are helping Ukraine because Ukraine is a democracy which has been subjected to an unprovoked invasion by Russia.

 

[RandyRebecca]

You should go fuck wrongway, or at least say you would,that way wrongway can refute my claim that no women from Lit would ever fuck him.

Your charm is overwhelming.

We are helping Ukraine because Ukraine is a democracy which has been subjected to an unprovoked invasion by Russia.

Ukraine have banned a dozen parties at least since 2014, including the pre-coup ruling party. No democracy there.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Your charm is overwhelming.


Ukraine have banned a dozen parties at least since 2014, including the pre-coup ruling party. No democracy there.

As is your love for all things Russian.

 

[JoePepsiCo]

We are helping Ukraine because Ukraine is a democracy which has been subjected to an unprovoked invasion by Russia.

I would submit that we're doing it to prevent the USSR Phoenix from rising from the ashes.

As pointed out, Ukraine is a marginal democracy at best and I'll add, not all that "Westernized."

 

[RandyRebecca]

We are helping Ukraine because Ukraine is a democracy which has been subjected to an unprovoked invasion by Russia.

Unprovoked? LOL.

As is your love for all things Russian.

Wrong. I oppose Putin because he's capitalist.

I would submit that we're doing it to prevent the USSR Phoenix from rising from the ashes.

Ridiculous. Putin is closer to the Tsars than the Soviets, and even then it wouldn't be accurate. In his speeches, Putin often attacks Lenin, for creating the borders of modern Ukraine (basically 2014-2022 borders, meaning minus Crimea), and attacks the Bolsheviks for pulling Russia out of WW1. Out of WW1, that is. Putin must be one of the very few politicians today who still sees WW1 as something to support instead of an awful slaughter.

As pointed out, Ukraine is a marginal democracy at best and I'll add, not all that "Westernized."

Russia is more of a "democracy" than Ukraine at this point. Russia's Communist Party hasn't been disbanded with its assets seized by the state, while its counterpart party in Ukraine has been, along with Ukraine banning a lot of other parties.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Wrong. I oppose Putin because he's capitalist.

Maybe you "think"you oppose him,but your posting on Ukraine doesn't show that. Hell even is this post's answer to that racist shit JohnEnglman you're claiming falsehoods about Ukraine,that Putin himself started.

 

[Rightguide]

We are helping Ukraine because Ukraine is a democracy which has been subjected to an unprovoked invasion by Russia.

Ukraine is not demonstrating its alleged democracy. Zelensky has outlawed his political opposition and has canceled elections in Ukraine. Even in the darkest moments of American history, we had presidential elections, during the Civil War, in WWII, and the Vietnam War. Those were demonstrations of a democracy.

 

[ll74]

Ukraine is not demonstrating its alleged democracy. Zelensky has outlawed his political opposition and has canceled elections in Ukraine. Even in the darkest moments of American history, we had presidential elections, during the Civil War, in WWII, and the Vietnam War. Those were demonstrations of a democracy.

The Constitution of Ukraine cancelled elections due to martial law.

 

[RandyRebecca]

Maybe you "think"you oppose him,but your posting on Ukraine doesn't show that. Hell even is this post's answer to that racist shit JohnEnglman you're claiming falsehoods about Ukraine,that Putin himself started.

I speak the truth on the matter, and see through the BS propaganda.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

I speak the truth on the matter, and see through the BS propaganda.

Sure you do.....*chuckles*

You just don't understand the meaning of either of those words...

 

[RandyRebecca]

Sure you do.....*chuckles*

You just don't understand the meaning of either of those words...

And all people like yourself can do when faced with criticism that contradicts your outlook is accuse them to being Putin sympathizers, like Hillary Clinton blaming Russia for her defeat to Donald Trump. I've said it lots of time, as Putin is a capitalist he is a political opponent of mine, but still the "Putin sympathizer" accusations keep coming, because they don't know how to respond to my criticism of their outlook, while also being terrified of having to self-reflect if they don't deflect.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

, but still the "Putin sympathizer" accusations keep coming,

You earned those accusations. Want to change that, quit blaming Ukraine for Russia invading. Hypothetically speaking, even if Russia was 100% right, that is still no reason for Russia to invade, kill husbands, rape wives, kill children, steal children and whole slew of other fucking crimes against the Ukrainian people.

Madeleine Albright famously said in 1996 that the deaths of half a million Iraqi children from sanctions and depleted uranium use in US bombs dropped on Iraq was all worth it. Such compassion from another Democrat.

Do Israel wonder about how many Palestinian babies and children that they've killed? They shoot and kill kids for throwing stones, bulldoze their family houses to the ground, steal Palestinian resources with impunity. It's simply monstrous. They expect Palestinians to just take this forever, without any violent response. Imagine if some outside group did this to a US community. You think there wouldn't be a violent response?

You seriously believe that BS? These are hospitals with gravely ill people and babies needing life support.

As I said before, Israel's politicians are not hiding what they are doing when they are talking to their supporters domestically. They insult the intelligence of North American and European populations with their propaganda BS, as if hospitals are basically the military barracks of Hamas.

So fuck off with all your righteousness,what you post above, doesn't seem to apply to Ukraine you fucking hypocrite.

 

[ll74]

You earned those accusations. Want to change that, quit blaming Ukraine for Russia invading. Hypothetically speaking, even if Russia was 100% right, that is still no reason for Russia to invade, kill husbands, rape wives, kill children, steal children and whole slew of other fucking crimes against the Ukrainian people.

This ^^^

 

[RandyRebecca]

You earned those accusations. Want to change that, quit blaming Ukraine for Russia invading. Hypothetically speaking, even if Russia was 100% right, that is still no reason for Russia to invade, kill husbands, rape wives, kill children, steal children and whole slew of other fucking crimes against the Ukrainian people.






So fuck off with all your righteousness,what you post above, doesn't seem to apply to Ukraine you fucking hypocrite.

All I said there was correct. If Democratic apologists for imperialist war can't accept that, tough. They are the ones who sleep at night while their precious administration supports ethnic cleansing and genocide.

 

[ll74]

All I said there was correct. If Democratic apologists for imperialist war can't accept that, tough. They are the ones who sleep at night while their precious administration supports ethnic cleansing and genocide.

You want Ukraine to lose this war.

You want Russia, who in vaded a foreign country to end up as the victor.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

All I said there was correct. If Democratic apologists for imperialist war can't accept that, tough. They are the ones who sleep at night while their precious administration supports ethnic cleansing and genocide.

lol you're one fucking sick individual. Seek help!

 

[RandyRebecca]

You want Ukraine to lose this war.

Naturally. You seem to back a regime with neonazis in its national guard since 2014, and with Canadian MPs (mostly liberals) letting the cat out of the bag with applause for the Ukrainian Waffen SS (vile Nazis) as "national heroes". All the Democrats' words about white supremacist groups at home are full of BS when they back neonazis in other countries and try to change the narrative around WW2 to one that supports the Waffen SS and demonizes our allies the Soviet Union.

You want Russia, who in vaded a foreign country to end up as the victor.

I oppose Putin's regime for the reasons already stated, and I have opposed the Euromaidan coup in Ukraine from the very beginning.

lol you're one fucking sick individual. Seek help!

The truth hurts you, it seems.

 

[ll74]

Naturally. You seem to back a regime with neonazis in its national guard since 2014, and with Canadian MPs (mostly liberals) letting the cat out of the bag with applause for the Ukrainian Waffen SS (vile Nazis) as "national heroes". All the Democrats' words about white supremacist groups at home are full of BS when they back neonazis in other countries and try to change the narrative around WW2 to one that supports the Waffen SS and demonizes our allies the Soviet Union.

I support the sovwreign country that was attacked

I oppose Putin's regime for the reasons already stated, and I have opposed the Euromaidan coup in Ukraine from the very beginning.

You want them to conquer Ukraine.

The truth hurts you, it seems.

Not at all.

 

[RandyRebecca]

I support the sovwreign country that was attacked

A country with neonazis in its national guard? Nazi Germany was a sovereign country. Was the Soviet Union wrong for going into Germany proper and raising the Soviet flag in Berlin in 1945? Iraq was a sovereign country in 2003 when the US invaded. Was that okay?

You want them to conquer Ukraine.

No, actually. That's not Russia's plan now anyway, not since their failure to overthrow the government in Kiev in the early part of the war. It's about the Black Sea coast now, and it's not going to go beyond bridging to Transnistria/Moldova and up to Kharkov in the north. Invading and holding down a hostile population is hardly desireable.

Not at all.

That was directed at Fuzzy.

 

[ll74]

A country with neonazis in its national guard?

A country with a Jewish President

No, actually. That's not Russia's plan now anyway, not since their failure to overthrow the government in Kiev in the early part of the war. It's about the Black Sea coast now, and it's not going to go beyond bridging to Transnistria/Moldova and up to Kharkov in the north. Invading and holding down a hostile population is hardly desireable.

Yes, they've failed. You still supported them.

That was directed at Fuzzy.

Doesn't matter.

 

[RandyRebecca]

A country with a Jewish President

Who cares what his religion is? Hatred of "the other" can happen among anyone of a right-wing mentality.

Adolf Hitler's best friend, Ernst Roehm, was a homosexual man. That didn't stop Roehm being the leader of the SA brownshirts, and later getting executed on Hitler and Himmler's orders after the Night of the Long Knives in 1934. Homosexuals (and LGBTs) ended up in camps, including being victims of the Holocaust. Unlike other groups who were victims of the Holocaust, most LGBTs were criminalized after the war too.

Yes, they've failed. You still supported them.

Ukraine have failed. Their mission was to return to the 2013 borders. That would be victory for them.

Russia's victory isn't to conquer the whole of Ukraine, but to landlock Ukraine, or at very least have more territory than before the invasion started. Look at the map. Before the invasion, Ukraine only lost control of some of the Donbass and of Crimea. Nothing else. Russia now controls the Black Sea coast east of the Dnieper river. If they go west of the Dnieper and bridge to Transnistria/Moldova, Ukraine is landlocked. Ukraine as a landlocked state would be of much reduced geopolitical importance, and then there's the hostile neonazi battalions in Ukraine who would hate that very strongly. Russia would be better leaving them for the EU to deal with, not take over the whole of Ukraine and hold down hardened anti-Russian opposition in western Ukraine.

These are the objective facts. Ask who is closer to what would be "victory". And ask who benefits more if the war ended today with a peace treaty on the current territorial lines.

 

[ll74]

Who cares what his religion is? Hatred of "the other" can happen among anyone of a right-wing mentality.

Adolf Hitler's best friend, Ernst Roehm, was a homosexual man. That didn't stop Roehm being the leader of the SA brownshirts, and later getting executed on Hitler and Himmler's orders after the Night of the Long Knives in 1934. Homosexuals (and LGBTs) ended up in camps, including being victims of the Holocaust. Unlike other groups who were victims of the Holocaust, most LGBTs were criminalized after the war too.


Ukraine have failed. Their mission was to return to the 2013 borders. That would be victory for them.

Russia's victory isn't to conquer the whole of Ukraine, but to landlock Ukraine, or at very least have more territory than before the invasion started. Look at the map. Russia controls the Black Sea coast east of the Dnieper river. If they go west of the Dnieper and bridge to Transnistria/Moldova, Ukraine is landlocked. Ukraine as a landlocked state would be of much reduced geopolitical importance, and then there's the hostile neonazi battalions who would hate that very strongly. Russia would be better leaving them for the EU to deal with, not take over the whole of Ukraine and hold down hardened anti-Russian opposition in western Ukraine.

These are the objective facts. Ask who is closer to what would be "victory". And ask who benefits more if the war ended today with a peace treaty on the current territorial lines.

The war was started by Russia. Their objective is the only one that has failed. Stopping them would be a successful defense of their attack.

But I know you have selective memory. Forgetting Ukraine's independence from the USSR for example.

 

[RandyRebecca]

The war was started by Russia.

Who started the war is not important when it comes to one's position in the war, or it shouldn't be. Technically, the Union started the civil war against the Confederacy, refusing to let the slave states just secede in peace. Does that mean that the Union was the bad side in the war? Hell no.

Their objective is the only one that has failed. Stopping them would be a successful defense of their attack.

Why are you closing your eyes to reality? Ukrainian politicians, and NATO politicians, have hardly denied that victory for Ukraine is a return to the 2013 borders, i.e. the return of all of the Donbass and of Crimea to Ukrainian control. Do you think that is going to happen?

But I know you have selective memory. Forgetting Ukraine's independence from the USSR for example.

Like how the Ukrainians in 1991 voted against the Soviet breakup, you mean? Yeah, why would people there NOT want to go from a world superpower to a middle income developing country? Why would they NOT want to go from full employment, secure housing, low rents, public services etc. to mass unemployment, wage cuts, raising rents, mass alcoholism and the biggest collapse in living standards in peace time since the Roman Empire's collapse etc.?

 

[ll74]

Who started the war is not important when it comes to one's position in the war. Technically, the Union started the civil war against the Confederacy, refusing to let the slave states just secede in peace. Does that mean that the Union was the bad side in the war? Hell no.

They invaded with an objective. Before that, they were the only ones concocting an actual objective for war. Defending that invasion was the only objective of Ukraine. And of course, the 2014 borders were considered the start of the war to them.

The civil war seems to be a go to false equivalency.

Why are you closing your eyes to reality? Ukrainian politicians, and NATO politicians, have hardly denied that victory for Ukraine is a return to the 2013 borders, i.e. the return of all of the Donbass and of Crimea to Ukrainian control. Do you think that is going to happen?

Defending their country is a victory.

Like how the Ukrainians in 1991 voted against the Soviet breakup, you mean? Yeah, why would people there NOT want to go from a world superpower to a middle income developing country? Why would they NOT want to go from full employment, secure housing, low rents, public services etc. to mass unemployment, wage cuts, raising rents, mass alcoholism and the biggest collapse in living standards in peace time since the Roman Empire's collapse etc.?

Ukraine unanimously voted for independence in 1991...over 90% in favor.

 

[dkovic77]

When war is profitable and large companies that stand to profit from it are allowed to buy influence in Congress and the White House...

And when the very legislators and bureaucrats who approve war, and implement the spending associated with it, can purchase stock in the companies supplying the hardware so they can profit too...

You can expect to have a lot of wars... perhaps even on a continuous basis.

And you are coming to this understanding now?

Where has your head been all this time?