Israel/Hamas PB Tribal Fight

[colddiesel]

This thread had sunk to 31st position in the list of what the members of this Board think is important. My take. Israel will win the fighting - eventually, but it will mean nothing. Neither they, nor their enemies have the slightest interest in any lasting peace, because the clear objective of both is to evict their enemies. Neither wants peace so we should chill out, 20 to 30 thousand dead per annum for 70 years is clearly tolerable for all political people. Hamas , Israel, Fatah, Hezbollah, Syria, Iran are all utterly corrupt financially and politically.

But it makes for spectacular pictures on the evening news.

 

[Rightguide]

Recall my post at #1366:

"Nobody is talking about the 800-lb gorilla in the room, Turkey. They are the military powerhouse in the Middle East. Turkey is not friendly with Israel and they are only a paper partner in Nato. There are massive demonstrations in Turkey to get involved against the Israelis. Turkey does have an ongoing relationship with Hamas. In addition, we see Pakistan telling Turkey that if they join the fight against Israel they will supply Turkey with nuclear weapons."

Erdogan threatens to declare war on Israel and send military to Gaza in chilling warning​

The Turkish president suggested in a speech at a pro-Palestine rally this afternoon that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly".​

By LIAM DOYLE
20:08, Sat, Oct 28, 2023 | UPDATED: 01:42, Sun, Oct 29, 2023

Turkey's president appears to have threatened to intervene in Gaza in an impassioned speech at a pro-Palestine rally this evening.

Recep Tayyip Erdogan delivered a speech to a rally this afternoon in which he told attendees Israel was responsible for war crimes, and framed Hamas as "freedom fighters".

In comments that have prompted Israeli outcry, and led the country to withdraw its diplomatic presence, president Erdogan suggested assaults on Gaza constituted a "massacre".

In the same speech, he reportedly said that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly” to ecstatic reception from hundreds of thousands of attendees.

More here: https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1829092/Erdogan-Turkey-Israel-war-Gaza

This is the nightmare scenario for Israel and for the US I was contemplating. The Turks have the biggest army in the Middle East and the biggest Navy, We have nuclear weapons stored on our bases in Turkey and we have military personnel stationed in Turkey both of which could be a risk if Turkey decides to join a region-wide Islamic war against Israel. It wouldn't take more than a month for Turkey to put almost a million troops on the Golan Heights and call up even more in reserve. Just sayin. The real danger here is that Israel could be wiped off the map in such a scenario. This is why Israel cannot have a policy of collective punishment in Gaza.

 

[ll74]

Recall my post at #1366:

"Nobody is talking about the 800-lb gorilla in the room, Turkey. They are the military powerhouse in the Middle East. Turkey is not friendly with Israel and they are only a paper partner in Nato. There are massive demonstrations in Turkey to get involved against the Israelis. Turkey does have an ongoing relationship with Hamas. In addition, we see Pakistan telling Turkey that if they join the fight against Israel they will supply Turkey with nuclear weapons."

Erdogan threatens to declare war on Israel and send military to Gaza in chilling warning​

The Turkish president suggested in a speech at a pro-Palestine rally this afternoon that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly".​

By LIAM DOYLE
20:08, Sat, Oct 28, 2023 | UPDATED: 01:42, Sun, Oct 29, 2023

Turkey's president appears to have threatened to intervene in Gaza in an impassioned speech at a pro-Palestine rally this evening.

Recep Tayyip Erdogan delivered a speech to a rally this afternoon in which he told attendees Israel was responsible for war crimes, and framed Hamas as "freedom fighters".

In comments that have prompted Israeli outcry, and led the country to withdraw its diplomatic presence, president Erdogan suggested assaults on Gaza constituted a "massacre".

In the same speech, he reportedly said that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly” to ecstatic reception from hundreds of thousands of attendees.

More here: https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1829092/Erdogan-Turkey-Israel-war-Gaza

This is the nightmare scenario for Israel and for the US I was contemplating. The Turks have the biggest army in the Middle East and the biggest Navy, We have nuclear weapons stored on our bases in Turkey and we have military personnel stationed in Turkey both of which could be a risk if Turkey decides to join a region-wide Islamic war against Israel. It wouldn't take more than a month for Turkey to put almost a million troops on the Golan Heights and call up even more in reserve. Just sayin. The real danger here is that Israel could be wiped off the map in such a scenario. This is why Israel cannot have a policy of collective punishment in Gaza.

Yes, and?

Nobody gives a shit about you believing you're some sort of military mastermind.

 

[Rightguide]

Yes, and?

Nobody gives a shit about you believing you're some sort of.kolotary mastermind.

Perhaps you should put down the wine bottle and speak in English.

 

[ll74]

Perhaps you should put down the wine bottle and speak in English.

Nobody gives a shit about your god complex on military analysis.

Turkey is flexing....and?

 

[Rightguide]

Nobody gives a shit about your god complex on military analysis.

Turkey is flexing....and?

Something nobody talked about until I did. BTW what is a " of.kolotary mastermind?."

 

[ll74]

Something nobody talked about until I did. BTW what is a " of.kolotary mastermind?."

Yes, nobody gives a shit that you feel like a military mastermind. (My phone autocorrected and I fixed it)

 

[Dribble]

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Recall my post at #1366:

What about it? You posted another person's article. Kind of like you do everyday you're on here. It was not your words, nor your prediction.

You see wrongway, you can't have it both ways, when you are called out for supporting something, then that is proven wrong; you say "prove I claimed that" you point to someone else's article, saying see I never said that, they did.

At the end of the day, a good day that is, you're just a parrot, replaying what other people wrote.

 

[Chobham]

By the looks of things Israel is going to have plenty of rubble to fill in those tunnels before they start pumping concrete.

 

[ll74]

By the looks of things Israel is going to have plenty of rubble to fill in those tunnels before they start pumping concrete.

The question is, how many hostages do they have in those tunnels?

 

[ShandyLeer]

Recall my post at #1366:

"Nobody is talking about the 800-lb gorilla in the room, Turkey. They are the military powerhouse in the Middle East. Turkey is not friendly with Israel and they are only a paper partner in Nato. There are massive demonstrations in Turkey to get involved against the Israelis. Turkey does have an ongoing relationship with Hamas. In addition, we see Pakistan telling Turkey that if they join the fight against Israel they will supply Turkey with nuclear weapons."

Erdogan threatens to declare war on Israel and send military to Gaza in chilling warning​

The Turkish president suggested in a speech at a pro-Palestine rally this afternoon that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly".​

By LIAM DOYLE
20:08, Sat, Oct 28, 2023 | UPDATED: 01:42, Sun, Oct 29, 2023

Turkey's president appears to have threatened to intervene in Gaza in an impassioned speech at a pro-Palestine rally this evening.

Recep Tayyip Erdogan delivered a speech to a rally this afternoon in which he told attendees Israel was responsible for war crimes, and framed Hamas as "freedom fighters".

In comments that have prompted Israeli outcry, and led the country to withdraw its diplomatic presence, president Erdogan suggested assaults on Gaza constituted a "massacre".

In the same speech, he reportedly said that Turkey can "come at any night unexpectedly” to ecstatic reception from hundreds of thousands of attendees.

More here: https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1829092/Erdogan-Turkey-Israel-war-Gaza

This is the nightmare scenario for Israel and for the US I was contemplating. The Turks have the biggest army in the Middle East and the biggest Navy, We have nuclear weapons stored on our bases in Turkey and we have military personnel stationed in Turkey both of which could be a risk if Turkey decides to join a region-wide Islamic war against Israel. It wouldn't take more than a month for Turkey to put almost a million troops on the Golan Heights and call up even more in reserve. Just sayin. The real danger here is that Israel could be wiped off the map in such a scenario. This is why Israel cannot have a policy of collective punishment in Gaza.

Not saying you’re wrong to imagine a regional conflict escalating beyond control, but can you not see that what Erdogan says in public today is no indication of what he will actually do tomorrow ? He‘s a pragmatist and opportunist and plays both ends against the middle. He seeks regional influence - at the expense of other players like say Russia, Iran or Saudi - not a conflict with a superpower his nation is currently aligned with, at a point when Turkey is having the better of things.

A “region wide Islamic war against Israel” would realistically mean an apocalyptic event - for exactly this reason the US has no diplomatic option but to commit itself to being prepared to dominate the sky over the area, by force if necessary. We just better hope it’s taken seriously by all parties - the Iranians understand very well its them the US response is directed to, but other actors toying with ideas hear it too.

You don’t need to be a Field Marshall to google how big the Turkish military is but no matter it’s size what strategic advantage would Erdogan gain by squaring up, militarily, against Uncle Sam ?

The only way this ever gets resolved permanently is with the Palestinians having a state of their own, and the only way that can be made acceptable to Israel - at least at the outset - is if that state is effectively a protectorate of a reliable Arab nation - that can police the place such that outfits like Hamas are snuffed out instead of rising to be the de facto government. Jordan, Qatar or Turkey would be potential candidates.

Unfortunately though the ”parties of God” on the two sides of the divide are not only entirely against it, but politically decisive.

 

[Chobham]

The question is, how many hostages do they have in those tunnels?

What hostages? When's the last time there's been any proof of life? Nobody is talking about ''hostages' anymore.

 

[Dribble]

The question is, how many hostages do they have in those tunnels?

Israel doesn't care. They are willing to sacrifice them to achieve their true objective.

 

[ll74]

What hostages? When's the last time there's been any proof of life? Nobody is talking about ''hostages' anymore.

Everyone is still talking about hostages

 

[ll74]

Israel doesn't care. They are willing to sacrifice them to achieve their true objective.

Yes, you demonstrate your position often

 

[Dribble]

More children have been murdered in Gaza than anywhere else in the last 4 years in the World

https://www.cnn.com/middleeast/live-news/israel-hamas-war-gaza-news-10-29-23/index.html

Apologists think it is acceptable

 

[Dribble]

Yes, you demonstrate your position often

Someone has to tell the truth

 

[ll74]

Someone has to tell the truth

Your bias has nothing to do with the truth

 

[Chobham]

Israel doesn't care. They are willing to sacrifice them to achieve their true objective.

That's right, the total elimination of Hamas and its supporters.

Oct. 7th was a Pearl Harbor moment and the Israeli's are going to treat the attackers the same way we treated Japan and their eager supporters, the Nazi's. Which makes you what?

 

[ll74]

Good thread. I am not anti Israel nor anti Palestinian. Both should be able to live in peace and safety. Some protestors truly don't understand what they are asking for

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718531897947496852

 

[cermin]

next time you rad about the death toll

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718861358186246192

 

[cermin]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718861358186246192

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718881018264932430

 

[cermin]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1718881018264932430

 

[ll74]

Israel presses into Gaza as pro-Palestinian protests spread worldwide​

Since the intensified operation began on Friday night, Israeli airstrikes have hit more than 600 Hamas targets, including weapons depots and anti-tank missile launch sites, Israel said. Israeli troops killed dozens of Hamas fighters on Sunday alone, the Israeli military said. Statements from the Israeli military described several "clashes" between Israeli soldiers and Hamas fighters.

...

"This is a worrying sign that civil order is starting to break down after three weeks of war and a tight siege on Gaza. People are scared, frustrated and desperate," said Thomas White, UNRWA's top official for Gaza, in a statement Saturday.