3 weeks ago, Indian Farmers scored a huge win against Corporations

[mayfly13]

A huge yet much overlooked news.

Indian Farmers protests, which started a year ago, saught to to repel Narendra Modi's three farm laws. These laws threatened to corporatize the food and agricultural sector in India, undermining small farmers.



QUOTE:
"Passed by parliament in September 2020, the three farm laws sought to deregulate Indian agriculture, lifting government supervision of crop sales and allowing corporations to negotiate directly with farmers. The government called them much-needed free market reforms. But many farmers feared they would cut into their already meager profits and favor big businesses instead.

In response, farmers waged one of the largest civil disobedience campaigns since India won its independence from Britain.

In January, India's Supreme Court suspended the farm laws' implementation, ordering the government to negotiate with farm unions. Then this month, Modi — India's most popular prime minister in decades — capitulated.:

https://www.npr.org/2021/11/26/1059200463/india-farmer-protests-modi-farm-laws

 

[mayfly13]

Apparently Indian farmers are also angry with Bill Gates, whom they see as a supporter of Modi's efforts + for reasons predating these.

The reasons for this anger are described during this interview:

Bill Gates is continuing the work of Monsanto', Vandana Shiva tells FRANCE 24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MNM833K22LM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YO3-1xSVG0M

 

[pecksniff]

Does this have any implications for anyone outside India?

 

[mayfly13]

Does this have any implications for anyone outside India?

Because small farming businesses aren't currently threatened with extinction ONLY in India.

All sorts of governmental decrees over the last years are doing the same in other countries. Invoking other reasons, but the end goal would likely be the same.

In France, farmers have been protesting ++ over Carbon emission laws that threaten their livelihood. In Australia and NZ, many small farm owners aren't allowed to use part of their land due to global warming, and they are Not receiving compensation.
As far as I know, in US/UK etc it might well be the same.

Meanwhile, the biggest corporate polutors are continuing unabated.



India is a huge precedent, let's see if it emboldens other farmers from other countries, to organize.

 

[pecksniff]

India is a huge precedent, let's see if it emboldens other farmers from other countries, to organize.

Well, in the U.S. . . . ain't many left. Agribiz has absorbed most of the sector.

 

[LupusDei]

Does this have any implications for anyone outside India?

Well, I admit my ignorance on the details of the matter, but what I think the core issue is really about, is about slapping copyright on seeds, including, but not limited to, wheat. This is done either by selling hybrids that don't mature viable seeds when it's done right, but when it cannot be done that way (as is case with wheat) or the mega corp doing the gene editing just lazy, they're trying to do it through legislative means, from contracts to laws.

For industrial farmers, who do not actually live on their own produce anyway, it's just an annoyance, together with understanding the seeds are more productive (or allow extreme, lazy but chemical rich methods).

But not only it creates monopoly (often entirely artificially), it goes against the grain of traditional peasantry who have for centuries operated on their own seeds they collect holding on to part of harvest, or actually, ever only selling surplus after their own needs -- subsistence and next season's seed -- are covered. The corporate model preclude this, it demands peasants to sell all their harvest and buy all their seeds every year. There it is seen as existential threat it is.

 

[GothTalk]

Because small farming businesses aren't currently threatened with extinction ONLY in India.

Nope, they've been under attack for a long time.

All sorts of governmental decrees over the last years are doing the same in other countries. Invoking other reasons, but the end goal would likely be the same.

In France, farmers have been protesting ++ over Carbon emission laws that threaten their livelihood. In Australia and NZ, many small farm owners aren't allowed to use part of their land due to global warming, and they are Not receiving compensation.
As far as I know, in US/UK etc it might well be the same.

Thank you for pointing out that "progressive" leftist are the biggest threat to farmers.

Meanwhile, the biggest corporate polutors are continuing unabated.

They have the money to follow or lawyer their way through all those elitist rules that the left piles on and on and on endlessly.

India is a huge precedent, let's see if it emboldens other farmers from other countries, to organize.

Too late. Democrats call that an "insurrection" now.

 

[GothTalk]

Does this have any implications for anyone outside India?

Not beyond possible inspiration.

 

[oggbashan]

In the EU, the Common Agricultural Policy is a major drain on the EU's resources. It helps to prop up inefficient small farmers in France by guaranteeing them set prices for their food and banning imports that are cheaper.

It also provides for set-aside to provide wildlife refuges at the edge of fields.

Now the UK has left the EU, we will no longer be paying French farmers (we were a net contributor to the EU) but the UK government is continuing the set-aside payments. Some UK farmers (and many French) make more money from the set-asides than they do from farm produce. That's mad.

 

[WillJ8787]

Well, I admit my ignorance on the details of the matter, but what I think the core issue is really about, is about slapping copyright on seeds, including, but not limited to, wheat. This is done either by selling hybrids that don't mature viable seeds when it's done right, but when it cannot be done that way (as is case with wheat) or the mega corp doing the gene editing just lazy, they're trying to do it through legislative means, from contracts to laws.

For industrial farmers, who do not actually live on their own produce anyway, it's just an annoyance, together with understanding the seeds are more productive (or allow extreme, lazy but chemical rich methods).

But not only it creates monopoly (often entirely artificially), it goes against the grain of traditional peasantry who have for centuries operated on their own seeds they collect holding on to part of harvest, or actually, ever only selling surplus after their own needs -- subsistence and next season's seed -- are covered. The corporate model preclude this, it demands peasants to sell all their harvest and buy all their seeds every year. There it is seen as existential threat it is.

I think this is correct....it is a huge problem in the US as well...large agribusiness want to own and control plant seed and monopolize the argo market place. Monsanto and the Round-up gene would be a related topic.

 

[astuffedshirt_perv]

In the EU, the Common Agricultural Policy is a major drain on the EU's resources. It helps to prop up inefficient small farmers in France by guaranteeing them set prices for their food and banning imports that are cheaper

Yes, this. Smaller farmers are inefficient. That translates into the crops from small farms being more expensive than crops from big farms that use better seeds and technology to maximize yields. The question is, should small farms be supported and protected? The West eagerly offloaded manufacturing to cheap Chinese companies, but has proven surprisingly resistant to allowing imports of cheaper crops. One of the key reasons the Doha round failed.

 

[oggbashan]

I think this is correct....it is a huge problem in the US as well...large agribusiness want to own and control plant seed and monopolize the argo market place. Monsanto and the Round-up gene would be a related topic.

In addition to my post above. The fact that farmers rely on set-aside payments is an indication that they are not paid enough for what they produce - particularly dairy farmers. The large supermarkets push prices for milk down to unrealistic levels and then sell 'British Milk' at a higher price that consumers won't pay because all the cheaper milk is also British.

 

[mayfly13]

Thank you all for commenting. Wow.
I lifted the talking points and the link to the Vandana Shiva interview
from Russel Brand's posts:

posted 4days ago
“WOAH!!!” The Media Don’t Want You To Know THESE PROTESTORS WON!!!”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3-22-oFYmQ

9 months ago
Indian farmers are protesting over new laws that could leave them at the mercy of giant corporations, while Big Tech companies are capturing their data. With Facebook and Bill Gates involved, what does it mean for you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fg0c2x74mgU

 

[Champakian]

I don't know a lot about India and have refrained on commenting because of that.

But our farming is now done at the corporate level.

We are well fed and by all accounts,
they are certainly not...

That's all.

 

[Champakian]

We do have small specialty farms who do raise things people will pay top dollar for.


I think BotanyBoy runs one of those...

 

[GothTalk]

We do have small specialty farms who do raise things people will pay top dollar for.


I think BotanyBoy runs one of those...

HEY HEY HEY...... if small time farmers can't compete in large scale commodity grains they are obviously victims!!!!

VICTIMS DAMN IT!!!!!

How dare they have to deal with economic realities of scale and technological advancement!!!! Boutique farmers have to grow boutique crops??? YOU'RE A FASCIST!!!!

LOL

My favorite is when leftist get all up in arms about it, then part the way through realize despite big ag cornering all the big commodities they as a political movement are literally the indi-family farmers worst enemy.

 

[oggbashan]

We do have small specialty farms who do raise things people will pay top dollar for.


I think BotanyBoy runs one of those...

We get a weekly delivery of organic vegetables from a local small scale farmer. The presentation might not be as good as in a supermarket, but the quality and prices are much better.

 

[JohnnySavage]

I think this is correct....it is a huge problem in the US as well...large agribusiness want to own and control plant seed and monopolize the argo market place. Monsanto and the Round-up gene would be a related topic.

That has been a big part of my professional career over the past 20 years.

 

[Champakian]

We get a weekly delivery of organic vegetables from a local small scale farmer. The presentation might not be as good as in a supermarket, but the quality and prices are much better.

No supermarket egg tastes as good as the ones my chickens lay.

They're even better if I let them free-range,

but, they attract predators...

 

[oggbashan]

No supermarket egg tastes as good as the ones my chickens lay.

They're even better if I let them free-range,

but, they attract predators...

The eggs come with the veg - collected that morning, and yes free-range. If you visit the farm you are surrounded by inquisitive chickens who like hiding under cars. They often have to be shooed out with a broom before you can drive away.

 

[JohnnySavage]

We get a weekly delivery of organic vegetables from a local small scale farmer. The presentation might not be as good as in a supermarket, but the quality and prices are much better.

In the summer, nearly everything I eat is grown or raised within 25 miles of my house. It's not practical for fruit and veggies in the winter though. For protein in the winter, I switch from local cows to local deer, squirrel and rabbits.

 

[JohnnySavage]

A dozen eggs would last me a year. I've seen where they come from. Same with milk.

 

[oggbashan]

In the summer, nearly everything I eat is grown or raised within 25 miles of my house. It's not practical for fruit and veggies in the winter though. For protein in the winter, I switch from local cows to local deer, squirrel and rabbits.

We get whatever is in season - not much in January and February, except stuff from his greenhouse.

 

[Champakian]

I eat the eggs because they keep piling up.

I do a lot of leftover and cheese omelettes.

 

[GothTalk]

In addition to my post above. The fact that farmers rely on set-aside payments is an indication that they are not paid enough for what they produce - particularly dairy farmers. The large supermarkets push prices for milk down to unrealistic levels and then sell 'British Milk' at a higher price that consumers won't pay because all the cheaper milk is also British.

Subsidized foods are part of the welfare state though man.

Can you imagine the outcry if suddenly the lower 20% of the country couldn't afford groceries and a much larger section couldn't afford to eat out anymore?

Cheap base foods from heavily subsidized farms are what make that cheap gallon of milk happen and why butter isn't a commodity for the well off like it was 120 years ago.

Americans want cheap beef? Well that's what all that cheap/free/grazing land and waived grazing fees etc. etc. are all about. Take all that away and see how much your burger costs next year.

Same with all the grains (except a few of course that are overproduced) that are the basis for all our baked goods, pastas, cereals etc. The ONLY reason all those products aren't 3...4...20 times as expensive as they are right now? Is because we have heavily subsidized grain production that makes the base crop inputs of the value added products super affordable if not downright stupid cheap depending on how much you're buying.

If we suddenly didn't have all the ag subsidies and big ag companies to produce lots of super cheap foods it would send massive waves throughout the entire food related economy totally fucking TRAUMATIZE most suburban/urban dwellers who've hardly ever given a though to where their food comes from much less run the numbers on what it costs to produce it when they went to the store and found out bare necessity groceries were going to cost about 1,200 bucks this week because a gallon of milk is now 45 bucks and a small box of corn flakes is just as much.

Don't even think of going out for a nice big burger.....after sticking it to all those FUCKING deplorables in dumbfuckistan by charging them all the things for their grazing fees, carbon taxes and all the wealth taxes to make sure they pay their "fair share" burgers are only for rich people and the middle class would be lucky to afford a pot roast on a holiday.