Will Ellon Musk's space tourism accelerate Global warming?

[mayfly13]

I just read this, and I was surprised by the lack of reaction (not only to my post), but also across google.


"Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk are dead set on expanding commercial space flight — even though a single person taking one of their carbon-spewing joy rides will produce more pollution in a few minutes than people belonging to 1/8th of the world population will in their entire lives."

According to this year’s World Inequality Report,
"a single, eleven-minute space flight emits at least 75 metric tons of carbon per passenger (according to researchers, this is actually an extremely conservative estimate). For comparison, as many as 1 billion people emit less than 1 metric ton per year.

https://jacobinmag.com/2021/12/billi...ing-inequality


Also, according to Wikipedia, "A 2010 study published in Geophysical Research Letters raised concerns that the growing commercial spaceflight industry could accelerate global warming."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_tourism#Criticism_of_the_term_space_tourist

 

[Champakian]

If they're in a rocket, they're not driving...,



... or charging up their Tesla.

 

[mayfly13]

I mean, is it fake news, or if true, what's the catch?

With everybody now tuned up to the issue (those with an ulterior motive AND those genuinely concerned) , you would have thought that it was going to be top news

 

[Champakian]

It's hyperventilating...


It sells advertising for those sites. :shrug:

 

[mayfly13]

If they're in a rocket, they're not driving...,



... or charging up their Tesla.

I'm honestly baffled, this isn't a trolling thread (of either pro-corporatists, or of the pro-Thunberg crowd.)

I mean, we'll soon go shopping with our buckets cause they're running out of paper bags too, yet we're allowing such pollution???
It doesn't make any sense to me, if true

 

[Champakian]

I doubt the sources and the metrics are probably dubious.


It's just more of "The Sky is Falling,"
so you need to live your life
according to our dictates.


:shrug:

 

[GothTalk]

If Elon Musk continues to agitate the left he's going to become environmentalist no 1 enemy pretty shortly.

IDK in the order but he just fired shots at E. Warren calling her senator "Karen"... I figure he's about to get smeared by the media.

You'll start hearing all about how TERRIBLE all the mines to get the materials needed for those Tesla batteries are and how Elon eats poor black babies because WHITE NATIONALIST!!! OHHHHH!!!!!!

Then like 15 women are going to come forward and claim he gang raped them by himself that's how evil he is....they won't be able to say when or where or produce any witnesses or corroboration....but it totally happened, believe all women or you're a Trumpian Nazi!!!

 

[mayfly13]

If Elon Musk continues to agitate the left he's going to become environmentalist no 1 enemy pretty shortly.

IDK in the order but he just fired shots at E. Warren calling her senator "Karen"... I figure he's about to get smeared by the media.

You'll start hearing all about how TERRIBLE all the mines to get the materials needed for those Tesla batteries are and how Elon eats poor black babies because WHITE NATIONALIST!!! OHHHHH!!!!!!

Then like 15 women are going to come forward and claim he gang raped them by himself that's how evil he is....they won't be able to say when or where or produce any witnesses or corroboration....but it totally happened, believe all women or you're a Trumpian Nazi!!!

Yes, Jacobin exaggerates, but a study conducted by NASA in 2010 expressed similar concerns.


And it's not just Elon Musk. Russians have just finished the first ever movie flick filmed in space.
https://www.rt.com/russia/537583-rt-special-coverage-challenge/

Farmers in France have absurd taxes on carbon emissions imposed on them, those from Australasia aren't allowed to use parts of their fields,
yet we'll be doing space tourism and movies shot in space.

 

[Champakian]

France is an economic powerhouse with the highest standard of living in the West!


Hey! even the world.

We should all model ourselves after the green green grass of France...

 

[Champakian]

Down under should just be nuked!



It should have never been populated by people of the Caucasian persuasion...



... they destroy everything they touch. Take France, for example. PLEASE!!!

 

[JohnnySavage]

I'm not one to be star-struck, but I'd go out of my way to have a cup of coffee with Musk.

 

[GeorgeSoros]

Musk, at least, wants direct air capture for cheaper and effectively carbon neutral rocket fuel. The speculation is, whatever DAC technology comes out of this, he’ll want to ship it to Mars for industrial purposes.

 

[WillJ8787]

If Elon Musk continues to agitate the left he's going to become environmentalist no 1 enemy pretty shortly.

IDK in the order but he just fired shots at E. Warren calling her senator "Karen"... I figure he's about to get smeared by the media.

You'll start hearing all about how TERRIBLE all the mines to get the materials needed for those Tesla batteries are and how Elon eats poor black babies because WHITE NATIONALIST!!! OHHHHH!!!!!!

Then like 15 women are going to come forward and claim he gang raped them by himself that's how evil he is....they won't be able to say when or where or produce any witnesses or corroboration....but it totally happened, believe all women or you're a Trumpian Nazi!!!

Your satire is 100% correct! ...chuckles

 

[LupusDei]

While each launch is quite expensive, including in emissions, the whole of that industry is still tiny in comparison. Mitigation strategies are at least proposed and worked on.

Jeff joyride uses hydrogen fuel, with could in theory be carbon neutral, but isn't as green as it could be because the green hydrogen as a whole is load of fluff and at best far future.

Elon so far is all business with very little tourism performed or planned. And what's planned is on Starship, and for that he (and pretty much everyone else working on something new over certain size) will switching over to methane as the primary booster fuel. And that is just as easily regenerative by carbon capture as hydrogen is "green" (actually, it's the most sensible way to store and transport the same, by further processing in so called "e-fuels"). Elon is doubly motivated to actually work at and test out that stuff as it's exactly the way he plans to refuel his fleet on Mars (and Moon, and just about anywhere).

So yes, the big fumes coming out of rocket's business end is a magnificent spectacle, but you should be more worried about, say, pyrotechnics. Seriously. And the economic benefits from low latency orbital broadband and eventually orbital solar power plants justify those expenses handily.

 

[pecksniff]

Space tourism is so expensive, and likely to remain so for the foreseeable future, that the industry is not likely to grow much any time soon.

 

[LupusDei]

Not a tread I would normally resurrect, but the same discussion come up elsewhere and some numbers were thrown around (not anywhere precise enough to bother a quote). The overall conclusion was a beautiful formulation of just how inconsequential the rocketry still is in this regard.

The emissions of all space rockets ever launched gets to about half of those of aircraft at an average day.

Talk about spotlight bias.

Sure, some early experiments (and Russians for quite same time) used some very nasty fuels, but even those were more just an immediate safety hazard. (Like the ill famous ClF3 that will set concrete on fire if spilled.)

If, or when, rockets fly regular point-to-point on earth or the Mars campaign goes big, or in any other way there's dozens upon dozens Starship sized rocket launches daily, it may eventually get to some noticeable percentage of airline or traffic emissions. However, if that point the methane used for fuel is synthetic production from carbon capture using electricity from renewable sources, the rockets (especially Mars and other deep space flights) can actually become CO2 negative.

 

[Champakian]

Good post.