Wow! Bill Cosby's Conviction Overturned! Freed!

[gordo12]

Interesting development.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/bill-cosby-released-prison-conviction-vacated/story?id=78582000

 

[TadOverdon]

Legal errors by the prosecution led to this. As for Cosby, the life he built is no more, blasted to smithereens by the exposure of his crimes.

Let the bastard go home to whatever gated sanctuary he has for a hiding place and spend the rest of his days shunned and in disgrace.

Does he golf? Maybe he and O.J. can play a few rounds.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Legal errors by the prosecution led to this.

Some discussion here on the court finding. Seems like an... unusual... decision.

I give it six months before he's on cable TV painting himself as a Victim Of Cancel Culture.

 

[NotWise]

Some discussion here on the court finding. Seems like an... unusual... decision.

I give it six months before he's on cable TV painting himself as a Victim Of Cancel Culture.

If there's anyone left to care, then may Cancel Culture wasn't very effective.

 

[lovecraft68]

Call it for what its the woke race card trumped the believe survivors metoo movement.

Pure and simple.

Another demonstration of the utter lack of progression when it comes to women being raped and abused.

There were laws against abusing animals in this country before domestic violence became a crime

We're still no better.

This is why I've spent two decades teaching women self defense and as a volunteer. Its why I've helped some of them with dangerous ex's buy guns(legally so keep it in your shorts Karens) and learn how to use them. Why my daughters both have martial arts training and can shoot, and why if they are ever assaulted they're told to come to me and other members of the family not the garbage system where cops arrest the rapist and scum lawyers and a misogynistic system let them go.

We live in a society where millions worship NFL players who beat and rape women , some have beaten their kids and gotten away with it, and every woman that comes forward against an athlete or a celeb or politician are all lying gold digging whores.

The LW section is just a louder more public version of what many men in this country think and feel, and there's some of them in this forum, all who talk all smooth and play the "No, I'm not like that" game.

Yeah, you are. I see it in your posts that you think are so clever and I smell the hate on you. Closet incels aren't just in the readership here.

But at least Cosby did some time, everyone's favorite Tarantino who openly admitted to enabling Weinstein(who is in jail) to rape those women, and never said a word because he was worried his mentor wouldn't back his career, all those women hurt that he could have prevented.

But you all run to his movies, don't you? Yeah you do.

The people of one political faction here in the US attack Christians or people of other political factions for being sexist and abuser etc...but you all kiss the ass of Islamic countries where rape isn't a crime, where a woman who is raped gets flogged for committing adultery, where girls who are still children are forced into marriage where in some places their sexually mutilated to never be able to enjoy sex...and as a bonus, gays are put to death

The most racist, sexist, homophobic 'religion" in history, but they're okay because its not "PC" to call their shit...but please, all of you, keep yammering about how much you care about women's rights. Because if you ever shut up and think about it, you'll have to admit that you don't care, just want to sound good and self righteous for the rest of your phony ass friends.

Keep posting your BTB stories and firing up the woman haters and think you're being funny. Keep laughing at their comments like its a joke. Keep encouraging them while fueling your own closet hate.

I know a lot about hate. I was raised in it. I learned to embrace it and use it to stand against other hate. But unlike all those phonies here, I own what I hate, and I'll state my case and not give a rat's ass how I'm perceived because unlike some here conviction is more important to me than lip service.

I've done more in my life to help and protect victims of abuse than any of the self righteous assholes pretending to be 'outraged' ever have. So you'll all have to excuse the rant while this story breaks and I have to listen to people who have never done one goddamn thing to help anyone but themselves act like they care, while the aforementioned incels laugh and say good for him, all those cunts were lying, because all women are lying and survivors are only to be believed if you don't like the accused, are they on your sports team? Your side of the political fence, your favorite actor...those bitches are lying! But if its all the opposite THOSE women are telling the truth.

Cute you all are

 

[NotWise]

Call it for what its the woke race card trumped the believe survivors metoo movement.

So, you think the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, deciding on a legal procedural matter, was throwing a "woke race card" to trump "metoo?"

That isn't usually how Supreme Court decisions are made. They are normally apolitical, and it looks to me like this one was too.

Maybe you wanted the decision to be more political, and that's causing your heartburn.

 

[KeithD]

That isn't usually how Supreme Court decisions are made. They are normally apolitical, and it looks to me like this one was too.

Yes, we're getting a lot of irrelevant and agendaed blather about this. Pretty straight forward. The original DA didn't think he had enough to pursue the criminal trial and did what he could to give the victim leverage to launch a civil one. Cosby spilled his guts and confessed to more than he was being charged with in a deposition, knowing he had a "no prosecute" deal in hand. A subsequent DA prosecuted him anyway. A straightforward no-no that the court has rectified, following the law.

Beyond that, I don't see why this is in the AH at all. This doesn't make Cosby not guilty of the crimes.

 

[NotWise]

Yes, we're getting a lot of irrelevant and agendaed blather about this. Pretty straight forward. The original DA didn't think he had enough to pursue the criminal trial and did what he could to give the victim leverage to launch a civil one. Cosby spilled his guts and confessed to more than he was being charged with in a disposition, knowing he had a "no prosecute" deal in hand. A subsequent DA prosecuted him anyway. A straightforward no-no that the court has rectified, following the law.

Beyond that, I don't see why this is in the AH at all. This doesn't make Cosby not guilty of the crimes.

It's more something for the politics board.

 

[LAHomedog]

Some discussion here on the court finding. Seems like an... unusual... decision.

I was discussing this with my attorney wife over lunch. As morally disgusting as this decision is, it is legally accurate. The fact is the prosecution cheated and broke the "I take the 5th" rules. And because of either legal incompetence, or overzealous DAs another bad guy is back out on the streets.

If the prosecutors of this country got their acts together and did their jobs properly we wouldn't have the O.J., Dan Whites, and Bill Cosbys of the world getting away with horrific crimes.

We watched the opening arguments of the O.J. trial with a friend of ours who is a judge on criminal trails and after Marcia Clark's opening argument he said, "O.J. will be found innocent in less than a day." He then explained step-by-step what she had done wrong. He was sadly correct.

There will be fallout from this for weeks. Hopefully it will inspire some DAs to get their acts together.

 

[AlexBailey]

It's more something for the politics board.

This.

 

[Comshaw]

Cosby, by his own admission is as guilty as sin of what he was accused. He shouldn't have been prosecuted in the first place using that self-incriminating evidence because of the deal with the prosecutor. That's what happens though when you have arrogant, overzealous, incompetent people in positions like that.

As despicable and evil as his actions were, and as anger-inducing as his release is, it is appropriate because of how our laws work. It is as it should be.

"That it is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer, is a Maxim that has been long and generally approved."

Benjamin Franklin

Comshaw

 

[XerXesXu]

Cosby, by his own admission is as guilty as sin of what he was accused. "[/I]

Point of fact. He has never admitted guilt. He still maintains his innocence, he maintained it even after the state offered inducements, such as early release, if he admitted guilt.

 

[KeithD]

Point of fact. He has never admitted guilt.

That's not how a lot others interpret that. He admitted to obtaining drugs to use in sex and a good many of his 50 accusers have claimed they didn't agree to that.

But . . . take it to the political board.

 

[XerXesXu]

That's not how a lot others interpret that. He admitted to obtaining drugs to use in sex and a good many of his 50 accusers have claimed they didn't agree to that.

But . . . take it to the political board.

I'm not sure what interpretation has to do with it. Point of fact, he has never admitted guilt.

Like most people he has shared drinks, or spliffs or whatever with prospective sex partners. He has one accuser, the Supreme Court never passed on the #metoo evidence as the decision on prosecutorial misconduct rendered it moot.

I see you're already on the political board ..... be a good boy and take any response there.

 

[Comshaw]

Point of fact. He has never admitted guilt. He still maintains his innocence, he maintained it even after the state offered inducements, such as early release, if he admitted guilt.

Point of fact, from the OP's cited article:

"During that deposition, Cosby made incriminating statements that Castor's successor, Kevin R. Steele, used to charge Cosby in 2015."

Comshaw

 

[XerXesXu]

Point of fact, from the OP's cited article:

"During that deposition, Cosby made incriminating statements that Castor's successor, Kevin R. Steele, used to charge Cosby in 2015."

Comshaw

When a narrative news channel conflicts with the State Supreme Court I know who I believe.

"At deposition, Cosby testified that he developed a romantic interest in Constand as soon as he met her, but did not reveal his feelings. He acknowledged that he always initiated the in-person meetings and visits to his home. He also stated that he engaged in consensual sexual activity with Constand on three occasions, including the January 2004 incident."

Q. Did you know X? A. No comment.
Not an admission against interest.

Q. Did you know X? A. Yes.
An admission against interest.

An admission against interest is not incriminating, but it helps the prosecution prove something for which the burden of proof lies on them.

 

[ishtat]

Point of fact. He has never admitted guilt. He still maintains his innocence, he maintained it even after the state offered inducements, such as early release, if he admitted guilt.

He did admit the facts of the crimes,. But on the understanding that he could not be prosecuted in a criminal court on this evidence admitted to get a deal in the civil case. Prosecutor's incompetence.

The only factor which really stinks is that the Prosecutor, Castor Jnr who struck the verbal deal, knew that his father Castor Snr, was a well paid attorney of Cosby on property deals. But obviously Castor Jnr denies that influenced him.

 

[XerXesXu]

He did admit the facts of the crimes,. But on the understanding that he could not be prosecuted in a criminal court on this evidence admitted to get a deal in the civil case. Prosecutor's incompetence.

The only factor which really stinks is that the Prosecutor, Castor Jnr who struck the verbal deal, knew that his father Castor Snr, was a well paid attorney of Cosby on property deals. But obviously Castor Jnr denies that influenced him.

Read the judgement. He didn't admit any crime in the depositions in the civil case, which was settled. He said the complainant took the Benadryl willingly and all the sexually activity was consensual.

 

[ishtat]

Read the judgement. He didn't admit any crime in the depositions in the civil case, which was settled. He said the complainant took the Benadryl willingly and all the sexually activity was consensual.

In 2015 the depositions of the Court reports of Andrea Constand's civil case were released. In them Cosby admitted administering Quaaludes, a hypnotic drug illegally; he also admitted to the 'casual sex' (his words) this facilitated. Her words were different!

Now you can toddle off back to fantasy land because the facts of this debacle are clear as is the prosecutor's incompetence. The irony is that, had Cosby not made the earlier admissions of his conduct in the civil matter, the Appeal court in the Criminal case would not have been in a position to rule that evidence inadmissible.

And that's all from me.

 

[TadOverdon]

Cosby always maintained that any drug use was consensual.

 

[XerXesXu]

In 2015 the depositions of the Court reports of Andrea Constand's civil case were released. In them Cosby admitted administering Quaaludes, a hypnotic drug illegally; he also admitted to the 'casual sex' (his words) this facilitated. Her words were different!

Now you can toddle off back to fantasy land because the facts of this debacle are clear as is the prosecutor's incompetence. The irony is that, had Cosby not made the earlier admissions of his conduct in the civil matter, the Appeal court in the Criminal case would not have been in a position to rule that evidence inadmissible.

And that's all from me.

When I was young Qualludes were all the rage (Mandies) consumed by men and women as recreational drugs along with alcohol, weed, amphetamines, acid etc, often shortly before casual sex.

How often did you wake up, look at your partner and ask, ‘Who the fuck is that; did I fuck him/her?’

The consumption of recreational drugs at or about the time of sex is evidence neither for nor against consent. How many Literotica users would have remained out of prison if it were otherwise?

Even the Trial Court accepted that there would be no triable issue based on the admissions in the civil trial depositions.

From the Supreme Court judgment; the reason why similar fact evidence was necessary:

“For the trial court, the aforementioned similarities between Constand’s claim and that of the other alleged victims weighed in favor of admissibility, particularly because the court believed that the Commonwealth had a “substantial need” for the evidence. Id. at 109. “Where the parties agreed that the digital penetration occurred, the evidence of other acts was necessary to rebut [Cosby’s] characterization of [J-100-2020] - 38 the assault as a consensual encounter.” Id. “Furthermore,” the court opined, “Ms. Constand did not report the assault until approximately one year later, further supporting the Commonwealth’s need for the evidence.”

Those saying that Cosby admitted guilt in the depositions are being borne along by a currently fashionable narrative which has nothing to do with legal reality.

For those who think the prosecutors were incompetent, think on the fact that the Trial Court and Appeal Court endorsed the prosecutor’s decision to prosecute despite the previous AG’s maneuvers. You’re as likely to be right about that as you are about Cosby admitting to non-consensual sex.

 

[SimonDoom]

Read the judgement. He didn't admit any crime in the depositions in the civil case, which was settled. He said the complainant took the Benadryl willingly and all the sexually activity was consensual.

I read it.

It doesn't matter whether you or I regard his deposition testimony as an admission of guilt. The fact remains that testimony was admitted at trial and he was convicted of three counts of aggravated indecent assault, in part on the basis of that testimony.

I don't agree with your assessment of the testimony. I think Cosby's use of drugs to render women unconscious or incapable of making decisions made him a serial rapist. The jury and trial court seem to have agreed with me. But that's not the issue in the case that was just decided.

The issue was whether the state was precluded from prosecuting Cosby and from using his civil deposition testimony because of statements made by the prosecutor that Cosby would not be prosecuted, and that he would therefore not enjoy the benefit of the Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination. That right does not apply in a civil proceeding. The evidence indicates that although there was no formal written agreement regarding non-prosecution between Cosby and the State before his civil deposition, he nevertheless relied on this understanding when he gave his civil deposition testimony. Later, contrary to the previous prosecutor's statement, the State prosecuted anyway and used the deposition testimony against Cosby.

The issue for the State Supreme Court was this: whether, in the absence of a written transactional immunity agreement, when the State makes an unconditional promise not to prosecute, and the defendant in reliance on that promise gives testimony in a civil proceeding, believing the Fifth Amendment does not apply, the State is subsequently bound by the prosecutor's promise and may not prosecute the defendant. The trial court and lower appellate court ruled that it was not bound, but the State Supreme Court ruled that it was.

As appalling as I consider the result, because I regard Cosby as a serial rapist who should spend the rest of his life in jail, this seems like the correct decision to me. The State pulled a bait and switch. That strikes me as a violation of Cosby's Fifth Amendment rights. No matter how bad the crime, if the conviction is obtained in violation of a defendant's Fifth Amendment rights, he should go free.

What any of this has to do with the Author's Hangout, I don't know, but at least the issue is getting a more intelligent back-and-forth here than it would on the General or Politics boards.

 

[TadOverdon]

It's bizarre that the #1 lead story in literotica's "Adult Headline News" listing is still "Bill Cosby Ordered to Stand Trial in Sex Case." It links to a five-year-old trade press article.

 

[SimonDoom]

It's bizarre that the #1 lead story in literotica's "Adult Headline News" listing is still "Bill Cosby Ordered to Stand Trial in Sex Case." It links to a five-year-old trade press article.

I'd completely forgotten about that. I'm not sure if those headlines were ever updated during the time I've been an author here. In fact, I've forgotten how to navigate to that page from the main page and haven't seen it in a long time.

 

[jaF0]

The issue for the State Supreme Court was this: whether, in the absence of a written transactional immunity agreement, when the State makes an unconditional promise not to prosecute, and the defendant in reliance on that promise gives testimony in a civil proceeding, believing the Fifth Amendment does not apply, the State is subsequently bound by the prosecutor's promise and may not prosecute the defendant. The trial court and lower appellate court ruled that it was not bound, but the State Supreme Court ruled that it was.

Now, will it be appealed to a Federal court and if so, what happens there?

The long standing position in contract law is that if it isn't on paper, it didn't happen.