NYC closes schools citing COVID-19, despite low positivity rate

[Counselor706]

New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio (D) announced Wednesday that public schools citywide would be closed and all learning would be conducted virtually starting Thursday, in a blow to parents.

A rise in coronavirus rates in the Big Apple was cited for the reasoning, despite officials admitting that cases in the nation's largest school system itself remain incredibly low.

Source

 

[phrodeau]

The risk in NYC dropped after Trump moved out.

 

[fma20fma]

hi

if children are alive and healthy, they can restart schooling another day, after covid.

 

[islandman]

It's a half-assed measure designed to obfuscate where the infections are taking place, the solution to which would be another lockdown.....and acknowledgement of the economic ramifications of such action.

 

[Lazaran]

.
New York was on its way to another large spike and schools are an obvious vector for spreading the virus.

It would have been gross negligence NOT to pause in person learning.

A cost benefit analysis would dictate cancelling in person learning when we're heading into prime respiratory illness season and a vaccine is supposedly just around the corner.

Easy call.

 

[Counselor706]

President-elect Joe Biden’s Covid advisors nix idea of U.S. lockdown to curb pandemic

Two of President-elect Joe Biden’s coronavirus advisors pushed back Friday on the idea of a national lockdown to suppress the coronavirus pandemic.

“As a group, really the consensus is that we need a more nuanced approach,” Dr. Celine Gounder, who sits on the panel and is an infectious disease specialist at the NYU Grossman School of Medicine, told CNBC’s “Squawk Box,” adding that it was “not the opinion” of the group to institute such widespread restrictions across the U.S. “We can be much more targeted geographically. We can also be more targeted in terms of what we close.”

Rather than adopting a comprehensive lockdown approach, Gounder told CNBC that state officials should focus on implementing tighter restrictions in regions of the country where there’s a high risk for the virus to spread, such as restaurants, bars and gyms, and aim to keep their schools open for students.

“I think of this as a dimmer switch, not an on-and-off light switch,” she said. “I think we need to close only those things that really are contributing to the spread, and really try to ... as much as possible remain open, like schools, if they’re not contributing to the spread.”

Source

 

[AlexBailey]

Thanks Counselor706,

You're doing a great job of showing how the Biden response to the corona virus is locally nuanced and intelligent instead of draconian and nation wide. Glad to see you are beginning to see the light.

 

[LukSkyFokker]

Meanwhile, the Republitard Gov. of Iowa who was hard against masks and social distancing has now tossed that nonsense aside and got on board. Iowa is totally fucked re. the virus.

 

[islandman]

Thanks Counselor706,

You're doing a great job of showing how the Biden response to the corona virus is locally nuanced and intelligent instead of draconian and nation wide. Glad to see you are beginning to see the light.

As a resident of NYC, the case here is neither nuanced nor intelligent. In-school positivity rate in 0.2%.

To put it bluntly, you're 14 times more likely to be infected in one of our capacity-limited, socially distanced restos. Yet these remain open while schools are shut.

This is a failure of adults rather than government. If Biden's plan is to rely on adults, life will take another hard left any second now.

 

[AlexBailey]

As a resident of NYC, the case here is neither nuanced nor intelligent. In-school positivity rate in 0.2%.

To put it bluntly, you're 14 times more likely to be infected in one of our capacity-limited, socially distanced restos. Yet these remain open while schools are shut.

This is a failure of adults rather than government. If Biden's plan is to rely on adults, life will take another hard left any second now.

It would be interesting to look at those in-school positivity rates. Are they actually testing every student weekly? My understanding is that kids can be carriers without being symptomatic, so those numbers may not be very useful. It could be the that the new restrictions are being implemented with the up coming holiday in mind.

If the only priority were to get rid of the virus, a draconian lockdown would be the best solution, but that doesn't fit well with a free society where people need to earn a living. Instead we have a system of compromises that no one can agree on.

 

[Lazaran]

As a resident of NYC, the case here is neither nuanced nor intelligent. In-school positivity rate in 0.2%.

To put it bluntly, you're 14 times more likely to be infected in one of our capacity-limited, socially distanced restos. Yet these remain open while schools are shut.

This is a failure of adults rather than government. If Biden's plan is to rely on adults, life will take another hard left any second now.

I believe it was a logical preemptive move.

With cases spiking kids are just another vector for transmission.

Why would you not want to limit the number of vectors during cold and flu season with cases of Covid spiking, when a vaccine is supposedly just around the corner.

A cost benefit analysis would dictate cancelling in person learning until the vaccine is distributed or until the spike in cases is controlled.

 

[islandman]

It would be interesting to look at those in-school positivity rates. Are they actually testing every student weekly? My understanding is that kids can be carriers without being symptomatic, so those numbers may not be very useful. It could be the that the new restrictions are being implemented with the up coming holiday in mind.

If the only priority were to get rid of the virus, a draconian lockdown would be the best solution, but that doesn't fit well with a free society where people need to earn a living. Instead we have a system of compromises that no one can agree on.

And in spite of these questions you feel qualified to call the closure "nuanced and intelligent'.

 

[islandman]

I believe it was a logical preemptive move.

With cases spiking kids are just another vector for transmission.

Why would you not want to limit the number of vectors during cold and flu season with cases of Covid spiking, when a vaccine is supposedly just around the corner.

A cost benefit analysis would dictate cancelling in person learning until the vaccine is distributed or until the spike in cases is controlled.

lol @ cost-benefit analysis. As someone who stares at P&Ls most days, your copy and paste doesn't impress.

If you want to limit viral vectors, you could do that more effectively just by shutting down gyms only rather than schools. You're addressing the campfire in the hopes that it mitigates the the 4-alarmer next door.

 

[Vanadorn]

My wife is a NYS school teacher and I had the luxury of hearing about this plan from the union point of view as well as the school board and parents point of view all summer as well as the fall and start of school term since there were LOTS of overheard Zoom meetings in our kitchen.

Long and short - the Union was split on going back in Sept and the concession they made with DiBlasio (who they hate) was that when the rolling 7 day average metric ticked up to 3%, they would close the schools to "protect the teachers" and the students. Listening to them, it was mostly their own ass they were worried about.

The suspicion was that in 6 weeks they'd have to close the doors. Imagine their surprise when the testing came back at .16% in the schools and problem was the bars and businesses around them. BUT, as it had gotten closer to 3%, they were holding his feet to the fire about shutting down and going full remote, even though NOW, most of the teachers actually in the schools did NOT want to shut down! Schools are about 1/3rd filled and spread out and everyone feels safe and there is less stress. But the union is sticking to the agreement and waving the flag saying see, we've got your back.

The feeling from what I overhear now is that they'll shut down, get the positivity rate to come down by rolling back from phase 4 (or orange zone - whatever the new layout is) and then reopen as soon as they can feasibly do so.

So it's a lot of little factors in play and some politics that is up against the mayor's ass and the governor's at this time.

-V

 

[islandman]

My wife is a NYS school teacher and I had the luxury of hearing about this plan from the union point of view as well as the school board and parents point of view all summer as well as the fall and start of school term since there were LOTS of overheard Zoom meetings in our kitchen.

Long and short - the Union was split on going back in Sept and the concession they made with DiBlasio (who they hate) was that when the rolling 7 day average metric ticked up to 3%, they would close the schools to "protect the teachers" and the students. Listening to them, it was mostly their own ass they were worried about.

The suspicion was that in 6 weeks they'd have to close the doors. Imagine their surprise when the testing came back at .16% in the schools and problem was the bars and businesses around them. BUT, as it had gotten closer to 3%, they were holding his feet to the fire about shutting down and going full remote, even though NOW, most of the teachers actually in the schools did NOT want to shut down! Schools are about 1/3rd filled and spread out and everyone feels safe and there is less stress. But the union is sticking to the agreement and waving the flag saying see, we've got your back.

The feeling from what I overhear now is that they'll shut down, get the positivity rate to come down by rolling back from phase 4 (or orange zone - whatever the new layout is) and then reopen as soon as they can feasibly do so.

So it's a lot of little factors in play and some politics that is up against the mayor's ass and the governor's at this time.

-V

And there's the missing piece to this latest De Blasio headscratcher.

 

[Lazaran]

lol @ cost-benefit analysis. As someone who stares at P&Ls most days, your copy and paste doesn't impress.

If you want to limit viral vectors, you could do that more effectively just by shutting down gyms only rather than schools. You're addressing the campfire in the hopes that it mitigates the the 4-alarmer next door.

Um, the businesses have been hit with a curfew, and stricter measures may be taken if the numbers don't come down. I hear that Cuomo is going to shut down bars and gyms. And yes, schools aren't the primary vector, but they are an additional one. During a spike, limiting as many avenues of transmission is critical to lowering the numbers so things can reopen.

Also, if the mayor hadn't closed schools when the Covid numbers reached the agreed upon limit he would have lost all credibility. The public needs to know that when their leaders make a plan they will stick to it. If de Blasio had moved the threshold up it would have set a dangerous precedent. Now the public knows what the rules are and that they aren't going to change due to public or political pressure.

The mayor was consistent, unlike Trump who has been all over the place on messaging and guidelines.

I applaud him for that.

 

[islandman]

Um, the businesses have been hit with a curfew, and stricter measures may be taken if the numbers don't come down. I hear that Cuomo is going to shut down bars and gyms. And yes, schools aren't the primary vector, but they are an additional one. During a spike, limiting as many avenues of transmission is critical to lowering the numbers so things can reopen.

Also, if the mayor hadn't closed schools when the Covid numbers reached the agreed upon limit he would have lost all credibility. The public needs to know that when their leaders make a plan they will stick to it. If de Blasio had moved the threshold up it would have set a dangerous precedent. Now the public knows what the rules are and that they aren't going to change due to public or political pressure.

The mayor was consistent, unlike Trump who has been all over the place on messaging and guidelines.

I applaud him for that.

Our mayor is a fucking moron. Only idiots from the outside looking in think he's got more than 2 brain cells to rub together. Any good that's happened since March as it relates to COVID-19 is either in spite of him, due to luck, or Cuomo stepped in somewhere.

Another guy NYers knew incapable of counting without using his fingers but outsiders couldn't get enough of his salespitch: Trump

Um, the businesses have been hit with a curfew, and stricter measures may be taken if the numbers don't come down. I hear that Cuomo is going to shut down bars and gyms. And yes, schools aren't the primary vector, but they are an additional one.

lol @ "an additional one". Unless we're going by your Ouija board, schools are safer than the streets. Why?

Because adults are the problem and not kids.

 

[Lazaran]

Our mayor is a fucking moron. Only idiots from the outside looking in think he's got more than 2 brain cells to rub together. Any good that's happened since March as it relates to COVID-19 is either in spite of him, due to luck, or Cuomo stepped in somewhere.

Another guy NYers knew incapable of counting without using his fingers but outsiders couldn't get enough of his salespitch: Trump




lol @ "an additional one". Unless we're going by your Ouija board, schools are safer than the streets. Why?

Because adults are the problem and not kids.

I don't know anyone who has a high opinion of de Blasio and I always thought Trump was a douche.

That doesn't change the fact that in this one instance de Blasio made the correct call. He stuck to the redline he had agreed to and now it's the responsibility of the whole community to take the steps necessary to reverse the trend so that kids can get back to in person learning.

 

[islandman]

I don't know anyone who has a high opinion of de Blasio and I always thought Trump was a douche.

That doesn't change the fact that in this one instance de Blasio made the correct call. He stuck to the redline he had agreed to and now it's the responsibility of the whole community to take the steps necessary to reverse the trend so that kids can get back to in person learning.

That instance hasn't happened yet. The data doesn't support it. The only thing that supports it is his promise to the teacher's union and.......you.....for some odd reason.

 

[AlexBailey]

And in spite of these questions you feel qualified to call the closure "nuanced and intelligent'.

Sure. Think about it in contrast to the Trump administration's response: a hoax, the China flu, not my fault, there is no problem, fuck scientists and doctors, what about the individuals with strong immune systems who just want things to be normal?

Biden is taking it seriously, both in recognizing the problem for health, but also by recognizing that different approaches are needed in different locations. Sure, no one wants to be in the lockdown zones, but it's obvious to those who look at the science objectively that it is a necessary inconvenience, necessary in that it considers the lives of vulnerable Americans and considers this a battle that we all have a stake in.

" ...promote the general welfare... " Compassion for the vulnerable is American to the core.

 

[islandman]

Sure. Think about it in contrast to the Trump administration's response: a

This is where I stopped reading. If you're going to view everything through the lens of "but Trump did this, so, what is in opposition must be awesome and so is the Dem who proposed it", then you're not worth the read.

Trump is out. The problem remains. Address the problem, and not with a PR stunt.

 

[AlexBailey]

This is where I stopped reading. If you're going to view everything through the lens of "but Trump did this, so, what is in opposition must be awesome and so is the Dem who proposed it", then you're not worth the read.

Trump is out. The problem remains. Address the problem, and not with a PR stunt.

If you didn't read past the first part you missed the point. You see, we have a polarized world here and our choices are largely one-or-the-other. We've been living in the 'other' and now we are going to be living with the 'one'.

Joe Biden is not a selfish self-centered man. He is humble and knows that he does not have all of the answers and will approach our nation's issues with reflection and intelligence and counsel instead of gut response, denial, and visceral reaction.

I haven't read enough of your posts to know where you are coming from, but it sounds like you'd rather take the approach of 'open up and just deal with it'. If so, you are on one side while science and compassion are on the other. I hope you will put away your blinders and open you mind to objective reasoning.

 

[CornusKousa]

Sure. Think about it in contrast to the Trump administration's response: a hoax, the China flu, not my fault, there is no problem, fuck scientists and doctors, what about the individuals with strong immune systems who just want things to be normal?

"Because Trump!!" is a SAD 'argument'......right up there with "but your source is biased" as an attempt to refute what is actually being said.

Biden is taking it seriously, both in recognizing the problem for health, but also by recognizing that different approaches are needed in different locations. Sure, no one wants to be in the lockdown zones, but it's obvious to those who look at the science objectively that it is a necessary inconvenience, necessary in that it considers the lives of vulnerable Americans and considers this a battle that we all have a stake in.

That's not actually true and why the WHO suggest doing so only as a last resort if things should turn for the worst.

Because outright blatant assassination of the economy WILL kill far more than Covid ever hopped of taking out.

" ...promote the general welfare... " Compassion for the vulnerable is American to the core.

That doesn't extend to starving people to death in their homes because "progressives" decide it's time to go on an illegal power trip.

But hey, as long as you nuts keep that shit at the state/city level? ROCK ON!! Shut NYC down FOREVER

 

[CornusKousa]

If you didn't read past the first part you missed the point.

No, he didn't......"buhh.....BUHH...BUTT TRUMP!!" was pathetic and he knew you were full of shit the second he saw it.

 

[islandman]

I haven't read enough of your posts to know where you are coming from, but it sounds like you'd rather take the approach of 'open up and just deal with it'. If so, you are on one side while science and compassion are on the other. I hope you will put away your blinders and open you mind to objective reasoning.

Suggest you put down the talking points and actually exercise your gray matter. The following are my points from yesterday. If after reading them you're still of the "blinders" opinion, then happy trails to you.

It's a half-assed measure designed to obfuscate where the infections are taking place, the solution to which would be another lockdown.....and acknowledgement of the economic ramifications of such action.

As a resident of NYC, the case here is neither nuanced nor intelligent. In-school positivity rate in 0.2%.

To put it bluntly, you're 14 times more likely to be infected in one of our capacity-limited, socially distanced restos. Yet these remain open while schools are shut.

This is a failure of adults rather than government. If Biden's plan is to rely on adults, life will take another hard left any second now.