To Authors who have written a series and the Readers who follow them.

[TeroWright]

The direct question:
Have you written a story that describes your character's future while having a vague guess at their past, only to go back and rewrite the future story after fleshing out the past?


The insight behind why I'm asking:
If it's not obvious already, I've done this. I wrote the initial meeting of my characters, then jumped ahead 5 years in their time and wrote another story - thinking I had it pretty well mapped out what would've happened to them in that time frame - and found out I was way off! I did it as a way of setting a goal, but now I find myself not liking the 'guidelines' I put in place for myself 5 years down the line as the more I write the stories in the past, the more I realize how messed up those guidelines actually are.


My resolve and follow-up question:
Yes, I'm aware of how stupid this seems - a rookie mistake if there ever was one. Writing the 'filler' stories has always been a part of the plan, but as I write them, what comes out feeling natural (at least for a fantasy situation) clashes with what I've already established, and it eats me inside to think about going back and fixing the 'future' stories.
So yeah, has anyone else done this to themselves? How did you deal with it? Was the rewrite harder or easier with the new information you presented yourself?
FOR READERS, have you encountered a situation like this? How did you feel about the changes? Did it discourage you from following the Author?

 

[eroticstoryspinner]

I recently realized that about 70% into a novel that I was actually writing the fourth book of the series starting the second arc rather than the first book of the series. Astute readers will tend to get all over you regarding what they see as continuity errors. So if you have already published it, your kind of stuck.

If you haven't, then if you have to rewrite for the story to be right for you, then don't be afraid to. Because it you don't think it's right, it's a safe bet your readers won't either.

 

[TeroWright]

Yeah, this is why I made the post - the story's are already published here. That this point, there are only two stories that need to be modified (one having multiple parts). As it stands currently, all the stories in my line up work with each other well, but the new one I'm working on is switching things up and my problem is that I feel like it's for the better.

 

[JamesMiehoff]

I've done that in reverse. I started a story that was supposed to be a one off, but really liked the characters and so began writing the past and future stories. It has been somewhat difficult to keep all the details straight (continuity involves a lot of rereading the previous stories and cringing), but it can be done.

The other thing you can do, is something I've had to do on occasion is recast the characters. I tend to be a stream of consciousness writer so having to stop and check continuity is a read mood breaker. So occasionally I write myself into a paradox with the characters. A quick edit with new names and voila a new story (or series).

James

 

[GTO_Racer]

Yes, I've had this happen

The direct question:
Have you written a story that describes your character's future while having a vague guess at their past, only to go back and rewrite the future story after fleshing out the past?


The insight behind why I'm asking:
If it's not obvious already, I've done this. I wrote the initial meeting of my characters, then jumped ahead 5 years in their time and wrote another story - thinking I had it pretty well mapped out what would've happened to them in that time frame - and found out I was way off! I did it as a way of setting a goal, but now I find myself not liking the 'guidelines' I put in place for myself 5 years down the line as the more I write the stories in the past, the more I realize how messed up those guidelines actually are.


My resolve and follow-up question:
Yes, I'm aware of how stupid this seems - a rookie mistake if there ever was one. Writing the 'filler' stories has always been a part of the plan, but as I write them, what comes out feeling natural (at least for a fantasy situation) clashes with what I've already established, and it eats me inside to think about going back and fixing the 'future' stories.
So yeah, has anyone else done this to themselves? How did you deal with it? Was the rewrite harder or easier with the new information you presented yourself?
FOR READERS, have you encountered a situation like this? How did you feel about the changes? Did it discourage you from following the Author?

I have multiple stories where there are relationships with characters in previous stories. Once, I just went with it because I didn't think that the screwed up timeline was that big of a deal. Another time, I tried keeping the timeline as written previously. That time, if the reader was actually paying attention, the ending is actually a couple of years in the future from now. I figure that the continuation of time will correct that on it's own. The last few stories, I review every previous story that will be impacted and adjust my current story accordingly.

 

[eroticstoryspinner]

Yeah, this is why I made the post - the story's are already published here. That this point, there are only two stories that need to be modified (one having multiple parts). As it stands currently, all the stories in my line up work with each other well, but the new one I'm working on is switching things up and my problem is that I feel like it's for the better.

What are the changes you want to make?

 

[TeroWright]

What are the changes you want to make?

Well, the story in question (or at least the one with the most issues) is "Christie's Homeless Friend".

The way it is written now, Christie and her lady Cindy have treated Brian (the homeless friend) as a friend with benefits. She (Christie) makes mention of it early on in the story as well. For 3 years, they treated him that way, and I decided as a writer that the reasoning behind it was because he was scared of losing their friendship, so he never acted on any advances they made.
When the girls come back from a 2-year business trip (totaling 5 years since they first met), they share with him that they've basically been losing sleep over a mysterious lack of communication, and now that they're home, they want to make the relationship between the three of them permanent, as in not just friends, but partners. He agrees, and throughout the story, his reactions to what they do are...well, under developed. It's like he's learning this stuff all over again. He has some memories of how the girls treated him before, but the more I read over it compared to my new story, it seems like it's something that could've happened maybe a couple months down the road, not 5 years. Oh, and Brian wasn't always homeless either.

The changes I want to make are mainly focused around his reactions. The new story puts Brian and Christie alone in a room together for the first time after meeting a week prior, and Christie is practically throwing herself at him because of his support for her interests. The other times she's been in his presence, she's had her friends with her and just played along with them.
It seems like now Brian and Christie are going to play off each other a lot more, and it'll be a waiting game for Cindy to join them.
I feel that the changes to "Christie's Homeless Friend" should reflect this, like he should be used to Christie's affection towards him (which he's currently not), and should be getting used to more of Cindy's affection now. By the way, Yes, this is a Polyamory thing - it's referenced in "An Interview with a Trample Lover", the second story that needs attention.

As for the changes in that second story, well, Christie is being interviewed about all of this - about why she's into trampling (which girls normally aren't) and about how she manages a poly relationship. She reflects on how she first met Cindy as well as first meeting Brian, and how they ultimately decided to make him apart of their partnership. Just minor changes are needed in this story, but changes nonetheless.

I like to think I'm pretty good with attention to detail regardless of this novice oversight, so that's why a bunch of red flags are popping up between these stories.

 

[BiscuitHammer]

My flagship series, The Alexaverse, is pretty much a direct result of needing to expound upon what I ended up writing. The characters outgrew my original vision for the story (maybe six chapters), and it has morphed into an entire saga that includes at least four spin-off series.

While the original story, Alex & Alexa, has ended after seventeen chapters (see?), it was continued directly by another series, Mike & Karen. The thing about MK is that it also delves into the background of our cast via flashbacks, as well as continuing to move the story forward in the present day. Essentially, I've got a hybrid Prequel/Sequel.

A Sprequel?

To that end, it has become necessary for me to not only invent everyone's backstories and life events, such as birthdates and anniversaries, but even family histories, which in the case of Karen, goes as far back as the Domesday Book in 1086. Karen told me it was there.

I'm not kidding, I found her Blackwell surname in the Domesday Book. That worked out really well, I gotta admit.

Anyhoo, it's a good thing that I've been playing D&D and been a dungeon master since the mid-to-late 70's, because I'm adept at world building as a result. This includes extensive backgrounds for everyone without being tiresome for the reader. Knowing all these details allows me to flavour my prose appropriately, minus endless cumbersome details. Because Mike & Karen is already 21 chapters, and MAYBE one third done at this rate.

Karen & Alexa, a quick side-story, was three chapters. Freja & Jeanie is currently four, and will probably be eight before it finishes. Another spinoff which I'm starting, 714 Bridle Path, is an unknown number of chapters, but needs to happen. I'm still planning another spinoff as well, another sprequel.

So in a sense, I've found this necessary, yes. It also made compels me to make sure that if I'm starting a series, I know all the relevant background deets firmly before I begin writing. Thank Sanguinius for that.

 

[MelissaBaby]

The direct question:
Have you written a story that describes your character's future while having a vague guess at their past, only to go back and rewrite the future story after fleshing out the past?


The insight behind why I'm asking:
If it's not obvious already, I've done this. I wrote the initial meeting of my characters, then jumped ahead 5 years in their time and wrote another story - thinking I had it pretty well mapped out what would've happened to them in that time frame - and found out I was way off! I did it as a way of setting a goal, but now I find myself not liking the 'guidelines' I put in place for myself 5 years down the line as the more I write the stories in the past, the more I realize how messed up those guidelines actually are.


My resolve and follow-up question:
Yes, I'm aware of how stupid this seems - a rookie mistake if there ever was one. Writing the 'filler' stories has always been a part of the plan, but as I write them, what comes out feeling natural (at least for a fantasy situation) clashes with what I've already established, and it eats me inside to think about going back and fixing the 'future' stories.
So yeah, has anyone else done this to themselves? How did you deal with it? Was the rewrite harder or easier with the new information you presented yourself?
FOR READERS, have you encountered a situation like this? How did you feel about the changes? Did it discourage you from following the Author?

I read your post several times trying to figure out what the actual problem is, until I realized that you seem to be writing different stories with the same characters, not one story divided into chapters. Is that right?

As for my experience, I wrote 36 chapters of Mary and Alvin. I finished the first chapter, wrote a rough draft of the last chapter, then outlined the major events that would happen in between.

In the course of writing it, naturally other ideas came to me (It took three years, after all) and I was publishing as I went. Some fit in, some did not. I've always used the analogy of the story being a journey. I knew the destination. A side trip here and there was fine, as long as the point of the trip was to eventually reach that destination. And sometimes, you've just got to tell the kids that, no, you can't go 500 miles out of your way to see the world's largest ball of rubber bands.

Or, as they say where I come from, "You can't get there from here."

The reason I think the distinction of whether or not it is all one story or different stories with the same characters is that, at least to my thinking, if it is one story, it has to "rhyme." The end must in some way reflect the beginning. The promises made to the readers then, and along the way, must be fulfilled.

For me, maintaining the integrity of the story trumps any cool ideas I might want to add. If they don't fit, they are a different story.

 

[Sextified]

And sometimes, you've just got to tell the kids that, no, you can't go 500 miles out of your way to see the world's largest ball of rubber bands.

Or, as they say where I come from, "You can't get there from here."

That's probably the best lines of advice I've seen on the forums in a while.


< < < > > >


If your creativity is keeping your writing going on at a good clip, then I truly think you need to continue on the path that feels right, right now.

Once you delve back into fixing old material, you put yourself at risk of stalling out, and beginning to write yourself around in circles.

Start a file somewhere, to jot down the things you would have changed. Make it a place to capture all of your ideas that would have made the first stories better, and that would provide smoother and more logical transitions between your time jumps. Add to it as often as you like, but other than using it as a reference to eventually make your old work more coherent with your new? If you actually took the time out to fix them?


< < < Leave the past already posted stories alone! > > >


If you ever creatively completely run out of gas, and need to torture yourself masochistically for some reason, only then go back and try to 'fix' things.

Having a place to put your 'what if' ideas is the key to getting them out of your system. I sincerely wish now that I had done that instead.

The small minor things I have fixed on my rewriting attempts have had no real impact on the story lines themselves. The major things I needed to change? They tended to spawn a never ending series of house fires I could never completely put out. Even still to this day!

The wrong eye color, hair color, how tall one character was, a real person's name used instead of a fictional one, age differences that were only a few years off, the number of failed marriages one man had, when one woman lost her virginity but not to who?

Those sorts of things readers can forgive, especially on a large project they are getting to read for free. If someone spots one, and is nice about it, thank them. Then offer them the chance to get an early read of your next chapter, and put them to work, catching those kinds of items before you post it for real.

The major stuff, if someone actually goes all the way back to your chronological beginning and reads it all from scratch? The first time you hear from someone like that, have a canned response ready to paste in to your reply to them, that spells out your continuing series' very worst warts in a non-spoiler like fashion.

Then move on.

If you are truly serious about eventually moving your work to the profit side of posting then, and only then, would you have a real problem that should matter to anyone else but yourself.

If writing makes you happy, do what it takes to keep yourself writing, without making yourself miserable.

 

[eroticstoryspinner]

Well, the story in question (or at least the one with the most issues) is "Christie's Homeless Friend".

The way it is written now, Christie and her lady Cindy have treated Brian (the homeless friend) as a friend with benefits. She (Christie) makes mention of it early on in the story as well. For 3 years, they treated him that way, and I decided as a writer that the reasoning behind it was because he was scared of losing their friendship, so he never acted on any advances they made.
When the girls come back from a 2-year business trip (totaling 5 years since they first met), they share with him that they've basically been losing sleep over a mysterious lack of communication, and now that they're home, they want to make the relationship between the three of them permanent, as in not just friends, but partners. He agrees, and throughout the story, his reactions to what they do are...well, under developed. It's like he's learning this stuff all over again. He has some memories of how the girls treated him before, but the more I read over it compared to my new story, it seems like it's something that could've happened maybe a couple months down the road, not 5 years. Oh, and Brian wasn't always homeless either.

The changes I want to make are mainly focused around his reactions. The new story puts Brian and Christie alone in a room together for the first time after meeting a week prior, and Christie is practically throwing herself at him because of his support for her interests. The other times she's been in his presence, she's had her friends with her and just played along with them.
It seems like now Brian and Christie are going to play off each other a lot more, and it'll be a waiting game for Cindy to join them.
I feel that the changes to "Christie's Homeless Friend" should reflect this, like he should be used to Christie's affection towards him (which he's currently not), and should be getting used to more of Cindy's affection now. By the way, Yes, this is a Polyamory thing - it's referenced in "An Interview with a Trample Lover", the second story that needs attention.

As for the changes in that second story, well, Christie is being interviewed about all of this - about why she's into trampling (which girls normally aren't) and about how she manages a poly relationship. She reflects on how she first met Cindy as well as first meeting Brian, and how they ultimately decided to make him apart of their partnership. Just minor changes are needed in this story, but changes nonetheless.

I like to think I'm pretty good with attention to detail regardless of this novice oversight, so that's why a bunch of red flags are popping up between these stories.

Personally, I think MelissaBaby has the right of it. I glanced at your stories and the only possible way to tweak things a bit is change the POV to Brian to see what he was thinking at the time. I don't think you can really go back and retcon that many stories. I suspect we all would like to rewrite something after we publish it to tweak it a bit. Live is too short and there are too many other stories begging to be written.

 

[TeroWright]

I don't think you can really go back and retcon that many stories.

Challenge accepted.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Challenge accepted.

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

 

[KeithD]

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

This. In addition, you're taking Web site processing time from other authors who aren't fussing about with their works.

 

[TeroWright]

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

I wasn't going to do it for the sake of being on the front page again, I'm not like that.
The last time I submitted a change (to a title and description), it didn't change the story's original post date, so it didn't go back on the front page, and I'm ok with that.

 

[KeithD]

It still has to receive all of the Web site processing it originally did.

 

[Voboy]

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

Absolutely correct. It's done. Move on.

I've got like two "series," and their ratings are quite high. It's nice that they're well-received (I mean, I enjoy them too), but I don't get enough of a thrill out of a somewhat "soft" 4.92 to write a bunch more series just for the sake of the high number.

When my muse wants me to extend a series, I guess I'll extend it. I'm sure they'll rate well if I do; my extendable series is in SF, which gets high scores anyway. But I tend to separate what I think of as the quality or "completeness" of a story from the score it gets.

 

[tomlitilia]

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

Amen.

 

[JaxRhapsody]

If I'm reading right; no I haven't. Some characters have cameos in other stories that elude to how their future(books present) turned out. I wouldn't edit and resubmit over it, matter of fact I wouldn't even do it to change or add a tag. What I would do; is reread the previous story and jot down notes that I can go back to for reference, to keep things canon and proper, if I was doing something that serious on Lit.

That's why everything I have here is one-shots. I'm not doing a series here, that's for something I hope to make money on.

 

[tomlitilia]

I haven't done the exact thing described by the OP either, but I learned the hard way from my first series to not publish anything before I'm done with the entire story. It's tempting to be trigger happy, but the moment you click "publish" on that first chapter, you've set a path you cannot change. Sure, you can edit previous chapters, but do you really think readers will re-read them before enjoying the sequels?

 

[gunhilltrain]

I have multiple stories where there are relationships with characters in previous stories. Once, I just went with it because I didn't think that the screwed up timeline was that big of a deal. Another time, I tried keeping the timeline as written previously. That time, if the reader was actually paying attention, the ending is actually a couple of years in the future from now. I figure that the continuation of time will correct that on it's own. The last few stories, I review every previous story that will be impacted and adjust my current story accordingly.

I didn't intend this originally, but one is not limited to a single timeline. I have some stories that have - or seem to have - the same narrator, but everything in them couldn't have happened to the same person. I sort of did it unintentionally. Sometimes different events are in the same period of time. Rather than aim for perfect consistency, I have informally created several overlapping timelines. If necessary, I add a note to the readers about what is going on.

It is true that in an actual series there should be consistency. But the longest one I've written so far only covers four months, and the longest one I plan covers about sixteen.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Why bother? It still going to be fundamentally the same story, and it's had its fifteen minutes of fame. I don't understand folk futzing so much with old stories, surely the next one is more important?

Sure, if you're planning to issue it as an ebook or something you'd rework it, but just doing another go around on Lit? Is it really that good?

TeroWright: You could just rework it and post it on another site, but we're talking about fourteen chapters here I think? That's a lot of work. I've done that for stand-alone stories. I'm not sure I'd bother with something that long.

How many chapters are you thinking of redoing? All of them?

 

[SimonDoom]

We all have our own muses and get our kicks in different ways, but I'm inclined to agree with EB66 about this: just move forward. Going back and rewriting what you've done before and republishing on Literotica is an awful lot of effort for minimal return. I've written stuff that I look back on, and some of it makes me cringe a bit, but I'm not going to change anything. I'll just write a new story. The horizon for new stories is infinite, and whatever improvements you want to make you can make in a new story.

Or you might think of it as analogous to a movie reboot, like new versions of Batman or Spiderman. They don't pull the old movies when they release the new ones. Don't worry about discrepancies. Just make the new story the best you can.

 

[TeroWright]

TeroWright: You could just rework it and post it on another site, but we're talking about fourteen chapters here I think? That's a lot of work. I've done that for stand-alone stories. I'm not sure I'd bother with something that long.

How many chapters are you thinking of redoing? All of them?

At max is 11 chapters (or posts). "Christie's Homeless Friend" is 10, and then there's the one other story as a single post. Not all of them require a rewrite, and it's not the entire story that would be changed, just bits of dialog and thoughts that refer back. Part of the story that move forward would remain untouched.
The plan still stands to make changes, I have the time for it. Whether or not those changes get posted here is up in the air as it seems to put peoples panties in a bind, and aside from site 'resources', I do know why.


The original questions still stand to future visitors of this post. Did you write a series out of order and screw up the timeline? And what did you do about it? And readers, did you notice?

 

[gunhilltrain]

At max is 11 chapters (or posts). "Christie's Homeless Friend" is 10, and then there's the one other story as a single post. Not all of them require a rewrite, and it's not the entire story that would be changed, just bits of dialog and thoughts that refer back. Part of the story that move forward would remain untouched.
The plan still stands to make changes, I have the time for it. Whether or not those changes get posted here is up in the air as it seems to put peoples panties in a bind, and aside from site 'resources', I do know why.

The original questions still stand to future visitors of this post. Did you write a series out of order and screw up the timeline? And what did you do about it? And readers, did you notice?

I suppose I wouldn't worry too much about site "resources." (They're already overburdened! But is that really our problem?) I wouldn't submit all eleven at the same time - maybe wait until the previous one is approved? That is a judgment call. It takes them at least a week, probably more, to get to a revised entry.

I would probably always submit a series in chronological order. Of course, there is always a possibility for "flashback" chapters later. I haven't done one of those yet.

According to your submissions page, you have done pretty well so far. I have no idea if your readers noticed anything wrong - none of them have said anything yet? If it really bothers you to have it wrong, then just do it. I have changed, I think, three stand-alone stories because of plot problems or excessive typos.