new, no-politics, coronavirus thread

[butters]

with the okay from Laurel, i'm starting this one up since it's such an important topic impacting our daily lives. if it can be kept to the coronavirus issues on a humanitarian, non-political level, it can stay. the virus doesn't care who you vote for or even if you are eligible to vote. it kills and maims and invades across any spectrum and the whole world faces its threat.

post information here on vaccines, treatments, trends, whathaveyou, and be prepared to challenge/be challenged on the veracity of information/information sources but keeping it to the parameters Laurel's agreed on: aka no politics.

i suppose certain trolls might decide it's worth fucking it up for shits n giggles, but then they also might get banhammered in the process. so here we go, a masks-on, hand-sanitised, socially-distanced and contact-traced new covid thread:
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WHO interactive global covid map

https://covid19.who.int/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI6YyMjKKP7AIVtR6tBh1SvQiwEAAYASAAEgJNrfD_BwE

John Hopkins coronavirus resource centre (interactive)

US 205,729 deaths

Brazil 142,058 deaths

India 96,318 deaths

Mexico 76,603 deaths

UK 42,161 deaths

The Uk has done poorly given its size, and India's maybe the one to watch most due to its huge population. I'm sure there'll always be some disparity in head-count for any country, both in cases and in deaths, but India's vast numbers of over 1.35 Billion rival China's of around 1.39 Billion and China's death stats are reported as only 4,739 deaths to date.

 

[Tryharder62]

I just know that I am not looking forward to combining the coronavirus with flu season.

 

[butters]

6.5 million rapid response tests are to be sent out this week to states in america, followed by more over the following weeks. States are free to deploy them where they decide but the aim is seen to be driven by the need to reopen schools more safely in order to help the economy open up to a greater extent. The deployment of these tests has been delayed but should help students, parents, and teachers alike.

The fact it doesn't require specialty computer equipment is a huge step forward for speedy results.

The tests will come from a previously announced supply of 150 million ordered from Abbott. The company’s rapid test, the size of a credit card, is the first that does not require specialty computer equipment to process. It delivers results in about 15 minutes.

Rapid, convenient testing is considered essential to reopening the U.S. economy.

https://apnews.com/article/election...ve-elections-7ad94115ac126ce1eb7a38bee6c5eedf

 

[butters]

I just know that I am not looking forward to combining the coronavirus with flu season.

me either!

stay protected, get your jab (if you can), help protect others. these things we can do

 

[islandman]

6.5 million rapid response tests are to be sent out this week to states in america, followed by more over the following weeks. States are free to deploy them where they decide but the aim is seen to be driven by the need to reopen schools more safely in order to help the economy open up to a greater extent. The deployment of these tests has been delayed but should help students, parents, and teachers alike.

The fact it doesn't require specialty computer equipment is a huge step forward for speedy results.


https://apnews.com/article/election...ve-elections-7ad94115ac126ce1eb7a38bee6c5eedf

That's the Abbott BinaxNOW Ag Card that is considered a joke in the testing industry. If you read the FDA's EUA approval letter, it says that if you get a negative test, don't take it as a negative result..........go get a molecular (PCR) test for confirmation.

Somehow, someway, Abbott got the FDA to knuckle under in order to offer a panacea to the country.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I just know that I am not looking forward to combining the coronavirus with flu season.

Agreed. I foresee hard times ahead.

 

[Lazaran]

.

Where I live, the four day average for positive test results is 20%, and hospitalizations are spiking. The death rate has declined, so I'm hopeful the hospitals have a better handle on the virus and at risk people are being extra diligent about their safety.

I had hoped the numbers would be better before Flu season, but I guess that was wishful thinking.

*sigh*

 

[islandman]

I'm fascinated by the logic train used by adults who cite the miniscule mortality rate among school-age children as the primary determinant for keeping schools open. Yet these same adults ignore the fact that 40% of the infected (including children) are asymptomatic.

Evidently school-age children live on their own and have no contact with adults be they healthy or at-risk adults.

 

[HisArpy]

Why did you feel the need to get Laurel's "permission" to post?

 

[butters]

That's the Abbott BinaxNOW Ag Card that is considered a joke in the testing industry. If you read the FDA's EUA approval letter, it says that if you get a negative test, don't take it as a negative result..........go get a molecular (PCR) test for confirmation.

Somehow, someway, Abbott got the FDA to knuckle under in order to offer a panacea to the country.

I wish I were surprised

do you have a link for this, iman? are there new, improved test kits being made ready? do we know why the results might come in negative when the person might have covid? (I'm thinking viral load not high enough to show up but maybe there's a weakness in the actual test itself?)

 

[Tryharder62]

me either!

stay protected, get your jab (if you can), help protect others. these things we can do

I'm putting on a drive by flu shot clinic. Get it...a drive by shooting. People don't even have to get out of their car to get the shot. Seriously, it's true.

 

[butters]

.

Where I live, the four day average for positive test results is 20%, and hospitalizations are spiking. The death rate has declined, so I'm hopeful the hospitals have a better handle on the virus and at risk people are being extra diligent about their safety.

I had hoped the numbers would be better before Flu season, but I guess that was wishful thinking.

*sigh*

20% is way too high

wishful thinking is as much good as hopes and prayers for a miracle; too many people are inherently selfish... time will tell if enough do what they need to do to protect others as well as think of themselves.

I'm fascinated by the logic train used by adults who cite the miniscule mortality rate among school-age children as the primary determinant for keeping schools open. Yet these same adults ignore the fact that 40% of the infected (including children) are asymptomatic.

Evidently school-age children live on their own and have no contact with adults be they healthy or at-risk adults.

well, duh!

 

[butters]

I'm putting on a drive by flu shot clinic. Get it...a drive by shooting. People don't even have to get out of their car to get the shot. Seriously, it's true.

https://www.jacksonville.com/article/20151117/NEWS/801257347

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I just know that I am not looking forward to combining the coronavirus with flu season.

Well, given that the same measures advised for COVID-19 (hand washing, masks, social distancing, etc) are also good ways to prevent the transmission of influenza and given that there is a vaccine against flu already, I’m not that worried. Apparently Australia is finishing its best-ever flu season, so there seems to be grounds for modest optimism.

If, of course, you view this as a political question, YMMV.

Good luck to all, sincerely.

 

[Tryharder62]

Well, given that the same measures advised for COVID-19 (hand washing, masks, social distancing, etc) are also good ways to prevent the transmission of influenza and given that there is a vaccine against flu already, I’m not that worried. Apparently Australia is finishing its best-ever flu season, so there seems to be grounds for modest optimism.

If, of course, you view this as a political question, YMMV.

Good luck to all, sincerely.

What makes a flu season the best ever?

 

[Tryharder62]

https://www.jacksonville.com/article/20151117/NEWS/801257347

Yep, it is really big around here now. Walgreens and other big names are doing it. Should be interesting.

 

[islandman]

I wish I were surprised

do you have a link for this, iman? are there new, improved test kits being made ready? do we know why the results might come in negative when the person might have covid? (I'm thinking viral load not high enough to show up but maybe there's a weakness in the actual test itself?)

The EUA documentation to the Abbott test can be found here. Just search for 'BinaxNOW' and click through the 'HCP' pdf: https://www.fda.gov/emergency-prepa...k/emergency-use-authorization#covidinvitrodev

All EUAs (that comprise 98% of COVID-19 tests out there be they PCR, antibody, or antigen) supporting doc can be found via this link.

Improved test kits are already here. Any diagnostic test (PCR) has higher sensitivity and specificity than either antibody or antigen tests. Problem is that PCR tests require a clinical lab to be processed and the collection of the specimen is distasteful. Anyone who has had an NP swab stuck up their nose all the way to the back of their brain can attest to it. It's a temporary discomfort, however. The processing of PCR tests can take days, and as the labs systems became overburdened, those turnaround times increased to the point that the results were rendered meaningless because too much time had passed.

Point-of-care tests like BinaxNow have utility in a healthcare setting such as an ER or doctor's office where PPE protocols are in place. Unless teachers and school staff opt to don PPE the entire day, and each student does the same, PoC solutions won't stop asymptomatic infected individuals from infecting the healthy.

Re false negatives, level of detection of viral load is the determining factor assuming appropriate collection systems. The FDA published a COVID-19 reference panel 10 or so days ago that evidences how sensitive 55 tests are, and there's a universe between to the top 3 and the balance of the list.

So, unless it's a PCR test, most everything else is a crapshoot.

 

[butters]

The EUA documentation to the Abbott test can be found here. Just search for 'BinaxNOW' and click through the 'HCP' pdf: https://www.fda.gov/emergency-prepa...k/emergency-use-authorization#covidinvitrodev

All EUAs (that comprise 98% of COVID-19 tests out there be they PCR, antibody, or antigen) supporting doc can be found via this link.

Improved test kits are already here. Any diagnostic test (PCR) has higher sensitivity and specificity than either antibody or antigen tests. Problem is that PCR tests require a clinical lab to be processed and the collection of the specimen is distasteful. Anyone who has had an NP swab stuck up their nose all the way to the back of their brain can attest to it. It's a temporary discomfort, however. The processing of PCR tests can take days, and as the labs systems became overburdened, those turnaround times increased to the point that the results were rendered meaningless because too much time had passed.

Point-of-care tests like BinaxNow have utility in a healthcare setting such as an ER or doctor's office where PPE protocols are in place. Unless teachers and school staff opt to don PPE the entire day, and each student does the same, PoC solutions won't stop asymptomatic infected individuals from infecting the healthy.

Re false negatives, level of detection of viral load is the determining factor assuming appropriate collection systems. The FDA published a COVID-19 reference panel 10 or so days ago that evidences how sensitive 55 tests are, and there's a universe between to the top 3 and the balance of the list.

So, unless it's a PCR test, most everything else is a crapshoot.

Thanks, iman... I'll look at that I knew they were less effective than the nasal swab but didn't realise their accuracy rates were so low. *sigh*

 

[butters]

What makes a flu season the best ever?

very low spread of infection and resulting hospitalisations/deaths

 

[islandman]

Well, given that the same measures advised for COVID-19 (hand washing, masks, social distancing, etc) are also good ways to prevent the transmission of influenza and given that there is a vaccine against flu already, I’m not that worried. Apparently Australia is finishing its best-ever flu season, so there seems to be grounds for modest optimism.

If, of course, you view this as a political question, YMMV.

Good luck to all, sincerely.

There isn't a flu vaccine. There is however, an annual "best guess" at a vaccine, which is why sometimes the flu hits geographies worse than other years when we get it wrong.

That being said, increased handwashing has benefit against the flu. But here in the U.S. we're seeing mutations in the virus that make it more transmissible. In effect, the Sars-CoV-2 virus is managing around handwashing.

A bit perverse if you ask me.

 

[Lazaran]

Well, given that the same measures advised for COVID-19 (hand washing, masks, social distancing, etc) are also good ways to prevent the transmission of influenza and given that there is a vaccine against flu already, I’m not that worried. Apparently Australia is finishing its best-ever flu season, so there seems to be grounds for modest optimism.

If, of course, you view this as a political question, YMMV.

Good luck to all, sincerely.

Tarnished silver linings, but I'll take it.

Thanks for the report.

 

[islandman]

Thanks, iman... I'll look at that I knew they were less effective than the nasal swab but didn't realise their accuracy rates were so low. *sigh*

They're not low, just lower than PCR, relatively speaking. If you want accuracy, go with NP (not AN) swab (for specimen collection) and a PCR test.

 

[PapaRomantic]

I've seen people come out these past two weeks that I haven't seen in months. When I asked why now, their reply was they just couldn't do the isolation anymore. They are still being careful and will wear masks and try to social distance. But there are more and more people feel that way.

I also worry about flu season. I wouldn't be surprised in our local communities that there would be a raffle on when the local school would close down again.

I also worry about the mental health issues that I'm afraid are going to spike soon. I'm surprised it's not been worse than normal already.

 

[Aglaopheme]

I'm putting on a drive by flu shot clinic. Get it...a drive by shooting. People don't even have to get out of their car to get the shot. Seriously, it's true.

The fella and I drove thru ours today.

 

[Aglaopheme]

I was working with a client yesterday who had Covid. She thinks she got it from her son, he’s 18. The son was fine but she and her husband were very sick. That was back in June and she said she is just now starting to feel 100%.