Solar pannels, electric cars & products sold as eco-friendly often aren't

[suurfer]

I'm sure that the article is as biased as, and they cherry-picked the data which suited them, but it raises some interesting issues:

Really want to help Mother Nature? Don't drive electric cars, ignore paper bags & forget about organic food
https://www.rt.com/news/472337-green-economy-fraud-marketing/

Eco-consciousness has become a winning marketing strategy, but products sold as eco-friendly often aren't.
(...)
Organic farming isn't the planet-saver it's promoted as, according to a study published last month in Nature Communications.
Because organic farming yields a smaller harvest per acre than conventional farming, it requires more land to raise the same amount of crops.

Solar power, for example, creates no carbon emissions once the solar panels are up and running, but their manufacture is a toxic mess. Produced with the carcinogenic, mutagenic heavy metal cadmium and requiring billions of liters of water to manufacture and cool.
--- Electric cars may not produce emissions while driving, but .... batteries they use are loaded with toxic metals like lithium, copper, and cobalt. Mining these substances devastates the environment, and improper disposal of used batteries can cause them to leak back into nature."

 

[suurfer]

And this is the part that I enjoyed the most:

"So why are companies rushing to brand things as green that are anything but, and why are consumers letting them get away with it? Included in the (usually hefty) price tag is the sense that the buyer is somehow “making a difference.”

“Brands are allowing people to pat themselves on the back without them personally having to sacrifice anything,” . And this is the essence of green consumerism – reassuring people used to a high-consumption standard of living that they need not change their lifestyle in order to reduce their carbon footprint.

 

[von_Bismarck]

How about this one:

California is on track to miss its climate targets—by a century

And it’s likely to get harder, not easier, for the state to achieve ever deeper cuts in emissions.

 

[phrodeau]

It’s just too bad that Trump got rid of all the regulations.

 

[seeshelly]

eco-friendly

Being eco-friendly makes sense. I think that the issue of climate change and global warming has become a political tool and most people are easily fooled by creeps like Al Gore. But that doesn't change the fact that we all should take care of the earth because it is our home. And the only planet we have. Fake religion teaches people to view our planet as a temporary dwelling place because in a few short years we will go off to some other realm. That mentality makes people treat the earth like an overnight stay in a cheap hotel. But the earth is our home and taking politics out of it we should all avoid polluting it. That means taking more than a surface look at things like electric cars for the reasons sighted in posts above. Many realize that they net pollution from the batteries and the electrical generation is worse than an efficient gas powered car. So just calling something "green" doesn't make it green.

The best example is the "green new deal" - which would result in financial collapse, agricultural collapse, starvation and the loss of billions of lives. It sounds sweet to be pro-green but like anything else we need to look deeply at unintended consequences.

 

[RocketLauncher]

Gas driven cars have batteries, too. Just sayin'.
And there's pollutants in oil refineries.

 

[von_Bismarck]

But there are also developments like this:

New efficiency record for flexible CZTS

Scientists at South Korea’s Daegu Gyeongbuk Institute of Science and Technology have set a new efficiency record of 11.4% for a cell based on a copper zinc tin sulfide thin film applied to a flexible substrate.

Solar cells based on copper zinc tin sulfide (CZTS) have attracted plenty of attention in recent years thanks to their reliance on cheap, abundant, non-toxic materials and potential for low cost production.

There is a looming problem of waste management with solar and wind energy systems. Countries like USA do a better job of regulating the manufacture of solar cells than countries like China. Transitioning to a renewable energy economy was always going to be a big project, involving end to end solutions and continuing R&D. But the point is that done properly renewable energy is a net benefit today, and there are on the horizon technologies that hold the desired promise.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Gas driven cars have batteries, too. Just sayin'.

Not even close to the same scale.

And there's pollutants in oil refineries.

As opposed to the coal/NG burning electric plants most electric cars are charged by??

BTW electric cars need those oil refineries, they still need various plastic parts, paints, covers, tires, hoses and housings.

Not to mention all the other modern life made possible by plastics.

Also all the forged/machined metal parts....all using huge amounts of electricity and or heat to produce that comes from again, mostly fossil fuel burning power plants and forges.



This is why getting rid of petrol products would be catastrophic.

This is why people say the whole "Green New Deal" shit is crazy AF and will kill millions.

No more tractors, no more trucks, no more parts or supplies to keep the old ones going, no more pesticides, no more fertilizers....what the fuck do all these Green New Deal fans think they are going to eat??

 

[phrodeau]

Being eco-friendly makes sense. I think that the issue of climate change and global warming has become a political tool and most people are easily fooled by creeps like Al Gore. But that doesn't change the fact that we all should take care of the earth because it is our home. And the only planet we have. Fake religion teaches people to view our planet as a temporary dwelling place because in a few short years we will go off to some other realm. That mentality makes people treat the earth like an overnight stay in a cheap hotel. But the earth is our home and taking politics out of it we should all avoid polluting it. That means taking more than a surface look at things like electric cars for the reasons sighted in posts above. Many realize that they net pollution from the batteries and the electrical generation is worse than an efficient gas powered car. So just calling something "green" doesn't make it green.

The best example is the "green new deal" - which would result in financial collapse, agricultural collapse, starvation and the loss of billions of lives. It sounds sweet to be pro-green but like anything else we need to look deeply at unintended consequences.

Sure, but who would we get to look at the consequences? There’s active denial of the consequences of using fossil fuels and copper mining. Many conservatives won’t even look into green energy solutions, as if that would go against their religious beliefs.

It doesn’t help when the author puts out bad info and scaremonger tactics as seen in the OP. Lithium, copper and cobalt are not toxic elements. Cadmium is hazardous, but so is lead, and both have been used in industry safely for a long time. Nobody is spraying cadmium around the countryside.

As for batteries, I properly dispose of all waste batteries, and I’m sure that you do too. At the commercial level, improper disposal is a crime. So who’s improperly disposing their batteries?

 

[icanhelp1]

But there are also developments like this:

New efficiency record for flexible CZTS

Scientists at South Korea’s Daegu Gyeongbuk Institute of Science and Technology have set a new efficiency record of 11.4% for a cell based on a copper zinc tin sulfide thin film applied to a flexible substrate.

Solar cells based on copper zinc tin sulfide (CZTS) have attracted plenty of attention in recent years thanks to their reliance on cheap, abundant, non-toxic materials and potential for low cost production.

There is a looming problem of waste management with solar and wind energy systems. Countries like USA do a better job of regulating the manufacture of solar cells than countries like China. Transitioning to a renewable energy economy was always going to be a big project, involving end to end solutions and continuing R&D. But the point is that done properly renewable energy is a net benefit today, and there are on the horizon technologies that hold the desired promise.

If we don't include state of the art nuclear power plants ( Gen IV, SMRs, Thorium ) with well thought out and strategic placement of modules, we are not going meet the requirement for mass produced energy for the future and have a green impact.

 

[Ann_Tagonist]

If there just weren't any humans, the earth would be so much happier.

 

[icanhelp1]

If there just weren't any humans, the earth would be so much happier.

How progressive of you.

 

[HisArpy]

How progressive of you.

REgressive. The word is REgressive.

As in pre-dinosaurs...

 

[suurfer]

How about this one:

California is on track to miss its climate targets—by a century

And it’s likely to get harder, not easier, for the state to achieve ever deeper cuts in emissions.

Sweety... I'm out of my depth here, but I'll read it cause you.

 

[oggbashan]

Our used batteries, taken to the local recycling centre, have been stolen because they are valuable.

 

[OneAuthor]

This is why getting rid of petrol products would be catastrophic.

Petrol products will get rid of themselves, sooner or later. There's only a finite supply. 'Tis better to work on alternatives now, so there isn't a real catastrophe somewhere down the road. And whilst that may not be until long after you and I are dead and gone, it's irresponsible to have what my economics professor often referred to as a "party now" attitude.

 

[icanhelp1]

Sweety... I'm out of my depth here, but I'll read it cause you.

When we can efficiently maximize the use of gravity ( wave, tidal energy, water falls) and solar ( extract solar generated heat from 8 rods to make a 9th rod hotter, we're close. When we can separate oxygen from hydrogen with less energy than it takes to recombine them, we're close ( fuel cells, hydrogen propulsion ) hydrogen fuel. When we can cost effectively deploy cold fusion, we're close. Maximize geothermal and wind turbines, we're close. Drumroll please ( MATTER ANTIMATTER). Just some thoughts for future green renewable energy sources, very interesting reading.